# Rabbit not growing



## Natusha (Jan 28, 2015)

I posted here previously about my ill bunny, buddy, who seems to have recovered... I just realised that he hasn't really grown? 
He's a mini lop, (or so I was told) and when we got him he only weighed 280 grams. After a vet visit they informed us that he was not 8 weeks old as the seller told us, and he was probably a few weeks less than that, and he's had many problems with cleaning himself, being ill, hard to toilet train etc. 
we have had him for about a month now. 
I weighed him two weeks in and he was 300 grams. 
Today I weighed him and he's 350 grams. 
That's seems an unusually slow rate for him to be growing. 
After about a month of having my other mini lop which I got at Christmas time, he had grown by almost half his original size. he now weighs a kilo and is about 3 and a half months old. 
But is, as a guesstimate, about 9 week old.
Should I be concerned about this little bunny?


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## Natusha (Jan 28, 2015)

I'll also add that you can't feel his spine and he's not particularly bony. In fact, he's has quite the little pod belly and eats enough, on a balanced diet of hay with a tiny bit of veggies. 
For his size he feels healthy, he's just so little, almost still able to sit in the palm of my hand little. He's very cute but I just wonder if maybe he's been set back because he was more Han likely taken from his mother far too early?


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## JBun (Jan 28, 2015)

That is a very slow weight gain and small size for that type of rabbit at that age. The coccidiosis can have some effect on that as it can retard growth due to it's effect on the liver, but if the cocci has cleared up and no permanent damage was done, then I would think the weight gain would improve as well. 

Did the vet actually confirm coccidiosis through a fecal float? What antibiotic was the bun on and for how long? What is his exact diet now- type and amount of hay, pellets, veggies, and any other foods he gets? You mentioned in your other thread that he is still sometimes having a messy bum. Is it mushy poop sticking to his fur or is it urine in the fur, and how often is it occurring?


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## Natusha (Jan 28, 2015)

The vet took a sample of his poop and she confirmed it was coccidiosis. 
He was on tribrissen(?) if that's the spelling, for 7 days, half a tablet day and night.
I might add that she didn't seem to have much rabbit specific knowledge and she never mentioned anything about disinfecting etc. 
I've been buying bags of grass hay from the pet store, and he's having veggies (broccoli, celery, cucumber and a little carrot) roughly half a cup daily. The hay pretty much unlimited he doesn't run out of it. 

He is still having a messy bum, usually a slightly mushy poop which seems to get stuck in his bum/groin area. He doesn't seem to get urine on himself, and every now and then he will have a little dry poo stuck to him. I check him frequently to make sure he isn't being left with a messy bum because I'm terrified of the possibility of fly strike. I'm assuming he needs a follow up appointment. She also never mentioned that.


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## JBun (Jan 28, 2015)

How long ago was the last dose of antibiotic given? Treatment for coccidiosis usually is done in two treatments, usually given for at least 5 days, wait 5 days, then retreat another 5 days or more. This is to cover and interrupt the cycle of the parasite. If the second treatment isn't given, there is a good chance of reinfection occurring. If your vet didn't cover a second treatment, you will want to either give the vet a call to discuss it or find a better rabbit vet if needed, so the rabbit gets the correct treatment.

Disinfection of the environment is done with a 10% ammonia solution. This needs to be done on things with hard non porous surfaces and rinsed *thoroughly* , also making sure the rabbit is removed to a safe area until the ammonia fumes have vented and dissipated. For porous surfaces like carpets, blankets, furniture, wash what you can in steaming hot water, and the other things can be disinfected with a steam cleaner. And try and minimize contact with feces as much as possible, as that is how it is contracted. Clean out cage and litter box frequently. Quite a hassle, but if you can do it, it will minimize reinfection risks.

For the mushy poop as well as the slow weight gain, it could still have to do with the coccidiosis, especially if it is the fecal poop coming out mushy, and especially if the vet didn't have you retreat the bunny. In which case if the bunny has become reinfected, you will need to do two retreatments and not just one. The vet should probably do another fecal float to confirm whether or not the cocci is cleared up or not.

