# R.I.P. 30 UVic Bunnies



## Bill Jesse

Thirty UVic rescued bunnies gotthrough a hole in a fence at the sanctuary in Coombs BC and were shot to death by an irate neighbour. She did not even give the volunteersa chance to get them back. A real shame after all the bunnies went through at the university and the work the volunteers did to save them from the tyrants at UVic.


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## Purple Mountain Rabbitry

such a shame. I wish everyone in the world was a rabbit love. may they rest in peace. binky free at the rainbow bridge little ones


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## Bill Jesse

Thank you for that. At first it was such a shock that it didn't affect me but each minute it seems like its getting worse. Really hate that murdering woman and despite my senior years I have never hated anyone.


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## Pipp

One of the email addresses was wrong and in any case we have a policy of not publishing contact info for people in these situations, although I'd personally love for people to discuss this with her in an even-keeled manner, I haven't heard her side of the story, there may have been mitigating circumstances, not that I'd find ANY excuse tolerable in this case.  

Until her name appears in the media, it can't be published here, but if it does, this will be reconsidered, thanks. 


sas :rip:


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## Pipp

http://www.westcoaster.ca/oceanside/9955-UVic-Rabbits-Escape-Sanctuary-Shot-Dead.html

UVic Rabbits Escape Sanctuary, Shot Dead 30/09/2010 16:13:00 Jan Beecher 

*Rabbits rescued from the University of Victoria were shot in Coombs this week after they escaped from their new sanctuary.* 


David Currie, a Ministry of Environment spokesman, said his Nanaimo office received a complaint from a woman who said rabbits had strayed onto her property from the neighbouring permitted-rabbit sanctuary at World Parrot Refuge. 

âWe can also confirm, the neighbouring resident did contract a nuisance trapper to destroy the rabbits that were on her property,â said Currie.

According to Currie, the shooting was within the rights of the property owner because rabbits are Schedule C wildlife. 

âSchedule C wildlife can be captured or killed anywhere and at any time in B.C.,â he said.

The University of Victoria rabbit issue has received nation-wide attention after a court injunction July 30 stopped UVicâs original rabbit management plan â to potentially trap and euthanize approximately 1,600 rabbits that reside on campus. 

In May, 94 rabbits were culled in a trial run of the plan. 

The University managed to have the injunction set aside in late August. 

From that point on university operations were allowed to humanely trap rabbits and hand them over to permit holders. 

The permit holders had to meet requirements set out by the Ministry of Environment. Permit orders had to prove their accommodations satisfied the rabbitsâ health and well being and prevented the animals from escaping. Permit holders were also required to prove the rabbits were sterilized.

According to university officials, two individuals came forward to take the rabbits â one of them was the Earthanimal Humane Education and Rescue Society, operated by Susan Vickary, out of Salt Spring Island.

Vickary has worked to get three permits: one at her property on Salt Spring Island, one at Cowichan Station and one at Coombs, which was on the World Parrot Refuge grounds. Cowichan Station can take 30 rabbits, Coombs is permitted for 350.

âI think itâs very unfortunate because she has worked hard to find a home for them,â said Tom Smith, executive director of facilities at UVic.

He said UVic has to date handed over 254 rabbits to Vickary. 

âWhen we turn them over they are counted â we keep track to make sure they donât exceed the permit.â

Smith says there have been 402 rabbits removed since the trapping resumed. 

âThereâs another wave of babies coming,â he said. 

Female rabbits that were lactating when they were captured were set free to return to their babies â but if the animals were pregnant when trapped, the babies became the responsibility of the permit holder.

The remainder of the rabbits, 148, are headed to Texas, to the Wild Rose Rescue Ranch. 

That operation is being led by Lara-Leah Shaw, a realtor and activist on the mainland, who has a permit to take up to 1,000 rabbits.

The ministry is still investigating the Coombs rabbit shooting.

Currie said that failure to comply with the terms of the permit to possess rabbits under the Wildlife Act could result in the permit being cancelled and denial of further applications.


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## SnowyShiloh

Poor bun buns  I have a hard time understanding how someone could equate bunnies with rage. Not saying that she did- like Sas said, we don't know her side of the story- but she'd have to have something going on if her first reaction was to go on a bunny killing spree and shoot them all before anyone could do anything.


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## Pipp

If any of those rabbits were the babies born on the property, they ARE the property of the Coombs Sanctuary, not the Crown. 

