# Skyler has a runny nose with green snot



## SnowyShiloh (May 31, 2008)

I'm worried about Skyler Monroe! Tonight he has a runny nose, the snot is green and I heard him kind of sneeze once. When he came out of his cage, his nose was slightly damp, but after running around and sneezing that one time, there's much more snot. It's not dripping or anything, but it's definitely there. I'm so worried :nerves1 I am afraid of losing him, too. Tallulah had runny nose problems and I'm afraid he got whatever she had. So many unknowns. I'm calling the vet tomorrow for an appointment, won't be able to bring him in until Monday unless I have my boyfriend bring him in on Sunday. Is that too long to wait? He's bouncing around the living room, being his usual nosy and energetic and hungry self.

How serious does this sound?


----------



## Pipp (May 31, 2008)

Poor Shiloh... 

Is there snot on his paws? Is he sounding stuffy in his repiratory tract or lungs? 

A lot of bunnies carry Pasturella (or other bacteria) and it only comes affects them when they're stressed.

It may be a case of the chicken or the egg -- is it something Monroe gave to Shilo or vice-versa. Or none of the above. It could be something else entirely. Monroe hasn't been there that long, and I don't think he was quarantined or tested before you got him, it's possible thatTallulah may have had a poor immune system (given her ongoing problems) and pickedup her runny nose from him.

Did hehave a wet or runny nose after the flight,or any other times he was stressed? 

If it is Pasturella, it's not a death sentence, but he will be on antibiotics for the rest of his life.

You really don't need this kind of a worry now. I don't think you need to hit an ER vet unless it's interfering with his breathing or he gets worse in terms of snot, appetite, etc, but he'll probably need a culture asap and maybe antibiotics.



sas ray:


----------



## SnowyShiloh (May 31, 2008)

Sas, thanks for replying! He's "sneezed" again a couple of times as he's been running around, but he's cleaned his face of most of the snot. It isn't on his paws or anything. He doesn't seem to be having trouble breathing. Tallulah was actually snot free from when we brought Sky home until she started getting ill again the other day, and even then her nose was just a little damp. Not outright snotty like Skyler. Skyler has had a slight damp nose a couple of times since we got him, but not until we brought him home from Anchorage. I don't think he gave it to Tallulah since she's been struggling with it for quite a while. At least I really, really hope he didn't give her anything that killed her... The fact that she seemingly died from problems she had before we got him is "encouraging" though.

A side note, if he does have pasteurella, do I need to limit my bunnies to just him and Rory, or is it safe to eventually bring in a third bun again? My heart is aching for Tallulah and I'm very interested in finding another little girl at some point in the future. 

Also, do I need to do anything special to keep Rory safe? The two eat hay from the same bag (at the moment, Skyler has his face buried in the bag of hay and is eating from it, Rory does the same when he's out), possibly spreading illness. I also don't usually wash my hands between petting them or anything.


----------



## Pipp (May 31, 2008)

Many, many bunnies will carry the Pasturella bug without ever showing symptoms. It can manifest itself in other ways -- various kinds of abscesses, eye and ear infections or whatever -- or they can remain perfectly healthy.

You'll read that immediate vet care is essential, but that starts with a Culture and Sensitivity test to determine the right antibiotics, so the intial vet visit must be capable of that kind of testing. If you go in on the weekend and they have to send the test elsewhere omMonday, might as well save the ER money and go to a bunny vetonMonday.

Again referring to the Library: 

From this article by Jeffrey R. Jenkins, D.V.M.

