# Hi! Future bunny mom-have some questions!



## BunbunBannana (Jun 3, 2021)

Hi! I have been wanting a bunny for a while now. I have been doing loads of research, and have a plan. This is everything I plan on getting...
Cage-$51
Food-$10
Brush-$20
Alfalfa hay (until 6-7m) $16 5ib 
food and water bowl-$9
Climbing tree $35
Rabbit chew ball set $14
Rabbit toy set $15
Nail trimmer $4 
Rabbit net chew $10
Rabbit tunnel $10 
Hide-bed $15 
I have a cat carrier yesterdays news bedding and a litter box already. I will put a small hutch in there as a hide, but the door out will ALWAYS be open. The cage will be 24*48. Do I have everything I need? I have a relative that has a friend who has a friends who breeds rabbits for met or pets (tho they are cared for like pets), so that's where ill get them. I will get some of whatever food they give, and start transtioning to oxbow, and adding about a handful of veggies. It will be fed in the morning and evening. Will that work? I plan of letting it run in my room or backyard (with my supervision)for 1h+ every day. I plan on getting a vest and harness and stroller someday so I can take it on walks. Does anyone know of a bunnyfest in SF bay area? Also, if we leave our bunny for 3d without playtime will it be ok (during trips), For longer my grandma can take him and let him free roam in a spare floor. TYSM!!!


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## peanutdabunny (Jun 3, 2021)

I only use alfalfa untill 10 weeks, 12 weeks max
And if you can I really reccommend sherrwood pellets, it has no soy or grains, which oxbow has, also sherrwood is all organic.


https://www.amazon.com/Sherwood-Pet-Health-Rabbit-Adult/dp/B00SA318ZK


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## peanutdabunny (Jun 3, 2021)

I reccommend the hair buster by SPS and the furminator, it wont let me load your links. If you dont have this already I reccomed a hide house that has 2 exits/entrances! If it doesnt have this it will make your rabbit anxious and scared. And use an open litter box, not a close top one. And your cage seems a tad bit on the small side, your cage cant be a perminate housing in my opionion. Your rabbit will have to be out for at least 8 hours for it to be okay, Thats what I think


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## peanutdabunny (Jun 3, 2021)

Also I really would not reccomend a harness, rabbits arent "walked" Its very dangerous for them. Some rabbits are scared when outside. Strollers are fine. If you got the idea from lennon the bunny, I wouldnt take that advice. I would get a cage the size of 4 by 4. the later connect 2 puppy pens, so its twice the size, and thats a good size. Oh and dont give veggies untill 6 months of age, and make sure you slowly introduce it. Or else your bunny can get runny poop. Oh and do not leave your bunny for more than a day with out someone checking on them, get a bunny sitter. Bunnies can get sick very very easily.


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## Preitler (Jun 3, 2021)

Welcome 

Hm. How you write sounds pretty exited and happy, I'm not sure that there aren't some misconceptions about rabbits. Have you spent some hours with rabbits some times, like visiting that breeder and spend some time there? Or do you know someone who has a pet rabbit? They are way different than other pets, in form of interaction and other stuff. A lot of cute youtube videos show rather special bunnies, and just their top 5% of the time. Most don't like being toted around, and it's not exactly like they go on a leash to explore the beach or park.

1h out of a small cage doesn't work like letting the dog in the yard, rabbits have their own schedules and times of activity (mostly morning/evening). Where will the rabbits be housed? If it's close to where you sleep you'll need to be able to cope with some action during untimely hours. My two house rabbits are free roam, sleep in my room but have their base with food and litter box in the vestibule.
Caging them up for 3 days, well, doable in an emergency, but they are not happy about their routine interrupted or the freedom they are used to cut back. But you can't stuff their cage with food and just leave them for the weekend. You'll always need someone to check on them, every day, appr. for the next 10-12years.

Anyway, cage: I'm breeding rabbits pretty much like that friend of a friend seems to do, for the same reasons, and my rabbits are 9-10lbs. This cage would be too small. As a homebase in a pen ok, with door always open, I would think. But with litter box, hay rack, food and water bowls and stuff, there wouldn't be much room to move left. Even for small rabbits.

To get an idea what indoor setups people are happy with can look like:





2020 Indoor Cages... add your photo!


Each year we start a new thread to show off our rabbit cages. Not only is it fun to see everyone's cages, it is also useful for new bunny owners. Whether you've made a cage out of cube grids, exercise pen, xl dog crate, old furniture or any combination, we'd love to see it! (there is a...




www.rabbitsonline.net









2021 Indoor Cages.....add your photo!


Each year we start a new thread to show off our rabbit cages. Not only is it fun to see everyone's cages, it is also useful for new bunny owners. Whether you've made a cage out of cube grids, exercise pen, xl dog crate, old furniture or any combination, we'd love to see it! (there is a separate...




www.rabbitsonline.net





Cages and hutches advertisment is pretty bad, a lot of the stuff sold can just be used as home base in a run. Also, the wire spacing looks rather big to be useful as a floor or ramp, don't think this works like pictured.
Square-grid cages are quite popular though (NIC-grid cages), they have the huge advantage of being adaptable, so I would look for a source where you can get additional panels easily.

Quite some stuff you listed isn't necessary or free stuff is equally good or better, wouldn't buy those toys.
Big stuff is missing in the list if it's about the money, like getting the rabbit spayed/neutered (not a bad idea for indoor pets), and putting aside an emergency vet fund (better to have it and not need it, than the other way around).

I would stick to the food the rabbit is used to until it has well settled in and is about 12 weeks old, apart from adding grass hay to the diet if it isn't anyway. Extra high protein food like alfalfa or special pellets are not necessery since your goal isn't to get it to butchering weight asap. Special formulated pellets with fancy names are IMHO clever marketing, but not relevant.

