# Help for Prince



## Sweetie (Feb 6, 2010)

I am very sad to do this but I have hit some financial difficulties right now. This month I have to start paying my electric bill each month. I had energy assistance but it ran out and I have to see if I can get more funds. I know that my finances will get better in September 2010. I need to find a foster home for Prince from about now until the end of September 2010. I would prefer the Kitsap area, but willing to accept Seattle area. That way Sweetie and I can come visit Prince occassionally. I will explain more if anyone has any questions. One thing I will not do is put Sweetie in a foster home/rehome her. I cannot live without her!

If anyone in the Kitsap/Seattle area can foster Prince until September 2010, please let me know, it will be greatly appreciated.

I can supply a cage, food dish and water bottle, and litter box, and some hay, to go with him to the foster home.

Again, I will not put Sweetie in a foster home or rehome her. I cannot live without her!


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## Pipp (Feb 6, 2010)

Breaking up these bonded bunnies is unspeakably cruel.

Rabbits are the least expensive pets to feed with just some effort. 

People made a lot of great suggestions in your other thread. 

Help with rabbit food and hay

Supporting Your Rabbits In Tough Time$



sas :sad:


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## Sweetie (Feb 6, 2010)

I am not trying to be cruel to them. If I can come up with some alternatives, I won't have to split them up for a few months until my finances get better in September this year.


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## NorthernAutumn (Feb 6, 2010)

If they are bonded, it would be most appropriate to send them together to the foster home.

I'm sorry that you feel you "can't live without her". 
But truly, *you* can cope better without Sweetie than Prince can without her. 

You are her owner, but he is her _very best friend_. He would be devastated. Absolutely heart-broken. You would also be hurting Sweetie just as much :bigtears:.

I hope you can be objective, and put both Sweetie and Prince's needs before your own.

ray:


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## Sweetie (Feb 6, 2010)

Right now I am thinking of ways I can keep them. I was very upset when Sweetie had to stay the night at the vet's for her surgery. I literally will be very devastated if I put Sweetie in a foster home.

Plus I said that I would prefer someone in the Kitsap/Seattle area so I and Sweetie can visit!


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## NorthernAutumn (Feb 6, 2010)

Please see the two lists above for details.
Update with what actions you have taken, and we will see what else everyone can come up with for you.

Remember, Love is not cruel. Love means letting go of what you love most to save them the pain.


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## Sweetie (Feb 6, 2010)

Well I will be going to Walmart to get a 10lb bag of rabbit food, it is just alfalfa pellets but it has the same amount of fiber as the food they are on now. I will also be getting another thing of Fresh Step cat litter, I have a cat also.

These are the animals I have 

A cat
A bird
Two rabbits
11 fish and 9 snails

The fish are in a 55 gallon tank and the snails are in my one gallon tanks.


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## NorthernAutumn (Feb 6, 2010)

Have you really done everything on this list?
Supporting Your Rabbits In Tough Time$

Contacted local farmers, breeding clubs, asking for outer leaves from the produce section?
Did you actively search out and get a bale of hay for about $3?

These are all very do-able.

I remember that you got a lovebird spontaneously back in the fall for about $50, and the cage is worth another $50. Maybe see if you can sell the bird and cage together.
A 55 gallon tank is also sellable; the fish as well. That would reduce your electric and water costs a bit.

I am not minimizing the importance of these animals to you, but the facts are clear.
The lovebird has no bondmate to lose if you sell him to someone else who will love the bird
The fish have eachother, and won't be hurt by being sold.

It is really your rabbits that will struggle if they are split up. You must keep them together, at all costs... whether they are with you, or in a foster home. They must be together.

Put them first.


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## bengal77 (Feb 6, 2010)

If you qualified for energy assistance and that's how you heat your house then they can not legally shut off your power during the winter months, no matter if you pay your energy bills or not. I suggest that you look up your state laws on this issue before re-homing your pets.

And if you do need to re-home then you should re-home both as a bonded pair. Breaking them up is not the way to go. And in the end, does having 2 bunnies really cost significantly more than having one? I grow my own herbs and romaine lettuce so if you did that in a few pots inside your house/apartment (full sun) then all you'd have to pay for is pellets and hay. Use newspaper or wood stove pellets (something like $5 for a 20 pound bag) as litter and just change their litter pans everyday.


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## Sweetie (Feb 6, 2010)

Well I was at Walmart for the food, guess how much it cost for a 10lb bag?


It cost $5.52 for a 10lb bag, and it is just alfalfa pellets, does not have what is in the food that my rabbits are on now. It is high in fiber, 20%. It is cheaper than about $10 for a 3lb bag. 