_[font=Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif]Pasteurelloses, "snuffles," torticollis, metritis, mastitis, abscesses and many other problems of rabbits are clinical expressions of infections caused by Pasteurella multocida, a bacterium that is present in most all pet rabbits. There is a great deal of misunderstanding about both the bacterium and the diseases that it causes in our friends.[/font]_
_[font=Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif]Pasteurella multocida lives in the upper respiratory tract (nose and sinus) of rabbits and other mammals. This is its niche, where it likes to live. Most strains of the bacterium have evolved to NOT cause diseases in their host, the animal which they live. Rather, a balance is established between the rabbit's immune system and the bacterium in which the number of the bacteria are kept in check and no disease develops.[/font]_
_[font=Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif]But disease does, of course, occur. Three factors may be involved in these situations. The rabbit may "pick up" a strain of Pasteurella that is more virulent (prone to disease), the bacterium may find its way into tissues or organs where it is more likely to cause disease (such as a bite wound, lactating mammary gland or uterus) or something may happen in the rabbit's life that decreases its immune system's ability to keep the Pasteurella in check.[/font]_


As for other rabbits, depends on the strain, severity and prognosis I imagine. It may not be the 'bad' strain (heck, it may not be bacterial). Usually serious pasterella infectionsmean a bunny is blowing white snot thick enough to coat his/her paws. 

So best not worry about it until he's tested. 

Here's another excerpt, this one from Fosters and Smith... 

http://www.peteducation.com/article.cfm?cls=18&cat=1803&articleid=2686

_Snuffles is generally treated with antibiotics for 14-30 days. Antibiotics commonly used include enrofloxacin (Baytril), ciprofloxacin, and trimethoprim sulfa. Rabbits need beneficial bacteria in their intestine to aid in digestion and they often need to be supplemented with these bacteria during and after antibiotic treatment; therefore, these drugs should only be used under strict veterinary guidance. In severe cases, supportive treatment consisting of fluids and supplemental nutrition may need to be given as well. _
_If the strain of Pasteurella multocida is a mild one and the immune system of the infected rabbit is strong, the symptoms may be mild and the animal will recover without treatment. However, if the strain is aggressive or the animal has a weakened immune response, the disease can be severe, chronic, and even fatal. The goal with treatment is to use an effective antibiotic at the first signs of infection. If the infection goes for days or weeks without treatment, it is likely that it will become chronic and very difficult to eliminate. In most cases, the signs of the disease may disappear, but the bacteria are usually still present, only in smaller numbers. Even in cases that are treated early, some animals will still develop chronic infections in their sinus passages that require long-term treatment, or even lifelong treatment to keep them under control._

_The disease can be present in the nasal cavities without the rabbit showing any signs of disease, so a healthy-appearing rabbit can still develop signs later if he is stressed. Reducing stress is also very important in helping a rabbit avoid infections and reducing the severity of the disease if he does become infected._

_Reducing stress is also very important in helping a rabbit avoid infections and reducing the severity of the disease if he does become infected. Common causes of stress in rabbits include poor nutrition, improper housing, chilling, overcrowding, or aggression from other rabbits. To prevent stress, provide the best possible housing. Offer a variety of fresh vegetables and free choice timothy hay in addition to a properly formulated pelleted diet. Also, avoid letting your rabbit come into contact with other rabbits, particularly if they are sick. Because this disease can be transmitted through secretions on your hands and clothes, be very careful when handling other rabbits, and always wash your hands and clothes after handling a rabbit other than your own.
_
sas :clover:


EDIT: whoops, replaced the breeder info with handling info..


----------



## ra7751 (May 31, 2008)

Hi,

I agree with everything being said and noted in the articles with one huge exception...the drugs mentioned in the Foster and Smith article. Those drugs have been so overused and abused over the years that most strains of pasteurella have become resistant to these drugs. Sometimes you might get these drugs to work once, maybe twice, and then they are useless. Your more progressive doctors are using much different antibiotics now. For the time being, Zithromax is the drug of choice of the "elite" level of doctors. I also use Penicillinor Chloramphenicol quite effectively. The key to treating this is to have a culture performed to determine exactly what the pathogen is and what it is sensitive to. One note about pasteurella.....it can never be cured and it will always be lurking. It is an opportunistic bacteria which means it is looking for a weakness in the immune system. While the drugs will help, if it is pasteurella, it will be the rabbit's own immune system that will "put the genie back into the bottle" so to speak. Do everything you can to offer support to the immune system.....stress free environment, proper diet, etc.