When picking a rabbit, listen to the breeder. I have 17 kits right now, and I would never give away 4 of them because noone gets happy with skittsh, shy animals. Their temperaments and characters can be very diverse, so take your time. Also, the character changes when they grow up, so have a look at the adult ones too.

Getting an adult rabbit from a shelter as a first bunny would be a good option, you can see their adult character, and usually they are already spayed/neutered.

I might be wrongbecause of the way I percieve your text (english isn't my first language), but Imo it wouldn't be a bad idea to visit there a few times and spend some hours with the rabbits, to learn (dealing with rabbits comes with a steep learning curve) and get over the exitement. It's a decision for 10 or more years.


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## BunbunBannana (Jun 3, 2021)

peanutdabunny said:


> I only use alfalfa untill 10 weeks, 12 weeks max
> And if you can I really reccommend sherrwood pellets, it has no soy or grains, which oxbow has, also sherrwood is all organic.
> 
> 
> https://www.amazon.com/Sherwood-Pet-Health-Rabbit-Adult/dp/B00SA318ZK


Ok! So- No alphalpha. Also isn't sherwood for adults (the rabbit I plan on getting with be 2-6m).


peanutdabunny said:


> I reccommend the hair buster by SPS and the furminator, it wont let me load your links. If you dont have this already I reccomed a hide house that has 2 exits/entrances! If it doesnt have this it will make your rabbit anxious and scared. And use an open litter box, not a close top one. And your cage seems a tad bit on the small side, your cage cant be a perminate housing in my opionion. Your rabbit will have to be out for at least 8 hours for it to be okay, Thats what I think


Yes, I do plan on getting a hairbuster. And I can make an open hide house! I think I can free roam the bun in my room, just spay the carpet with bitter apple spray...


peanutdabunny said:


> Also I really would not reccomend a harness, rabbits arent "walked" Its very dangerous for them. Some rabbits are scared when outside. Strollers are fine. If you got the idea from lennon the bunny, I wouldnt take that advice. I would get a cage the size of 4 by 4. the later connect 2 puppy pens, so its twice the size, and thats a good size. Oh and dont give veggies untill 6 months of age, and make sure you slowly introduce it. Or else your bunny can get runny poop. Oh and do not leave your bunny for more than a day with out someone checking on them, get a bunny sitter. Bunnies can get sick very very easily.


Ok!


Preitler said:


> Welcome
> 
> Hm. How you write sounds pretty exited and happy, I'm not sure that there aren't some misconceptions about rabbits. Have you spent some hours with rabbits some times, like visiting that breeder and spend some time there? Or do you know someone who has a pet rabbit? They are way different than other pets, in form of interaction and other stuff. A lot of cute youtube videos show rather special bunnies, and just their top 5% of the time. Most don't like being toted around, and it's not exactly like they go on a leash to explore the beach or park.
> 
> ...


Thanks! Unfortunately, there are no shelters in my area. What toys do you recommend? I have decided to let my bunny free roam in my room(I will spray the carpet with bitter apple spray). I had pet rats, so I already have a $500-700 vet vund.


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## BunbunBannana (Jun 3, 2021)

Preitler said:


> Welcome
> 
> Hm. How you write sounds pretty exited and happy, I'm not sure that there aren't some misconceptions about rabbits. Have you spent some hours with rabbits some times, like visiting that breeder and spend some time there? Or do you know someone who has a pet rabbit? They are way different than other pets, in form of interaction and other stuff. A lot of cute youtube videos show rather special bunnies, and just their top 5% of the time. Most don't like being toted around, and it's not exactly like they go on a leash to explore the beach or park.
> 
> ...





BunbunBannana said:


> Ok! So- No alphalpha. Also isn't sherwood for adults (the rabbit I plan on getting with be 2-6m).
> 
> Yes, I do plan on getting a hairbuster. And I can make an open hide house! I think I can free roam the bun in my room, just spay the carpet with bitter apple spray...
> 
> ...


And I don't have a problem with the noise, I sleep with 2 LOUD aqariums.


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## John Wick (Jun 3, 2021)

To start, I have a bias of playing devil's advocate and essentially trying to convince people _not_ to get a pet rabbit. I mean it with good intentions though, as I think it's important to understand the less glamorous parts of rabbit care and how things can be less great/go wrong. In getting a pet rabbit, you need to be willing to care for the rabbit through both the pleasant and unpleasant experiences.

Re: the listed supplies, many rabbits chew/destroy fabrics and soft things, so the bed and tunnel for example may be things you end up not using because of potential ingestion risks. Bitter apple spray does not work for many rabbits. Also, rabbits are commonly animals who don't really use things for their intended purposes. In fact, I'd think it's more likely for a rabbit to use the hide-bed as a bathroom than a bed/sleep spot. I also don't see many rabbits using the cat climbing tree as intended, based on its layout. As @Preitler mentions, what you're seeing on social media are pretty unusual for rabbits. It's not impossible, but I think it's better to assume you will have a rabbit that will not enjoy cuddling with you all the time and being picked up, dressed up, and be more of a dog than a rabbit, in terms of companionship.

Also, the NIC grid pen you have requires additional things. You need to separately buy/make flooring for it, as rabbits cannot walk on the grids due to their large spacing. You need to buy, cut, and attach a sturdy material to the top of the grid floors. Many people buy coroplast and then add carpet squares or something on top to add traction (since coroplast is smooth). How ever you end up setting up and flooring the NIC cage, realize you need to be able to have access to and easily clean it in case of peeing/pooping/messes occurring in places you didn't intend them too.

