# Holland lop life expectancy



## elrohwen

This question isn't related to a specific bunny, but I thought this forum was probably the best location.

Does anybody have experience with reduced life expectancy in holland lops? I have one, and while talking with a rescue owner (looking to get a second bun) she mentioned that hollands typically have a reduced life span due to over breeding and issues caused by the smushed face (persistant respiratory infections, etc).

I've never heard this before and a quick google search didn't turn anything up. I was under the impression that small bunnies had longer life spans than large buns and that hollands fit into the general small bun category. 

Does anyone else have experience with this?


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## pamnock

We've been breeding Hollands for about 20 years and have noted an average life-span of 6-7 years.


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## elrohwen

Pam, I assume that's for non-spayed/neutered? My boy is neutered, but not sure if that would really extend his life span the way spaying can.

Would you say that's about the same for other breeds? Or less on average?


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## pamnock

It'saveraged about the same for all the breeds we've had (large such as Checkered, Satin, New Zealand, French Lopto the small Dwarf breeds).


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## elrohwen

Thanks, Pam. My husband was very nervous that our bun would die early, but it sounds like hollands typically live as long as any other bunny, which is what I originally thought.

I don't doubt that the rescuer has seen more issues in hollands, but she's also getting the bunnies that are probably neglected or not well cared for which could skew her perspective.


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## OakRidgeRabbits

*elrohwen wrote: *


> I have one, and while talking with a rescue owner (looking to get a second bun) she mentioned that hollands typically have a reduced life span due to over breeding and issues caused by the smushed face (persistant respiratory infections, etc).


It sounds like this rescue owner is not very familiar with the Holland breed. Not sure what she meant by "over-breeding", but that would not be characteristic of this breed.Any individual breeder may choose their breeding methods that any one of us may or may not agree with. The breed, on the whole, has many responsible breeders in it who do not overwork their rabbits.

I've also never had a respiratory issue related to the shape of their face. Hollands are one of the most popular show breeds in the United States, and there are many breeders working with them. On the whole, that means that they have pretty solid genetics and any weaker animals are culled from most herds, in order to produce the healthiest rabbits we can.

So Hollands are a pretty strong breed overall. I haven't had an adult pass from old age yet, my current oldest is my first herdsire who is now about 6 years old and still healthy as can be.:biggrin2:


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## elrohwen

OakRidge, I don't think she meant over-breeding as in breeding a doe too many times; I think she meant too much inbreeding and irresponsible breeding (because of the popularity of the breed as pets) leading to genetic disorders and the like. Similar to how labs, or golden retrievers are "overbred". I did get my guy from a show breeder who is definitely more responsible than a backyard breeder or the like.

Thanks for your experience! I have heard that teeth problems can be a result of the face shape in nethies and hollands, but there is no evidence of that in his line and in my bun himself - so that might be a general concern, but not a specific concern with him.

I'll fully admit that as a rescuer, she has no real experience with breeders per say, but she's been doing it for 15 years so I can't discount trends she's noticed. Then again, as I said above, if she's seeing the neglected rabbits, purchased from pet stores, etc then she's only seeing the worst case scenarios.


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## tonyshuman

I think that because Hollands are more prone to some dental and respiratory issue than other species, some may die younger. That may bring the overall life expectancy down. However, any given Holland that doesn't have those issues, at least not until middle or old age, might be expected to live longer. My Holland mix is about 3 years old, and hasn't had any tooth or respiratory issues yet (knock on wood), so I'm hoping that is a sign of a good long life (again, knock on wood). However, she was neglected, underfed, and overbred (in the sense OakRidgeRabbits means) before she was rescued and eventually adopted by me. Therefore, I have no clue if she has some underlying organ damage due to improper nutrition in the first year of her life, and that may show up as she gets older. Every day we have with them is a blessing, no matter how many or how few there are. With rescue bunnies, you never know if prior bad treatment will have an effect on their life span--myheart's Luna comes to mind, with her excessive overweight and poor nutrition, and then kidney failure possibly related to that after she was at a good weight. Also, because we often get bunnies that are not showable, there may be some genetic issues and tooth issues in them that have DQ'd them from the show table.


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## elrohwen

Tonyshuman, thanks for your rescue experience! You've confirmed much of what I was thinking. I'll show your post to my husband as I think it'll make him feel better. Our guy has been extremely well taken care of and has been nothing but healthy, so I can't imagine the repiratory or teeth problems ending his life early.


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## jamesedwardwaller

*elrohwen wrote: *


> This question isn't related to a specific bunny, but I thought this forum was probably the best location.
> 
> Does anybody have experience with reduced life expectancy in holland lops? I have one, and while talking with a rescue owner (looking to get a second bun) she mentioned that hollands typically have a reduced life span due to over breeding and issues caused by the smushed face (persistant respiratory infections, etc).
> 
> I've never heard this before and a quick google search didn't turn anything up. I was under the impression that small bunnies had longer life spans than large buns and that hollands fit into the general small bun category.
> 
> Does anyone else have experience with this?


i rescued two gray-female- hollandminilops that were being raised in cedar chips at a pet store,,they were a pleasure to have,,too short of alife span--even though one did see 6 1/2 yrs.,,they had medical problems all their life,,i was told,by the dvm--they would not see six yrs.--they are great little guys,,being fixed,proper diet,excellent environment--is the best you can do--and ask for,,,i miss them...sincerely james waller:wave::rose:annabelle:rainbow::rose:abbygail:rainbow::rose:--i did have a positive experience with them,,there are no guarantee,s--even on us...


