# Small animal auctions, a rant



## gentle giants (May 23, 2006)

Last night I went to a small animal auction looking for a few ducks to be pals for the ones we already have. I have been to these before, and it always bothers me, but it was especially sad this time. 
There are always a lot of rabbits there that the owners have brought to sell when they get sick or old, instead of taking care of them. Last night, there was one in particular that I simply couldn't walk away from. To make a long story short, I now have a Rex doe that is in very bad shape. 
She is emaciated, as in her ribs are protruding and her head looks too big for her body. She has sore hocks, and what looks like the beginnings of ear mites. Her fur is falling/has fallen out in big patches. The sale tag said she is bred, due June 20. She has come off another litter so recently she is still lactating. 
Does anyone know what could have made her fur fall out like that? I am going to get her on vitamins and all that, hopeing to get her back in condition before she kindles again. I am going to try a cat ear mite medicine on her to try and fix that. As sad as it is, it might be better for her if she miscarries. I don't know how she could survive kindling again, and nursing kits, unless I can make a huge difference in her condition before she is due. If anyone has any ideas to help out, I would really apprecite hearing them. I am going to try getting pics of her up, if she will let me take some. She is very nervous and scared of being handled.


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## TrixieRabbit (May 23, 2006)

I don't have much advice, as I am no rabbit expert, but I think it's great that you rescued this poor, tired soul. Good luck!


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## LuvaBun (May 23, 2006)

Bless you for taking this poor girl home - she sounds like she is in a sorry state. Afraid I can't help much - I know someone else was concerned about their Rex losing a lot of fur. Hopefully Pam, or someone else can help you more. let us know how she gets on.

Jan


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## gentle giants (May 24, 2006)

Here are pics of the doe, who I have decided to call Charity. I am hoping the hair falling out is from malnutrition, but I am still being very careful to keep her away from my other rabbits, feeding her last and all that.


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## gentle giants (May 24, 2006)

Side view, shows how thin her fur is.


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## gentle giants (May 24, 2006)

One more, showing how thin she is.


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## Eve (May 24, 2006)

Aww, the poor little thing! She is so extremely lucky that yougot her. I thinkwhat you didis really wonderful, you have probably saved her life.:kiss:

Do you know how old she is?


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## SweetPeasMommie (May 24, 2006)

Oh bless your big heart for taking this poor girl. She sure looks like a beautiful girl as well. I love the name Charity and it suits her.

Now I am mad for careless people in the world


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## BACI (May 24, 2006)

Wow, she is lucky you found her. I can't believe people are so neglectful. She is cute and with a little love will make a great pet. She seems friendly and does not seem to mind being handled. I am sorry for all those others that did not get saved, bought.. you know what I mean.


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## Pipp (May 24, 2006)

I can't believe they bred her in that condition. 

Do you have NutriCal? I'm assuming alfalfa hay and pellets will also be good. 

And hopefully Pam or somebody more knowledgeable will chime in here,but I always thought one shouldn't usecat mite medication on rabbits, because they're a different mite. Maybe mineral oilfor the time being just to play it safe?? 

(And BACI, it's probably more like she's too weak to fight being handled). 

Oh, and I've got a thread on here about hair loss in mini rexes, and it's looking like some of them do lose their fur in clumps during a normal molt, so that might be at least part of the problem.'Tis the season to be molting. 

Let us know how it's going. 

And you're a wonderful human being. Your kindness brings me to tears. Bless you. 

:hug:

sas and the warren


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## Pipp (May 24, 2006)

I'm moving thisto the Infirmary (or maybe the Rabbitry?).I think your new little adoptee isgoing to need some expert advice.


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## m.e. (May 24, 2006)

I'm just seeing this. That poor, sweet baby  I wish I had more in the way of advice to offer, but hopefully our more knowledgeable members will pitch in. I just wanted to say what a wonderful thing it is that you rescued this gal, and I wish you the best of luck!


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## Pipp (May 24, 2006)

Let's try the Rabbitry... 

:anyone:


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## pamnock (May 24, 2006)

She probably pulled a lot of it out from the previous litter. Could be fur mites, fungal infection, bacterial, molt, parasites, nutritional deficiencyor genetic. 

