# MooShu and her lump



## JimD (Feb 5, 2009)

Baby MooShu has a lump 

She was out for some freetime and I decided to brush her before putting her back.

On her left side, between her front shoulder and her ribs, I found a lump.

Feels likeit may be anabscess.... about the size of small grape.

She'll need to go see Dr.C...but she's never been out of the house since we've had her. 
She's NEVER been in a carrier...but she'll have to be in one for the ride and wait at the vet.

We brought her home 5 years ago when she was a baby..... along with her mommy, S'more.

:sigh:


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## Maureen Las (Feb 5, 2009)

Isthe lump really hard Jim ?


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## Maureen Las (Feb 5, 2009)

I think that you've had enough of "lumps" for 1 year 
What a shame 

Could it be a fatty cyst ?


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## Bo B Bunny (Feb 5, 2009)

I hope that's all it is! Bo had a tiny little thing on his back the last time he saw the vet and she said they do get little fat deposits like that sometimes. 

ray:

Jim, I'm thinking of you and her.... it's been a rough time for you.:hug:


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## JimD (Feb 5, 2009)

angieluv* wrote: *


> Isthe lump really hard Jim ?


It's firm, but not real hard.
It's kind of squishy.
It moves and doesn't seem to be attached.
And it doesn't seem to cause her pain if I mess with it.

angieluv* wrote: *



> I think that you've had enough of "lumps" for 1 year
> What a shame
> 
> Could it be a fatty cyst ?


It feels just like the abscess that Binky had removed a couple of years ago.
Chippy's lump was unique cyst, so I don't think I can use that as a comparison.
I think I'll have to let the vet figure this one.

Bo B Bunny* wrote: *


> I hope that's all it is! Bo had a tiny little thing on his back the last time he saw the vet and she said they do get little fat deposits like that sometimes.
> 
> ray:
> 
> Jim, I'm thinking of you and her.... it's been a rough time for you.:hug:



I think this is too big and developed too fast to be a fatty deposit.
I brush Moosh at least once a week and haven't noticed until now. I could have overlooked it, but I'm usually pretty thorough.

Dr.C won't be in until next week.
I'll monitor her closely to see if the lump increases in size or changes in any way.
I can take her in as an emergency if needed


On a side note:
Chippy seems to has recovered completely and the cyst has not reformed.
She has some scar tissue, and her fur grew in kind of wonky.
But, I think she's deserving of a clean bill.


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## naturestee (Feb 5, 2009)

Is there another good bunny vet you could see earlier than next week?

Good thoughts going to you and MooShu!


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## Hazel-Mom (Feb 5, 2009)

Don't rule out the fatty deposits, though. Hazel has one that developed quite sudden, and grew quite big.
The vet did a needle biopsy on it, and it turned out just a fatty deposit.
I hope for you and MooShu that this is what it is.


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## JimD (Feb 5, 2009)

*naturestee wrote: *


> Is there another good bunny vet you could see earlier than next week?
> 
> Good thoughts going to you and MooShu!



My old vet is available tomorrow and Saturday, but she's quite expensive (Banfield Pet Hospital).

The Oradell Animal Hospital has a good exotic vet that treats rabbits, but the hospital itself has a bad reputation.

I trust Dr.C completely and he gives me a BIG break in charges.
He did Chippy's laser surgery for $88.
And he is available 24/7 for emergencies.
He took Saturday's off for the summer and hired an associate....but the associate doesn't treat any exotics.
I'll have to call and see if he's working Saturday's again ***crosses fingers***


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## JimD (Feb 5, 2009)

Thanks for all of the words of wisdom and well wishes.

This is the only pic I can find of Moosh....a lot of pics seem to have disappered from my blog


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## LuvaBun (Feb 5, 2009)

I'm sorry to hear about MooShu, Jim. I can understand about being worried for her going in a carrier and out to the vet. Could you put another bun in with her for company?

Jan


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## JimD (Feb 5, 2009)

*JimD wrote: *


> ....a lot of pics seem to have disappered from my blog



I think it's my own fault.:twitch:

The missing pics were most probably attached right from my PC instead of a host site (ie; Photobucket):foreheadsmack:

I still have all of the originals, but it would take me forever to match the right pic to the posts.

I've pretty much trashed my own blog.
I guess it's time for a new one.

C'est la vie hwell:


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## Pipp (Feb 5, 2009)

When did you lose them? 

I hope not recently? 

When we moved in mid-07, volunteers saved a bunch of attachments to Photobucket that never got restored. 

Here's easy fix vibes for pics and MooShu!



sas :clover:


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## JimD (Feb 5, 2009)

*Pipp wrote: *


> When did you lose them?
> 
> I hope not recently?
> 
> ...



Thanks for the vibes, sas.

I can't be sure about when the pics went missing, but I think they were there before the move.