Randy


----------



## JadeIcing (May 31, 2008)

Deep breath sweety. Keep in mind they can sense your stress.


----------



## SnowyShiloh (May 31, 2008)

Sky sneezed more last night and I've heard him sneeze/snuffle since I got home from work half an hour ago. I spent all day at work trying to find someone with tomorrow or Monday off so I could trade days with them and take him to the vet, but the soonest I could get was Tuesday. Then after all that, it turns out that my boyfriend isn't leaving to go to a convention thing in Texas until Monday morning, not tomorrow morning! So he will be able to bring Skyler in tomorrow while I'm at work  I wish I could be there to help explain things and share my concerns with the vet, but at least Skyler will be seen and I can always schedule a time to call and talk to Dr DeLeon.

Also, I'm cross posting this from Tallulah's thread because I figure it might be relevant to Skyler's illness. This is part of an e-mail I got from Tallulah's breeder today:


"I know some of Tallulah's symptoms started right away (runny nose) when you first had her, and that you consistently gave her the very best vet care (I'm sorry about your vet bill--way more than I could have imagined), so I believe perhaps genetically she had a compromised immune system that could not overcome the usual rabbit ups and downs. Her mom has always been healthy, and her dad as well(I am sorry to say that Ijust last monthplaced him in a 4H home because I just had too many bucks). Olivia has never lost a baby, nor have I ever had someone contact me with a healthy problem in her children--till now. However, Olivia had a litter of six in March, and I lost three of them in the space of one week when they reached six weeks of age. It was mucoid enteritis, which strikes weaning bunnies and is essentially 100% fatal due to cocci and clostridium overgrowth resulting from GI stasis and toxins in the cecum which cause death. I spent a lot of time and money and tried every antibiotic, probiotic, vitamin, etc. that I researched, but to no avail. I have lost four more bunnies during this month, all in the same manner, though in different litters, and it is so sad and discouraging. In previous years, I have never lost more than one baby here and there, and never one older than 9 weeks. I read that there are predisposing factors, such as environmental changes, loud noises, different caretakers, diet changes and genetics that may precipitate this condition, but the real cause is unknown. It sounds like this is the same condition that affected Tallulah, although she was an adult and should have been able to overcome it, I would think...but it makes me wonder about genetic predisposition. I am still breeding my rabbits and currently have several healthy ones that made it through my recent crisis without any problems, but I cannot help but wonder why some were affected and others weren't. I am disinfecting my cages carefully and have switched to hay racks so the babies aren't eating hay off the bottom of the cage as much, but they still sit on their food while they eat, etc, so I have all the moms and babies on Sulmet for cocci, although none of my adults are thin or show any sign of disease."

What do you all think?


----------



## mouse_chalk (Jun 1, 2008)

Oh no Shiloh, it's not fair for you to have to worry about another bunny so soon, I'm sorry. I'm afraid I can't offer any advice medically, but I really hope that Skyler will be ok! :hug: I do know that he has the very best care available to him...

Jen xx


----------



## Marietta (Jun 1, 2008)

Having read this very interesting e-mail of Tallulah's breeder, I see now that more of his young rabbits have died of mucoid enteritis. It seems that Tallulah's ongoing health issues could, indeed, have beengenetic or due to a hereditary predisposition whichcould have beenfurther affected bythe breeding conditions. One could never know for sure, though. In regard to Skyler (have you got him from the same breeder?), the green snot is a symptom of a bacterial infection of the respiratory system, as all the others have told you. Which bacteria have infected him, therefore, which shall be the proper antibiotic for his case, can only be determined via a culture.

I don't see a direct connection between Skyler's respiratory ailment with Tallulah's GI problems. Should Skyler's problem be pasteurellosis, other members have already told you that it breaks out in times when the rabbits immune system is already compromised by other reasons.

Marietta


----------



## SnowyShiloh (Jun 1, 2008)

Marietta, thanks for your reply! The reason I'm worried about Skyler is because Tallulah also suffered from a snotty nose a lot of her life, and I'm worried that whatever she had could take hold in him because his immune system seems to be weakened right now.