I hope Wendy, the sanctuary owner, is pursuing this. 


sas


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## Bill Jesse

Sorry I would have a very difficult time discussing this on an even-keel manner. She killed rabbits and they may even have been some that I befriended when I was patrolling the university. Hopefully this case has gone world-wide. And if you do not let anyone put contact names on this site, fine but her name is on most Facebook sites. What she did was horrible.


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## Purple Mountain Rabbitry

your welcome. I know what you mean I don't hate many people it takes alot for me to hate someone but its true for this lady how heartless can people be. This really effects me because I had a neighbor who allowed his dog to kill my chickens when they were free range. the one he killed was my baby. I penned them up and one day one of my laying hensgot out. instead of coming to get me he let his dog kill it then came and got me. he said it was in the bushes. I looked everywhere in the feild where there was bushes i couldn't find her i figured something carried her off. my brother found it up in the yard bushes when he took the dog out. not a mistake and my hens never came up past the garden. back yard, he found her in the front yard bushes. some people just don't understand animals and how to deal with them. This reminds me of the case in Cali where a pregnant cow at the Cali State Fair got out(she was there for a live birth display) they couldn't catch on pen her so they shot her instead of allowing 4h and FFA kids and parents to deal with it they chased her with a car agitated her and killed her and her unborn calf cause they were more worried about opening the fair than the cow and her calfs safety, Hello ever heard of hay and a lasso. people can be so heartless.


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## Bill Jesse

I suppose there are millions of such stories involving animals and each is sad. Humans just do not understand. Now that the rabbits are almost gone from the university the next thing to be culled will be the deer. As someone wrote "a death sentence for eating a flower is pretty harsh!" I'd ather live with a thousand animals than an equal amount of humans.


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## Purple Mountain Rabbitry

*Bill Jesse wrote: *


> I suppose there are millions of such stories involving animals and each is sad. Humans just do not understand. Now that the rabbits are almost gone from the university the next thing to be culled will be the deer. As someone wrote "a death sentence for eating a flower is pretty harsh!" I'd ather live with a thousand animals than an equal amount of humans.




If that becomes the case I hope some one is as willing to save them as so many were to save the rabbits. Amen. I agree I would rather live wih a thousand animals than an equal amount of humans any day. 

RIP and Binky free.

Crystal


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## Bill Jesse

I don't know. The number trying to save the rabbits is very small. It started big but like everything there were many more talkers than doers. At the moment in Victoria there are probably 3, maybe 4 real active people.
I once suggested in a letter to a newspaper that the province cuts down every tree and paves every inch of landscape (they are trying to!) and the animals and birds would have no place to go and all die off.


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## Purple Mountain Rabbitry

*Bill Jesse wrote: *


> I don't know. The number trying to save the rabbits is very small. It started big but like everything there were many more talkers than doers. At the moment in Victoria there are probably 3, maybe 4 real active people.
> I once suggested in a letter to a newspaper that the province cuts down every tree and paves every inch of landscape (they are trying to!) and the animals and birds would have no place to go and all die off.



I never realized how few there were. 

That is so true. I just seems like no one wants animals specifically wildlife or livestock around anymore. I know for years there have been many of us working to save the wild mustangs here in the US. And then so many trying to save race Horses "after the finish line", no one realizes how many champions end up in slaughter. I have rescued horses for many years. I have also rescued dogs, cats, birds, etc. It sickens me how people can care so little. i don't get it. Maybe its time for us animal lover to truely make a stand for animals that have no voice and can not defend themselves.

Crystal


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## Bill Jesse

Yes we are really very few people in this rescue mission in Victoria. There is one - maybe more involved in the Coombs sanctuary but any information about them is kept a secret. In our group there are a few more in Vancouver but being where they are they cannot be literally hands-on. Their work is highly needed and appreciated though.
If only I could find a decent piece of land to build some sort of sanctuary on it I would. Land here is very expensive and any lots that become available are in new housing tracts. Might be time to go to the country.


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## Purple Mountain Rabbitry

I understand what you mean. Finding affordable land in my area is like trying to find a needle in a haystack. I would if I could but trying to do that and try to pay for college and take care of animals is litterally impossible. I wish I could because I feel bad but I do try to help out as many bunnies here that I can as much as possible. We have people that dump them in parks daily and many end up being euthanized because people don't want them. If I had the space time and money I would do everything in my power to save every animal I could

Crystal


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## Nela

what a sad outcome...


