# Swine Flu Vaccine



## irishbunny (Dec 1, 2009)

Well we have been offered the swine flu vaccine in school and I'm not sure whether to get it or not :?

We got a consent form to bring home, but since I'm 16 I can choose whether I want it or not, not my parents.

My main concern is getting sick after it, if I'm going to get sick, I don't think I want it because the chances of me ever getting swine flu is much, much lower then me getting sick from the vaccine.

I also have no health problem so I should be well able to fight off the swine flu if I was to get it.

So...

Do you think it's worth getting?
If you did/are getting it, why did you?
If you didn't/aren't going to get it, why?


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## irishlops (Dec 1, 2009)

Do you think it's worth getting?
Do you have a underlying medical issue? If you do please get it.

If you did/are getting it, why did you?
I got it, I have 3 diffrent serious medical issue.


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## Luvmyzoocrew (Dec 1, 2009)

here is my opinion and the reason why we didnt get it, please let me state that this is "my" "opinion" and the reasons why "i" decided for "my" family to get it or not to get it.

we did NOT get the shot, my kids WONT get it, i WONT get it,and the hubby WONT get it. From everything i have read there is no way i would get it , my family and kids have no underlying medical conditions, if they had other medical conditions i have no idea if i would get the shot or not. We also dont get the regular flu shot either. Firt i looked at what was in these shot, as well as the other shots that are given, and the things that are put into these shots as preservatives is INSANE!!!!! i dont want these thing injected into my kids or myself. 

My other reason why is that the flu, for the most part, is no big deal!!!!!!!! most people, who are healthy, survive it without big complications. The swine flu , from what i have read, is no worse then the regular flu. I have read where alot of the cases that they were saying was the swine flu was actually the Rhinovirus, i think this swine flu stuff is all hyped up. A natural immunity is so much better. I am 34 and have had the flu, and although it sucks, i am still here no worse off then had i never had it.

The only way i would get a shot of anykind, would be if there was 100% guaruntee that it would work for the disease that it is trying to keep away. They give you the swine flu and reg flu and there is a 50-50 chance that you will not get the flu, unless it is 100% i am not injecting that crap into my system, or into the growing system of my children.

Again this is my opinion, as i say dont get the shots, there are others that say get it , so you need to research and figure out what is best for YOU. Good luck


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## degrassi (Dec 1, 2009)

I did NOT get the shot and I have many health problems. I personally dont' think the risks of getting the shot(side effects, the crap they put in the shot)out weight the risks of getting the flu. 

My mom decided to get both the regular flu shot and the H1N1 flu shot this year. She is a grade 1 teacher and her school has been hit hard by the flu and didn't want to get sick and bring home anything. For her the risk was worth it. 

You just have to see if its worth it to you. Your healthy and not in an age bracket that is "at risk". From the sound of your post you have already made up your mind.


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## tonyshuman (Dec 1, 2009)

Young adults and teens are pretty badly affected by the swine flu--that's why I got it. People I know have been sick and had to stay home for days. I know someone whose son stopped breathing and turned blue because of it (also a young adult). I have gotten the vaccine--got it while I already was struggling with a sinus infection--and did not get sick. My boyfriend has type 1 diabetes so he got it (complications with blood sugar etc) and he didn't get sick either. I would do it. The things they add to the vaccine have all been tested and proven to be safe in people.


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## Luvmyzoocrew (Dec 1, 2009)

*tonyshuman wrote:*


> The things they add to the vaccine have all been tested and proven to be safe in people.


I think that can be debatable , if they were so safe no one would have reactions to any shots given and there are numerous reported cases of reactions from mild reactions, to severe reactions, to death.


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## PepnFluff (Dec 1, 2009)

Mums part of the swine flu team thingey over here, the vacc isn't available here yet but they have all the info etc on it....None of the people in the team are getting it....Thats Dr's, professors and the head of the hospital. They say it was pushed through far to quickly and the trials weren't as thorough as theythought they should be, it obviously meets all the requirements needed for a vacc but theyview some boxes to be overticked and underticked IYKWIM lol.I'm not going to get it (is it obv haha) and to minimise swine flui'm just sticking with the washing hands, coughing into elbow etc.


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## pamnock (Dec 1, 2009)

My daughter is recovering from H1N1 after getting very ill. As already stated, young adults and children are more susceptible. People with type O blood (like my daughter) are more likely to get seriously ill. I know a few people who were hospitalized from H1N1. If it were available in our area, we would all get the shot. There have been more deaths from H1N1 than reactions from the vaccine reported.

Pam


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## irishlops (Dec 1, 2009)

*PepnFluff wrote: *


> Mums part of the swine flu team thingey over here, the vacc isn't available here yet but they have all the info etc on it....None of the people in the team are getting it....Thats Dr's, professors and the head of the hospital. They say it was pushed through far to quickly and the trials weren't as thorough as theythought they should be, it obviously meets all the requirements needed for a vacc but theyview some boxes to be overticked and underticked IYKWIM lol.I'm not going to get it (is it obv haha) and to minimise swine flui'm just sticking with the washing hands, coughing into elbow etc.


I said it was to fast getting made but I was pressured into getting it.