----------



## SnowyShiloh (Jun 2, 2008)

I just got home from work, Paul dropped Skyler off at the vet's after I left for work and then picked him up after the vet examined him. She wrote me a note saying all that she did. She did a fecal to test for parasites, determined that he has a mild upper respiratory infection, and prescribed him the antibiotic Albon. She said she wants to try it before moving onto a stronger one. He's supposed to get 1/4 a tablet of Albon crushed and mixed with water once a day for the next 20 days- a new one for me, they've always been prescribed liquids before! This might be interesting. 

Anyway, I'm a little irritated. I don't really see why he needed to be tested for parasites, I would prefer if he were tested for coccidia and clostridium. Also, they didn't do a culture, which seems rather important! $120 spent just to have to bring him back in and have more tests run, not to mention another examination fee :huh She wrote a note that I should call and schedule a time to talk to her on the phone and she wants to see Skyler again in 7-10 days.

So, what do you all think of what happened? Does the diagnosis, treatment and medication seem appropriate?

Thanks!


----------



## SnowyShiloh (Jun 2, 2008)

Well, that certainly wasn't successful! I just tried to give him the crushed up pill in water, and most of it ended up on my pants and the rest ended up all over him. He refused to swallow and most of it just dripped out of his mouth while he flailed his arms frantically and unhappily chewed the fur on his chest. He's only 5 months old and I know sugar is bad for bunnies, but could I maybe mix the crushed up pill with a little bit of apple juice? Maybe then it would taste better.


----------



## Marietta (Jun 2, 2008)

Does the pill have to be crushed and mixed in water? I mean, if swallowing it would be the same, putting it in a small slice of his fav fruit or a tiny piece of bread would be much easier to swallow. In this way, he'll just keep on spitting it... Why don't you ask the vet if you can put it in food instead of water? On the other hand, if it has to be dissolved in a liquid (maybe in order to avoid tummy/stomach upsets), do give a nice yammie juice a chance, whatever flavour you think he'd like.

I don't know this drug, so I can't comment on the treatment. I'm sure that somebody else, familiar with Albon, will answer. However, a more agressive treatment option was the one I thought the vet would have prescribed.

Marietta


----------



## mouse_chalk (Jun 2, 2008)

Poor Skyler... :hug:

I don't know about the treatment, but did you say that it was the 'lesser bunny experienced' vet that saw her? If so, is there any way you could call the more exerienced vet and speak to her, and maybe tell her your concerns, and explain that given what happened with Tallulah, you'd rather be on the safe side and have a culture done, and tests for coccidia and clostridium? I don't know if that would help maybe...

Thinking of you guys, and hoping it all gets easier soon...

Jen xx


----------



## RexyRex (Jun 2, 2008)

When I had to give pills to Alaska and Gixxer I crushed up the pill and mixed it with Petromalt. They LOVE that stuff and gobbled the "doctored" Petromalt up with no problems. I hope this helps....I'm so sorry for all you are going through

If Skyler likes canned pumpkin or has a favorite baby foodyou can mixed the crushed up pill in that.


----------



## Pipp (Jun 2, 2008)

Apple juice, apple sauce, banana... those will all work. A little sugar is fine, it's a lot of sugar or a sudden influx of sugar that's not so good. (One of my vets suggested mixing honey in with the meds, but I prefer fruit!)

He shouldn't be stressed when taking the meds, so whatever it takes to make him the least stressed. 

And they shoud have done a C&S test, although often they'll prescribe something in the meantime while waiting for the results. 

I know Dana Krempels thinks Albon is pretty much useless, I think Randy does as well?. 

Here's an excerpt from Dana'sC&S opinion: 

If your bunny has an infection of any kind--from an upper respiratory infection, to a jaw abscess to a urinary tract infection--it's critical to know which antibiotics will be effective against the particular pathogen (i.e., disease-causing agent) causing the problem. This means that (1) the species (and strain) of bacteria (or other pathogen) must be identified and (2) the drugs most effective at inhibiting their growth must be determined. The only reliable way his can be done is a culture and sensitivity test.