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## Bunny parents

:cry4: What a tragic... RIP, bunnies :rainbow:


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## Nancy McClelland

Rest in peace little ones. What justification can there be for this. She had to know where they came from. I have yet to hear of a single case where someone was in fear for their life because of a bunny attack. Sounds like a good argument for taking away firearms from someone who shouldn't be allowed to have them in the first place. Truthfully, sounds like she had a grudge against the sanctuary.


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## Bill Jesse

Sadly in this province the Ministry of Environment has deemed all rabbits as 'wildlife' which allows farmers, trappers and homeowners to kill them. They have no protection.
The other bad part is there are supposedly another bunch of rabbits on this person's property and she will not allow the rescue volunteers to enter. She says "I will deal with the rabbits on my land in whichever way I have to!" This does sound ominous.
We are sending her emails to try to convince her otherwise. I would give you or anyone her email address but I have been told I cannot post it. However you can email me for it.


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## slavetoabunny

How cold-hearted of this person!


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## kirbyultra




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## Pipp

"On Thursday evening, Smith said she could see about two dozen rabbits in her field and another four dozen in a neighbouring field, but she has no intention of allowing Vickery on her property to catch them.

âI will deal with the rabbits on my land in whatever way I have to,â she said."


Read more: http://www.vancouversun.com/technol...rabbits+shot/3606131/story.html#ixzz119S3twIc


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## Bill Jesse

One member of the group in Victoria phoned Smith trying to appease her and said she would come out and remove the rabbits on her property. When Smith found out that she was going to take them away Smith said "there is no way are you going to spread this problem! I have a trapper here and we will kill them all!"
So there you go rabbit lovers. Sadly I am not permitted to post any address info on the site otherwise i would let you all know. its time we stopped being such nice guys!


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## Pipp

As noted, we can reproduce other media. (If you returned my calls, I'd be able to tell you the plan for action!) 

Roslyn has an awesome list of all the best places to email protests, I'm just looking for it but if you have it, please post it. 

And I just posted this on my Facebook page: 

_"On Thursday evening, Smith said she could see about two dozen rabbits in 
her field and another four dozen in a neighbouring field, but she has no
intention of allowing Vickery on her property to catch them.âI will deal with the rabbits on my land in whatever way I have to,â she said." 

Barbara Smith has children and grandchildren, w...hat is she teaching them? This woman also runs a competitive trail riding association (http://www.bcctra.ca) which also attracts young riders, would you want this attitude passed on to those kids? The association is sponsored by Cavallo, a horse equipment company (http://www.cavallo-inc.com), I'd never support a company supporting this kind of carnage towards small animals. Saving the rest of the rabbits is going to take fast action and a LOT of pressure, please contact all involved and make your feelings known before its too late. 



_


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## Bill Jesse

I think we are past emails. My emails to the SPCA, the RCMP, the Law Society all went unanswered. I spoke with a constable at the Oceanside RCMP detachment who said he would try to appease her but other than that he has no legal gounds to stop her.


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## Purple Mountain Rabbitry

does the lady truly understand what these rabbits went through. Maybe that could help apease her. But then again maybe not. I know plenty of people that don't care anything for the animals themselves, just the buck they can make off of them. I've met enough kill buyers (people that buy horses for meat.) to know that they simply want to make a buck off of them. My opion is this lady knows what these rabbit have gone through and doesn't care she just wants her 15 minutes of fame wether its good or not. SHE DOES NOT CARE. people like her never do and beleive me there is no changing her mind,beleive me I know her kind and I have tried to no avail. But I will keep praying that she will change her mind and allow them to be recaptured.


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## Bill Jesse

I do not think she is into kill buying as she is a director of a riding group. Nonetheless her attitude towards the rabbits is scary. Maybe she knows what they went through, maybe not. To her they are pests that must be eliminated. The mere fact that she thinks the "problem" will spread and the fact she considers them rodents makes me believe she does not care or have any idea.


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## Purple Mountain Rabbitry

No I don't think she is a kill buyer. I just know alot of them that have attitudes just like hers. She just doesn't care. We had that problem here in Idaho way back when and look where that got us. Not very far and It caused alot more problems than it was worth alot of problems were are still dealing with today. TheMinistry of Enviroment peoplereally need to read our Idaho History. Maybe that will change their mind about eliminating rabbits. i will have to see if I can dig up the story again. It really makes you think twice about allowing people to just kill at will.


