# Bunny with "Snuffle" symptoms, passes away!



## GeorgiaGirl322 (Nov 7, 2011)

I need someone to tell me where this disease comes from, and what I can keep on hand in case it appears in any more of my rabbits. I thought at first it was alergies, and had it at bay for more than a year. All the sudden, he took a turn for the worst, and passed away today. He was a broken-steel English Lop!  I am very upset that he is gone now, but very happy that he has to suffer no more.



Thanks,

GeorgiaGirl322


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## Bunnylova4eva (Nov 8, 2011)

Yes, snuffles is definitly a horific disease. I'm so sorry about you losing your english lop. That would be terrible.
I had a bunny, Charlie, and a similar thing happend to me. I ended up giving her back to the breeder since she had been sick when I got her. I thought it was allergies but after meds from the vet, it became apparent it was no such thing.
Snuffles is a very difficult thing to sure. It requires vet attention and still sometimes (like in Charlies) you still can't do much to treat it.


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## MILU (Nov 8, 2011)

I'm so sorry for your loss... I don't know why it killed your bunny, but I'm very, very sorry that it happened. ray:ray:ray:
May your bunny rest in peace.


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## GeorgiaGirl322 (Nov 8, 2011)

Thank you. Yeah, it is a horrible thing. I treat my rabbits myself rather than taking them to a vet because you will find that only certain vets will treat a bunny. For some reason they place them under "exotic" animals.... LOL!! I tried really hard to save him this go round but with each sickness treated, he always got worse the next time around instead of better. I will def. miss him. He was a broken-steel. He was beautiful. I have a backyard full of bunnies so there are more to love, but of course none of them will take his place. We raise English Lops, Flemish Giants, Lionheads, and I have about 6 "rescue" bunnies, who are of course, just "Easter" bunnies. I love them all the same....


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## Bunnylova4eva (Nov 8, 2011)

So what where his symptoms? Just curious. ~I mentoined i had my bun Charlie, and when the breeder took her back she swapted me a different bunny, My current on Ripley. He's had some runny eyes (there's a topic in the forum about it) and his nose occatoinally a bit wet ( clear). It seemed alot better with taking the litter out, but still there, so I'm not set on it being allergies. I might take him in, but after the vet not being able to treat Charlie, I think it'll be the exact same response. And they are supposedly 'rabbit-savvy' house rabbit society recomended, RO recomended. =P I'll have to see about a different vet. =PP


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## Maureen Las (Nov 8, 2011)

I am very sorry that you lost your rabbit 

Unless you use a combo of fairly powerful antibiotics for a lengthy period of time this type of infection will tend to reappear. These bacteria have become resistant to the more commonly used antibiotics like baytril and trimethoprim sulfa . Over the counter powder for use in the water ( terramycin or sulfa)just builds up bacterial resistance. 


Since rabbits suppress symptoms they are very ill by the time that they look sick 

Many vet are unsure of using stronger meds in rabbits due to their fear of upsetting the gut flora . 

Experienced rabbit vets use combos of meds like bicillin injections and Zithromax for extended periods of time aand many of these infections can indeed be eliminated if properly treated. 

Other good rabbit drugs are injectable Convenia ( still off-label for rabbits), chloramphenical ( breaks the blood -brain barrier) and Zeniquen ( family of enrofloxicins like baytril but better ) 

Did you every use subqutaneous bicillin? .;this drug can be purchased at farm stores (labelled for cattle )in the refrigerated section and many rabbit folks do use it on their own .


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## pamnock (Nov 8, 2011)

"Snuffles" is simply a generic term that refers to cold symptoms in a rabbit (rhinitis). It can be caused by bad teeth, tumor, bacterial infection, viral infection, heart failure, fungal infection, injury, or any other number of causes.

Treatment would depend on the cause/pathogen and success of treatments varies depending on the virulence of the cause.


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## Bunnylova4eva (Nov 8, 2011)

:yeahthat: But yeah, I guess I was more referring to snuffles caused by Pasteurella moltocida about my bunny Charlie.