Here are a couple of her articles (they're also in our own Library): 

www.bio.miami.edu/hare/culture.html

www.bio.miami.edu/hare/sneezing.html

Hope this helps!



sas ray:


----------



## ra7751 (Jun 3, 2008)

I was just about to post about how confused I was and then I read Pipp's post. Maybe I missed something but Albon is a sulfanomide...in the same class of drugs as Septra, Bactrim, Sulfatrim, etc. I use Albon in rabbits for only one thing....to help control coccidia....and that is the only thing and it's not real good at doing that. If this problem is a bacterial infection caused by pasteurella....those germs are going to laugh. I don't like to disagree with doctors....because they are doctors and I am not.....but I can't make things work with this treatment. Honestly, this sounds like a treatment from eons ago when very little was known about treating rabbits properly. I think this is headed down a potentially dangerous road.....I suggest pulling off to the side of the road and rethink the routing....in other words, another opinion would be in order. In all seriousness, and in my non-professional opinion, I don't think Albon is the correct line of treatment here.

Randy


----------



## SnowyShiloh (Jun 3, 2008)

Aww  Randy, what should I do? This vet is the best in Fairbanks (Jen, it's the "good" one, not the one who misdiagnosed Tallulah). I'll feel very weird confronting her about her choice in medications. In the letter I wrote to her, I said that you did not advise treating Skyler Monroe with any sulfamides- I basically quoted exactly what you said in the e-mail, but she prescribed Albon because she said she didn't want to pull out the big guns quite yet. She thinks it's a mild URI and not pasteurella, but how can you diagnose that without testing? On a happy note, little man has been snot free the past couple days and I haven't heard any sneezing. His cage is right here in the living room, so I can hear whatever he does. 

Randy, is there any possibility of you mailing me the correct meds or something? I'm going to try to give the vet a call today since I have the day off, and see if we can get him in for testing. Maybe with the results, she'll change her mind on how to treat him...


----------



## LuvaBun (Jun 4, 2008)

oh Shiloh, I'm just seeing about poor little Skyler now. I can't believe that you are going through all this so soon after poor Tallulah .

As you know, Pernod is being treated for Pasteurella. She is on Sulfatrim, which i see is one of the meds Randy mentioned as being the same type as Albon. I have to say, she has improved hugely on this, as the Baytril had no effect. Her snotty nose has all but gone, and sheis much happier.

How is Skyler in himself? Isn't it strange that both are Dutch bunnies that travelled huge distances on a plane?

Hope things improve :hug:

Jan


----------



## SnowyShiloh (Jun 4, 2008)

Jan, little man is doing pretty well! If I didn't know he's sick, I wouldn't be able to tell because his little schnozz looks great, nice and clean. Maybe the Albon will work okay for him :? He's got 3 doses so far, and yesterday's definitely went the best. I bought him some organic banana peach oatmeal baby food and crushed the little pill up then mixed it with a tiny bit of baby food, and he ate it off the spoon! Hooray! The night before last, I made the mistake of mixing it with too much baby food and he only took a couple licks off the spoon, so I had to stir in a little water so I could suck it up into the syringe and give it to him that way. He handled it MUCH better than the straight water and pill combo the night before, but he did manage to kick the syrine out of my hand, causing baby food to be sprayed across the back off the couch and the wall behind it! 

Something occurred to me yesterday. Could his runny nose have been caused by the stress of me mourning Tallulah? He got the snotty nose the day after she died. The bunny cages are about four feet away from where I'd been sitting, crying hysterically over my little girl's body. At the time, I looked over to see if the other two were okay because I didn't want to scare them, and he was sitting there eating hay seemingly okay, but maybe I stressed him out? Rory behaved differently after she died, too, he's still a little stand offish with me after the biting incident a month ago, but he let me pick him up for cuddles and came over and stuck his head out of his cage for pets for a good minute or so even though I just put food in his bowl. Just something for me to wonder about...