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## Bill Jesse

The Ministry of Environment claims that any rabbit that has been abandoned for more than 30 days is now "owned" by the government. When we tried to remove rabbits from the campus at the university we had to have permits from the MoE as we were removing wildlife. Yet anyone could shoot or kill them without. Of course proving that the rabbits that were taken had been on campus for more than 30 days would be impossible. The MoE is a typical red tape bureacracy and nothing changes their mind. When we dealt with the ministry we were also dealing with graduates of that university who work for the ministry. Something akin to an "old boys club".


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## Pipp

*Bill Jesse wrote: *


> I think we are past emails. My emails to the SPCA, the RCMP, the Law Society all went unanswered. I spoke with a constable at the Oceanside RCMP detachment who said he would try to appease her but other than that he has no legal gounds to stop her.


Unanswered is good. Hopefully that means they're getting too many to respond to. When they have the time to answer, that's when I question the volume. 

We're talking 'pressure' and 'opinion'. Right now they're reading the pro-death responses on the media articles and they're thinking that public opinion is on their side.

Civil disobedience means interfering in a non-violent manner, but doing something that HAS to be addressed, like going after third party supporters/suppliers, is very effective! 

That said, Smith's husband's website is www.rickcoonce.com.


sas


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## cheryl

Oh my gosh...after everything..this happens!....poor bunnies


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## Sweetie

Poor little bunnies. That lady is truly heartless. I would love to give that lady a piece of my mind about killing those innocent little bunnies.


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## Sweetie

I don't know if anyone tried to explain to the lady that rabbits are not a nuisance like rats or other wildlife, but maybe it would get her to listen if she knew the facts about rabbits.


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## nabhraj

This is the letter I sent to the TC and other places:

Apart from the obvious humanitarian and ethical considerations which I assume most people take for granted, I would like to remind the person who ordered the shooting of many rescued bunnies from the sanctuary in Coombs that her action shows no respect or consideration for the many hours of work that numerous compassionate vets donated with much effort in their spare time or even on weekends to spay/neuter those rabbits. It can take one hour to sterilize one female so one can easily figure out the total hours that they have devoted to do this and that have now been wasted. Also, the author of this action shows no respect whatsoever for the many members of the public including myself who have donated much time and money to this cause. I hold this person personally responsible for this loss. I expect a lawyer to at least be able to understand losses of time and money if nothing else.


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## Bill Jesse

Nice and to the point. I hope they publish it although the T-C is very anti-rabbit.


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## nabhraj

They posted yours today on their website. But how many people read the TC online on Mondays?


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## Bill Jesse

I am surprised they did. Must check it out. Incidentally do we know each other?


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## nabhraj

I recognize your name from letters you wrote previously to the TC. I did write a few myself.


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## Bill Jesse

Seems I cannot get TC on-line. Can you email me the link please.


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## nabhraj

you just type www.timescolonist.com and then scroll down. You will see: Letters: deer, rabbits etc and click the link.


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## Bill Jesse

Found it thanks.


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## Bill Jesse

Seems like there was another rabbit death today when this same woman sicced her dog on a group of rabbits. The dog apparently killed one which was a pet of the sanctuary operator. Rumour has it the wildlife people will be investigating as its against the law for dogs to harass (and kill) wildlife. This has got to end.


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## Purple Mountain Rabbitry

hopefully the wildlife officials will get her to stop. knock on wood and praying. can you look up wildlife laws and see? it would be very interesting to know. maybe this could be the loop hole to getting the rabbits back. you know if it is against the law for dogs to harrass them then maybe the wildlife people can get you on the land to get the rabbits out of danger.

RIP little bunny binky free at the rainbow bridge


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## Bill Jesse

First of all and I may have mentioned this before. Rabbits were deemed wildlife by the Ministry of Environment so they could be killed as pests. The first massacre cannot be upheld legally. It is illegal to have wildlife harassed or killed by roaming dogs. This is why they are investigating it now.


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## nabhraj

If I don't get a reply from the law society by tomorrow I will write back. They promised a formal acknowledgment of the complaint.


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## Bill Jesse

I wrote them on Wednesday and never received any acknowledgement. Nothing from anyone at the SPCA either.


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## nabhraj

The society says they expect lawyers to behave better than normal people even outside of their profession. I personally expect everybody to rise above the law and behave ethically and with integrity. And lawyers should give the example.