Not to worry though....I have backup of all my photos....and it was time I started a new blog.

Speaking of that....I see the blog links were fixed....YAY!!
Do you know what the new tags are to make it work??


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## krsbunny (Feb 6, 2009)

I agree... don't rule out the fatty cyst. They are not that uncommon ... and I've seen them get pretty big pretty fast. And the location you describe is where I've seen them too. 

If you have another vet who might do a needle aspiration of cells this week, it might give you peace of mind. If it's just fatty stuff, you will probably still want to have it removed, but could relax while waiting to see your regular vet. 

Sending good energy your way!

Kathy Smith


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## AngelnSnuffy (Feb 6, 2009)

Not to worry you, Jim. But that area is where I found Angel's tumour that turned out to be cancerous (Mammory). I wish and am praying for the best!


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## Bo B Bunny (Feb 6, 2009)

Definitely needs looked at! 
There's our little Mooshu girly! :hearts:


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## JimD (Feb 6, 2009)

The earliest Dr.C can see her is Tuesday evening.

The Banfield vet can see her as a walk-in tomorrow...which means we go and wait for an opening....could be several hours wait time.
They'll want to put her under general anesthesia for the aspiration.
She's 5 years old, so that worries me.
Then they'll charge me for an office visit, the aspiration, lab (mandatory Banfield procedure), plus incidentals (ie; anesthesia,hazardous waste disposal, surgical supply materials, etc.). And then it can take up to a week to get results back. They also charge for follow-up visits.
The bill will be around $750....and that's without removal or treatment.

Dr.C will probably opt to remove it. 
He may or may not send out a sample to the lab....it depends on what he finds.
The bill for the major laser surgery he did on Chippy only cost $88.
He didn't even charge me for the 3 aspirations or the one minor surgery, and only charged me for some of the meds & lab work.
The total bill was less than $500 (mostly from the lab charges).

Moosh is doing fine and doesn't seem to be bothered by the lump at all.
She's eating/drinking/pooping/peeing normal, and was doing binkies all over the place last night. She even seemed to enjoy getting brushed!


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## naturestee (Feb 6, 2009)

What the...? You'd think with Banfield being a chain that the prices would be lower due to bulk purchases, etc. Fey's overnight stay at the emergency hospital was less than what they'd chargeyou for a simple needle aspiration. I guessBanfield's pricing is just like Petsmart's- higher for no reason.

If your vet does find that the lump needs to be removed, you can ask about have kidney/liver blood tests done. My vet will do just those instead of a full blood panel for otherwise healthy animals about to have surgery and it costs a lot less than the full panel. It will ease your mind, as the liver and kidneys are the organs most likely to have issues with anesthesia besides the heart.

5 year old Loki has had several dental surgeries needing full anesthesia in the last year. He always does fine and doesn't even seem groggy after he wakes up.

I'm glad she's feeling well despite causing so much worry! Does she mind when you touch the lump or does it not bother her?


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## Bo B Bunny (Feb 6, 2009)

Jim, I think Tuesday is good too. Sometimes we have to wait as hard as it is.


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## JimD (Feb 6, 2009)

*naturestee wrote: *


> I'm glad she's feeling well despite causing so much worry! Does she mind when you touch the lump or does it not bother her?




It doesn't seem to bother her very much at all when I mess with it.

And she's a very sensitive/insecure bun to begin with.

A bit of background info:

Danielle reminded me that we had taken Mooshu to the vet when she was about 8 months old.

There was a major mix-up about Mooshu's sex when we adopted her/him, and we took her/him to Banfield for a general exam and sexing.

At that exam it was determined that "he" was female, and most likelyintact ...and not a fixed male as the shelter had ultimately told us.
They also found that she has reversed splayed hind legs (aka knock-kneed), and impaired vision and hearing.

Moosh is very happy and content, as long as she'sin familiar surroundings.


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## JimD (Feb 6, 2009)

*Bo B Bunny wrote: *


> Jim, I think Tuesday is good too. Sometimes we have to wait as hard as it is.



Thanks, Pennie :hug:
I need those kind of positive thoughts right now.

I'm okay with the wait as long as it isn't detrimental to Moosh's well-being.

Ashlee, Dr.C's receptionist, knows me from when I was bringing Chippy in.

She told me not to hesitate to callANYTIME (24/7), and bring Mooshu in if I think it has turned into an emergency situation.

I can be there in 20 minutes....10 if there's no cops.:coolness: (they'd have to chase me all the way to the vets before I'd pull over anyway! Police escort??!!)


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## tonyshuman (Feb 6, 2009)

I think they'd let you go without a ticket too.


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## naturestee (Feb 6, 2009)

Make way! Man with a sick bunny!