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## tonyshuman (Nov 9, 2011)

This page lists all the possible causes of these symptoms:
http://www.medirabbit.com/EN/Respiratory/Differential/respira_diff.htm

This site has info on treating URIs
http://www.medirabbit.com/EN/Respiratory/Bacterial/URI.htm

We had a bunny with what seemed to be "snuffles." For a while, it was controlled with children's allergy medicine. Then it came back and was treated with antibiotics. Then it came back and was treated with antibiotics and anti-inflammatory meds. Then it came back and we had no idea what was going on. We had a lot of diagnostic tests done, to see if it was possibly a tooth issue (the bunny was a netherland dwarf). We had x-rays done to check the teeth. On those x-rays, the vet discovered a mass in the chest cavity, near the heart. We went for further diagnostics at a specialty vet and the vet school. 

It was determined he had a large tumor of the thymus (a gland near the heart, involved mostly in immune system function). This type of cancer is not uncommon in rabbits. The location and his size made it inoperable, and the only other option was radiation. Because he was asymptomatic, we decided that treatment would only make his life more miserable, even if it would make it a bit longer. 

Several months later, he had acute respiratory failure. He had been a bit less active in the week before, not eating as much, but still himself. In the morning he looked a little bad, breathing a bit heavily, so we got him a vet appointment. A few hours later he was gasping or falling asleep in between breaths, and eventually he was unable to breathe. The vet school did an extensive necropsy and confirmed the thymoma put pressure on the lungs and heart, and that caused his death. He was only 3 and a half.

It is dangerous to assume all runny noses are bacterial infections, especially if they don't respond to treatment. In our case, it did end up being something we couldn't treat, but if it were a tooth root issue things would have been very different. A lot of different and potentially deadly problems can cause "snuffles" symptoms.


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## GeorgiaGirl322 (Nov 9, 2011)

Q) Did you every use subqutaneous bicillin? .;this drug can be purchased at farm stores (labelled for cattle ) in the refrigerated section and many rabbit folks do use it on their own.

A) No, mostly what I use is agramyicin (ms), I also use Wazine for wormer, as well as Safeguard, I have rabbit-mycin drops for the nose, and also probiotics (good gut bacteria), amongst several other antibiotics but never tried any of the things you mentioned. With havng 25+ rabbits, it is def. worth the trip to the feed store to stock up on them. 

Titan (bunny) lived a glorious life. I had him for over 3 years. I just don't know what exactly caused it. 

Tonyshuman: That is awful sounding! Yeah, the symptoms your bun showed are exactly as mine. I was a good momma though and saved him many times before this claimed his life. He will be missed. Thankfully, I do have his brother in the rabbitry as well, so I can carry on the genetics. 

Bunnylova4eva: His symptoms were weight loss, runny eyes, "coughing" rattles in the chest cavity, aspiration of food and water -otherwise throwing up. I know


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## MiniLopHop (Nov 9, 2011)

When I got Becky she had an active Pasturella infection- runny eyes from blocked tear ducts, runny nose, weight loss (she was a shelter rescue that they were going to PTS). My vet at the time was recommended here, from HRS, and the local rabbit rescue. Unfortunately after almost 9 monthsBecky was still having issues. The vet was recommending flushing her tear ducts multiple times a week. Lots of tests had been done to get to the root cause. I took her to get a second opinion (our current vet). Dr Thomas treated with stronger antibiotics and was able to get everything cleared up.

To prevent recurrence we now have her taking "Perfect Food", which I also take. It is sold in health food stores for people. It is a crystallised form of intense chlorophyll foods such as wheat grass, algae, and probiotics. I open one capsule on her food a day and it boosts her immune system. She has been clear of any symptoms for months now. No it is not approved for animal use, but it is worth discussing with your vet if you are faced with the issue. The alternative was chronic antibiotic eye drops, which I didn't want to use.


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## Bunnylova4eva (Nov 9, 2011)

What was it they used to clear it up for your bunny? They tried Baytril and then 'Benzapen' (Pencillin, injected. The baytril didn't touch it for her, and the penicillin seemed like it was working and then she got bad again. =(


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## CCWelch (Nov 10, 2011)

My Nessie has had snuffle symptoms and Pneumonia, she gets treated with Pen Aqueous, duramycin and rabbit mycin nose drops. The Pen Aqueous is a sub Q or Intramuscular injectable Penicillin based antibiotic, Duramycin is water soluble so it is mixed in the water and you already know about the drops (which I hate to administer). The penicillin dosage is based on rabbit weight, If my Satin gets 2CC's I would expect that an English Lop would get 3 or 4 CC's most likely 3 daily, duramycin is 1/2 tsp to a 16oz bowl of water daily(both of these for at least 10 days or 3 to 5 days beyond the cessation of symptoms. The nose drops are used as directed on the bottle, 2 drops each nostril 2X daily for 3 days, then I wait 3 days and do it again until symptoms are clear. Then I follow up everything with a good probiotic for at least 3 days. If the rabbit gets the runs add some oatmeal to their feed.