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## Bill Jesse

I guess you haven't dealt with too many lawyers have you?? Integrity?
Who once said those famous words "kill all the lawyers!"
All kidding aside this person is obviously deranged. One of our group knows someone who worked or articled in her office and claims she is crazy. After her actions this week its fairly obvious. Sadly it seems like nothing is really being done about this slaughter and it will probably continue.


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## Purple Mountain Rabbitry

It should be a loop hole. if "It is illegal to have wildlife harassed or killed by roaming dogs" then maybe you can use it as a loophole to get the rabbits back.you know the dog harrassing the wildlife so the wildlife must be removed to get them out of harms way(the harassing dog is the harm).I have 3 generations of cops in my family I know how to turn laws around and figure out loopholes. Lawyers are not easy to deal with and they are not a good example of anything. 96% of what comes out of a lawyers mouth is BS. At least thats what my grandpa tells me. he was a cop for 29 years like his father before him and his father before him. lol.

I am hoping and praying that this investigation turns in the rabbits favor and they can be recaptured


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## nabhraj

I hope so too. Good night for now.


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## tonyshuman

Most lawyers are upstanding people and they do have to be held to a stricter code of ethics to be members of the Bar. They take an oath when being admitted to the Bar that requires them to uphold certain ethical guidelines. Many people dislike lawyers because they often have to represent people who did wrong things, but that is part of their job, and if there was nobody there to stand up for people who have made bad decisions and need help, the smallest mistake could ruin a person's life. Coming from a family of lawyers, it is unfair to classify all lawyers as bad people. Some lawyers do bad things, just like some doctors do bad things, but most of what most lawyers do helps people and helps justice to be served.

It was clear to me from the first instance (the bunnies that were killed by guns) that this woman is not the ethical pillar of her community that a lawyer should be. This second action with the dog makes it beyond clear that she has committed a crime and should not only be disbarred but have some criminal charges brought against her.


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## jcl_24

Facebook Group against the actions of the woman who killed the rescue centre's escaped rabbits:-

http://www.facebook.com/#!/group.php?gid=166549806691602


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## ladysown

they are vermin on her property. Sorry...but the lady raises horses...rabbits dig holes...ergo to her they are a danger to her hobby/livelihood. So it behooves her to have them removed as soon as possible. DO NOT blame her (except for the siccing the dog on them) for taking action against these rabbit. Blame the rescue for not taking proper action to secure the animals.

Could things have been handled better by all parties concerned? yes. But don't be tarring a lady for protecting her land and her livestock.


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## Pipp

I don't think you're going to win too many friends here if you consider rabbits 'vermin'. You've certainly lost my vote. 

To answer your question in your introduction, we are primarily a rabbit health and welfare-oriented forum, so killing them doesn't exactly fit our mandate. 

The issue in this case is the alternatives available and the time frame. There is some question as to the how hard she tried to facilitate removing them alive, and exactly how long they were on the property -- the rescuers say hours, she says days. Neither are long enough to do damage. (Rabbits don't randomly burrow in the middle of a field). 

And yes, both parties can equally share blame, but actions fueled by ego and testosterone that cost innocent lives are not acceptable from other side. 

The bottom line is this woman would not allow the rescuers on the property to retrieve the rabbits and as far as I know, she still hasn't. This boils down to killing the rabbits over some personal 'tiff', this is not concern for her horses.



sas :grumpy:


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## Bill Jesse

If she was so concerned about the welfare of her horses then why has she refused to allow rescuers on her property to retrieve the remaining rabbits? Is she just waiting for them to dig holes to prove a point?


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## ladysown

i used the terminology vermin to describe what nuisance wildlife are...just like rats and mice and coyotes and deer.

not saying there isn't fault on both sides. BUT she did call and say your rabbits are here, remove them. They said "give us a few days". She didn't want that, she wanted them gone immediately. AND quite frankly I don't blame her. I'd want them gone immediately as well...before they dug themselves in.

Mind...if they were still there after a few days I'd accept any help I could get... BUT there might be mitigating circumstances...such as AVID animal rights activists that you don't want on your property under any circumstances.

Once you've been hit by AR people, you don't want to be hit again. THEY AREN'T NICE and they most certainly don't play fair. Notice how everyone is taking the rescues side and villifying the horse neighbour?

is there continuing fault on both sides? yes there is.

but nuisance wildlife IS vermin...even if it is cute and cuddly as well.