Best bet is to get her to a vet to rule out a fungal infection that could spread to you or other rabbits.

Nutri-Cal would give her a much needed calorie boost.



Pam


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## gentle giants (May 24, 2006)

I'm ordering the Nutri-Cal for her out of a catalog. I don't think the fur loss could be from normal molt, it is down to bare skin, as in no fur left at all in places. I am keeping her separate from my other rabbits, and I take a shower after handling her.
Pipp, you suggested mineral oil--would olive oil or vegetable oil be ok, since I don't have any mineral oil? I just want to get this stopped before it gets really bad. I've seen pics of rabbits with severe cases of ear mites, and it about made me sick. 
Once she gets back in condition, and has weaned the litter she is carrying (assuming she is able to have a live litter)I think I will get her spayed. She deserves a break, and I know I will definatly never breed her.

Oh, and is it ok to use Neosporin on her sore hocks? I have her in a solid bottom cage, BTW, because of her feet.


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## Pipp (May 24, 2006)

I'd hold off on the vegetable oil until somebody with more experience can chime in here. I know certain oils and treatments can damage the inner ear. Even the mineral oilis a temp solution. 

I'll look around and see what I can find online.

sas


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## pamnock (May 24, 2006)

*gentle giants wrote: *


> Oh, and is it ok to use Neosporin on her sore hocks? I have her in a solid bottom cage, BTW, because of her feet.




I like to use Desitin because itsticks so well.Rubber mats or dry padding in the cage can be used to help relieve some of the pressure from her feet.

Pam


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## naturestee (May 24, 2006)

That poor thing. I'm so glad you picked her up! It's definately time for her to have something good in her life.


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## Pipp (May 24, 2006)

Naturestee is checking some things inthe Resource Center. (She's way better at this than me).  

Meanwhile, here's some threads on ear mites... 

http://rabbitsonline.net/view_topic.php?id=11323&amp;forum_id=1

http://rabbitsonline.net/view_topic.php?id=2994&amp;forum_id=1

*And here's some info froma commercial rabbitry:* 

Ear Mites (Ear Mange, Canker)
This is the most common external parasite infection of the domestic rabbit. An infected rabbit shakes its head and flops or scratches its ears trying to rid itself of mites. Thick crusts of mites and serum will accumulate inside the ear. In severe cases symptoms include spasms of eye muscles, nerve damage resulting in partial paralysis, weight loss, and secondary infections of the ears. 

_Treatment_ 

Massage mineral oil into the ear every third day for four applications.The mineral oil will smother the mites. Follow-up applications smother mites hatching from eggs. 
Another treatment is swabbing the ear with a mixture of 1 partiodoform, 10 parts ether, and 25 partsvegetableoil.Remove all scales and crust before swabbing the ear. Repeat treatment 6to 10 days after first treatment. An alternate swabbing solution is25-30% emulsion of benzyl benzoate in vegetable oil. 
Treat all animals near the infected animal. Treat all newly introduced animals to prevent the ear mite from entering the rabbitry. 

*Here's one from a HOME REMEDIES site.*

*EAR MITES*

"I use a mix of apple cider vinegar in olive oil. First, clean the earwith a Q-tip, removing the brown waxy build-up. Then, with a dropper, drop 6 or 7 drops in each ears, holding the earflap closed for a few minutes after each treatment to keep bunny from shaking the oil all over you. A few tablespoons of apple cider vinegar in the water bottle is also supposed to act as a repellant and general tonic. Handy stuff...a basic for any bunny medicine cabinet!

*This one says it's okay...* 

Q. What is the treatment for Ear Canker (ear mites)?
A. Mineral or vegetable oil or ear mite medication.


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## naturestee (May 24, 2006)

Here's two threads on ear mites that talk about using oil. I think you can use vegetable oil, although mineral oil might be easier to work with. You should be able to get a small bottle at a regular pharmacy. With either kind, just use a little bit, and only use it in the ears. 

http://rabbitsonline.net/view_topic.php?id=777&amp;forum_id=1&amp;highlight=mite

Ivermectin would be better. You *can* buy the horse stuff and self-dose, although since she's in such bad condition and pregnant I don't know if that would be a good idea.