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## tonyshuman (Dec 1, 2009)

The purpose of a vaccine is to cause a reaction that is mild--that's how your body knows that the thing that was injected is bad for you and you need to make antibodies against it. A mild, localized reaction is absolutely normal and good. If you get a little bit sick, that's within normal as well. Again, the point of vaccination is to expose your body to molecules from the virus and pair that with an irritation that activates the immune system. Activation of the immune system in response to an irritation is what causes the body to make antibodies for the virus. A mild effect is expected, and it's the price you pay to not get very sick from a full infection of the virus. It usually lasts 48hrs at the most and doesn't incapacitate you enough to cause you to miss work, etc.

Life-threatening reactions are usually associated with immunocompromised individuals, who need special care and assessment before being given a vaccine. For these people, the immune response to the irritants in the vaccine isn't as strong, or is deficient from normal in some way, and it's often in a way that is unpredictable depending on the cause of their immune deficiency (AIDS, cancer, radiation treatment, auto-immune diseases). There aren't enough people with these conditions to do testing that is as extensive in these special groups. That's why sometimes vaccines have unpredictable side effects in these people, and they really should be more careful about getting vaccines.

Some people are also allergic to some ingredients of a vaccine, like chicken eggs or some antibiotics, and don't know it until they get the vaccine and have a life-threatening reaction. We don't do allergy tests on everyone to find out if they're allergic to these things, so it is possible that the first exposure to some of the things added to a vaccine could be upon vaccination. This is an over-reaction of the immune system, and it shows how sometimes we can't predict what will happen when we expose the body to a new substance, whether it is peanut butter or a vaccine. The only way to know if a person will be allergic to the vaccine (if they haven't been exposed to all part of it before) is to give it to them, just like the only way to know if your kid is allergic to peanuts is to try and see. Every person is different and we can only estimate what will happen in MOST people, not ALL. All medicines have a risk of you being allergic to them and having a severe reaction--so do all foods. To not use them because there is a very slight risk of danger would mean that we wouldn't have any medicine available to treat disease.

Here's a list from the FDA on additives in vaccines and their health risks:
http://www.fda.gov/BiologicsBloodVaccines/SafetyAvailability/VaccineSafety/ucm187810.htm


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## tonyshuman (Dec 1, 2009)

Thanks for letting us know about the type O blood thing, Pam. I have type O so I'm even more glad I got it! I also work with parents of young kids and live with a type 1 diabetic (all sensitive groups), so I wouldn't want to get it and spread it to them.


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## irishbunny (Dec 1, 2009)

Gah, can't make up my mind!
Everyone is making really good points. Also, my blood type is O.


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## irishlops (Dec 1, 2009)

*irishbunny wrote: *


> Gah, can't make up my mind!
> Everyone is making really good points. Also, my blood type is O.


Im O postitive as well


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## irishbunny (Dec 1, 2009)

One thing I'm worried about is the fact it was made so fast, how do they know that it has not got serious side effects that take a long time to show up?


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## mardigraskisses (Dec 1, 2009)

I haven't gotten it and I don't plan too. There are other people out there who need the vaccine more than me, assuming that it actually works. I never get flu shots or anything like that because I'm able to fight off illness pretty well. Maybe one day when the vaccine is 100% effective at protecting you from the flu with no bad side effects I'll get it.  I just try to avoid shots when I can.


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## BethM (Dec 1, 2009)

*Luvmyzoocrew wrote: *


> *tonyshuman wrote:*
> 
> 
> > The things they add to the vaccine have all been tested and proven to be safe in people.
> ...



Well, peanuts and bee stings can cause mild to severe reactions, including death, too. I still consider them safe.

I am hoping to get the H1N1 vaccine, if it ever is available here. There have been a couple of clinics, the first ones were only for pregnant women, then they were doing them on days I had to work. The H1N1 vaccine is made exactly the same way as the seasonal flu virus. If the virus had appeared a few months earlier than it did, it would have been included in with this year's seasonal vaccine.

I have asthma. I have read tht H1N1 is especially hard on the lungs, and drastically increases the chances of developing a co-infection of pneumonia. My lungs are stressed enough already, I really do not need this to add to my problems. My MIL is a nurse, she got the vaccine and had absolutely no side effects from it, though she has seemMANY people hospitalized from the actual flu.

I am sort of tired of people who have had the H1N1 saying "it wasn't really that bad," just because it wasn't bad for you doesn't mean it won't be bad for someone else. If it wasn't that bad, people wouldn't be dying from it! More people have died from getting the flu than have died from getting the vaccine.

I was sort of so-so on getting the vaccine, until a man I was acquainted with died from it. He was my age (34), and had NO underlying health conditions.


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## pamnock (Dec 1, 2009)

*tonyshuman wrote: *


> Thanks for letting us know about the type O blood thing, Pam. I have type O so I'm even more glad I got it! I also work with parents of young kids and live with a type 1 diabetic (all sensitive groups), so I wouldn't want to get it and spread it to them.



My daughter had gotten the flu shot last year and didn't get sick. Two years ago, her medical bills from a bad bout with the flu totaled over $5,000.

Unfortunately, she didn't get a flu show this year 

Pam


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## Mrs. PBJ (Dec 1, 2009)

I have decided not to get the flu shot I got the regular flu shot last year.
But because of mold and stuff in the air I decided to get it due to hurricane.

I think the H1N1 is not as bad if your not in the risk group. I am in the age of getting it bad but I don't come in contact with a lot of people. 

For me the risk out way the benefits.

But again its your decision

I do want to say over 40,000 American die from the normal flu each year also. so the swine flu just effects a different age group.