----------



## SnowyShiloh (Jun 7, 2008)

Skyler had a bit of staining around his nose this evening from slight discharge. His nose wasn't damp, but the slight green staining is there. I haven't heard him sneeze. I don't know if I'm just imagining it, but he seemed to feel a little heavier than usual when I picked him up. This is alarming because Tallulah had the same thing. He's pooping normally, but so was she... I think I might just be imagining it. In any case, he has an appointment with the vet at 10 am on Sunday (figures I have to be at work at 10:30, so I'm not sure how I'm going to do this...) for a check up. I might try to push it back until Tuesday so I can actually be there with him instead of my boyfriend taking him in. The vet wanted to see him again in 7 to 10 days, so Tuesday is still within that range. I'll keep an eye on his possibly imaginary weight gain :? 

Also, I found out tonight that he doesn't like blueberry applesauce baby food very much, I had to stir in a little white grape juice to get him to take the meds! Guess I'll be buying another jar of the peach banana oatmeal baby food tomorrow.


----------



## JadeIcing (Jun 7, 2008)

If you want stronger meds say... "After lossing my sweet girl I want to fight this hard from the start. Just in case." You get the idea? Just make it seem like you are using what happened.


----------



## Thumpers_Mom (Jun 9, 2008)

:hug:Hey Shiloh, How is Skyler doing? Did you take him yesterday or are you waiting till Tues? 

I hope all is well with the little one and that you are doing better. Give Skyler and Rory kisses for me please. :hug2:


----------



## SnowyShiloh (Jun 9, 2008)

Jackie, Skyler had a bit of green snot again. He's been on Albon for a week now. He's still acting normal and I'm looking forward to the vet visit tomorrow. I'm also going to ask about his bite from Rory, it was a month and a half now but you can still see where it was, it's now just a thin black line, but why black? And he also has a gray smudge on his lower lip. It may have always been there, I don't know, but I saw it for the first time when he jumped off the couch and hit the printer head first. I picked him up to make sure he wasn't hurt and hadn't cut his mouth, and I found the gray smudge on his lip. It's still there. I'm also going to ask her about Rory, he's been shedding since April and often when he drinks from his water bowl, I can hear his tummy making sounds. Then there are all the questions I have to ask about Tallulah. So many questions! The vet has instructed the receptionists to schedule me for the time of 2 appointments whenever I come in because I always ask so much :baghead


----------



## mouse_chalk (Jun 9, 2008)

C'mon Skyler, get rid of that green snotty stuff, and get better for your mummy!

I hope it all goes ok at the vets tomorrow Shiloh, and that you get the answers you need for all the bunnies...

Oh, and I can relate to the vets booking you double appointments, we always take ages in there as well cos I ask so many questions too! 

:hug: Jen xx


----------



## AngelnSnuffy (Jun 10, 2008)

Shiloh, do you plan to ask for a different med for Skyler? Doesn't sound like the Albon is doing anything to cure this, as Randy thought it wouldn't. You could wait partially through your appointment and see if they suggest another med, but if they don't, if it were me, I'd be asking for Zithromax, as Randy suggested early on. Also, has your vet done a culture to determine if this is indeed a bacterial upper respitory infection?

Best of luck tomorrow, hon!


----------



## SnowyShiloh (Jun 10, 2008)

Crystal, I'm going to request a culture of his boogers and a fecal test for coccidia and clostridium. I'm also going to request Zithromax  Tonight I'm going to make up a whole list of questions for the vet so I don't forget anything! And thanks for the kind thoughts, Jen! Little man seems to be feeling fine as he's acting as hyper and happy as usual, but this afternoon I saw him sneeze 4 times in a row. It was actually kind of cute even though I know sneezing is bad.


----------



## Pipp (Jun 10, 2008)

:goodluck



sas :clover:


----------



## Thumpers_Mom (Jun 10, 2008)

Shiloh you are soo silly. Better to ask questions right?? 