If the door will always be open, you need to consider all the rabbit-proofing that needs to be done. I am a bit confused about having them free-roam with your supervision for 1h+ each day, but also always having the cage door open. Lets say there is a day you can only supervise for 3 hours-- does that mean the rabbit would be in the NIC cage for the rest of the day? If that's the case, I recommend buying two of the NIC cages so you have more grids to make a larger cage, and also purchasing an X-pen to attach to it, so the rabbit's restricted space (i.e. space when not supervised) is as large as can be. Going back to rabbit proofing, having a free-roam rabbit means being willing to make changes and be OK with a certain level of property damage during a learning curve... Spraying your carpet with bitter apple spray, in my opinion, isn't likely to stop a rabbit from pulling and digging up carpet, as an owner of a carpet digging/chewing rabbit myself. Also carpet takes up a lot of space, and spraying it all seems like a lot of work. There's also the fact that while rabbits tend to use litterboxes, it is not 100% and some rabbits simply aren't as adherent as others. One of my rabbits is a gem at it, while the other is completely not. I clean up pee stays daily from him. If you have baseboards, exposed wall corners, wooden/plastic furniture, these are all things that a rabbit may be tempted to chew, so buying grids to block them off or moving things around to prevent a rabbit from getting there can be a big part of rabbit proofing. Also, rabbits love to pee on beds, so understanding that you might need to cover your bed with a water-proof cover or something when they're out is a part of that. 

You absolutely do not need to reveal any specifics of your situation, but if you are someone who is living with others and rely on others for transportation and finances, understand that pet rabbits require specialized vets, which can be more expensive and harder to find than dog/cat vets. Pet rabbits require ongoing purchases, so someone is responsible for buying new hay, veggies, and toys at regular intervals for 10+ years. There are many misconceptions about pet rabbits, so if someone else (ex. a parent, primary household caretaker) has more authority over how money is spent, how the home needs to be arranged, who gets access to a vehicle, that individual needs to be willing to work with you, rather than be stubborn against you. Unfortunately, I know of many situations of children (not assuming you are, but just saying to make a point) who seem like they'd be excellent pet rabbit owners, but their parents were unwilling to provide what was needed and it ultimately led to the rabbit suffering and/or rehoming the rabbit.


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## Preitler (Jun 3, 2021)

Rabbits love apples, and eat a lot of bitter stuff. And why would you spray the carpet with that, they are not supposed to eat carpet? Joke aside, this isn't a rabbit deterrent.

Don't give the rabbit too much room from the start, for the first days until it has settled in a cage is ok, then a small pen until it has figured out that the litter box is the place to pee in, can take weeks, and then gradually expand it's little universe.

A friend of mine had to rehome her rabbits because she got panic attacks due to their night time activities, v


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## BunbunBannana (Jun 3, 2021)

John Wick said:


> To start, I have a bias of playing devil's advocate and essentially trying to convince people _not_ to get a pet rabbit. I mean it with good intentions though, as I think it's important to understand the less glamorous parts of rabbit care and how things can be less great/go wrong. In getting a pet rabbit, you need to be willing to care for the rabbit through both the pleasant and unpleasant experiences.
> 
> Re: the listed supplies, many rabbits chew/destroy fabrics and soft things, so the bed and tunnel for example may be things you end up not using because of potential ingestion risks. Bitter apple spray does not work for many rabbits. Also, rabbits are commonly animals who don't really use things for their intended purposes. In fact, I'd think it's more likely for a rabbit to use the hide-bed as a bathroom than a bed/sleep spot. I also don't see many rabbits using the cat climbing tree as intended, based on its layout. As @Preitler mentions, what you're seeing on social media are pretty unusual for rabbits. It's not impossible, but I think it's better to assume you will have a rabbit that will not enjoy cuddling with you all the time and being picked up, dressed up, and be more of a dog than a rabbit, in terms of companionship.
> 
> ...


I understand. I have kept pet rats for a while, so I am used to some things (like pee and poop). And I meant I will just have the bun free roam. I already found a vet (we took our rats to her). We have plenty of vet funds (500-700). Honestly, my room is perfect for rabbit-proofing. all my stuff is on shelves, I don't have many corners, etc. I will have to hope my rabbit won't chew the carpet...


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## peanutdabunny (Jun 3, 2021)

BunbunBannana said:


> I understand. I have kept pet rats for a while, so I am used to some things (like pee and poop). And I meant I will just have the bun free roam. I already found a vet (we took our rats to her). We have plenty of vet funds (500-700). Honestly, my room is perfect for rabbit-proofing. all my stuff is on shelves, I don't have many corners, etc. I will have to hope my rabbit won't chew the carpet...


Can you foster at all?


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## BunbunBannana (Jun 3, 2021)

New everything I will be getting list:
Food-$10
Brush-$20
Timothy hay $20
food and water bowl-$9
Climbing tree $35
Rabbit chew ball set $14
Nail trimmer $4 
Rabbit net chew $10
Timothy hide $13
Rabbit tunnel $10
Cardboard rabbit castle $25
Circle tunnel $35


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## BunbunBannana (Jun 3, 2021)

peanutdabunny said:


> Can you foster at all?


I wish... Also, is Sherwood pet health ok for baby buns?


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## peanutdabunny (Jun 3, 2021)

BunbunBannana said:


> I wish... Also, is Sherwood pet health ok for baby buns?


Yes, I believe so, I reccommend mixing hay for enrichment if you can!


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## Blue eyes (Jun 3, 2021)

Sherwood has food pellets for baby rabbits (through 12 weeks+ of age). But, as already mentioned, stick with what the rabbit is used to for the first few weeks. 