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## missyscove (Dec 1, 2009)

They give out the seasonal flu shot and the H1N1 shot on my college campus free to students. I got the seasonal flu mist and I'm planning to go in for the H1N1 any day now. Before the vaccine was available, well over 700 students on my campus were affected by H1N1, including a number of my friends. We only lost one student life, and the majority of the others only lasted 3 days, but honestly I do not have the time to be sick. The risk category is people under the age of 24 for H1N1 and being in such close contact with so many young adults on a daily basis, there's just no reason for me not to.

I had never gotten a seasonal flu vaccine before college, but this is my second year getting one. I just don't have the time to get sick so I'm doing all I can to avoid it.


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## mouse_chalk (Dec 1, 2009)

Steve got the H1N1 vaccine last weekend- he was offered it because he suffers from asthma, and he had the regular flu vaccine a few weeks ago. 

He had a lump on his arm that felt like a bruise- he said his arm was achey like he'd overworked it, and he felt tired a few hours afterwards. By the next day he was completely fine and his arm back to normal. This is pretty much the same reaction he gets with the regular flu vaccine every year though, lol. They told him at the time that he may experience mild localised reactions like that.

If I was offered it, I'd definitely take it. As it's been said many more people have died from the actual virus than from the vaccine, and any kind of flu is nasty enough. Steve was terrfied that he might catch H1N1 and be unable to work for weeks, and being self-employed, he didn't want to take that risk.

My mum is worrying because she wants me to have the vaccine but they're only offering it to people who are considered to be 'at risk' and I'm not. She's freaking out because I seem to catch every little thing going and she doesn't think I ever fully recovered from Glandular Fever, and she worries that I'd get really sick if I caught it. She has had it because she has Chron's disease and is considered to be immunocompromised, and my dad had it because he lives with somebody who is considered to be immunocompromised. So, the 3 people I see the most have had it, and I haven't. I reckon I'm fairly safe at least, lol!


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## naturestee (Dec 1, 2009)

Hm, didn't know about the type O blood thing. I'm type O. Good thing I got the shot! I'm pregnant and there's a lot of H1N1 around here. I also got the regular flu shot to cover my bases.

The baby of a distant relative had to be flown to the Children's Hospital in Milwaukee because of H1N1. He was too young to get the shot. He was fine when he was put down for a nap but when his mom checked on him two hours later he was barely breathing. By the time the paramedics got there he didn't seem to be breathing at all. Thankfully he survived and is back home again.

Yes, some people are worried about the preservatives used in the shots. But there are preservative-free shots available. There aren't as many and the H1N1 clinic I went to was saving them for pregnant women. But they are available. The preservative-free version of the regular flu shot should be easily found.


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## Orchid (Dec 2, 2009)

My short and quick 2 cents.

I am an asthmatic, allergic to the world with serious chronic broncitis and all sorts of fun stuff.
My daughter has severe dust allergies and mild asthma.

Years ago any time I did get the flu shot, I think it was 3 years in a row....17yrs old, 18 and 19...each time I got VERY sick...I had to be put in the hospital for one of them related to my asthma.

I have found I do not seem to get the flu, if I do not get the shot. I might get some colds here and there and even a small part of the flu every now and again...but nothing was ever as bad as when I actually had the shots.

Because they are so new...with no real understanding of the long term possible problems...I will not allow my daughter to have it either. There is too much history of people trying to do good and finding out, 10, 20...50 years later that it had horrible repercussions...
I will not risks my daughters long time life plans for a moment of fright...After all we do have a hospital 5 minutes away should something terrible happen...


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## Orchid (Dec 2, 2009)

http://www.sodahead.com/living/a-14...-the-cervical-cancer-vaccine/question-653093/


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## Orchid (Dec 2, 2009)

I can not find it...but I am not quite sure what it is I am looking for to begin with...Many years ago, my mother told me about a shot? Vaccine? something..that I think had some thing to do with mercury...and it was not until 20 years later that they learned it was making women sterile.

I am aware that with everything there is a risk. 

I think as a people, we must make our own choices, based on the lives we lead, the experiences we have had and make as well and educated guess as possible.

I do believe I heard children tend to follow the genetics of the mothers. It was explained to me, my daughters allergies come from me having them...etc.

So because of the reactions I have to the flu shots..this is a huge reason why I will not allow her tyo get any flu shot.

They say that though it is not 100% promise/fact that your children will react as you did, but the risk is high. Pertains to medicenes as well. Everyone in my famliy is very allergic to Penicillian. Me...deathly so. Almost killed me twice as a young child. My mom, sister, Nana...all have issues with it...but...my daughter does not. Nature is a funny fickle woman...
I try my best to just smile and not argue with her


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## BethM (Dec 2, 2009)

*Orchid wrote: *


> http://www.sodahead.com/living/a-14-year-old-has-died-after-receiving-the-cervical-cancer-vaccine/question-653093/


It is stated clearly in the article that the girl was ill prior to getting the vaccine, and that there was no clear link between the vaccine and her death.


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## Pet_Bunny (Dec 2, 2009)

The regular flu shot and the N1H1 shot is free in Alberta.

I got my regular flu shot on Oct 19, after the initial rush was over, and there was no longer any line ups for it.

I plan to get the N1H1 any day now, as I come in contact with many people during the day. Several people at work already got theirs.

I am healthy, but if I get sick, I get really sick. Who would look after my bunnies?