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## Maureen Las

My holland (from a pet store) has serious dental problems but since he has consistenty had his teeth cared for he is still here at close to 7 years. 

the dentist has told me that 'Beau is tough"
he's been through a lot in his life but has a lot of fightin him. 
I had another holland who developed cancer when he was young; he was from a rescue.
I would not worry to much about the age issues.


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## pamnock

I actually haven't seen any evidence of Hollands having any more respiratory issues than other breeds. (And we've had thousands of Hollands over the years). However, in cases of rabbits with malocclusion, respiratory symptoms would be more likely.


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## JadeIcing

I don't know long term but my Dallas just turned 4. :shock:Eek!


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## Lunnabell

Hollands have lifespan is more unusual then other small rabbits typically 910-12 for small breeds like Netherlander dwarfs . But Hollands life span is 7-12.When it really should be 10-12, why some pet stores say they live 6 to 7? Because all rabbits have extremely high risk of Ovarian Cancer or Prostate Cancer. Rabbits naturally have high reproductive systems, can produce litters up to 8.Rabbit mills (rabbits usually come from pet stores and meat mill (cough New Zealanders and rexes) over inbreed the rabbit to decrease the time between litters, and the amount in the litter for profit.Some time meat millers pose as breeders trying to "sell the extra stock" so make sure the breeders are legit. But this can also significantly decrease the mothers life due to stress, to the point rabbit will eat their own babies. You shouldn't have any issues buying a bunny from a breeder unless it has give birth, or you didn't spay it.Does have increase of ovarian cancer, and when have litters.
So when i buy a bunny i don't buy:
From pet stores
Rabbit meat mills
Breeders with too many litters at a time
People who sell all Rexs and New Zealand Rabbits due to the fact they usually used in meat mills
Mother rabbits
And rabbit with yellow paws because that indicates the rabbit are rolling in the pee, major risk to 4 really deadly disease they get from urine like Gastrointestinal stasis

Finally if the Holland lops are on the bigger side it might naturally live a shorter life, because mixed with larger breeds its lifespan is close to 6 to 8.


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## Preitler

Lunnabell said:


> , why some pet stores say they live 6 to 7? Because all rabbits have extremely high risk of Ovarian Cancer or Prostate Cancer.



I guess that 6-7 years are a selling argument (getting a pet for a 8yo that will be alive when it is 20 is hard to plan for), or experience from "pet" bunnys that live lonesome lives in a little pet store hutch somewhere in the backyard.

Although their rate for cancer of the female reproduction tract is definatly higher than in humans (my guess is about double, but we're catching up), but there isn't much actual hard data. "A vet said" isn't data. It get's repeated over and over and exaggerated as a deadbeat argument by people who want to get rabbits spayed (which is a good idea for pet bunnies anyway, even without that argument - which is still valid without those exaggerations).
There is no scientific data for a great cancer risk for bucks, but once posted as "fact" it too gets repeated all over the internet, like that apple seed nonsense.

Giving birth or not doesn't seem to change that risk, actually there are people claiming that the risk is lower in does that got bred. I wouldn't say that's a prime argument pro or contra a bunny, as long as she's in good shape it doesn't reduce their life span. Getting fat is a bigger problem.



> Rabbits naturally have high reproductive systems, can produce litters up to 8.Rabbit mills (rabbits usually come from pet stores and meat mill (cough New Zealanders and rexes) over inbreed the rabbit to decrease the time between litters, and the amount in the litter for profit.


Yes, they reproduce fast, and the biggest litter one of mine had was actually 12. What you write and your conclusions lead to the impression that you don't know too much about breeding and raising rabbits, or what inbreeding or linebreeding is, what the inevitable not so funny things are when working with animals , or why exactly those breeding rabbits for a source of income or food are very interested in not letting bad genetics slip in (I'm not talking about commercial big scale meat factories here). There sure are bad apples out there, but you always get some of those.

In meat breeds health, relaxed and friendly character (no fun working with skittish or easily stressed animals), are very important breeding goals, and easier to achieve because culling out bad genes is easy. That makes them pretty good pet rabbits if one doesn't mind their size, my 10lbs intact buck is my perfect, free roam house bunny.
There's no incentive to sell off problematic rabbits.

Pet breeds on the other hand, well, breeding goals like cute pug faces, small size etc. pose problems in itself, and it needs dedicated breeders to also care for health and good personalities. I guess just producing numbers for the anonym pet market can be profitable.



> And rabbit with yellow paws because that indicates the rabbit are rolling in the pee, major risk to 4 really deadly disease they get from urine like Gastrointestinal stasis



No, it just indicates that the rabbit is not living an a wire cage, or is not an indoor pet. Yellow feet are not a sign that they roll in pee, and gastrointestinal stasis has a lot of causes, urine isn't really one of them. Bad hygiene and wet bedding are a problem, can lead to things like urine scald, parasites etc.. 



> Finally if the Holland lops are on the bigger side it might naturally live a shorter life, because mixed with larger breeds its lifespan is close to 6 to 8.



Uhm, I don't know much about pet breeds, but aren't holland lops actually very small rabbits, with max. 4lbs? You might mean french or english lops, with around 11lbs, but my rabbits are medium sized in that range too, the shorter life expectancy comes with very large breeds like flemish giants, for the same reasons as for very large dog breeds.


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## lavendertealatte

6-7 years?! That's so short.. :O I thought rabbits had longer lifespans than that, closer to 10... is this specific to Holland Lops?


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