Siccing the dog on rabbits that are on someone else's property SHOULD be a punishable offense. But are they punished? not usually...ask the countless numbers of rabbits that are killed because a dog off leash goes after a pet bunny on a lawn, or breaks into the neighbours rabbitry? 

Punished...nope. AND often is shrugged off as "dogs will be dogs".


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## Bill Jesse

You have a valid point but I do not think the rescuers were AR types. From what I understand it was the volunteer contingent that wanted to get the rabbits.


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## ladysown

"From what I understand it was the volunteer contingent that wanted to get the rabbits." but that's your conjecture right? that's talking like someone who has never had to deal with animal rights people. WHO...even if you are doing everything right (by established animal husbandry standards) have the mental philosopy of "how dare you"!!!! do it differently than what "I SAY" is right.

I've learned to view most rescue people with cautious eyes.
Many are AR types...even mildly.
And messing with them is just asking for trouble.

She (as a lawyer) might well have that same viewpoint. Be cautious, very very cautious. AND DO NOT let them onto your land if you have any reason to be suspicious of them.


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## Bill Jesse

Its not conjecture. I know the people who were involved and I am an animal rescuer, having saved many of the university rabbits myself. AR me? Sorry, not even mildly.


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## ladysown

You are upset because someone chose to remove animals from their property. That they didn't allow animal rescue people on to their property AFTER the animal rescue people (as reported in the paper in the first account I read of this) waffled as to when they would come. That they did not come over IMMEDIATELY was the issue. 

An animal of mine on property that didn't belong to me...I would have been over IMMEDIATELY to retrieve said animals. Not hours later, not days later, Immediately. That didn't happen. This landowner exercised her rights to protect her property. The rescuers were in the wrong. Be very clear on that.

yes, it's sad, it's annoying that they weren't given a second chance to remedy the situation. I agree with you there. (see...agreement).

But villifying the landowner for taking lawful legal action to protect her property...I am not okay with that.

Just like farmers have the right to shoot stray dogs, this lady has the right to trap, kill or otherwise remove unwanted stray animals from her property. Rabbits are stray animals and she chose to remove them from her property her own way. 

WOULD I Have preferred that she catch them and say here... take them back? Yeah, sure. But coming from a farming background I understand her saying Okay...I called you, you didn't come over immediately, therefore I took care of the problem. That's what farmers do. EVEN IF her primary job is a lawyer, she has land, she has horses....that makes her a farmer. And farmers do have the right to remove a feral, invasive species from their property.

The fact that there are still rabbits on her property shows just how invasive they can be. Female rabbis dig very fast and build tunnels in the ground like you wouldn't believe. 

I used to put my female rabbits out on the grass...but the speed at which they dig holes was enough for me to say...NOPE... no more girls out on the grass. In an hour on the grass they'd have 3-8 inch deep holes dug. Not fun tripping in those, or having to fill them in.


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## Bill Jesse

Your comments were about the AR types. I did not agree with her shooting the rabbits and I do not like the fact they were not well contained as per the Ministry of Environment regulations - even though they approved it.
Another fact is the newspaper changed the story at least twice so I would not rely on them as gospel.
Female rabbits burrowing? Yes they do but at this moment I have 3 in a grassy pen where they have been for 2 hours and sorry no holes yet. Never ever found one. Maybe yours are bored.
Anyway you have gone to great lengths to make your point - not to mention time - and I thank you for it. Incidentally if you want more fuel for your fire go to www.islandhorses.com and look for the topic on the Coombs shooting. You will find allies there and also some who disagree.


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## tonyshuman

I would like to remind everyone to please be civil in your comments. We do not allow name-calling, attacks, or a failure to "agree to disagree".


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## Bill Jesse

name calling? un-civil? attacks?
very well. adios amigos!


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## Pipp

Bill Jesse wrote:


> name calling? un-civil? attacks?
> very well. adios amigos!



I don't think TH was accusing anyone, especially you, she was just quoting from the rules. I found your responses very thoughtful and civil. (Except for maybe the 'who crapped in your cornflakes' line its response, which I see was edited out).

Unless of course you mean you don't want to participate because you can't call people names, be uncivil and attack.  But I don't think so. 


sas :coolness:


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## jcottonl02

If they really did say 'give us a few days to retrieve them' I find that incredibly strange...and I am a little bewildered......