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## Maureen Las (Feb 6, 2009)

This isoff-topic to Angela
I got a ticket for going through a stop sign when I was bringing Oberon back from the vet after he was neutered. The cop looked at the carrier and said 
"Do you have to be somewhere in a hurry? andI was honest and said 

"no"
I should have said"Make Way Woman with ajust neutered bunny!" :biggrin2:



Jim,

IfI were you I would wait for your regular doctor also. I wouldn't hesitate to wait unless Moo Shu looked in distress ...


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## JimD (Feb 6, 2009)

I'm thinking of getting a couple of magnetic signs for my car...




[align=center]_RABBIT RESCUE
AMBULATORY TRANSPORT_[/align]

[align=left][/align]

[align=left]I can put the extra carrier in the car...and maybe put a stuffed rabbit in it for the full effect.
Maybeone of thoseyellow flashing lights with the suction cup for the roof? Or a pink one maybe?
A bunny's waterbottle in the cupholder...and a bag of crasins on the dashboard?
Hang some IV bottles from the coat hooks?
The riot helmet with bunny ears might be a bit over the top, eh?[/align]


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## JimD (Feb 7, 2009)

Moosh is doing very good today.

She looks great!...considering that she's going through a major molt.
I think all the extra grooming has helped.
I've also been giving her extra sunflower seeds and rolled oatsies...along with larger portions of dried papaya.

I checked the "lump" and it hasn't seemed to change much.


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## Maureen Las (Feb 7, 2009)

I think that if you had that on your car
they "be coming to take you away" 


I"m glad that little Moo Shu is holding her own

I had Moo Shu veggies for dinner last night

she would have liked it...


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## JimD (Feb 8, 2009)

Moosh is still doing fine.

I went through all of her old pics and decided that I needed to update them.

Here's a couple that I've downloaded so far....
***please excuse the lousy red-eye fix...just couldn't get it quite right today***

This is her good side...









This is her left side.....I circled the area where the lump is....


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## Maureen Las (Feb 8, 2009)

She's gorgeous 

Do you know what that coloring is called?

I can see the lump but as long as it's not growing try to relax until Tues.


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## JimD (Feb 8, 2009)

*angieluv wrote: *


> She's gorgeous
> 
> Do you know what that coloring is called?
> 
> I can see the lump but as long as it's not growing try to relax until Tues.



Thanks!:hearts:

She's a dutch mix and looks nothing like her mother, S'more (we have _her_, too!!).
We don't know anything about the father.
S'more and her 5 babies were brought into the shelter when their owner passed away.

Here's S'more....


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## Bo B Bunny (Feb 8, 2009)

Those two are so pretty! You have so many sometimes I need refresher pics! LOL! 
I know she's getting the best possible care, but I am anxious to hear what they say on Tuesday!


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## Hazel-Mom (Feb 9, 2009)

Hi Jim, the lump on Mooshu's picture is exactly where Hazel has her fatty deposit, and looks exactly the same!
Those prices you quoted look horribly over the top! We are lucky that our vet is much cheaper!
When Hazel's vet did the needle biopsy, she just stuck the needle in without total anesthesia. It went very quick and easy, Hazel didn't even flinch. (My husband was with her, not me, so I'm not sure whether they used local anesthesia. I think not, though.) The vet did compliment her on how calm she was, she didn't even need the assistant to help hold her 
They also did the cell examination right then and there, we didn't have to wait for results. If they had seen something more than just fatty cells, they would have sent it out, though.
Hazel never had the lump removed, the vet didn't think it was necesary, we just keep an eye on it. It hasn't changed for 4 years now.
Hopefully all turns out well for MooShu and you.


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## JimD (Feb 9, 2009)

*Hazel-Mom wrote: *


> Hi Jim, the lump on Mooshu's picture is exactly where Hazel has her fatty deposit, and looks exactly the same!





> Those prices you quoted look horribly over the top! We are lucky that our vet is much cheaper!





> When Hazel's vet did the needle biopsy, she just stuck the needle in without total anesthesia. It went very quick and easy,





> They also did the cell examination right then and there, we didn't have to wait for results. If they had seen something more than just fatty cells, they would have sent it out, though.





> Hazel never had the lump removed, the vet didn't think it was necesary, we just keep an eye on it. It hasn't changed for 4 years now.
> Hopefully all turns out well for MooShu and you.



The best senario I could hope for is that it's a fatty deposit of some kind.

I love the vet at Banfield, but... as you saw...their prices are outrageous.
EVERYTHING in my immediate area is overpriced.
That's why I travelalmost 20 miles to see Dr.C at the Pompton Lakes Animal Hospital.

Dr.C does partial anesthesia when he does an aspiration. Just enough to calm them and keep them from moving.

He'll send out a biop to the lab if he sees anything that warrants it.

Tomorrow at this time, I'll be headed home to pack up Moosh.


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## JimD (Feb 9, 2009)

:cry2


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## naturestee (Feb 9, 2009)

Jim? What's up? How's MooShu?


