# Rabbit food that says hay is NOT needed!?



## Nitis3334 (Apr 23, 2011)

So I went into Walmart today to do some shopping and I figured I needed some rabbit food, I usually buy Purina rabbit chow at Tractor Supply but I figured I would take a look at the stuff at Walmart. I read the back and was surprised when they said "Hay and other forages can be fed, but are not required." I have never heard of a rabbit food that you do not need to feed hay, hay make up at least half my rabbits diet. So is it just Walmart being a lousy place to buy pet products as usual, or is there really such thing as a food that replaces hay. I've been researching rabbit diets for months and I can't imagine telling someone not to give their rabbits hay. By the way, the food in question is the Walmart store brand "Small World Complete Rabbit Feed". I looked it up online and was surprised it even has good reviews. Most people say for the price it is a bargain, but if I remember right the 25 lb bag cost about $11. I can buy a 50 lb of my usual for $15 at Tractor Supply. I also can't believe it, but in a month my 2 Flemish's went through a whole 50 lb bag, they are growing so fast! I'll admit, they do enjoy knocking over their food bowl, so not all of it goes in their tummy


----------



## Yield (Apr 23, 2011)

[align=center]Woooow. I hate Walmart more and more every day for selling such horrible stuff. 

Do they not realize that hay is NOT just a nutritional value thing? It's also needed for teeth and gut =/ 

I really hope people stop buying that. 

Everyone I meet who has rabbits, I ask them what pellets they feed, and then I suggest Purina and Manna Pro- especially if they have that "fancy" kind. Mostly Manna Pro because I love it XD


----------



## Eli (Apr 23, 2011)

Upon reading your posting, I looked up the ingredient listing of Small World Complete Rabbit Feed. It is surprisingly not a bad feed at all!!! Of course, I would still feed my rabbits hay if I were you. The pellets are alfalfa based with a high crude protein amount at 16%. Adult rabbits should only need 12% crude protein. I would regulate their pellet intake at the 6 month-old mark. They really should not be consuming too many pellets after they reach 6 months old because pellets are to ensure your rabbits get all the nutrients they need that they would otherwise get in the wild (domestic bunny in the wild haha). Too many pellets is pretty much like vitamin OD in people.

Adult rabbits should be eating timothy-based pellets but it is not a big issue if your rabbits are eating a lot of hay. Some pellets taste so good that rabbits neglect their hay. Only then should you be concerned.

I have been researching online and writing adamantly about rabbit feeds lately. Perhaps you may be interested in my other postings as well regarding rabbit feeds. I found some things to be horrific, such as American Pet Diner's rabbit feed which contains sodium lignosulfonate. It was the 8th ingredient in a long list of ingredients and may cause lesions in the colon and in extreme cases, death. I am waiting for their response concerning that.

Another ingredient is cane molasses/molasses. The purpose is for binding (less powder) which reduces dust (less waste & respiratory issues) but it is also for taste. Rabbits love sweets. However, it will make house rabbits fat and rot their teeth over time. Unfortunately, a LOT of rabbit feeds contain molasses, including Manna Pro and Purina. Sweets, as you may have read already, are not good for the gut.

I now feed my rabbits Oxbow's Organic Bene Terra Rabbit Feed. It is quite expensive but it has safe binders and is timothy-based. It is the ideal feed for a rabbit, in my opinion. However, your bunnies eat an incredible amount. Mine are tiny little things. You mentioned the price of industrial rabbit feed being lower than the commercial brand, well it usually is. I guess marketing really brings up their costs? 

To sum it all up:

Small World Rabbit Feed is a surprisingly decent rabbit feed that is worth buying for your rabbits.

However, although hay is "not required," it is highly recommended by ALL experts for the health of your rabbit. A rabbit will survive whether it gets hay or not if they are eating pellets. However, the age it lives to is questionable. Quite the misleading statement, don't you think? *sigh*


----------



## OakRidgeRabbits (Apr 23, 2011)

Eli wrote:


> Small World Rabbit Feed is a surprisingly decent rabbit feed that is worth buying for your rabbits.
> 
> However, although hay is "not required," it is highly recommended by ALL experts for the health of your rabbit. A rabbit will survive whether it gets hay or not if they are eating pellets. However, the age it lives to is questionable. Quite the misleading statement, don't you think? *sigh*



I agree.I was surprised to find out that Small World feed is actually a pretty good pellet. I have used it in a pinch before when my feed store ran out of the usual.

Hay is not required in a rabbit's diet. It is actually only recently that people have started really recommending it. At one time, most breeders only fed commercial pellets. But as rabbits have become more popular as pets, there has been more and more research into their nutritional needs especially since we're keeping them a lot longer. Now, hay is certainly recommended.