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## GeorgiaGirl322 (Nov 10, 2011)

Oatmeal is a bunny mom or dad's best friend!! We use it everyday in our rabbitry! They love it and it keeps the runs away!!


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## MiniLopHop (Nov 11, 2011)

I will look when I get home, I still have the boxes for reference.

My buns LOVE steal cut oats on their breakfast and Becky won't eat without them! Just a sprinkle, but very important


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## pamnock (Nov 11, 2011)

http://www.rabbit.org/care/pasteurella.html


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## MaxRules (Nov 19, 2011)

I am so sorry for your loss! My rabbit "Max" (French Lop) was diagnosed with pasteurella over a year ago. It is contagious and can live in a rabbit, but never become active. It passes from one rabbit to another. Max is bonded with my other 2 rabbits, but those 2 aren't showing signs after being together for 3 years. Unfortunately, Max has all the signs. It's a tough disease and can never be cured. The symptoms can be managed, as in Max's case. He is on daily Penicillin injections for life. Max also has a host of other problems, such as severe dental disease, that we just found out when he went for surgery this week for a lump removal. I am impatiently waiting for the results from the biopsy. Vet thinks tumor. Definitely not an abscess.

Anyhow, sorry I went off subject, it's been a long week for me (and Max). Pasteurella, or snuffles, makes rabbits prone to pneumonia. Max was treated for pneumonia last year. He is one tough rabbit!! Maybe your bunny came down with pneumonia and why he all of a sudden took a bad turn. When Max had it, the vet would never have known if it weren't for the x-rays. His breathing was fine and lungs even sounded fine with the stethoscope.


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## tonyshuman (Nov 21, 2011)

If the penicillin doesn't cause improvement within 3-4 treatments, it isn't working and you need to use a different antibiotic.


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## MaxRules (Nov 22, 2011)

We have tried other antibiotics and penicillin seems to work the best. The main reason he is on penicillin is for his teeth abscesses. It's a long story and probably for another thread of my own. I don't mean to hijack this one.


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## MiniLopHop (Nov 23, 2011)

Sorry it took so long, my brain is swiss cheese. Anyway, the antibiotics I gave Becky were Orbax (orbifloxacin oral suspension) and ciprofloxacin opthalmic drops. The orbax is technically only approved for use in cats and dogs, but my vet also has a rabbit so she keeps up with the bunny literature. It worked really well and didn't upset her tummy. I did still give her bene-bac with it just in case.

Becky has a new mate and I also give him the "perfect food" supplement on his breakfast (he shoves his head into her bowl so I couldn't stop him even if I tried). They have been together for almost 2 months and he is not showing any sign of catching the infection from her.


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## mybunnyau (Dec 1, 2011)

I have read some websites about trial vaccines against Pasturella multicido (spelling???). But none have any recent datings on them. Obviously by readng more here, I have answered my question about if its available - I guess not. 

I wonder how the vaccine trials are going, and if they can incorporate the three main offenders into one.


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## shawnwk1 (Dec 1, 2011)

along with the dental problems and gi stasis snuffles is what tucker was diagnosed with yesterday before he passed away. he had discharge from the eyes, nose, and mouth (just looked almost like a white powder) and he was wheezing really bad (and of course him not eating or drinking or pooping,but a couple real tiny ones). come to find out with the necropsy he also had a severe lower abdomen infection that went into his blood stream and literally blew open his stomach. the infection could have been what caused his snuffles, but he didn't live past his first treatment of antibiotics, other meds for gi stasis, and inflamation/pain meds so no idea whether or not they would have helped him if the infection hadn't already spread to his bloodstream. 

everything mentioned above is exactly what the vet told me about it being a chronic condition that will most likely keep reappearing its nasty face and it not having a "treatment" to cure it. 

although an extremely sad ordeal i'm so glad he's not suffering anymore and am happy he was on the pain meds when he passed so hopefully it wasn't too painful of a passing.


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