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## Pipp (Feb 9, 2009)

JimD wrote:


> :cry2




:?


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## Bo B Bunny (Feb 9, 2009)

JIm????


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## JimD (Feb 10, 2009)

I'm here, I'm here!

I'm sorry.

Moosh is fine.

I'm just a little worried.


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## Maureen Las (Feb 10, 2009)

Tomorrow is the vet appt 

we'll be waiting to hear how things go for you and Moosh

:hug:Maureen


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## krsbunny (Feb 10, 2009)

I can see the lump too. It looks very much like (and is located in the same place as) Dante's lumps ... and they were fatty cysts. Hopefully that will be confirmed tomorrow.

Kathy Smith


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## Maureen Las (Feb 10, 2009)

How'd it go???
Maureen


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## JimD (Feb 10, 2009)

Haven't gone yet.

Our appointment is at 6:45p (EST)

I called to see if there was any chance of getting in earlier. No can do.

Our appt is booked 15 minutes before they close, so I think they squeezed us in.
This could be a late night.


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## Bo B Bunny (Feb 10, 2009)

:censored2:

I was hoping it would be over and you'd tell me that it was a fatty lump when I got in from work.

ray:


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## JimD (Feb 10, 2009)

I'm leaving work.... to go home.... in about 20 minutes.

I'll post before I leave for the vet, so y'all know I'm on the way.


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## mouse_chalk (Feb 10, 2009)

I've been following this thread from the start, but not posted yet for some reason...

I really really hope you get good news at the vets! I will be thinking of you tonight until I come back online in the morning...

You and MooShu take care :hug:


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## Bo B Bunny (Feb 10, 2009)

I was about to kick my son for being on the computer all evening..... Where's jim?!


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## JimD (Feb 10, 2009)

Here I am!

Sorry about not posting when I left.
The computer had a virus and I was running a scan....it found a nasty worm....and got rid of it...yay!

We got back about an hour ago.
I settled Moosh in, and fed all the buns.
She seems to be fine, and did really well with the carrier, car ride, etc.
Last I saw she was picking all the treats out of her bowl....
and then she pooped and peed on her blankie***"take that, daddy!!!"***

And then I had some supper myself....I was starving!!!

Anywho.....

First off....Dr.C thought MooShu was "gorgeous"!!
And he knew she was a dutch mix just by the shape of her head! I was impressed....considering she looks nothing like a dutch.

Heopted to drain the mass.

It had actually gone all the way up into her shoulder from her side.
He did a fine needle aspiration and drained a little over 10cc.
Moosh was the best. They said she just sat there while he did it....no anesthesia.

He did a micro analysis of the sample and determined that it was benign!!!!!!!
Mostly fatty cells.
In vet lingo, he called it a "preliminary gross morphology/cytology lipoma" and recommended no further action unless it reformed.


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## Bo B Bunny (Feb 10, 2009)

:yes::jumpforjoy::yes::dancingorig::bunny18arty0002::trio:yahoo:



*I literally have teared up here! I was so worried! and now so relieved!*


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## JimD (Feb 10, 2009)

*Bo B Bunny wrote: *


> I was so worried! and now so relieved!


me too!

:bunnydance:


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## krsbunny (Feb 10, 2009)

Yay! That's what I thought itwas! Great that your vet was able to drain it without anesthesia. Go relax ... you've earned it!

Kathy Smith


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## JimD (Feb 10, 2009)

*krsbunny wrote: *


> Yay! That's what I thought itwas! Great that your vet was able to drain it without anesthesia. Go relax ... you've earned it!
> 
> Kathy Smith



Thanks, Kathy!
....and a belated "Welcome to the RO Forum!!"

Dr.C has skills and compassion that are seldom found...and I am truly blessed to have found him.

Relaxing sounds nice!
I've been kicked back for a bit, and will be going down shortly to tuck the buns in for the night.
***I think they deserve an extra bedtime story tonight***


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## naturestee (Feb 10, 2009)

Thank goodness! I am so happy for you and MooShu!


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## pumpkinandwhiskersmom (Feb 11, 2009)

:bunnydance::bunnydance::bunnydance:inkelepht::great:inkbouce::yes:
WOOT!!!! I've been worried about Mooshu and you, Jim. You handle these things so well....I'd have been out of my mind by now....thank goodness your sweetie is doing well... we'll keep praying that it's gone for good. Dr. C. is my hero! Wonder if we could bun-nap him to come to PA???hmmmmmm


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## JimD (Feb 11, 2009)

*naturestee wrote: *


> Thank goodness! I am so happy for you and MooShu!



Thanks, Angela.

She's doing great!
She's groomed herself up nicely. There's just a small area that they shaved.....otherwise you'd never know what she'd been through.
And she gotSO excited when I offered hera piece of papaya at bedtime. :biggrin2:

I'm so proud of her!!