You don't want harm to come to your buns yet you will leave them 'free' for days where any wild animal can get them? :S

IF that's true of course. Might not be.

Incidentally I think what she did was disgusting. Foul in every sense.

Jen


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## Purple Mountain Rabbitry

I agree. why would people who worked so hard to save these bunnies leave them in a place where they could get hurt or killed easily? doesn't make sense to me.

Crystal


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## canadagirl

I just read the whole thing and I vote that Ladysown is the voice of reason in the thread. Honestly, if I found 30 rabbits in my precious horse pasture I would flip right out. No I wouldn't shoot the rabbits, but I would want to. If they got out once whats to say they were not going to get out time and time again? 30 rabbits could do a LOT of damage and eat a pile of crops. And if they were not captured right away they could turn into 300 pretty quick. 300 is a lot harder to shot than 30. 

I am not sure of the facts, but I believe land owner should have given them a chance to remove them ASAP (not sure if that happened...is anyone sure?) then the rescue should have been out there with as many live traps as they could catching them. 

But I also wouldn't be keen on a whole bunch of strangers traipsing around MY animals....so I am not really sure what the real answer is. I just know I would be some mad to find thirty of any sort of animal loose on my property. 

Just to make myself clear. I personally would NOT shoot any animal of any sort. I don't like the fact that the rabbits go shot and I think its a darn shame, but at the same time I understand why they got shot.


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## tonyshuman

Unfortunately some of the important facts are missing. We don't know for sure how long the rabbits were on the neighbor's property. We don't know if the neighbor gave the rescue notice before shooting the bunnies, and if they did, we don't know how much time they gave the rescue. Unfortunately, these questions will take a long time to answer, and since everybody's arguments seem to hinge on these issues, we can't come to a conclusion at the moment.

I was trying to remind people to be civil and was paraphrasing the forum rules, found here:
http://www.rabbitsonline.net/view_topic.php?id=11860&forum_id=14

Please remember (quoted from there)
Unacceptable Behavior (Subject to Warnings):

- name calling

- ridiculing of another's opinion

- failure to 'agree to disagree'

- the posting of obviously inflammatory topics (eg: rabbit meat, breeder vs. animal rights attacks)

- overly abrasive or negative posts on any topic

- personal vendettas


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## jcottonl02

That's so true. We don't know the facts. JUst the media's side, facebook groups etc. so we really aren't sure what exactly went on.

I understand if she really really didn't want them on her property and wanted them removed ASAP, but why didn't she (i doubt she did this) call the rescue, and then join them in helping get the rabbits? This way she would be able to supervise etc. and be doing something constructive to help. It doesn't seem like anything was really....tried. I just think killing them should really have been a last resort.

Thing is...these are pet rabbits. They aren't wild animals etc. It's like someone's cat straying on your property and you shooting it because it might pooh in your garden.  very sad.

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion here, though. Some people may own horses and really understand the damage a rabbit can do. I personally don't so I don't know if they do at all, but they could do.

I think there was definately wrong doing on both parts. I'm sure you'd notice 30 rabbits gone from your yard, whether you got a phone call or not...so wouldn't you be out IMMEDIATELY to get them back?

Jen


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## canadagirl

tonyshuman 

- the posting of obviously inflammatory topics (eg: rabbit meat, breeder vs. animal rights attacks)
[/quote]

Rabbit meat is obviously inflammatory??? Maybe I am in the wrong forum.....


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## Pipp

canadagirl wrote:


> Rabbit meat is obviously inflammatory??? Maybe I am in the wrong forum.....



I'm editing your post. 

Yes, you have joined the wrong forum. I suggest maybe Rabbit Talk or the Rabbit Habit (I'm sure you can look them up), but Rabbitsonline.net is not the place for you, sorry. 



sas :expressionless


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## canadagirl

So I am not welcome at all? Gee thanks. Even though I SAID I wasn't going to cause trouble or say the M word. Awesome. I thought I found a goldmine here with the wealth of information but apparently I have to leave. :?


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## Pipp

canadagirl wrote:


> And if they were not captured right away they could turn into 300 pretty quick. 300 is a lot harder to shot than 30.



These rabbits were rescues, all spayed/neutered. 

This topic has run its course. The RB forum is for announcing and paying tribute to lost bunnies, its not for debating the manner of their deaths. 


sas


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