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## degrassi (Dec 2, 2009)

> I am healthy, but if I get sick, I get really sick. Who would look after my bunnies?


I would


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## Luvr of Wabbits and Polar Bears (Dec 2, 2009)

I'm in the high risk group because I have Asthma. I didn't know about the Type O blood. My sister and I are both O one of us is positive the other is negative. Neither one of got the H1N1 shot. I think because of the field of work I do, I would of got by now but I haven't so I'm good. I have never received the Flu Shot as an Adult, dont remember getting it in my teen years unless we got it through school, so why start now?

If I get sick it's usually just a cold or Asthma related. I think I've had the flu once in ten years.

I voted NO. I'm not getting it and don't want it.


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## cheryl (Dec 2, 2009)

We have enough of the swine flu vaccine here for all of us aussies...but i have chosen not to get it...no reason at moment...might change my mind later on though

I have never had the flu shot either..


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## Happi Bun (Dec 2, 2009)

I just got over having the flu... may have been H1N1 or may have been the usual. 
Not sure but right after getting over it I got a cold. Not fun!  Finally I'm feeling completely better.

I'm still holding off on getting either of the vaccines.


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## Pet_Bunny (Dec 2, 2009)

Just got my N1H1 shot this morning.

No line up at all, there was a nurse ready to jab me, as I walked in.


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## Pet_Bunny (Dec 2, 2009)

*degrassi wrote: *


> > I am healthy, but if I get sick. Who would look after my bunnies?
> 
> 
> I would


Thanks Valerie. Not sure if you want to take on 2 rabbits and 3 fosters.


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## Korr_and_Sophie (Dec 2, 2009)

*Pet_Bunny wrote: *


> Just got my N1H1 shot this morning.
> 
> No line up at all, there was a nurse ready to jab me, as I walked in.


Now that there is enough to go around and everyone can get it, there are no lines. I guess people like waiting in long lines in the cold, but that may just be Calgarians.

I am not getting the shot. I have not gotten the seasonal flu shot in a long time (if ever) and I don't get sick often. I am relatively healthy and have never been hospitalized for anything. While I am a young adult (20), I am not in school and don't work and have little contact with people. I also don't like needles (I tend to faint), so would like to avoid them if at all possible.


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## BethM (Dec 2, 2009)

Husband came home feeling flu-y today, and has spent the whole evening comatose on the other end of the sofa. (I do not understand why he doesn't just go to bed.) 

Figures: Next week, my department starts two weeks of mandatory overtime at work. No time off approved for ANY reason. I have vacation time available, but being out for more than a day will get me tons of points. (They're currently trying to fire a girl for being out for a week with H1N1 last month.) The only way to not get in trouble would be to get hospitalized.

Which means if I get sick, I will have to go to work sick, even if I'm vomiting half the day. 
Hopefully, I will be able to avoid getting sick. 


Still no H1N1 vaccine available here.


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## Orchid (Dec 3, 2009)

*BethM wrote: *


> *Orchid wrote: *
> 
> 
> > http://www.sodahead.com/living/a-14-year-old-has-died-after-receiving-the-cervical-cancer-vaccine/question-653093/
> ...






Of course it does. One only has to read the article to see that.

It does how ever have more information to read than that one simple statement however.



_but "no link can be made between the death and the vaccine until all the facts are known and a post-mortem takes place." 
_


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## BethM (Dec 3, 2009)

*Orchid wrote: *


> *BethM wrote: *
> 
> 
> > *Orchid wrote: *
> ...


Do you have a link to the post-mortem information? This death occured a few months ago, surely they've completed that by now. 

Besides, this article has nothing to do with the H1N1 vaccine. Different vaccine for a different illness.


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## Orchid (Dec 3, 2009)

*BethM wrote: *


> *Orchid wrote: *
> 
> 
> > *BethM wrote: *
> ...





I do not see why you seem so upset. Can not everyone here have an opinion, even if it differs from yours?

and it is related to my response...my feelings on vaccines.



Either which way...I am not concerned enough to find out whatever post mortem information there is because I will not have this nor will my daughter. Should someone more interested in those answers want to look they may do so....but I do not see what is relevant to if I know the answers. I only provided a link and food for thought. Diversity...


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## BethM (Dec 3, 2009)

*Orchid wrote:*


> I do not see why you seem so upset. Can not everyone here have an opinion, even if it differs from yours?
> 
> and it is related to my response...my feelings on vaccines.
> 
> ...



You imply that the death is related to the vaccine, but don't even care enough to follow up to find out the final facts in the case? The actual facts are not relevant?
That's fear-mongering.

I never said no one else should have an opinion, but if you're going to scare people you should provide some facts to back up the reasoning.


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## Saffy (Dec 3, 2009)

My brother had his last week and the rest of the week his arm ached like mad and he felt achey all over .. but that's about it .. as he has heart problems, better this than the risk of full blown Piggy flu!


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## fuzz16 (Dec 3, 2009)

I wouldn't get it, I have never gotten vaccinatd for any flu type virus and I have a compromised immune system where I get sick easily. 
Most of the H1N1 cases have not been true, mainly jus tbad cases of te flu.

And the creatoers of the drug, word of mouth, have not even gotten the vaccination. I will not get this for my daughter. No one knows the possible long term effecs of it, and if not this virus, then another will mutate from the vaccine and so on.