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## JimD (Feb 11, 2009)

*JimD wrote: *


> ***I think they deserve an extra bedtime story tonight***




I told them the one about "Moosh the Mighty" and her 7 Bun-Knights.....
..the episode where they fight off the Bad Thingys.


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## JimD (Feb 11, 2009)

*pumpkinandwhiskersmom wrote: *


> WOOT!!!!


Thanks!!

...and ditto to the "WOOT!!!" part :bunnydance:


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## AngelnSnuffy (Feb 11, 2009)

I'm so glad to hear she's doing well, Jim. Give her a huge hug from me.


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## Hazel-Mom (Feb 11, 2009)

*JimD wrote: *


> He did a fine needle aspiration and drained a little over 10cc.
> Moosh was the best. They said she just sat there while he did it....no anesthesia.
> 
> He did a micro analysis of the sample and determined that it was benign!!!!!!!
> ...


Yes, that's what Hazel had too. I'm so happy for you and MooShu, Jim!
And aren't we sooo proud of them when they behave perfectly at the vets :biggrin2:.


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## slavetoabunny (Feb 11, 2009)

Yay for Moosh! What a little trooper.


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## Pet_Bunny (Feb 11, 2009)

:bunnydance:


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## Maureen Las (Feb 11, 2009)

:highfive::great:Glad to hear that all went well

Maureen


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## mouse_chalk (Feb 11, 2009)

YAY!

I'm so glad to hear it's not serious. Bless your Dr C, he sounds great 

You must be so relieved!


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## Bo B Bunny (Feb 11, 2009)

*JimD wrote: *


> *JimD wrote: *
> 
> 
> > ***I think they deserve an extra bedtime story tonight***
> ...


LOL! I sing to mine!


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## JimD (Feb 11, 2009)

*Bo B Bunny wrote: *


> LOL! I sing to mine!



me too :blushan:



***soon to be released..."Moosh the Mighty: *The Musical*"***


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## mouse_chalk (Feb 11, 2009)

*JimD wrote: *


> *Bo B Bunny wrote: *
> 
> 
> > LOL! I sing to mine!
> ...


There's a show over here called 'The Mighty Boosh'. I am now forever going to think of it as 'The Mighty Moosh'

The theme tune even goes 'the mighty booooooooooosh'


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## Bo B Bunny (Feb 11, 2009)

LOL! 

Wonder what others might think of us? :craziness


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## JimD (Feb 11, 2009)

*Bo B Bunny wrote: *


> LOL!
> 
> Wonder what others might think of us? :craziness


:twitch:


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## JimD (Feb 11, 2009)

Tonight is the sneak preview of "Mighty Moosh: Conquest of the New Litter Pan"


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## AngelnSnuffy (Feb 13, 2009)

Jim, you are so funny. Still in my prayers for Mooshu. You guys take care and update us.ray:


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## JimD (Feb 14, 2009)

...not completely absolutely totally 100% sure, 



....but I think it may be reforming.




:sigh:


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## AngelnSnuffy (Feb 14, 2009)

*JimD wrote: *


> ...not completely absolutely totally 100% sure,
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Oh no! Oh, Jim. I just don't know what to say other than to think positively. We'll get this! Even if it did form back, talk to other docs that have more experience with this and the removals. Let me know what they say, as I've been there.

Thinking of you and praying for MooShu!ray:


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## JimD (Feb 14, 2009)

She won't let me touch it.
And it feels warm...could that be because there no fur.

She's acting fine..eating/drinking/pooping/peeing (peeing everywhere)

She wouldn't let them take her temp the other day.
I might give it a try.

I think Dr.C is out of town next week...and his associate isn't too rabbit savvy.
I prefer not to go anywhere else....but will if I have to.

If it's turned into an abscess, I don't want to wait.
I'm thinking some antibiotics might keep it in check until he gets back.
Baytril?
Pen-G?
IV is probably the best...but could oral be enough? The vet would have to administer IV and/or prescribe oral.


She's 5 years old
Dutch mix
6 lbs, 7 ozs.
not spayed


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## Maureen Las (Feb 14, 2009)

If it was an abscess it would not have been filled with fat; it would have had pus and other a bacteria in it .
The fact tht it is warm (are you sure it is warm) would make me uncomfortable unless it became irritated/ possibly infected when they did the withdrawal of fluids initially.

Take her temp if you can ...


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## Maureen Las (Feb 14, 2009)

I just thought of something that happened to one of my guinea pigs. he had a lump that was growing and I had it aspirated with a needle (turned out to be malignant) 

several days after the aspiration the lump got even bigger,redder and appeared very sore and almost crusty ; I was really alarmed but then learned that this was normal after a needle biopsy.

maybe there is just minor irritation at the site where the fluid was withdrawn


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## tonyshuman (Feb 14, 2009)

Maureen is right. There shouldn't be any bacteria in a fatty cyst, and with rabbits' digestive systems it's best NOT to do antibiotics unless you're sure you need them. If it's still there after any swelling from the biopsy has gone down, then you need to go back, but it may just be irritated.