I grabbed two 10lb bags which should last them a month and a half. 

If I have to I can buy 1 bag a month and I will always be able to get them food.

It looks like I won't need to separate my bunnies. I am so happy!


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## Sweetie (Feb 6, 2010)

Bengal77: for food for one rabbit would cost me $10 a month and for hay would cost me about $15 a month.

So having two rabbits does cost more than having one rabbit. A 3lb bag of food that I have them on right now would last Sweetie a month, because I would only have to fill her dish every other day. Now that I have to buy 2 bags.

Now that I found rabbit food cheaper, I can get without worrying about not having enough money.


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## bengal77 (Feb 6, 2010)

That's great! And if they get enough hay (from a cheap bale) you won't need to feed them that many pellets. Lily weighs four and a half pounds and she only gets 3/8ths of a cup of pellets a day. I give her unlimited Timothy hay, a handful of Oat hay, and a cup and a half of fresh veggies, lettuces, and herbs that I grow myself. That 20 pound bag of food should last you several months for two small bunnies.


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## Sweetie (Feb 6, 2010)

Yep it should and it probably will!


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## Luvr of Wabbits and Polar Bears (Feb 6, 2010)

The Rabbit food sold at Wal-Mart isn't an ideal food you should be feeding them. How much pellets are you feeding them if 10lbs only last a month and half? That's crazy cause I buy a 10lb bag of Oxbow for $22 and it last about 6 months and I have 3 rabbits.


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## Sweetie (Feb 6, 2010)

If 2 three pound bags of Sunaturals will last my rabbits a month, then 10 lbs will last them a month and a half. I got two 10lb bags, which will last/should last 3 months. 

Sweetie and Prince both get fed a handful (I have medium sized hands) a day. But I am going to have to feed them every other day to make sure they don't gain too much weight.

Luvr of Wabbits and Polar Bears: if this new food I got them isn't an ideal food for my rabbits, then what food is?

My rabbits are very healthy and I plan to keep them that way. The food I got is Small World Rabbit. I also saw that Walmart had Wild Harvest but it had seeds and other stuff that were not safe for rabbits, so I didn't get it. I got the Small World Rabbit food.

One point I will make: I will not go to Farmland for rabbit food. They have it in open bins and who knows how long the food has been sitting in the open.


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## Pipp (Feb 6, 2010)

Unfortunately Sweetie can't have it both ways. If cheaper pellets are necessary for her to keep the bunnies together, that will just have to be the case. 

The expensive pellets she was feeding them previously weren't great either. 

Note to Sweetie: Initially mix the two brands, they'll get used to it easier and it won't upset their systems.

If the bunnies get unlimited hay and grass supplemented by a few veggies, they'll be fine. They can get by with only a few tablespoons of pellets -- at the most. 

Most important is still hay. 

There's a few ads on Craigslist for your area, and anywhere there's a horse, there is hay. You'll probably be able to obtain and carry a big garbage bag with several flakes. Take a friend and carry two. 

The horse people will probably let you do that for nothing, or just a few dollars, but Its cheaper to pay for a bale, take what you can carry and leave the rest. 

There's an ad for $9 a bale of local grass hay (which is just fine). I emailed her, its stored inside a building and she's in the Long Lake/Port Orchard area.

There's also an equestrian center in Bremerton and I'm sure tons of other options close by. Check under riding lessons, horse boarding, etc. They'll all have hay. 

Really easy to feed rabbits for very little expense. 

If you can't find good produce stores now, by the end of April you can probably connect to the Farmers Markets to grab the veggie parts that will just be composted. That strategy is outlined in the link above. 

And they can be supplemented with grass and dandelions, etc. 

Until then, Wal-Mart will have to do. 

sas :bunnydance:


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## Sweetie (Feb 6, 2010)

Thank you Pipp for explaining my situation. Also thank you for emailing that person in the Port Orchard area. Let them know that I am in Bremerton and that I don't drive. Please see if they can deliver the hay, the more hay I have the better and I will save money.

Again my rabbits are healthy. If I see too much weight gain I will switch to Timothy pellets, but not until then.

Also Pipp: I know to mix the new with the old. How long do I do it for?


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## pla725 (Feb 6, 2010)

I understand about financial problems. I'm still having issues myself even though I work three part-time jobs. Go figure.

I would check with energy assistance again. Not sure why you didn't qualify this time around. Even with my three jobs I still qualify. 