Oh Skyler, you need to get better soon...PRETTY PLEASE!!!et:I'm glad he is still being his hyper self...that is good.

Wow, Rory's been shedding since April? Do you have furballs floating through your house? The other day I picked up my Peaches and boy did she leave all her hair on me! It's time to whip out the furminator.

Good luck at the vet today...please update us. Positive thoughts going your way.:hug1


----------



## AngelnSnuffy (Jun 11, 2008)

Good luck, Shiloh! (When are you going to the vet?)


----------



## SnowyShiloh (Jun 11, 2008)

Crystal, we're back now! The vet was able to explain to me more what she did last week, too. She said that last week they did test Skyler's poop for coccidia and clostridium, and thankfully neither those nor anything else bad were present. I also brought in some fresh Rory poops (who by the way refused to poop for me for a good hour this morning, he waited until right before we left) and they're going to test those too. She said she didn't do a culture of Sky's boogers because cultures from the nose tend to be contaminated with whatever's in the environment so not very conclusive. She said if he's not getting better by next week (he has another appointment), we'll draw some blood and do a pasteurella titer on him. If he's better next week, we'll just be glad and consider what he has to be a simple URI. She also prescribed him Zithromax and said to keep him on the Albon too, which she is using as a preventative to whatever Tallulah had, just in case. Once we get Rory's poop results, we'll decide if he needs to be treated as well. She also suggested moving Skyler's cage into a different room from Rory, in case Rory's presence is stressing him out. Currently, his cage is on top of Rory's. Rory hates Skyler and would love to hurt him, as is evidenced by the bite he gave to Skyler (which by the way is healing nicely).

I got Tallulah's ashes back today. One of my close friends works at the vet office and she gave them to me. They were in a nice little box, very lovingly packaged by the crematorium. I'm looking for the perfect urn for her ashes and am trying to find a nice music box for the job. As for her health, the vet doesn't think it's worth sending the samples from her necropsy in to be tested right now. The general consensus is that Tallulah died from septicemia from the cecum issues and her intestines were not twisted likes was previously thought. My poor sweetie. 

The vet suggested that because of Skyler's sensitivity, when I get a new rabbit I should get one with a known healthy background and from a clean place, then quarantine her for a month before introducing her to the boys. I know this is going to upset some people, but she advised against getting a shelter bunny because it would come with an unknown background. A bunny from a rescue should be okay though I think because it probably would have been in the rescue for a while (time for illnesses to present themselves?) and we'd be able to have the rabbit checked out by a vet before commiting to it. She said that there's a possibility that Rory is a carrier of pasteurella or whatever since Skyler didn't show any symptoms of anything until after he'd been living with us for a week or so. We stayed with Paul's parents for two days before coming home, too. I suppose Tallulah could have given it to him too, since she had a runny nose sometimes too. There are so many unknowns!

One last thing about Sky's meds. This is copy and pasted from the dosage thread on the main forum, hope that's okay: Skyler was prescribed Zithromax and I had to actually take the prescription to the pharmacy at the grocery store to be filled. I'm afraid they might have misread the prescription or something, because it cost $75 and I got two whole bottles of the Zithromax for 10 days! Skyler weighs 2.7 pounds, and I'm supposed to give him 3 mL once a day for 10 days. It was a powder they mixed with water. The label says "Generic for: Zithromax 100/5 mL SU". Is that the concentration? In another spot, it says "Whe constituted as directed, each 5 mL contains azithromycin monohydrate equivalent to 100 mg of azithromycin".

The vet is closed until the morning and I'm not going to give him any until I hear that it's okay. This just sounds like too much medicine to me. Maybe it's supposed to be .3 mL? I don't have the original prescription paper, so I can't look at it.

So, how does Skyler's treatment and meds and the general approach to what's going on sound?


----------



## SnowyShiloh (Jun 11, 2008)

Well, I'm very relieved to report that Skyler likes the Zithromax! I was a little worried about how he'd take it and had Paul ready with towels, but he just lapped it up. What a good boy! It's cherry flavored :biggrin2: I also forgot to say that the vet said his lungs and everything sound clear.


