# Overdue Netherland Dwarf Doe



## Velveteen Lop (Jan 31, 2019)

Hello!
So, I have bred bunnies before, I've been breeding for about 4 years, maybe longer, but this is my first time breeding NDs. On Monday evening (three days ago), my BEW doe kindled two dead kits, one was stuck, other was malformed. She kindled a day early (was due Tuesday). My other doe, a solid black, Raven, was due same time as her, but is now a couple days overdue. Now, I've had late bunnies before, but I'm worried about her, this is her second litter. The first she kindled a baby fine, dead, but then she had a stuck kit. I just really need your guys input and advice and word of reassurance. 

She's definitely pregnant, palpated positive, and showing aggression, growling, lunging at your hand, the whole works! And the date is correct as well. She's got plenty of hay that she seems only interested in eating, and hasn't pulled fur or shown any signs of nesting yet. I know the dangers of very late kindling, and I'm getting worked up over this girl. I'm trying to be patient, haha. So any advice I would love to hear!


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## Khloe (Jan 31, 2019)

You could try to get her into labor by having her run in a pen inside or just around your house. I also heard tums work to get a doe into labor. I wouldn't worry to much, but once she reaches 35 days, I would start to worry. Good luck!


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## majorv (Jan 31, 2019)

I usually started worrying when they were 2-3 days overdue. You could try the suggestion of getting her to run around. You could also try putting a buck close by. If you choose to put the buck with her then watch them very close for aggression, and don’t let the buck mate. We never really found the tums to help. Short of that you could take her to the vet where they can induce labor. They also might take an X-ray to see how many she has.


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## Velveteen Lop (Feb 1, 2019)

majorv said:


> You could try the suggestion of getting her to run around. You could also try putting a buck close by.





Khloe said:


> You could try to get her into labor by having her run in a pen inside or just around your house.



I just put her with the buck, but kept a close eye on the two, he never mounted, she just kept running away in distress, but never attacked him. I then let her run around, so we'll see. I also palpated her again after that, but felt nothing. I know for sure she had kits in there. Maybe she birthed some unhealthy ones and ate them....? I'm going to give her a few more days, palpate, then see about rebreeding her. Thanks you guys!


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## Velveteen Lop (Feb 3, 2019)

Update: She’s started gathering nesting materials, not pulling fur yet. She’s 5 days overdue, is it possible she’s still holding the babies? Or a fake pregnancy?


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## majorv (Feb 3, 2019)

It’s possible but at this point, if they are 5 days overdue they probably won’t be alive.


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## Binkis Mum (Feb 4, 2019)

Please let us know how she is.. I understand you are worried, but it is very interesting. I've spayed mine, so I wont go through this


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## Velveteen Lop (Feb 4, 2019)

Binkis Mum said:


> Please let us know how she is.. I understand you are worried, but it is very interesting. I've spayed mine, so I wont go through this


Of course! I checked on her this morning, she had destroyed the nest she made last night (I checked on her before I went to bed), she had made a nice little nest with just hay, no fur. I palpated her again, no babies. When I put her with the buck though, she was panicking and running around trying to escape, so I took her out thinking she maybe had a baby? This was last night. I'll keep an eye on her today and try to rebreed her. I'll let you know how that goes!
Edit: Or maybe because of her hormones, she still thinks she's pregnant.


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## Velveteen Lop (Feb 5, 2019)

I just checked on Raven this morning. She had pulled fur and rearranged the nest she destroyed. I checked, but no babies. She did the grunting when I reached towards her to pick her up, so I just left her alone. 
On another note, my other bun pulled some fur and made a nest, but she's not due until tomorrow. I know its not common for that to happen, but does that mean she's not pregnant? Opinions on early nest making?


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## majorv (Feb 5, 2019)

Making a nest 1-2 days before is normal. For Raven, you could always take her to a vet for an X-ray if you want confirmation, but at this point it doesn’t sound like she is.


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## Velveteen Lop (Feb 6, 2019)

majorv said:


> Making a nest 1-2 days before is normal. For Raven, you could always take her to a vet for an X-ray if you want confirmation, but at this point it doesn’t sound like she is.


 Agreed. I tried to rebreed Raven, again she freaked, so I took her out. I'm going to let her settle down and try in a couple days. 
With my other bun, she kindled this morning, between 3 and 5:50, one looks like it was DOA and the other could've been DOA. They were both dead, she only had two. Thank for your guys help!


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## Velveteen Lop (Feb 6, 2019)

This probably needs to be another thread, but the doe that kindled two dead kits, I checked on her and noticed that she was noticeably slimmer than before, and now I think about it, her appetite has been down as well. I flipped her over to check her vulva (I’m now paranoid about my pregnant buns since I had a stuck kit) and it is very swollen and a dark red. I just cleaned out her hutch with new shavings, and can see spots of blood. I know that is is common for blood after kindling, but this seems different. I just wanted to know your guys thoughts before I take her to the vet (either way I’m going to wait in case she just needs time, highly doubt it though...) and any suggestions.


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## majorv (Feb 6, 2019)

If you continue seeing spots of blood then you do need to get her to a vet, just to be safe.


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## Velveteen Lop (Feb 7, 2019)

majorv said:


> If you continue seeing spots of blood then you do need to get her to a vet, just to be safe.


Yes, definitely. I checked her last night, and the swelling has gone down a bit and she hasn’t bled anymore that’s what’s already there.


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## Velveteen Lop (Feb 12, 2019)

Binkis Mum said:


> Please let us know how she is.. I understand you are worried, but it is very interesting. I've spayed mine, so I wont go through this


Hey! I'm not trying to bump this thread or anything, I know Binkis Mum wanted to know how Raven is doing, and it could be helpful to others who are looking in the future. I've been directed to this site many times when searching for answers. 
So in regards to Raven, she was pregnant. Turns out, I made the one mistake I was so sure I didn't, and was confident I would never make. Her due date. I am lucky though that I put down the dates I breed them, I just never put in my calendar the date she should kindle. So I was never planning on it, only the date from two weeks earlier. I had bred her December 29th and was planning on a late January kindling, but then I guess I had palpated her and felt nothing, so rebred her January 12th. Turns out, I kept the first kindling date (January 29th) and never put in the second (February 12th). She pulled some fur and made a nest (I posted that above) but no babies. 
I then for some reason kept her nestbox in there, and put fresh hay in it, and never took it out, because she never ate the hay from it or dumped it out. I am so glad I didn't. I came home from work yesterday (February 11th) to learn that my brother found that Raven had pulled fur and made a nice fluffy nest, kindled three healthy babies, but they were chilled. My mom warmed them all up, but only one was revived. The baby was so small and skinny, and I was worried about it. We tried to have it nurse, but it wouldn't. The baby was just cold, and searching for warmth, so we got the mom and baby situated inside. I woke up this morning, worried about the baby. We checked on it, thinking we'd have to help it nurse, but pulled it out and saw a plump little tummy! 

Raven is taking good care of this baby, and I have learned a very important lesson, experiencing it firsthand. ALWAYS check your dates. Even an experienced breeder can slip up sometimes. Thank you all for your help!

For my other bun that kindled two dead kits, the swelling went down significantly, and she's eating again. I'm keeping a close eye on her, but it looks like she'll be just fine.


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## Binkis Mum (Feb 12, 2019)

Glad to hear mum and one kit doing well


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## majorv (Feb 14, 2019)

So glad you didn’t take out the box! So she pulled hair for the nest but didn’t cover them? I’m glad one made it !


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