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## Bo B Bunny (Feb 14, 2009)

:nerves1


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## Maureen Las (Feb 14, 2009)

What's going on Jim????
How's Moosh?


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## JimD (Feb 15, 2009)

She wouldn't let me take her temp. I need an extra set of hands to hold her still.

But she did let me check her.
They shaved the site so it's easy to inspect.

There's no redness or discoloration.
The skin is smooth, clean, and clear....can't even tell where he inserted the needle.
It doesn't seem to be as swollen, and is less warm to the touch.

She's acting fine.

Hopefully it was just an effect of the procedure.
I'll be keeping a close eye on her.


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## Maureen Las (Feb 15, 2009)

I would guess that it is just the effect of the procedure .........

Hope so anyway...

glad that you got on and let us know 


I hope that she'll look perfectly fine in the AM


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## DeniseJP (Feb 15, 2009)

Just started following this thread...best wishes for MooShu's recovery.

She is a beautiful rabbit! 

My abscess experience: We had a Holland years ago with a weird abscess on her back - our veterinarian removed it (she is rabbit savvy) after explaining how she would do the anesthesia) but what she removed was a collection of gunk (pus, blood and tissue) that had somehow encysted similar to how oysters make pearls. If the veterinarian hadn't shown me, I would not have believed that rabbits' bodies could do this. It was all benign. She lived to be 8 years old.

Hugs to MooShu and S'More - 

Denise


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## JimD (Feb 16, 2009)

As of tomorrow, it's been a week since Moosh's cyst was aspirated.

I believe it has reformed.
Same size....same feel.....same area effected.

It doesn't seem to be bothering her.
It was most definitely swollen and sensitive during the last few days.

She's now acting as if nothing is wrong....she's even using her litter pan again. 
It may have been bothering her enough to keep her from hopping into the pan.

I'm going to keep an eye on it, and will be making plans accordingly.
We'll most likely be going to see Dr.C. for a follow-up exam, when he gets back.


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## tonyshuman (Feb 16, 2009)

That is very strange that it reformed... Will be curious as to what the vet says.


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## JimD (Feb 16, 2009)

*DeniseJP wrote: *


> ...best wishes for MooShu's recovery.
> 
> She is a beautiful rabbit!
> 
> ...



Thanks, Denise.

She really is a pretty rabbit...even ignoring what she says about herself 
I wish we knew what breed her daddy was.


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## JimD (Feb 16, 2009)

*tonyshuman wrote: *


> ......curious as to what the vet says.


ditto


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## JimD (Feb 16, 2009)

*angieluv wrote: *


> I hope that she'll look perfectly fine in the AM


Thanks, Maureen.

She's looking and acting fine right now.


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## Bo B Bunny (Feb 17, 2009)

Jim, didn't one of your others have that same situation? (remember I'm old and have the flu so my brain isn't doing well....)

Chippy! didn't she have it come back and then have to have it removed?


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## JimD (Feb 17, 2009)

*Bo B Bunny wrote: *


> Chippy! didn't she have it come back and then have to have it removed?


Yep...it was Chippy......4 aspirations and 2 surgeries.


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## Maureen Las (Feb 17, 2009)

ThatWAS Chippy with multiple cycts 
cannot believe that this is happening to another of your rabbit's 
it is strange...

Another wearing problem but it probably will resolve with treatment

"hugs"
Maureen


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## Bo B Bunny (Feb 17, 2009)

It makes you wonder if there isn't something doing it. Rabbits are so unique that we don't really know what might cause a cyst like that to appear in them, ya know? Maybe if the sun shines on their fur on the wrong day of January ..... it's just weird.

I just have to say that if it's not cancerous we gotta be thankful.... just get better little mooshie!


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## AngelnSnuffy (Feb 18, 2009)

I'm praying for Moshie Jim. I hope it's next to nothing. Keep us posted.ray:


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## mouse_chalk (Feb 18, 2009)

Poor MooShu. I can't believe it's back! 

I'm thinking of her, I hope you can get to the bottom of this Jim!


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## JimD (Feb 18, 2009)

*Bo B Bunny wrote: *


> .....little mooshie!


Leave it to Pennie to come up with a NEW nickname. :hearts:


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## JimD (Feb 18, 2009)

Yep....it's back.

We'll deal with it....no matter what.

A big difference is that Chippy has an inner strength that lends itself to those involved.

Little Mooshie is somewhat the opposite....and needs the strength of those around her to cope.
She's a lot like her mommy...S'more.

"little mooshie" is looking and acting okay.