Also, bun should be confined to its cage for the first few days. You want him to establish the cage as his territory and as his "safe space." Don't make the mistake of allowing him out to roam too soon. Roaming starts with a small area outside the cage and gradually gets larger. 

Here's a summary of how to setup a cage (from my website):








Setting Up a Cage


There are so many cage options and configurations. See (click) this page to determine what might work for you. How all of these items are arranged in your chosen cage will be up to you (and your...



rabbitsindoors.weebly.com





There is also a method that helps bunny get settled and an important part of that is preparing ahead of time. This link helps with that:








Bringing Your Rabbit Home


[ Tablet users, try the "web" version by clicking on "web" at the bottom of this page for a better, user-friendly format . ]



rabbitsindoors.weebly.com





I'd agree that there are a number of items on your list that are pricey and/or unnecessary. Of course you can get them if you like, but if you are trying to watch your spending, several items can be skipped (or gotten later on).


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## peanutdabunny (Jun 3, 2021)

I wouldnt pick Kaytee hay, I would choose SPS for best hay! (not there pellets though) Also you dont need the cat tree, or the cardboard castle, I would reccomend the toki hut castle. I would also reccomend there foraging mat. I would go to chewy for toys. I would get the rosewood pack of mats, the rosewood ball set, and a few oxbow toys. They are much better quality than amazon, you can also get toys from SPS here SMALL PET SELECT (for some reason this link gives a 20% discount) I reccomend you get the sampler box. SPS has great toys and treats that are amazing for keeping your pet in good health. I would reccomend it for baby rabbits 110% I also love the willow rings, all bunnies love them. So stay away from amazon. (as the things can come from unsafe china facilaties) the tunnel your getting is quite expensive. if you have ikea near you, you can get a huge one for $7! If you want beds and interactive toys you can go to shein. Not the most sustainable brand, but it has some cute beds.


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## BunbunBannana (Jun 3, 2021)

peanutdabunny said:


> I wouldnt pick Kaytee hay, I would choose SPS for best hay! (not there pellets though) Also you dont need the cat tree, or the cardboard castle, I would reccomend the toki hut castle. I would also reccomend there foraging mat. I would go to chewy for toys. I would get the rosewood pack of mats, the rosewood ball set, and a few oxbow toys. They are much better quality than amazon, you can also get toys from SPS here SMALL PET SELECT (for some reason this link gives a 20% discount) I reccomend you get the sampler box. SPS has great toys and treats that are amazing for keeping your pet in good health. I would reccomend it for baby rabbits 110% I also love the willow rings, all bunnies love them. So stay away from amazon. (as the things can come from unsafe china facilaties) the tunnel your getting is quite expensive. if you have ikea near you, you can get a huge one for $7! If you want beds and interactive toys you can go to shein. Not the most sustainable brand, but it has some cute beds.


Thanks. I plan on going to the pet store for the hay (to get the freshest they have). I plan on making a foraging mat, aswell as a cardboard castle. And I am fine with paying, amazon just works best for me. Here is the new list...
Food-$10
Brush-$20
Timothy hay from pet shop $20
food and water bowl-$9
Rabbit chew set $14
Rabbit ball and carrot $8 
Nail trimmer $4 
Seagrass chew mat $10 
Circle tunnel $35


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## BunbunBannana (Jun 4, 2021)

Guys, would a cage 42 by 82 be big enough. The carpet won't let me free roam-dang.


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## Apollo’s Slave (Jun 4, 2021)

BunbunBannana said:


> Guys, would a cage 42 by 82 be big enough. The carpet won't let me free roam-dang.


42 by 82 inches? it still sounds quite a bit too small. Thankfully, it's not a thin line between a caged bunny and a free-roaming bunny. There are loads of options in between, the best might be an xpen. However, your bunny will still need a few hours (or preferably most of the day) out of the pen to exercise x






Amazon.com: Pet Trex 30" Playpen for Dogs Eight 24" Wide x 30" High Panels : Everything Else


Amazon.com: Pet Trex 30" Playpen for Dogs Eight 24" Wide x 30" High Panels : Everything Else



www.amazon.com


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## Mac189 (Jun 4, 2021)

There are actually some pretty decent methods to rabbit-proof carpet if the carpet is the only deterrent to free roam. The method I used was getting a large (9'x9') flat woven area rug to cover 90% of the carpet and then placing "wood" linoleum tiles on the edge to prevent any access to the carpet. It worked very well and actually greatly improved the aesthetic of the space (although I have quite the vendetta against carpet in general). I greatly enjoy "McGyvering" rabbit proofing problems, many of them can be solved with some troubleshooting and stuff you have on hand.

I think Preitler and John Wick did a really good job playing devil's advocate, so I won't try to play with perfection. I will note that the Bay Area is home to tons of awesome rescues for you to check out and contact. Breeders are a wealth of information and often a very good place to get a rabbit, however, I generally think an already spayed/neutered adult is the best choice for a new rabbit parent. Occasionally breeders will have an adult rabbit they are looking to rehome (such as a failed breeder or a rabbit they hoped would be show quality but turned out to be pet quality) and that could be a good option too.

I would HIGHLY recommend a read-through of Rabbits for Dummies for anyone new to rabbits. I cannot describe how much this book helped me when I was starting out. It's pretty general, but it answers all of the questions you should ask before selecting and moving forward with a new rabbit.