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## tonyshuman (Dec 3, 2009)

It's clear that this discussion is pretty heated, but remember that we're trying to be objective here, not personal. Please don't be offended if someone disagrees with you. Simply asking for more facts is not a personal attack.

As a student in the health sciences, it makes me very worried when people make decisions about their health that are based on irrelevant or false information. I feel it's my duty to share truthful information about these health questions so that everyone can read that info, judge it for themselves, and make a decision that way. For that reason, I recommend that everyone read the FDA link I posted above.

Here's an article from the FDA on H1N1 vaccine safety: http://www.fda.gov/BiologicsBloodVaccines/SafetyAvailability/VaccineSafety/ucm182290.htm

One on Gardasil safety, which is not really relevant to this debate but I'll post as well:
http://www.fda.gov/BiologicsBloodVaccines/SafetyAvailability/VaccineSafety/ucm179549.htm

Please consider the sources you get information from. There are many websites that try to sensationalize rare cases simply because creating a feeling of panic increases their website traffic and thus their profits from advertisers. The FDA is a government agency that exists to protect the public from unsafe medication and they work very hard to do so. The climate within the pharmaceutical industry (and I have worked in this industry) is very regulated and everything is documented and reported.

If you read good scientific information produced by the FDA, which exists solely to keep us safe, and still don't want to get the vaccine, that's fine for you, but please remember that if you get the disease, you can spread it. Spreading the disease will only make the worldwide situation worse. Widespread vaccination has made some diseases all but disappear in the US, which protects everyone, including those who don't have the money to get a vaccine or aren't in one of the target age groups.

The problem with most of the popular information about vaccines is that it relies heavily on rare cases or things that could be due to a number of factors in the patient's life. This is because people are all different and will respond differently to a drug. You may be the one in 100,000 that has an adverse reaction, that is true. However, the potential benefits of the H1N1 vaccine--not getting sick and missing work, not spreading the virus farther to extend the worldwide pandemic, not spreading the virus to children who are too young to be vaccinated, not spreading the virus to those who aren't on the recommended vaccination list--are great, and the risks are very low. The probability of a major adverse event is very low.

More info on vaccine safety:
http://www.fda.gov/BiologicsBloodVaccines/SafetyAvailability/VaccineSafety/ucm133806.htm

As for long-term safety, seasonal flu vaccines do not have to have the same long-term safety studies that other drugs do; that is true. However, this is because they are needed urgently--manufacturers don't have as much time to go through all the same tests for vaccines that they do for other drugs (or other vaccines) in time to get a seasonal flu vaccine to the public. However, there have been no major reports of long-term seasonal flu effects, and the seasonal flu vaccine has been around for years.

Please make your judgements based on sound scientific information, not sensationalized media coverage. I can respect a decision made on good information.


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## pamnock (Dec 3, 2009)

*fuzz16 wrote: *


> Most of the H1N1 cases have not been true, mainly jus tbad cases of te flu.




H1N1 is the predominant strain ofinfluenza this season. If you've got the flu, the chances are most likely that it's H1N1.

Influenza mutates continually to overcome natural resistance in hosts. Therefore, new vaccines must be developed every year. 

Over 500 children have died from H1N1. If the vaccine were widely available in our area, I'd certainly have my son get the vaccine.

Pam


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## Orchid (Dec 3, 2009)

*BethM wrote: *


> *Orchid wrote:*
> 
> 
> > I do not see why you seem so upset. Can not everyone here have an opinion, even if it differs from yours?
> ...



Because there is a chance it is related. Whether it be because it was a bad dose, bad batch..bad vaccine. Could have to do with the fact you should never get a vaccine if you are already ill , until you become well. Many factors. So much unknown....but how does one find out? By looking? By reading? By asking questions?

I implied nothing. I simply shared the link. The follow up is not relevant for me. and I of course disagree...fear mongering would be to stick ones head in the sand and not bother to look around at all...or perhaps it would be better to be sheep and not question anything...hmmm....

The only way to scare someone with regards to this is if they do not bother to read the whole article...and should they have concerns are they not able to look further into it to begin with? 

I am not a news reporter, just someone who watches and takes an interest where something interests me. Sharing that should not have cause this sort of discussion and I no longer care to banter back and forth on an issue you see very black and white with no room for anything else. I dont like being attacked just because I shared something so regardless of your response...I will not reply again.


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## irishbunny (Dec 3, 2009)

I think I'm going to get it. My whole family is getting it on Monday so I might as well just get it. There are a few really wise people on here who support it and, now, from what I can see the advantages of the vaccine really outweigh the risks. Thanks everyone for your opinions :highfive:


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## Luvmyzoocrew (Dec 3, 2009)

i find this topic interesting, i like to see the different sides and what people decide. having read the stuff, i still dont feel comfortable getting certain shots or having my kids get certain shots. I cant believe that formaldehyde, and metals, and the nurmerous other things in shots are good for my kids. Like i said before until the shots are 100 percent affective in fighting what they are vacing for then there are shots that i will not get my family. Grace good luck on monday.


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## missyscove (Dec 5, 2009)

*pamnock wrote: *


> *fuzz16 wrote: *
> 
> 
> > Most of the H1N1 cases have not been true, mainly jus tbad cases of te flu.
> ...