***off to gather whatever skills it takes...may the powers be with me ***


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## JimD (Feb 18, 2009)

*JimD wrote: *


> Chippy has an inner strength




And it just bit me!:grumpy:


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## Bo B Bunny (Feb 19, 2009)

*JimD wrote: *


> *Bo B Bunny wrote: *
> 
> 
> > .....little mooshie!
> ...



It fits her 

and _someone_ bit you, huh? Chippy just thought you tasted good! 

Keep us posted. ray:


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## JimD (Feb 20, 2009)

Going back to the vet.

We have an appointment for Monday 6pm (EST).

:sigh:


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## Bo B Bunny (Feb 20, 2009)

Oh no. :nerves1


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## JimD (Feb 20, 2009)

I've been doing a bunch of research on the internet about fatty cysts....
....well, trying to anyways....

My internet kept going down at work, and everybody called out sick at work today so I "flew solo". I've had the flu for the last 2 days...***whinewhinewhinesss***.

......so I only have "half-info" at best.

In some cases, it seems the cystshave a higher chance of reforming due to diet.
It's something about the kidneys not being able to filter out the fatty acids from the bloodstream.

I need to some more studying to get a better understanding....like what kind of dietary fats are suspect...what kind of foods contain those fats...etc.

:twitch:

Anyone have any input?
It would be most welcomed!


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## Bo B Bunny (Feb 20, 2009)

Jim, this sounds very interesting.

Do you sometimes feel we are, as bunny owners, unknown research scientists? It seems like trial and error are the way most are still learning with bunnies.


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## JimD (Feb 20, 2009)

*Bo B Bunny wrote: *


> Do you sometimes feel we are, as bunny owners, unknown research scientists?




I wanted to be an Oceanographer.... until I found out bunnies don't live in the sea.

:expressionless

Would that make us Bunnyographers?


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## Bo B Bunny (Feb 20, 2009)

Lagographers


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## dquesnel (Feb 20, 2009)

I know in humans that some fruits and grains have been attributed to fatty cysts, especially in women. I totally remember more info than that, but you could be on the right track re: diet. Some humans have found salmon oil and certain teas to shrink cysts. That obviously won't work for rabbits though. I will keep my ears open on this one...


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## JimD (Feb 20, 2009)

*dquesnel wrote: *


> I will keep my ears open on this one...



Thanks.

I've compiled a list and an analysis of everything I feed her.
I'll discuss it with Dr.C on Monday.


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## Maureen Las (Feb 20, 2009)

I never thought about why a fatty cyst forms...

interesting ....
anyway I may look into it too,


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## Hazel-Mom (Feb 21, 2009)

Hi Jim, from what I have heard, it depends on whether she has a "sebaceous cyst" or a "lipoma". Either way, if they are removed completely, by excision (cutting out), they usually don't re-form. If they have been suctioned on the other hand, which I believe was done with MooShu, they have a very high chance of re-forming. Same if they aren't removed completely.
So I guess if you want it removed, you'd have to take a chance on a minor surgery.
You could always consider leaving it, since they are usually benign, don't hurt, and don't grow.


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## JimD (Feb 21, 2009)

Thanks for the input...:thanks:



*Hazel-Mom wrote: *


> Hi Jim, from what I have heard, it depends on whether she has a "sebaceous cyst" or a "lipoma".


The vet diagnosed it as a benign lipoma.

Hazel-Mom* wrote: *


> If they have been suctioned on the other hand, which I believe was done with MooShu, they have a very high chance of re-forming.



Yes, DrC aspirated it...mostly to see if he could determine what it was.

Hazel-Mom* wrote: *


> Either way, if they are removed completely, by excision (cutting out), they usually don't re-form.
> So I guess if you want it removed, you'd have to take a chance on a minor surgery.
> You could always consider leaving it, since they are usually benign, don't hurt, and don't grow.



Those are the things I want to talk to DrC about.

It really doesn't seem to be bothering her...even when I mess with it.

And, she's looking good, too :coolness:.....shiny coat, bright eyes...
...she even binkied for dinner last night!:nod


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## Hazel-Mom (Feb 21, 2009)

Hi Jim, the thing Hazel has was diagnosed as a Lipoma as well. Her vet didn't recommend removing it, she usually just leaves them be, and told us to just keep an eye on it.
She's had it for 4 years now, and it doesn't bother her at all. It also hasn't grown or changed.
A fatty cyst (or cebasious cyst) is not the same as a lipoma btw, so the dietary reasons for forming fatty cysts may not even apply to lipomas.


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## Maureen Las (Feb 24, 2009)

Hi Jim

Didn't you have an appt today?


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## Bo B Bunny (Feb 24, 2009)

Yeah, it was this evening, I bet they had another late one


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## JimD (Feb 24, 2009)

I had to cancel the vet appointment.
Stayed home from work and slept most of the day.