I'd definately keep this girl quaranteened and far away from your rabbits, wash your hands, etc., until you know the causes for all of this and it's treated. It could be from nutritional problems and frequent litters, but it could also be fungal issues, ringworm,mange (another mite issue, treatable with ivermectin) etc.


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## Pipp (May 24, 2006)

*Oh yeah... forgot to mention the ear mite meds for cats... depends on the ingredients, but here's some info on that: 
*

Generic Name
*Rotenone*, Pyrethrins

Brand Names
*Rotenone: Ear Mitecide, Ear Mite Lotion, Ear Miticide*

Pyrethrins: Cerumite, Mita-Clear, Drs. Foster and Smith Miticide, Nolvamite

Type of Drug
Insecticide

Form and Storage
Drops and lotion
Store at room temperature.

Indications for Use
Treatment of ear mites in dogs, cats, and rabbits.

General Information
FDA approved for use in treating ear mites in dogs and cats. *Rotenone is also approved for use inrabbits.* Available by prescription and over the counter. Ear mites are passed from one infested animal to another through close enough contact that the mite has time to crawl from one to the other such as from a mother dog or cat and to her offspring. Typically, ears infested with ear mites have a dark waxy, flaky debris in them, similar to coffee grounds. Both ears are usually affected. The mites can be easily seen under a microscope at low power. Once the mites are gone, they will not recur unless the pet is exposed to another animal with them again (such as a new puppy or kitten in the house).

Usual Dose and Administration
It is essential to clean ears before applying the medication. Apply amount of drops or lotion according to label. Massage in well and wipe excess from the flap and inside of the ear. Repeat every 2-3 days for4-8 weeks. Note that this may be a longer period of treatment than that described on the label, but it has been found that to treat less often or for a shorter time period, the mites may not be eliminated. Other medications such as ivermectin injections have been shown to treat ear mites and have frequently been used, although ivermectin has not been FDA-approved for this use. Contact your veterinarian if you have difficulty treating your pet or you have a large number of pets to treat.

Side Effects
Unlikely. May see skin irritation. Cats may drool when ears are cleaned.

Contraindications/Warnings
Not for use in patients hypersensitive (allergic) to the drug.

All types may not be for use in patients less than 7 weeks of age. Readthe labels. Contact your veterinarian before treating young animals.

Need to treat all the dogs, cats, and rabbits in the house at the same time, or they will reinfest each other again.

If poor response to treatment or the symptoms recur, it may be an earinfection and not mites or an ear infection in addition to mites.Contact your veterinarian.

May be toxic to fish and other aquatic life. Dispose of container properly.

If medication comes in contact with pet's eyes, flush eyes thoroughly and contact your veterinarian.

Drug or Food Interactions
Unlikely to have drug or food interactions.

If using a topical ear antibiotic also,separate treatments by several hours to allow the first medication time to work before it is removed during application of second product.

Overdose/Toxicity
Unlikely with the ear drops or lotion.


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## naturestee (May 24, 2006)

I'm going to link two Rabbit Health References threads so you can find them easier:

Fur Mites
Ear Mites

I've heard of fur mites being treated with Listerine. It's messy and it would need multiple applications, but you could try it for now until you can get her to a vet.

And a couple of other articles that might help. It's hard to tell what it might be from this end of the computer.

Fur Loss and Skin Problems in Rabbits
Ringworm FAQ(rabbits can be treated with Program, again be careful with her poorcondition and pregnancy)

Hope that helps a bit.


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## Starlight Rabbitry (May 24, 2006)

Wow, I am just seeing this.My friend raises Rex and when they molt, they lose their fur inpatches. Looks like someone plucks it from them in no particular pattern. Could be from molt. It is not unheard of that a mother will pluck ALL her fur to make a nest. Happen to me once. 

However, since you got this rabbit from an outside source and don't know the history or person who had her before you, I would take her tothe vet or in the very least keep her away from your other animals. Like Pam said, could be fungus too.