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## LizzyMayHarvey (Jun 4, 2021)

What I think is a good idea is getting all the basics like food, cage, bowls, litter/bedding, etc. and hold off on the expensive toys for a while. Just give them some cardboard boxes, hay stuffed cardboard rolls, sticks, and random bits and bobs that you can get for free. Then after you have had your bunny for a while and gotten to know him/her you will know if they like climbing, hiding, jumping, chewing, and/or digging. Then you can buy them the appropriate toys and accessories because animals being animals you could buy them the most expensive amazing thing and they won't even look at it but play with the box it came in instead. Also make sure your bunny has space. Being shut in the cage at night or something is fine but if you can give your bun some hours for running round or exploring in their own time then they will be a lot happier. My buns have 12 hours+ to run around and do whatever they please every day. If you give them 1-3 hours roaming time a day then they will most likely just spend the time sleeping. If you give them 6+ hours then they can choose to sleep and run and explore when they feel like it. 
Bunnies are amazing pets but they are not all cuddle buns. My girl will sit next to you for ever and give you the sweetest bunny kisses but if you try to pick her up and cuddle her she will do anything to escape and bite and scratch. On the other hand, my boy won't sit still for pats and doesn't like humans in general but if you manage to catch him then he'll sit quietly in your arms. Every bunny is different so don't expect a certain personality or that your bunny will even want to be cuddled or taken on walks in a stroller.


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## peanutdabunny (Jun 4, 2021)

You can get small pet select on amazon. You are endangering the health of your rabbit, as most amazon listings dont tell you where the ingredients or supplies are from. Small pet select does tell you, and its on amazon. Lennon the bunny has said the same thing about wish. The quailty is not very good, the listing photos are showing the mat yellow


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## BunbunBannana (Jun 4, 2021)

Mac189 said:


> There are actually some pretty decent methods to rabbit-proof carpet if the carpet is the only deterrent to free roam. The method I used was getting a large (9'x9') flat woven area rug to cover 90% of the carpet and then placing "wood" linoleum tiles on the edge to prevent any access to the carpet. It worked very well and actually greatly improved the aesthetic of the space (although I have quite the vendetta against carpet in general). I greatly enjoy "McGyvering" rabbit proofing problems, many of them can be solved with some troubleshooting and stuff you have on hand.
> 
> I think Preitler and John Wick did a really good job playing devil's advocate, so I won't try to play with perfection. I will note that the Bay Area is home to tons of awesome rescues for you to check out and contact. Breeders are a wealth of information and often a very good place to get a rabbit, however, I generally think an already spayed/neutered adult is the best choice for a new rabbit parent. Occasionally breeders will have an adult rabbit they are looking to rehome (such as a failed breeder or a rabbit they hoped would be show quality but turned out to be pet quality) and that could be a good option too.
> 
> I would HIGHLY recommend a read-through of Rabbits for Dummies for anyone new to rabbits. I cannot describe how much this book helped me when I was starting out. It's pretty general, but it answers all of the questions you should ask before selecting and moving forward with a new rabbit.


Thanks!


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## peanutdabunny (Jun 4, 2021)

There is only *1 *thing I reccomend on amazon thats not SPS. It is the 12/14 chew ball set for bunnies, its okay quality. If you want a good size cage get the Furplast krolix 200. Or 160 if you cant get the 200


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## peanutdabunny (Jun 4, 2021)

Can you see this picture?


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## BunbunBannana (Jun 4, 2021)

Apollo’s Slave said:


> 42 by 82 inches? it still sounds quite a bit too small. Thankfully, it's not a thin line between a caged bunny and a free-roaming bunny. There are loads of options in between, the best might be an xpen. However, your bunny will still need a few hours (or preferably most of the day) out of the pen to exercise x
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Thanks! I plan on letting the bun have playtime whenever I'm in the room 1-6h


LizzyMayHarvey said:


> What I think is a good idea is getting all the basics like food, cage, bowls, litter/bedding, etc. and hold off on the expensive toys for a while. Just give them some cardboard boxes, hay stuffed cardboard rolls, sticks, and random bits and bobs that you can get for free. Then after you have had your bunny for a while and gotten to know him/her you will know if they like climbing, hiding, jumping, chewing, and/or digging. Then you can buy them the appropriate toys and accessories because animals being animals you could buy them the most expensive amazing thing and they won't even look at it but play with the box it came in instead. Also make sure your bunny has space. Being shut in the cage at night or something is fine but if you can give your bun some hours for running round or exploring in their own time then they will be a lot happier. My buns have 12 hours+ to run around and do whatever they please every day. If you give them 1-3 hours roaming time a day then they will most likely just spend the time sleeping. If you give them 6+ hours then they can choose to sleep and run and explore when they feel like it.
> Bunnies are amazing pets but they are not all cuddle buns. My girl will sit next to you for ever and give you the sweetest bunny kisses but if you try to pick her up and cuddle her she will do anything to escape and bite and scratch. On the other hand, my boy won't sit still for pats and doesn't like humans in general but if you manage to catch him then he'll sit quietly in your arms. Every bunny is different so don't expect a certain personality or that your bunny will even want to be cuddled or taken on walks in a stroller.


Thanks! I narrowed the list down.


peanutdabunny said:


> You can get small pet select on amazon. You are endangering the health of your rabbit, as most amazon listings dont tell you where the ingredients or supplies are from. Small pet select does tell you, and its on amazon. Lennon the bunny has said the same thing about wish. The quailty is not very good, the listing photos are showing the mat yellow


I would, except they only have food for adults. As soon as the rabbit turns 1yr I will transition him...


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## peanutdabunny (Jun 4, 2021)

no, no! Don't give small pet select food! Give there toys. Their food isnt good quality, For food, for best quality get sherwood when they are an adult. Did you see my post about the furplast 200 cage? its 6 feet by 2 feet


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## BunbunBannana (Jun 4, 2021)

peanutdabunny said:


> Can you see this picture?





peanutdabunny said:


> no, no! Don't give small pet select food! Give there toys. Their food isnt good quality, For food, for best quality get sherwood when they are an adult. Did you see my post about the furplast 200 cage? its 6 feet by 2 feet


I did, but is it big enough as a cage for 10h of the day?