From an article today in my campus newspaper
Gannett is Cornell's campus health center

"As of Nov. 30, 1,628 students have been diagnosed by Gannett with probable H1N1. The highest rates of infection occurred in early September, when the number of students diagnosed with probable H1N1 at Gannett peaked at 103 per day. During the outbreak, 565 students were diagnosed at Gannett with probable H1N1 over a two-week period from Sept. 7 to Sept. 20. During this two-week period, Gannett stopped routine appointments and organized extra staffing in order to deal with the influx of patients. The Interfraternity Council also placed a moratorium on social events during this time to reduce the transmission of the virus. Sadly, this outbreak was also marked by the tragic death of Warren Schor â11, who passed away from complications related to the virus.
While the number of cases drastically declined following the initial spike, for the past few weeks Gannett has still been diagnosing between 20 and 25 patients per day with probable H1N1. *According to the New York State Department of Health, all forms of influenza in New York State area are of the H1N1 strain.*"


They call them "probable H1N1" because they can't confirm it without sending a sample in to a government lab and the high number of cases means they don't do that unless the person is hospitalized.


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## Luvmyzoocrew (Dec 5, 2009)

Here is an article from a local paper where i am from that basically is stating that all t hese "swine flu" cases may not be swine flu. So if this is happening here it is most likely happening everywhere, so when they are labeling someone with the swine flu and giving these very high numbers of people who have caught the swine flu, the numbers may be WAY OFF. I think due to the media that the swine flu has gotten to be this greater then life thing when if fact it is not much worse then the regular flu, with of course the exception to the rules when it comes to immuno suppressed and such. 


http://www.philly.com/inquirer/home...k_is_rhinovirus__not_swine_flu.html?viewAll=y

Ill this fall? Maybe it wasn't swine flu after all By Don Sapatkin 
Inquirer Staff Writer
_I had swine flu._ It is almost a badge of honor, suggesting that the speaker survived the first pandemic of the 21st century and is immune to the next wave.
It also may be wrong.
Tests at Children's Hospital of Philadelphia suggest that large numbers of people who got sick this fall actually fell victim to a sudden, unusually severe - and continuing - outbreak of rhinovirus, better known as a key cause of the common cold.
*Experts say it is logistically and financially impossible to test everyone with flulike symptoms. *And signs, treatment, and prognoses for a bad cold and a mild flu are virtually identical, so the response hardly differs.
But the finding may send an important message to parents who (despite doctors' recommendations) are questioning the need to immunize their children against swine flu because they seemed to have already had the disease, said Susan Coffin, director of infection prevention and control at Children's Hospital.
"Maybe their child is still susceptible to H1N1 and should still get the vaccine," Coffin said.
For years, rhinoviruses have been the Rodney Dangerfields of microbes. Even major institutions have found plenty of reasons not to pay them much mind. They are exceedingly common, they cause mere colds, they come in hundreds of hard-to-identify strains that make testing a challenge, and there is no effective treatment anyway.
Neither the federal government nor the states track rhinoviruses in the way they do "surveillance" for influenza, based on samplings of doctor diagnoses, emergency-room visits, and lab reports. Children's Hospital of Philadelphia is one of the few institutions that routinely checks for them whenever it tests for influenza and other viruses.
Rhinovirus - named after the Greek word for nose - is known to circulate year-round, and typically to peak shortly before and after flu season. Children's recorded rising numbers in September, right on schedule. Then they kept rising.
"The rate of activity was unbelievably high," Richard L. Hodinka, director of the clinical virology laboratory, said yesterday. "What got my attention was not only the numbers we were seeing in the laboratory, but physicians saying there was severe disease."

'Looking back ...' The hospital alerted the Philadelphia Department of Public Health. The city, citing reports from several labs, issued an advisory for the public-health community Oct. 9. They also asked the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention to investigate the outbreak; a CDC team returned to Atlanta last Wednesday after two weeks here but has not finished its analysis.
Meanwhile, people around the region were coming down with flulike illnesses. Two Catholic high schools, Archbishop John Carroll in Radnor and Bishop Shanahan in Downingtown, briefly closedafter a third of the students were absent.
Doctors and hospitals had been expecting and preparing for swine flu. Yet laboratory data indicate that, while swine flu was present in the region as early as mid-September, it did not start to rise sharply until the third week of October.
"When this began happening, we all believed what we were seeing was influenza," said Coffin, speaking both as a physician and as the mother of a 16-year-old Lower Merion student who got sick in the middle of September.
"I went around telling my friends, 'I'm positive she had flu.' And now, looking back, I think she probably had rhinovirus."
Lab positives for rhinovirus at Children's continued at very high levels through October as swine flu also spiked. Emergency-room visits for flulike illness spiraled upward.
The ER was forced to convert part of the hospital's atrium lobby into a waiting area, and visits reached a record Oct. 26. (They have been gradually declining since then, and now are about 20 percent more than normal for this time of year.)
Although most ER patients were not tested, late October coincided with the laboratory's highest numbers for both swine flu and rhinovirus. More than 40 percent of them were the latter.
Besides the sheer numbers of rhinovirus, Coffin was surprised that it was causing more problems - wheezing, pneumonia, fever, and lower-respiratory-tract infections - than are normally associated with the common cold, which typically infects the upper respiratory tract. That has led her to suspect that a strain not seen here before may be responsible. The CDC's lab will attempt to identify the strain.
With no nationwide reporting and few other hospitals routinely testing for rhinovirus, it is difficult to determine whether it is causing similar problems elsewhere. Hodinka, the Children's lab director, said rhinovirus outbreaks generally were not limited to one city; he suspects that this one is occurring in other East Coast cities.
And doctors in Louisville, Ky., at least, noticed a similar phenomenon: serious illness (in both children and adults) that did not test positive for influenza. They, too, were surprised to find rhinovirus.
"We haven't thought of it as something that causes kids to be really sick and need to be admitted to the ICU," said Kris Bryant, hospital epidemiologist at Kosair Children's Hospital.
Scientists who specialize in rhinovirus are used to their chosen microbe being underestimated, and lauded Children's just for testing for it.
There's an "albatross around their neck," that they are "just the common cold virus," said Ian Mackay, a leading researcher in emerging viruses at the Queensland Paediatric Infectious Diseases Laboratory in Australia.