----------



## 2bunmom (Jun 11, 2008)

Hi, Please pm Randy to check on the medication dose for your little guy. I have a 7.5 pound bunny on the generic for Zithromax right now. It was a powder that they had to mix up and it is cherry flavor. It sounds very similar to the medication you have but I cannot be completely sure because the medication bottle is at home. I am giving Trouble 1.3 mls once a day. Randy told mehe usually gives a higher dose. Trouble did not tolerate the medication as well as I would have liked. He was being syringe fed for an entire week and had to go to the vets for IV fluids. He is doing well now and the URI is doing better. He will be on his meds for 30 days as he has had the infection for quite a while and this is his third antibiotic for the same infection. 

My point is 3mls seems like a lot for your small bunny. I know how you care forand love your bunnies.I also know that you have recently lost one. So I am extending this caution to you in a loving manner as a caring bunny parent.

I hope this medicationis the correct dose and works for your little guy. I also hope that you have him for many years to come. My Trouble is 7 years old and so is his girl friend Trixie. They have been a great source of joy for me. Take care , Beckie Trouble and Trixie


----------



## SnowyShiloh (Jun 11, 2008)

Beckie, I suppose I could have mentioned that Randy replied in the Dosage thread on the main forum! He said that 3 mL per day is just right for a bun of Skyler's size, so I went ahead and gave him the medication. I appreciate your concern though! How much did your Zithromax cost?


----------



## 2bunmom (Jun 11, 2008)

Well,I just did a nice long post and then lost it. Whew!!! Thank goodness for Randy! I have learned so much from him. It also gives me some comfort to hear his opinion on rabbit health matters. 

I paid $104.00 for Trouble's 30 dayprescription and think it is going to be worth every penny. His sinuses were so full thatI could feel a elongatedlump down his face and the area around his nose was swollen. All that is gone and he no longer has the snuffling sound coming from his nose. He sneezed twice yesterday but i had to listen really well to understand that it was a sneeze. He has been on the meds for 11 days so far. 9 of those days he would not eat pellets or oats. He would eat a few vegetables andI was syringe feeding him baby food and of course water. He was not drinking either.I took him back to the vet for IV fluids and bought Critical Care while I was there. He just started eating really well this Monday. 

Hopefully you were able to get some bene bac, that will be important too.

Thank you for not being offended at my other post. From past experience, I just know how devastating and lonely it feels when you have a sick rabbit and you hope you are doing everything right to get them well. You have had enough to cope with and I was worried about the dosage. Your little Monroe will be in my prayers for a speedy recovery! Take care, Beckie, Trouble and Trixie


----------



## SnowyShiloh (Jun 17, 2008)

I think it's time to update this thread! Skyler's been on the Zithromax for 6 days now, and he's still getting Albon. Thankfully, he loves the Zithromax and runs over to get it from the syringe. What a relief! Also, the store stopped carrying his banana peach oatmeal baby food to mix with the Albon, but he thinks apple oatmeal baby food is a decent, if not as good, substitute. He's also growing! I can tell he's bigger in the past week. It will be interesting to see how much more he weighs at the next vet visit.

I'm not sure what to report about his runny nose. He still has some staining, but that might just take a while to fade since the fur there is white. I haven't heard him sneeze in several days, but last night I thought I heard some sneezy sounds coming from the kitchen (where his cage is now since the vet thought maybe being above Rory was stressing him out). I had music playing though so it was hard to tell. Paul was closer to the kitchen and I asked him if it was sneezing, but he said he thought Sky was just digging in his hay... That may have been wishful thinking on his part, though :? I hope he isn't sneezing again! He still has 4 days of Zithromax to go though.


----------



## AngelnSnuffy (Jun 18, 2008)

I hope it clears up here in the next few days! Maybe Randy can land some insight on how he's seen Zithromax work as far as timing and declining symptoms?

Thinking of you guys!


----------