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## peanutdabunny (Jun 4, 2021)

BunbunBannana said:


> I did, but is it big enough as a cage for 10h of the day?


Yes and no, its much above the minimum, it would be good for the first 6 months of life, while you get them litter trained, even after that it keeps the litter in the cage, so you can have an x pen attached. This does not mean make the whole cage a litter box, but put your litter box in the cage and it will keep it contained


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## BunbunBannana (Jun 4, 2021)

peanutdabunny said:


> Yes and no, its much above the minimum, it would be good for the first 6 months of life, while you get them litter trained, even after that it keeps the litter in the cage, so you can have an x pen attached. This does not mean make the whole cage a litter box, but put your litter box in the cage and it will keep it contained


Thanks! Except, the long concept doesn't really work. how about this cage? After 6m, I do plan on starting free roam! https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0854G5KLN/ref=twister_B07VLKKGC7?_encoding=UTF8&psc=1?


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## peanutdabunny (Jun 4, 2021)

BunbunBannana said:


> Thanks! Except, the long concept doesn't really work. how about this cage? After 6m, I do plan on starting free roam! https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0854G5KLN/ref=twister_B07VLKKGC7?_encoding=UTF8&psc=1?


I cant look at the links at the moment, whats the cages name>


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## BunbunBannana (Jun 4, 2021)

Here's a screenshot, its 61.42 x 40.94 x 26.02 inches


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## peanutdabunny (Jun 4, 2021)

BunbunBannana said:


> Here's a screenshot, its 61.42 x 40.94 x 26.02 inches


Yea thats okay, but why not get an xpen then, it has an open floor like an xpen (xpens are also cheaper)


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## BunbunBannana (Jun 4, 2021)

peanutdabunny said:


> Yea thats okay, but why not get an xpen then, it has an open floor like an xpen (xpens are also cheaper)


Mm, I just like the built-in hides and look. 
Here is the new list. 
Rabbit cage $200 
Food-$10
Brush-$20
Hay from Pet store
food and water bowl-$9
Rabbit chew set $14
Nail trimmer $4 
Timothy treat $1


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## peanutdabunny (Jun 4, 2021)

If you are looking for ways to save of hay, (hay gets very expensive from the pet store) Buy in bulk from amazon from *TRUSTED companines. Aka oxbow, small pet select, hay hole. *Those guys sell 50lb boxs on amazon. IF you have tractor supply near you, you can get hay there too


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## BunbunBannana (Jun 4, 2021)

peanutdabunny said:


> If you are looking for ways to save of hay, (hay gets very expensive from the pet store) Buy in bulk from amazon from *TRUSTED companines. Aka oxbow, small pet select, hay hole. *Those guys sell 50lb boxs on amazon. IF you have tractor supply near you, you can get hay there too


Ok!!!


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## Mariam+Theo (Jun 4, 2021)

I think you are on the right path, but I thought I should share some suggestions.
Pellets: Oxbow is a great brand and is very very healthy. If you get the young adult alfalfa pellets and feed those until the rabbit is 4 months (at 4 months start swapping from alfalfa pellets to timothy pellets) the rabbit will be in great condition. Sherwood is a healthier brand, but it is also a more expensive brand. If money is not an issue, you could feed Sherwood, but Oxbow is a great option. Sherwood has baby rabbit food and adult rabbit food.

Hay: Instead of buying hay from a pet store I highly suggest finding a local farmer or farm store where you can buy hay. The hay from farm stores will be very high quality because it is for horses and people are very picky about what they will feed their horses. I think someone already said this, but DO NOT FEED ALFALFA HAY TO BABY RABBITS. Baby bunnies should have Alfalfa pellets, but if you feed them Alfalfa hay when they are babies they will never want to eat timothy hay.

Cage: If you want a cage that will last forever and be super convenient, get an xpen. Xpens need to be 48" so the rabbit doesn't jump over them, but if your rabbit doesn't jump over it then you could use a shorter one. If you want it to look really nice get on Pinterest and search "rabbit pen ideas" and you will see there are tons of super cute options.

Food/Water bowls: You need a heavy bottom ceramic water bowl that your rabbit can't spill. I wouldn't suggest getting a food bowl because lots of rabbits have a bad habit of eating too fast and will choke on their food. I prefer to scatter feed so Theo has to search for his food and won't eat super fast and choke.

Brushes: Wait to see what the rabbit's fur is like before buying the hairbuster. If your rabbit's fur is like normal rabbit fur then I would buy the brush, but if the rabbit is mixed with the Rex breed then the brush won't work and it would have been a waste of money.

Toys: Try to avoid any toys that include food/treats because they are not normally safe. Instead of looking on Amazon for toys, look at BinkyBunny and Etsy stores. The toys are way healthier for your rabbit.

Treats: Give a fresh piece of fruit or if you really want to buy cute treats check out Etsy shops. Just make sure to check the ingredients!

Here is a list of what I would buy if I was getting a bunny for the first time:
*I'm sure I have forgotten something so let me know what I forgot 
Xpen-$100
Baby Rabbit Food-
 Sherwood: $20
Oxbow: $16
Hay-$21
Water Bowl-$19
Brush- wait until you get the rabbit
Nail Clippers-$4
Toys-
Treat Ball Toy: $8
Seagrass Mats: $25
Tunnel: $20
Hideyhouse: $20
Treats- (Any treats and toys from this Etsy store are safe in moderation!)