Some of the above suggestions I did myself. I stopped buying the expensive bagged hay and switched to local baled hay. It costs about $10 for 40 lbs. My rabbits like it just as much. My friends with rabbits do the same thing. 

I switched to the cheaper version of Yesterday's news for litter. I got a 25 lb. bag for $10 at Petsmart. The cat litter you use is not safe for rabbits. 

My rabbits don't get pellets. They get along just fine with hay and greenies. I go to local farmer's markets twice a week to get greens. 

I agree don't split up a bonded pair.


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## Sweetie (Feb 6, 2010)

My energy assistance money ran out. I have to get more funds. I do qualify. I had $340 in funds, they only covered a few months. So I have to go and talk to them about getting more funds. They only give out funds only once a year.

I do have Critter Litter, but only one bag. I am using Fresh Step right now. The rabbits have a litterbox with a grid on it, so they can't get any on them or ingest it.


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## Sweetie (Feb 7, 2010)

I live in an apartment complex and my electric bill is $108.96 a month. I have electric heat! I already know how I can keep my bill down and I am talking with the electric company. I have very good credit with Puget Sound Energy.


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## bengal77 (Feb 7, 2010)

If her apartment is heated with electric then $100 a month is fairly reasonable, especially since she lives in Washington and they are in the middle of the snowmaggedon.

Tips for cutting your electric bill:

When you're done with an appliance unplug it. TVs and other electronics use energy even when they're turned off. Do this for computers too when you won't be using it for a while (like when you go to bed).

Put door snakes or a rolled up towel by the floor of your front door to seal off any cracks that are letting in drafts

Put up curtains or thick blankets over your windows, this will help keep the cold outside and your heat inside

If you like long showers, shorten them. It's pretty likely that your hot water heater is electric if your central heating is too. 10 minutes should be enough to get clean and relax a bit.

Turn your thermostat down to 68 or less. Wear sweaters and thick socks around the house.

Invest in a featherbed or down blanket (artificial works too). It will keep you toasty warm in the winter and if you stick your feet out you'll stay cool in the summer.


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## Sweetie (Feb 7, 2010)

I am cutting my thermostat down as of right now. I will unplug my appliances that are not being used. I really cannot unplug my fish tank!

I am also turning off the lights when I am not in a room, that will cut down on my electric bill!


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## Pipp (Feb 7, 2010)

*Sweetie wrote:*


> Let them know that I am in Bremerton and that I don't drive. Please see if they can deliver the hay, the more hay I have the better and I will save money.


Wow. :shock: I have a better idea. Why don't YOU look on Craigslist and find the ad yourself and YOU ask them. :grumpy:

This is exactly why everybody is so exasperated with you. :X

Not only are you asking me to continue working on YOUR problem, you give me 'instructions' and expect the people to deliver? Horse people usually sell dozens of bales at a time, they'll be doing you a favor letting you split one up. Read the part of my post where I said: "You'll probably be able to obtain and carry a big garbage bag with several flakes. Take a friend and carry two." 

You don't know anyone in Bremerton with a car? Or are they just fed up with this 'do everything for me' attitude too? 

Craigslist has a rideshare section, and a 'volunteers wanted' section. Sheesh, post a notice at the equestrian center. Tons of ways around all this stuff. 

*Sweetie wrote: *


> Also Pipp: I know to mix the new with the old. How long do I do it for?


Just start with 1/5 new, 4/5 old and reduce it by a fifth every couple of days. But you really have to be giving them more hay than they can eat, and not a lot of pellets. 

And make an effort to find free pre-compost produce. Read the links. (I'm not sure you bothered with that, either). 


sas


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## Sweetie (Feb 7, 2010)

I am on craigslist now and I found one a bit cheaper than $9. There is one in Central Kitsap selling hay for $5.

I am sorry I upset you! It is hard to find someone who is willing to give me a ride, because the people I know are busy with their own things. But I will see what I can do about getting more hay for my rabbits!


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## Pipp (Feb 7, 2010)

Make sure it's grass hay and not alfalfa.


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## Sweetie (Feb 7, 2010)

I will definitely do that! Another thing, which cut of hay is better for rabbits, for example: is 2nd cut or 3rd cut better?

I will keep looking for ways to save money. Today I grabbed filter cartridges for my fish tank, Fresh Step cat litter for the cat, along with the rabbit food at Walmart.

There is a guy who works at the local store near by, Ralph's Red Apple, who lives in the same apartment complex as I do. I may talk to him and see if I can get veggies and fruit for free for my rabbits. Are bruised veggies and fruits ok to give to rabbits, or do I need to cut out the bruised area and only give the nonbruised part to my rabbits?