This link has a lot of good information on coccidiosis disease, symptoms, and treatment in rabbits, if you want to take a look. But just be aware that it also contains some medical related photos that could be a bit disturbing to see.
http://www.medirabbit.com/EN/GI_diseases/Protozoal_diseases/Cocc_en.htm *(WARNING: GRAPHIC MEDICAL RELATED PHOTOS)*

Another possibility for the mushy poop, is the veggies and/or carrot(high in sugar). If the fecal poop is normal round balls and it is the cecals that are coming out mushy, it is called cecal dysbiosis and is due to a microflora imbalance in the rabbits cecum. Young bunnies can sometimes have difficulty with veggies in the diet, especially if they didn't grow up eating them with their mom. It might be a good idea to cut the veggies out of the diet for now, then try reintroducing back into the diet when the bunny is at least 12 weeks old and the mushy poop has cleared up. When reintroducing veg, it's best to go slow, and starting with dark leafy veg is usually better as things like celery, cucumber, and carrot are common veg that can lead to mushy poop developing. Start with a small amount of one veg and only gradually increase the amount if there are no signs of digestive upset. Doing one veg at a time helps to pinpoint if there is a particular veg causing digestive issues. Also, is there a particular reason the bunny doesn't also get pellets in his diet?
http://rabbit.org/intermittent-soft-cecotropes-in-rabbits/
http://www.lagomorphs.com/salad.pdf
http://www.medirabbit.com/EN/GI_diseases/Food/feeding_en.pdf


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## Natusha (Jan 29, 2015)

Wow, I cannot thank you enough for the information and advice. 
You have so far given me more valuable information than the vet, and I'm now quite concerned about her lack of knowledge.. 
He will be taken back to the vet asap. 
I didn't disinfect things as I wasn't made aware of how it should be done, I simply cleaned everything in his cage as I normally would before returning him to it. 
I'll look at his diet again and as you suggest I will take away the veggies for now. 
The reason he doesn't have pellets is because I have been given so much different information I have become confused, and by many I have been told that pellets are bad and by others they are good. 
The ones I have come across so far didn't seem to meet the requirements for what is considered a quality pellet, if you have any advice on a quality pellet I would appreciate, keeping in mind though that I am in Australia. 
There isn't much information around, and vets don't seem to be much help either, I'm yet to discover one that has a lot of rabbit specific knowledge. I'm very worried about my bunny and fear that even with vet visits he won't get the right treatment because nobody here in tasmania seems to know what they're talking about when it comes to bunnies


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## Natusha (Jan 29, 2015)

One last thing to add, my second rabbit lives separately from this one as they don't get along right now and haven't been desexed, anyhow, while he lives separately they play in the same area of the house. 
The sick one isn't really properly littler trained yet, so he has pooped on the floor, obviously it's tidied up straight away quite well but does this mean that it's quite possible the other bunny night have gotten it from him? I haven't noticed any difference in behaviour, eating, drinking and toilet habits. 
I guess he should be checked by a vet too.


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## majorv (Jan 29, 2015)

Considering his age, I would definitely recommend a good quality pellet as soon as you can. That will provide him with the nutrients he needs to grow. He won't get that from hay.


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## bright_eyes (Jan 29, 2015)

Sherwood rabbit food is a very good brand, very healthy and bunny-appropriate. The company might be willing to work with you to get it shipped to Tasmania:

https://www.naturalrabbitfood.com/

In my opinion, this little guy will benefit from consistency. Even if the pellets you have in your country are not of superior quality, they will still offer him consistency while getting more vitamins and minerals into him than just feeding greens and hay. He is too small to physically eat enough volume and types of greens to get what he needs. Plus with his very delicate and poorly digestive/immune system he seems to have been born with, consistency in a diet of just pellets and hay is going to override the drawbacks of feeding a pellets with soy or corn. Lesser of the evils, just my opinion though.

Once he gets a little older and back on track, the diet can always be revised- greens and variety can be added once more.


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## Natusha (Jan 29, 2015)

Thank you so much everyone. 
He will be getting pellets from today forward.


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## JBun (Jan 29, 2015)

You may want to wait a bit on the pellets until you get the mushy poop sorted out. Adding in new foods when there are already mushy poop problems, can often contribute to the issue and the microflora imbalance. Especially if cocci is causing the mushy poop, then hay really is the best thing to help restore the gut balance. Once you get the mushy poop cleared up and the poop has been normal for at least a few days(may need longer though if it comes right back), then you could gradually start adding pellets in if you want. You may want to try and find a probiotic to help restore the gut balance as well. Common ones used for rabbits are Bene Bac or Fibreplex, not sure what you have available to you though. Also wondering what type of grass hay is it that you are feeding him?

There is debate whether pellets are good or not. The reason is that the carbs and sugars in them can sometimes lead to digestive issues developing, especially in rabbits that have an extra sensitive GI tract. I've had a rabbit that couldn't have pellets and was on a hay/veggie diet, but I also feed my other rabbits limited amounts of pellets in addition to their hay. The reason pellets can be a good addition in a rabbits diet is because they contain a balanced amount of the correct vitamins and minerals that rabbits need. So a bit like a multivitamin. And as long as a rabbit has a healthy GI tract and doesn't have health issues that make them sensitive to pellets, then pellets are usually fine to have in a rabbits diet. For rabbits not fed pellets, it can be difficult finding the right balance in their diet with veggies/herbs/forage, but it is possible. 