I haven't found that eliminating hay from the diet drastically effects longevity either. I have a rabbit who is 8 years old who doesn't really eat much hay. It is offered to her, but she just isn't a big hay eater. She is very healthy and hasn't had any teeth or gut issues. So although it would probably be better for the food to recommend hay, their message about hay wouldn't really turn me away from the pellet.


----------



## Nitis3334 (Apr 24, 2011)

As a kid I had rabbits growing up and I remember feeding them hay only as a treat every once in a while. Never really thought anything about it. The rabbits only lived till about 4, mini rex mixes I believe. Now that I'm an adult I panic if I run out of hay, I have been hearing so many people say they need it for digestion. I guess it is a good thing to know they won't die without it for a week, when I ran out last time and couldn't go to the store I was clipping grass outside. Still, I do attribute my rabbits short life span to the hay. I actually had a male rabbit that use to chew on the cage bars a lot. I thought when he chewed on the bars it messed up the alignment on his teeth because he eventually had a problem with his teeth where they were growing at strange angles and weren't wearing down. For a while we had to clip the teeth with a nail clipper, eventually he had surgery to remove the teeth. We called in Frankenbunny because of how strange he looked when he had the long teeth. Now that I'm thinking back, maybe it had to do with the hay. Thanks for the info on the food, I use to order hay from Oxbow when I had my 16 guinea pigs (never trust Petco to sex a guinea pig). I looked at their pellets a few times and they seemed good. Only thing is cost. Between the cost of the pellet itself, and they high shipping cost of heavy bags, definitly gets pricy. I think Dr. Foster and Smith do free shipping on hay, not sure about pellets, I'll look more into it when I have time. Well anyway, off to feed the buns their new food, lets see if they approve of the walmart food


----------



## Eli (Apr 24, 2011)

Yes, Oxbow is definitely more costly. But even their regular line has molasses. Only their extremely expensive, organic feed seems good. Sure sucks to be picky me. My wallet is crying because it is lonely without Benjamin Franklin and Andrew Jackson by her side. :cry1:

I had a rabbit as a child and it lived to be 9.5 years old. It was a checker bunny. We also mainly fed him pellets from Walmart (funny enough) but I did not buy it since I was only 7 at the time. I honestly think we only bought hay less than 10 times his whole life. He had a lot of time outside, running around and eating all the grass he wanted. Perhaps the fresh and dried grass provided him with what he needed for a healthy gut. It helps mainly with hairballs and assists in passing stuff that might be indigestible. Pretty much like fiber and humans, I guess.  I can't help but think though that he may have lived an even longer life had we known more about rabbit care back then.

Your first bunny sounds like he had a malocclusion. That is a genetic defect so you don't have to feel badly about that.

Glad to be of help. I wish your Flemishes long, happy, and healthy lives!


----------



## tamsin (Apr 24, 2011)

The problem is volume, with hay you can get a big volume of fibre without all the calories. With pellets, yes you can get a big volume of fibre if you feed enough of them but by feeding enough to get the volume of fibre you get too much of everything else.

Price wise, I think it's just as cheap to buy a good brand pellet and feed very small quantities and then buy hay in bulk - and probably better for a bun anyway!


----------



## GorbyJobRabbits (Apr 26, 2011)

Most GOOD feeds are designed around a rabbits diet where hay would not be needed. I don't feed hay and have no issues and I've over 20 buns.


----------



## MiniLopHop (Apr 26, 2011)

I have found hay to be very important for my one rabbit to loose weight. Cindi was a shelter bunny for 3 years. They had to stretch how far the hay went and she didn't have enough exercise so she ended up too chubby (7 pounds). Now she runs around all she wants and has lots of hay. She tends to eat all day long, but the pellets are gone quickly in the morning. This way she is not hungry but doesn't have all the calories of too many pellets. She is down to 5.5 pounds with probably another 1/2 pound to go. I think without the hay she would be so hungry she would get destructive.

The other two don't have even close to the same appetite. They eat hay, but not to the same extent. I guess it comes down to the individual.


----------



## Nancy McClelland (Apr 26, 2011)

We get our "feed" from Walmart, and we get hay from Smith and Foster. We've always given our bunnies unlimited hay. Also, they get fresh greens in the AM and the PM. While they can survive on just the pellet, it is not a natural diet and we feel that just pellets would also be boring.


----------



## Dulmit (Apr 26, 2011)

Wow, I didn't think the Small World stuff was any good at all. Wal-Mart does carry a what I consider to be a better pellet (Natural Harvest I think). I was told a short bit ago that the treat type is bad, but they do carry an all pellet form which seems to have good specs, but a bit costly. good to know I can cut it with the Small World. 
Hay is GREAT! I live in the North East so I can get 50lbs bales for $15 it is cheaper than many pellets so they always have more hay then they know what to do with.


----------