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## bengal77 (Feb 7, 2010)

I think that the quality of the cut of hay depends on where it is grown and how long that region's season is. Generally the second and 3rd cuts of hay are best. But if you live in an area where the growing season is short the farmer may only do one cut of hay. So the general rule of thumb is to buy the second cut.


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## Sweetie (Feb 7, 2010)

Ok! Then I will see about getting the 2nd cut hay and I will make sure that it is grass hay and not alfalfa hay.


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## Pipp (Feb 7, 2010)

A variety of hay is good. And bruised fruit is good except that one apple should last them over a week. They really shouldn't get much. 

Anything that looks brown and rotting (or wet and rotting) isn't good. Carrot tops are pretty crappy in the winter around here, but they're okay if I cut off the leafy part and just give them the stems. The core of the lettuce, leaves and stems from broccoli and kale, all sort of things like that from any kitchen are good. 

But... I'm repeating myself. Please just read the recession-proofing article, it outlines the types of vegetable products that should be the easiest to get. 

Glad to see you're making a good effort. 


sas :bunnydance:


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## Sweetie (Feb 7, 2010)

Thanks Pipp!

I have read the recession proofing article and I will read it again. 

I will ask a neighbor if I can get some veggies and fruit from the store where he works that aren't sellable for my rabbits! I will give him a list of veggies and fruits that are safe for rabbits!


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## undergunfire (Feb 7, 2010)

You've also been told before that cat litter is NOT okay for rabbits. I'm not sure how you can afford to buy things of cat litter for your rabbit, anyway....even since the cat is using the litter too. Fresh Step isn't the cheapest litter...shoot, not even Walmart's "Special Kitty" brand is cheap (the bag kind is, but thats terrible stuff).

You can go to Walmart (out in the garden center) and pick up a 40lbs bag of wood stove pellets for $5....that will last you a very long time if you use a net over the litter box to catch poop & hay and then scoop out the wet litter daily (will turn to a dust-like consistence).


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## Mrs. PBJ (Feb 7, 2010)

I have tried to help you before.

So i will try one more time. I would re-home the love bird they are very expensive to take care of. 
Trust me Skylar is no longer in my care for some of those reasons. 

I know you have to have a taxi or something in your area. Find a local feed Store.

I go next week and Buy a 50 pound bag of pellets Alpha base but very high in fiber.
18 bucks for 50 pounds
10 bucks for a bail of hay I will be splitting that with bunny buddies. Cause it will all go bad in my house. 
And 8 bucks for forty pounds of horse stall bedding. 

36 bucks will feed Storm for a year. You have two buns and the price would probably only go up to 44 for two bags of Horse stall bedding.

That for a year if your really broke and cant feed vegys fine. I am lucky in Storm can't eat them.

But he is healthy without them. So one year wont hurt some house bunnys only live on crap pellets there whole life. 

I am glad to see your finally making a effort. But once I really started looking I found a place in 2 hours. One stop one feed Store and he special ordered the food for me. 


I hope this help like I said before I am behind you but you have to want to help yourself. Get rid of the love bird don't get more pets when you can barely take care of the ones you have.


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## Mrs. PBJ (Feb 7, 2010)

I also wanted to add sense you will be saving on doing that you only ned a car one time pay them 5 to 10 buck that bring the total up 54 for a year. 

Some feed Stores will bring it to your home if you ask. They are normally owned and worked by the same person or just one employee. Depending on the size. 

I have to say this if you really want to keep anypet in your care you will find a way to do it. 
I have seen people come into the shelter and say i can't afford to feed my dog. The shelter gives them a 50 pound bag of Ol roy they are like I won't feed my dog that. 

We then tell them that what they will get here. 

But 50 bucks a year verses having to rehome a beloved pet.
50 bucks a year works out to Like four bucks a month. 

Your buns should only be getting 1/4 a cup a day at the most of pellets the rest hay.


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## Sweetie (Feb 7, 2010)

I am going to be asking my vet how much he charges for bird care. I have been thinking about rehoming my love bird, because I am getting annoyed with his loud chirping.

The cat litter is $6.98 for 20lbs of cat litter at Walmart.

I will take a look at the garden center next time I go to Walmart and see if they have wood stove pellets and how much they charge here.

I only have to scoop the litter box every few days, so about 3 times a week, and that is for the cat.