I've got some kind of stomach virus/flu...been fighting it off since Friday (i think).
Every time I think I'm better, it starts all over again.

Been letting a lot of bunny chores slip the last few days...which doesn't help because then they pile up.
The "WEE THREE PEE" group isn't helping either :grumpy:....I go in to do some small chore and end up spending 45 minutes cleaning up piddle puddles.

Anywho...

Moosh is doing okay.
The lump seems about the same. It hasn't gotten bigger and doesn't seem to bother her. Being that it's a lipoma, I think we're going to let itbe for now. Asprirating/draining it will most probably result in it reforming.
I'd only opt for surgical removed if absolutely necessary....she's over 5 years old and I'd be concerned about anesthesia.


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## Maureen Las (Feb 24, 2009)

Sorry that you are sick Jim butI agree there is no hurry about the lump.

Hope that you feel better soon.

Maureen


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## Bo B Bunny (Feb 25, 2009)

Jim, we had that stomach bug a month or so ago. Lexi and I were sick for a weekend, but Luke ended up being sick off and on for 2 weeks. He was eating peanut butter and cheesecrackers during this time.... I hope you didn't get something bad! The doc believes Luke got some bad peanut butter product and it made his worse.


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## JimD (Feb 25, 2009)

Today I noticed that there was some discoloration at the aspiration site.

I can't understand how I could have not seen it before today.
It looks like it might be bruising from the procedure....a straight line.... in line with the location of the tumor.
Or, it could be from when they shaved the area and might have caught the skin....however the site it quite smooth and doesn't indicate any surface trauma.

The tumor is still about the same size....it's changed a little in shape, but I'd kind of expect that from a lipoma.

I'm puzzled.:?


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## tonyshuman (Feb 25, 2009)

Could it be a bruise from where the needle went in to the tumor?


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## JimD (Feb 25, 2009)

I was able to get some halfway decent pics.
Moosh let me brush the fur away, and then sat verrrry still while I took them....such a good girl.
I'm pretty sure it's most probably a reaction to the fine needle aspiration.

See?....







And the same pic with the bruise outlined in blue






....annnd the same pic with the tumor outlined in red


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## Bo B Bunny (Feb 25, 2009)

Jim, could it be a line of new hair coming in? Bo gets funky colors like that where he has a bald spot when molting..... his hair comes out as it turns about that color then a day or two later it's fur.....


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## JimD (Feb 25, 2009)

She was going through a heavy shed/molt a week or two before the vet visit.
I thought it was new fur growing in until I checked it closer.

It's the skin. A blue-green color.

It's in the area that they shaved, and the fur hasn't started to grow back much at all.
It's smooth and soft like the surrounding skin.

Here's another pic that might show the color better...I'm stretching the skin a little, so it looks bigger.


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## Bo B Bunny (Feb 25, 2009)

Poor girl. Were you there when they did the aspiration? did they hold her there funny? It almost looks like a thumbnail or something dug in there a bit.


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## JimD (Feb 26, 2009)

It's a little stretched out of shape in that last pic. 

I got another really good look at it...no pics, sorry.

There'sno obvioussurface trauma...it's under the surface of the skin. 
I can't feel any difference compared to the surrounding area (ie; no swelling, hardness, etc)
It's very fine at the top and then gets wider as it get towards the bottom.
***similar tothe color of a reeeealyold tattoo***

It looks like it'spossibly from inserting the needle and moving it around.
I'm guessing it worked like a liposuction procedure....which commonly results in some swelling and bruising.

I wasn't there when they did it.
They said she was very good, didn't move or fuss, and stayed still until they were done.


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## JimD (Mar 6, 2009)

It's beenover a week now.

The tumor has gotten bigger...and the bruise, too.

We'll most probably be going back to see DrC for a check.

I really have to feel the tumor to realize the way it's growing.
It's not bulging out so that it's more visibly noticeable. 
It's spreading out,and in an envelopein the fold of skin below/behind her shoulder.

The bruise has doubled in size.
It's still smooth and soft.
I'mpretty surethat the aspiration procedure was the cause....but I'll feel better with DrC's consult.

She looks really good. 
Eating, drinking, pooping, and peeing like normal.

Every time I look at her I realize what a unique and pretty bun she is.
All shiny and smooth now....finished blowing her coat!
I can always see some of the "Dutchy" things about her....one white Dutchy foot...a very fine white line of a Dutch collar....and those absolutely Dutchy ears!!!
We wish we knew what breed her daddy was.


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## LuvaBun (Mar 7, 2009)

Don't know why the bruise would get so much bigger after a week :?. I know our bruising takes a few days to fully develop, so I guess bunnies must do too.

I think another check is a good idea, especially with the great vet you have. And at least she's acting like her normal self 

Keeping the good thoughts coming your way!

Jan


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