When picking a pellet out, you really want to try and find one that has alfalfa hay as the first ingredient for baby rabbits as they need the higher protein, and for adult rabbits I prefer a pellet with a grass hay as the first ingredient as they are usually lower calcium, which I want for my adult pet rabbits. Then you don't want too many grain ingredients, and you want grain and sugars to be as low down on the list as possible, definitely you don't want a grain product as the first thing on the list. I also don't like corn to be in the feed at all. I like Oxbow rabbit food, and I believe it should be available to you there online, in pet stores, or your vet should be able to order it in. They have a young rabbit food and an adult food. Hay is the first ingredient in both and it has a higher amount of vitamins added to it, which is good when you are feeding it in limited amounts along with unlimited hay. I know a few other RO members from Australia, also feed their buns Oxbow. If there is another feed that you are interested in but aren't sure about, you can always post the ingredient list on here and we can give you our opinions on it. 

When adding pellets into the diet, you want to do it slowly like you do with veggies. Start with a small pinch of pellets for a couple days, then gradually increase the amount over a couple weeks if there are no signs of digestive issues. You want to be feeding close to unlimited pellets. I will usually feed baby rabbits twice a day and just enough pellets so they run out about 3 hours before the next feeding, then they can snack on their grass hay. I've found this makes sure they are also eating enough hay for good gut motility. Basically you want them at least eating a pile of hay the size of their body each day and then the rest of their diet in pellets. If you are seeing fecal poop that is smaller than it should be, hard, dark, and may be sticky or irregularly shaped, then the rabbit isn't getting enough indigestible fiber from it's hay and it needs less pellets and more hay in the diet. You want a rabbits poop to be soft and crush easily in your fingers. If you start seeing mushy poop again, you may be increasing the amount of pellets too quickly or the bun may not be able to tolerate too many pellets in the diet. In which case, reduce the pellet amount until the mushy poop stops, then more gradually start increasing again. If you again see mushy poop, reduce pellets until it stops and then you may just need to maintain pellets at the amount where you no longer see mushy poop. If you ever see watery diarrhea, that is different and you should stop pellets, continue with grass hay, and contact your vet immediately. This link gives a good explanation of the different types of poop you might see from your rabbits.
http://imgur.com/a/5N4lD

There is also the added need of baby rabbits, for higher protein and nutrients while they are growing. And it's a good alfalfa based pellet that usually will provide these needed nutrients. When feeding a grass hay only to a baby rabbit, this will usually slow their growth rate because of the lower protein and nutrients. Once you are able to add pellets into the diet, if you find they are causing digestive issues for the baby, you could instead try adding in alfalfa/lucerne hay into the babies diet. This will provide it with extra calcium and protein for growth, though just not as balanced as a pellet would be, but also doesn't have the added grains and sugars that pellets have and which are usually the triggers for digestive issues when they occur. If you do add alfalfa hay into his diet, just make sure to do it gradually over at least a week, as rabbits digestion needs time to slowly adapt to new foods(aside from grass hays). So start off with a small amount and if it doesn't seem to cause any problems, gradually increase.

Until the baby rabbits cocci problems have been confirmed to have cleared up, I personally wouldn't let your other rabbit be in the same area. If your other rabbit had an overgrowth of cocci, you would probably be seeing symptoms of it, but sometimes you won't at first, so if you have any concerns you may want to have a fecal test done to confirm your rabbit hasn't been infected. I found one rabbit vet listing for Tasmania. Not sure if it is current or even how good the vet is, but it is under rabbit vet listings.
*North Hobart Veterinary Hospital
**Dr Rupe Woods*273 Elizabeth Street*
North Hobart *7000TasmaniaPhone: (03) 6234 7044


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## Natusha (Jan 29, 2015)

I'm afraid I'm unsure on the type of grass hay, I didn't ask because I didn't actually realise that it matter or that there even are many different types, I will ask them where I bought it though. 
I have seen oxbow at the vet I go to so will get some of that and as you suggest, add it gradually and only once the mush poop is under control. 

That's the veterinary clinic I took little buddy to, I wasn't aware at the time that they had a specialist though. Now that I am aware I will specifically book with that vet where possible. 
You have really given me a lot of good information and I'm feeling a little more confident that I can look after these bunnies properly, thank you for your help. I'll see how I go with their diets and they'll both be checked over by a vet once more.


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