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## ~*sAbRiNa*~ (Feb 7, 2010)

Sweetie, today I made an arrangement with the owner of the farm where I keep my horse that I can have the hay that falls out of the bales for FREE (yay)! There is nothing wrong with the hay, just when they open a bale in the hay loft, or if one breaks it makes a big mess but they hardly ever pick up the hay because its not enough to feed the horses. I checked everything for mold/dust and it all looks good! It only took me about 10 mins to fill a garbage bag full of amazing quality hay. 
I know that I might be lucky because I keep my horse there but I am sure that you would be able to find a farm in your area who would let you essentially clean up their hay loft for them. 
Also depending on the type of bedding that the farm has (i.e. rabbit safe) if they buy it in bulk they might be willing to sell it to you for a good price since what a rabbit uses is nothing compared to horses. Its worth a try to ask.


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## Sweetie (Feb 7, 2010)

I will see about that also!

Thank you all for helping me find ways to save money and keep my bunnies together!


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## TinysMom (Feb 8, 2010)

I used pelleted bedding (that is used for horse stalls) in my rabbits' litter boxes. I just bought some - it was $6.98 for a 40 pound bag at Tractor Supply Company. 

I love this stuff - I can scoop out what they've used daily if I want and just put a tad more back in. It really keeps down odors too.


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## Sweetie (Feb 8, 2010)

I will look at Walmart and see what they have and I will also check out some farms if I can find any around here.


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## Amy27 (Feb 8, 2010)

*TinysMom wrote: *


> I used pelleted bedding (that is used for horse stalls) in my rabbits' litter boxes. I just bought some - it was $6.98 for a 40 pound bag at Tractor Supply Company.
> 
> I love this stuff - I can scoop out what they've used daily if I want and just put a tad more back in. It really keeps down odors too.


Peg, can I ask what brand the pellet bedding was? That is really cheap and I want to check it out. Thanks.


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## Maureen Las (Feb 8, 2010)

*Amy27 wrote: *


> *TinysMom wrote: *
> 
> 
> > I used pelleted bedding (that is used for horse stalls) in my rabbits' litter boxes. I just bought some - it was $6.98 for a 40 pound bag at Tractor Supply Company.
> ...


I get Superior horse Bedding at Farm and fleet $6.98 for 30 lb so Peg gets a better deal but even mine is a good deal when compared to pet stores.


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## tonyshuman (Feb 8, 2010)

I got Marth Hardwood Pellets, 40lb bag, yesterday at our local pet store chain--Mounds Pet Food Warehouse for $4.95 including tax.

Our shelter uses non-clumping gravel cat litter under the hay because people donate cat litter through a program in the pet stores (buy a bag for the Humane Society) and they donate more than the cats at the shelter need. The wood stove pellets are cheaper, but we have not had problems with the non-clumping gravel cat litter.

Purina is coming out with a new pellet, Purina Rabbit Chow Fiber3, that's pretty good.
Here's a list of Purina Mills dealers in WA:
https://www.rabbitnutrition.com/DealerLocator/default.aspx?state=wa&SearchType=MR

These feeds are usually $10 or less for a 25lb bag.

They also sell a Lab Diet that you may be able to find.
http://www.labdiet.com/western_distribution.html
If you call one of the distributors on this list they may be able to direct you to a local store. This food usually isn't sold where other rabbit diets are sold, but you may be able to find it. Our pet store sells it.


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## luvthempigs (Feb 8, 2010)

*undergunfire wrote: *


> You can go to Walmart (out in the garden center) and pick up a 40lbs bag of wood stove pellets for $5....that will last you a very long time if you use a net over the litter box to catch poop & hay and then scoop out the wet litter daily (will turn to a dust-like consistence).


Hmm, I have looked for wood pellets at the local Walmart and I can't find them. Do you think they are a seasonal item? (I think I was looking for it in the summer) Five dollars is a great price for the wood pellets. I think I am going to have to take another look.


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## NorthernAutumn (Feb 8, 2010)

They should be in the heating section... ask at Lowe's or Home Hardware/Home Depot too.
My Home Depot has them year round.


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## luvthempigs (Feb 8, 2010)

The heating section? Like where they sell outdoor fire pits or chimeneas?


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## NorthernAutumn (Feb 8, 2010)

Yes  Some people also fuel all of their home heating off a wood pellet stove/furnace.


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## luvthempigs (Feb 8, 2010)

Oh okay, I didn't know that...:embarrassed:thanks


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## undergunfire (Feb 8, 2010)

Yeah...I find them outside in the garden center at Walmart. Since I am in AZ, they only have them during the cooler months....I expect them to be gone in all stores within the next month. I need to stock up!!


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