Sharon


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## gentle giants (May 24, 2006)

Thanks, everybody for the links and info. The home remedies thing about mixing apple cider vinegar and olive oil sounds like it would be perfect, I have both of those things on hand.How much of what do I use, though? All my rabbits already get acv in their drinking water. 
I have Charity separated from all my other rabbits, and always handle/feed her after all the others are done. I didn't know about mites possibly coming in in the litter you use, though. 
I am planning on taking her to the vet, but I have to wait to get paid first, have no moola right now.


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## Spring (May 24, 2006)

There's a livestock auction, probably around 20 minutes away from my house.. I stopped going there. My cousin works there, but hates it. She has probably rescued maybe around 15-20 rabbits that were almost dead like Charity. Sometimes if the owners can't make it on saturday, they drop the rabbits off On Friday and they spend the night in cramped cages, with no food or water. It's sickening. 

One of the does she rescued had lots of fur loss like Charity, and my cousin thinks because she was to the point where she was so starved, she started trying to eat her own fur. 

Poor souls.. Just shows how little respect some disgrace full humans have for such innocent creatures.

I hope she recovers wellray:


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## naturestee (May 26, 2006)

How's she doing today?


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## SunnieBunnie Rabbitry (May 26, 2006)

*pamnock wrote: *


> Shepro bably pulled a lot of it out from the previous litter.Could be fur mites, fungal infection, bacterial, molt, parasites, nutritional deficiencyor genetic.
> 
> Best bet is to get her to a vet to rule out a fungal infection that could spread to you or other rabbits.
> 
> ...


Ditto.

One of my Rex does kindled on Sunday & she plucked herself BALD... She plucked quite a bit more than the pictures of your girllook. 

The only advice I'd give on her condition is be careful how much & what you feed her... if she doesn't miscarry the litter, you don't want her to have difficulties kindling due to fat buildup.

I hope she does well & I'm glad to hear she's found herself a great home.

~Sunshine


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## gentle giants (May 28, 2006)

She is definalty doing much better. She seems to have filled out slightly just in the week I have had her. I have been trying to feed her several small meals a day rather than the two larger ones that my buns regularly get. My feeding schedule is this: am, hay and pellets, pm, greens and or veggies. I have been giving her a little extra hay in the middle of the day, and a smidge of pellets if she has cleaned up what I gave her first. 
I haven't had the chance to get her to the vet, just got my pay today, but her fur is getting thicker,and that is giving me high hopes that the fur loss was from malnutrition. Her feet are doing worlds better, I was actually stunned what putting on a little Neosporin and putting her on a solid floor acomplished in a week. 
I will be getting her in for a checkup as soon as I can, and once I can confirm whether or not she is actually pregnant I will see about getting her spayed. Because even if for some reason I decided to find her another home, I don't want anyone to ever be able to use her as a bunny factory again. It still boggles my mind that someone would breed her in that condition, purely to try and get an extra buck off her at the sale. I saw the people that brought her in, but didn't notice heron the cart at the time. I wish I had, I would have torn them a new one!


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## Bunny B. (Jun 4, 2006)

Hi,

I deffinetly think the hair loss is from her litter. I just had a doe that pulled TONS of fur, looked just like your doe. 

Give it a while if will most likely grow back, hopfully before her next litter!

Well good luck!


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## gentle giants (Jun 4, 2006)

Her fur is coming back in, so it could be you're right. I tried to palpate her, to see if she really was pregnant, but she was so tense I had a hard time telling. Does anyone else have problems with their does getting very cranky when they are bred? Charity is _very_ grouchy. I am allowed to reach into her cage as far as the feed dishes, which are right in the front, but if I try to touch her or reach into the cage itself, I get scratched! She has never offered to bite, she just lunges at me and scratches with her front feet. She hardly ever growls, just the lunge and scratch. I'm not sure if she is just feeling territorial because she is pregnant, or what.


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## SunnieBunnie Rabbitry (Jun 4, 2006)

I've had does react like that both when they're bred (and palpated positive) and when they really, really want to breed badly... but for one reason or anotherI have not given them the opportunity at that time.

I think it's best to play it safe and just assume she is pregnant...that way if she does kindle, you've already prepared for them and done everything necessary for her. If she doesn't kindle within 34days from first acquiring her... then it would be safe enough to say that she didn't take - that is if she waseven bred in the first place.

~Sunshine


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