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## Blue eyes (Jun 4, 2021)

Actually, you'll save much more on hay if you just get it from a local feed store. There is no need to buy a "brand name" of any hay. You can buy in bulk from a feed store. A bale (talking over 100 lbs) may cost just $20 and will last you close to a year. (Will stay fresh if stored properly.) At that price you can buy it every 6 months and throw away any leftover if freshness is a concern. [edit: apparently, @Mariam+Theo was writing her post at the same time ]

You asked earlier about a cage that would be 42" x 82". That is 24 sq ft, which is not bad at all with daily free time. [The one that @peanutdabunny suggested (2' x 6') is only half that and definitely not large enough.] So the 42" x 82" should work for now.

For pellets, look for a brand that has a line specifically for juveniles/babies. You can see a selection here:








Pellet Food


[ Tablet users, try the "web" version by clicking on "web" at the bottom of this page for a better, user-friendly format . ]



rabbitsindoors.weebly.com





You've narrowed your list down nicely. I'd skip any treats though. Treats are not a good idea for the first few weeks with a new rabbit. That's like changing their diet and can cause stomach issues. No treats at all until they've settled into their home, transitioned to the new pellet food (will take a few weeks), and are old enough to have begun being slowly introduced to greens. Greens also take many weeks before they've adjusted to a variety of greens. After all that, then they can have treats.

I'd suggest looking through the rest of the site that is linked here for further info.

One thing you may not have considered is a first-aid emergency kit. Here's a link to what should be on hand:








First Aid Kit


Indoor rabbits typically don't spend much time digging in dirt or running around on concrete -- both of which help to wear down nails naturally. This means that our indoor rabbits need to have...



rabbitsindoors.weebly.com


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## peanutdabunny (Jun 4, 2021)

Sorry for the smaller cage, for some reason it wont let me load amazon links, (we are trying to figure it out). The only reason oxbow is not the best (@Mariam+Theo ) Is because it has grains and soy, which are bad for rabbits and can cause health issues later in life. I would use the rabbits pellets as treats, as its healthy and will form a stronger bond. Also @Mariam+Theo my bunny ate alfafa hay, and transitioned easily to timothy/orchard/oat mix. Maybe I got lucky?


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## Mariam+Theo (Jun 4, 2021)

peanutdabunny said:


> The only reason oxbow is not the best (@Mariam+Theo ) Is because it has grains and soy, which are bad for rabbits and can cause health issues later in life.


That all depends on how many pellets you are feeding your rabbits. If you are feeding your rabbit lots of pellets then you should feed a super high-quality pellet (such as Sherwood) but if you are only feeding your rabbit pellets as treats or only small amounts (1/8-1/4 cup each day) then Oxbow is a great brand.


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## peanutdabunny (Jun 4, 2021)

I can agree with that @Mariam+Theo


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## BunbunBannana (Jun 4, 2021)

Thanks everybody!


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## BunbunBannana (Jun 4, 2021)

Is it better for them to live inside or outside?


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## peanutdabunny (Jun 4, 2021)

BunbunBannana said:


> Is it better for them to live inside or outside?


10000000000% inside!!! Please don't get a rabbit if you want to house them outside . I understand if you already had a raabbit and you didnt know they were supposed to be inside, but buying a rabbit and knowing you cant keep them inside is irrespossible.


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## Preitler (Jun 4, 2021)

No, it isn't irresposible, and no, they aren't "supposed" to be just inside. The vast majority lives outside, indoor bunnies are a rather recent hype but over represented in social media.
Depending on climate (they don't cope well with heat, guess that is an issue in CA), local predators (there are way more teeth and claws in the US than here), etc. it can be way more work, investment and preperation to get it right. It's imo even more work to care for them every day outside. Other than that, rabbits can be perfectly fine outdoors. Mine definitly are. But I'm not going to say the way I keep my rabbits is the right way for everyone, it isn't.
I wouldn't keep a single rabbit outdoors though where it would be alone the whole day, they are social animals after all.

I prefer local sources to buy stuff, I can't wrap my head around the now pretty normal decadence to have simple stuff shipped around half the globe. In my opinion most of the discussion about pellet brands is pretty pointless, it doesn't matter much for pets if they are of decent quality (some grain or soy in it doesn't matter either) since it's just a supplement to the diet, it is somewhat different when breeding and raising for a goal like show or wool, or performence, but that's a different story.


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## peanutdabunny (Jun 4, 2021)

yes, in their it would irresponsible. I was not saying around the world. In CA it is hot, and there are a lot of preditors, I know In other areas it is better to keep them outside, but not in the us


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## LizzyMayHarvey (Jun 4, 2021)

My bunnies live outside and are very happy. My climate is mostly cold and in summer it's easy enough to keep them cool as it normally only reaches 30-35 degrees Celsius and then I just put them in the shade. But if I could I would let them live inside but that's not an option due to our big dog so instead they have VERY large walk-in runs outside that they are in 12 hours+ then shut in their cages for safety. Cats are the only predators we have in the city and they wouldn't be able to take down my big FG girl but it's better to be safe then sorry. What I love about them being outside is that their space is not compromised at all and they can dig in the dirt so I don't have to trim their nails. But if you have the option then it would be good to let your bun live inside. You will have more opportunities to spend time with them and it will be easier to monitor their health. 
I feed my bunnies pellets and hay from the local feed store and I've never had a problem with moldy hay and even though the pellets are probably not the best quality they are only given a small amount and I feed them a variety of greens for extra nutrients. Get what you can and so long as your pellets aren't full of colourful bits and pieces then it will probably be fine if used as a treat and not a main part of their diet.
I hope you aren't put off having bunnies yet! I know it sounds like you might not be able to have everything perfect but if your bun is loved, given space to be a rabbit, has access to vet care, and given access to healthy food and ample hay then that's the best you can do and your bun will be happy. If you don't think you provide a happy environment for a bun then it's probably best not to get one. But having a healthy happy bunny isn't all about the expensive toys or food. They just need space and love and a full tum.