Intrigued That common cold virus is generally recognized to be responsible for 70 percent or more of colds worldwide, making it the No. 1 cause of respiratory illness.
Mackay was involved with the discovery several years ago of a third group of rhinoviruses, known as human rhinovirus C, that some researchers believe causes more severe illness than the A's and B's. HRV-C presumably has been around for a while, but the molecular tests necessary to find it did not exist until recently.
Mackay also is intrigued by the possibility that the timing of Philadelphia's rhinovirus outbreak - like others, shortly before the flu - was more than coincidence.
A fledgling, highly controversial theory suggests that circulating rhinovirus can somehow delay the spread of influenza - one more reason, Mackay said, to increase the testing and study of rhinovirus.
As a practical matter, finding that rhinovirus is responsible for many illnesses that had been blamed on swine flu may be mainly another motivation to get vaccinated against novel H1N1, researchers said.
Washing your hands and covering your cough is the best way to prevent the spread of both. The only real difference in treatment is that Tamiflu, which reduces the duration of swine flu by one to two days - and is recommended only in severe cases - is useless against rhinovirus.
If the Philadelphia findings are further detailed and found in other cities, however, perhaps they will begin to change perceptions of rhinovirus, said Kathryn Miller, an expert in rhinoviruses and asthma at Monroe Carell Jr. Children's Hospital at Vanderbilt University in Nashville.
They might serve "to make people more aware," she said. "That plain old common cold virus, maybe we need to take it more seriously."


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## Luvmyzoocrew (Dec 5, 2009)

so sorry i tried to edit it so it was more paragraphed and not so big an jumbly,lol


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## BethM (Dec 5, 2009)

*fuzz16 wrote: *


> I wouldn't get it, I have never gotten vaccinatd for any flu type virus and I have a compromised immune system where I get sick easily.
> Most of the H1N1 cases have not been true, mainly jus tbad cases of te flu.


When I got my seasonal flu shot, back in October, the nurse that was giving them told me that seasonal flu was not in Kansas City yet, and that it wouldn't be until January. (They started vaccinating so early 1) get everyone before the virus hit, and 2) because of the holidays, people could travel somewhere that already has it.
She told me that if I did get the flu before then, it was more likely to be H1N1.


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## BethM (Dec 5, 2009)

Fran, that's an interesting article. 
I still believe that H1N1 can be dangerous, based on my acquaintance who was otherwise healthy and died from H1N1. I do understand that, for some people, H1N1 can be mild.

I do agree that it's easy for a "popular" sickness to get blamed for other things. 
I have a co-worker who thought she had H1N1, but it turned out to be a sinus infection. Another co-worker felt better after getting antibiotics, so that's either big-time placebo effect, or she had something else.
I do think that sometimes people take the cold virus a little too lightly. At the very least, people don't take care of themselves and it can take much longer to recover. 


I do have chronic respiratory problems, so I try to be careful with anything that can make it worse. 

For me, there have always been two major things that differentiate flu from a cold: When I have the flu, my skin hurts. It becomes hyper-sensitive, and anything touching my skin is literally painful. A little bit in an ache-y way, but mostly in a way that's like the sharp end of a needle being dragged over my skin.
The other thing is vomiting. I guess different people have different symptoms, but for me, the flu *always* means vomiting. If I don't vomit, it's not the flu.


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## fuzz16 (Dec 5, 2009)

*BethM wrote: *


> *fuzz16 wrote: *
> 
> 
> > I wouldn't get it, I have never gotten vaccinatd for any flu type virus and I have a compromised immune system where I get sick easily.
> ...


NEVER vaccinated in my life, never had the flu...Even though I have MRSA and am easily susceptible to viruses. I may be old fashioned, but I don't beleive in filling my body with all the junk in medicine. I rarely even take pain killers.


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## Luvmyzoocrew (Dec 5, 2009)

*BethM wrote:*


> If I don't vomit, it's not the flu.


lol!!!!


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## degrassi (Dec 5, 2009)

> For me, there have always been two major things that differentiate flu from a cold: When I have the flu, my skin hurts. It becomes hyper-sensitive, and anything touching my skin is literally painful. A little bit in an ache-y way, but mostly in a way that's like the sharp end of a needle being dragged over my skin. The other thing is vomiting. I guess different people have different symptoms, but for me, the flu *always* means vomiting. If I don't vomit, it's not the flu.



This is where people are confused. The flu(the influenza virus) doesn't cause vomitting or diarrhea. Most people think of the flu = vomitting and the cold=running nose, cough. But actually the flu(influenza)= cold like symptoms, aches, headache, no vomitting, no D. and vomitting, or diarrhea = stomach virus/bacteria or mild food poisoning. If you have the "stomach flu"(vomitting, achy,D) you most likely picked a mild case of food poisioning or some other intestinal problem, its not "the Flu".


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## BethM (Dec 5, 2009)

*degrassi wrote: *


> This is where people are confused. The flu(the influenza virus) doesn't cause vomitting or diarrhea. Most people think of the flu = vomitting and the cold=running nose, cough. But actually the flu(influenza)= cold like symptoms, aches, headache, no vomitting, no D. and vomitting, or diarrhea = stomach virus/bacteria or mild food poisoning. If you have the "stomach flu"(vomitting, achy,D) you most likely picked a mild case of food poisioning or some other intestinal problem, its not "the Flu".


Well, the CDC says vomiting and diarrhea CAN be symptoms of the flu. I'm inclined to believe the CDC.


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## BethM (Dec 5, 2009)

*fuzz16 wrote: *


> *BethM wrote: *
> 
> 
> > *fuzz16 wrote: *
> ...


Well, I wasn't trying to make you go get a vaccine. I was just pointing out the inaccuracy in the statement about what type of flu is prevalent right now.
*sheesh*

I haven't had the flu in many, many years. I only got the vaccine this year because it was free. There's worse chemicals in many processed foods than in vaccines.


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## degrassi (Dec 5, 2009)

*BethM wrote: *


> *degrassi wrote: *
> 
> 
> > This is where people are confused. The flu(the influenza virus) doesn't cause vomitting or diarrhea. Most people think of the flu = vomitting and the cold=running nose, cough. But actually the flu(influenza)= cold like symptoms, aches, headache, no vomitting, no D. and vomitting, or diarrhea = stomach virus/bacteria or mild food poisoning. If you have the "stomach flu"(vomitting, achy,D) you most likely picked a mild case of food poisioning or some other intestinal problem, its not "the Flu".
> ...


Well I've been looking over the CDC website and all I can find it this S


> stomach symptoms, such as nausea, vomiting, and diarrhea, also can occur but are more common in children than adults. Some people who have been infected with the new H1N1 flu virus have reported diarrhea and vomiting.


This doesn't mean that the flu causes vomiting or diarrhea. This means that people have reported having those symptoms while they have the flu. Influenza is a *respatory* illness. That doesn't mean the odd person won't throw up or have D because they are feeling sick. Why do you think vomiting and diarrhea are listed as side effects for every medication. People experience them for a wide range of reasons. 

http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20030114/flu_not030114/Health?s_name=&no_ads=


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## BethM (Dec 5, 2009)

*degrassi wrote: *


> Well I've been looking over the CDC website and all I can find it this S
> 
> 
> > stomach symptoms, such as nausea, vomiting, and diarrhea, also can occur but are more common in children than adults. Some people who have been infected with the new H1N1 flu virus have reported diarrhea and vomiting.
> ...


I guess I am just *really lucky* and somehow manage to get food poisoning and the flu at the same time. In the past, when I have had the flu, I vomited. I am quite sensitive, I sometimes vomit when I have a sinus infection, and I sometimes vomit when I have a bad headache, and there are a couple antibiotics that make me vomit. One day last week, I vomited because some jerk wore perfume to work.

If you will go back and read what I wrote:_ *For me*, there have always been two major things that differentiate flu from a cold: When I have the flu, my skin hurts. It becomes hyper-sensitive, and anything touching my skin is literally painful. A little bit in an ache-y way, but mostly in a way that's like the sharp end of a needle being dragged over my skin.
The other thing is vomiting. *I guess different people have different symptoms, but for me, the flu *always* means vomiting.* If I don't vomit, it's not the flu.

_I never claimed that you, or anyone else, has to vomit when you have the flu, or that it's not a respiratory ailment.


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## Orchid (Dec 5, 2009)

Hey....RO STAFF & PIPP...

I am wondering as mods....if someone can please put a stop to the constant disagreements that can not seem to end on there own? Lock the thread or something?
This seems to be beyond any point of reason now...and I think is causing some serious negative vibes out there...

For what my two cents are not worth....


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## irishbunny (Dec 7, 2009)

After a two hour wait, we finally got it. It was called Pandemrix or something lol. The wait was so long and boring, lot's of kids running away from their parents and kicking and screaming, I have a head ache from it. Better be worth it! :grumpy:


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## Pet_Bunny (Dec 7, 2009)

*irishbunny wrote: *


> It was called Pandemrix or something lol. Better be worth it! :grumpy:



Ours was called Arepanrix TM, one dose of 0.5 ml in the left arm.

I felt my arm was a littlesore for three days, but then it was fine.

However it doesn't excuse you from washing your hands. :highfive:


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## irishbunny (Dec 7, 2009)

*Pet_Bunny wrote: *


> *irishbunny wrote: *
> 
> 
> > It was called Pandemrix or something lol. Better be worth it! :grumpy:
> ...


Lol, don't worry I wash my hands anyway! 

My arm is feeling really ''dead'' and heavy and I'm really tired after it, went to bed and slept for awhile.

Pandemrix

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pandemrix


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## Sabine (Dec 7, 2009)

I haven't even considered getting the shots for myself or the family.
But then again, the only creatures that get vaccinated in my house are the bunnies


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## missyscove (Dec 14, 2009)

I went in and got mine, intranasal, last week. No side effects and it only took me about half an hour. 
No regrets here.


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