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## BunbunBannana (Jun 4, 2021)

peanutdabunny said:


> 10000000000% inside!!! Please don't get a rabbit if you want to house them outside . I understand if you already had a raabbit and you didnt know they were supposed to be inside, but buying a rabbit and knowing you cant keep them inside is irrespossible.





Preitler said:


> No, it isn't irresposible, and no, they aren't "supposed" to be just inside. The vast majority lives outside, indoor bunnies are a rather recent hype but over represented in social media.
> Depending on climate (they don't cope well with heat, guess that is an issue in CA), local predators (there are way more teeth and claws in the US than here), etc. it can be way more work, investment and preperation to get it right. It's imo even more work to care for them every day outside. Other than that, rabbits can be perfectly fine outdoors. Mine definitly are. But I'm not going to say the way I keep my rabbits is the right way for everyone, it isn't.
> I wouldn't keep a single rabbit outdoors though where it would be alone the whole day, they are social animals after all.
> 
> I prefer local sources to buy stuff, I can't wrap my head around the now pretty normal decadence to have simple stuff shipped around half the globe. In my opinion most of the discussion about pellet brands is pretty pointless, it doesn't matter much for pets if they are of decent quality (some grain or soy in it doesn't matter either) since it's just a supplement to the diet, it is somewhat different when breeding and raising for a goal like show or wool, or performence, but that's a different story.





peanutdabunny said:


> yes, in their it would irresponsible. I was not saying around the world. In CA it is hot, and there are a lot of preditors, I know In other areas it is better to keep them outside, but not in the us





LizzyMayHarvey said:


> My bunnies live outside and are very happy. My climate is mostly cold and in summer it's easy enough to keep them cool as it normally only reaches 30-35 degrees Celsius and then I just put them in the shade. But if I could I would let them live inside but that's not an option due to our big dog so instead they have VERY large walk-in runs outside that they are in 12 hours+ then shut in their cages for safety. Cats are the only predators we have in the city and they wouldn't be able to take down my big FG girl but it's better to be safe then sorry. What I love about them being outside is that their space is not compromised at all and they can dig in the dirt so I don't have to trim their nails. But if you have the option then it would be good to let your bun live inside. You will have more opportunities to spend time with them and it will be easier to monitor their health.
> I feed my bunnies pellets and hay from the local feed store and I've never had a problem with moldy hay and even though the pellets are probably not the best quality they are only given a small amount and I feed them a variety of greens for extra nutrients. Get what you can and so long as your pellets aren't full of colourful bits and pieces then it will probably be fine if used as a treat and not a main part of their diet.
> I hope you aren't put off having bunnies yet! I know it sounds like you might not be able to have everything perfect but if your bun is loved, given space to be a rabbit, has access to vet care, and given access to healthy food and ample hay then that's the best you can do and your bun will be happy. If you don't think you provide a happy environment for a bun then it's probably best not to get one. But having a healthy happy bunny isn't all about the expensive toys or food. They just need space and love and a full tum.


Thanks, inside bc it gets to 90 during the summer. Here is the edited list- (back to cnc cage)
Cage-$51 (dimensions will be 41 by 84)
Food-$10
Brush-$20
Hay from Pet store
food and water bowl-$9 (or $1 in DT)
Rabbit chew set $14
Nail trimmer $4 (or $1 in DT)
Timothy treat $1
Rabbit treat toy for fun food $8
Circle tunnel $35
Hay hide $14 
Litter box and wood balls at DT.
(DT is dollor tree)


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## peanutdabunny (Jun 4, 2021)

litter box is great from dollar tree,
the balls not so much.
you can maybe get the wooden cars, but I’d still not trust it.
i would just get a water bowl (not from dollar tree, a cermaic bowl is good)
nail trimmers from dollar tree are great, I do recommend them.
I’d recommend these pellets Science select
I’d get these toys Ball set, Stacking cups, Foraging mat,Treat ball
this could be a cute water dish Water bowl
your brush is good
treats are not good, Kay tee is not a trusted brand, here is some amazing healthy treats! Healthy treats
rabbits love tunnels! But the one you Provided only shows one entrance/exit, here’s a few good ones Tunnel 1,Tunnel 2,Tunnel 3, Tunnel 4 
you can get tunnel 4 at ikea for much cheaper (aka $7)
Hay hide is good, you can get the exact same thing on chewy for cheaper though
heres some good hayHay Mix I would get this hay, it is good quailty, you can see what your rabbit likes best, also the more types of hay the more enrichment for your rabbit, which is super important, and IMO fundamental to a rabbits life.
this took me a long time to write, please take this into consideration,


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## John Wick (Jun 5, 2021)

There's a lot of cleaning aspects that might not have been addressed. 

White vinegar + water can be put in a spray bottle and used to clean litter boxes and accidents.
If you don't want to go through paper towels all the time for routine cleaning, you can have specific rabbit-related cleaning towels and can buy a separate laundry bag to keep the soiled ones and wash them separately from the rest of your laundry.

Hay hurts. At least me. I have garden gloves to interact with hay so I don't get stabbed. You likely have a face mask or two at this point, which is helpful to wear when interacting with hay in case you have allergy or irritation from it.

I don't think there has been specific mention of litter for the litterboxes? You don't _need_ litter but I personally find it helpful. Many people use the stall pellets from Tractor Supply. I have a litter screen made from plastic knitting mesh to sit on top that is cleaned every day when I refresh the litter boxes. Some people use paper-based litters though the absorbency is generally not as good as other alternatives.

A small vacuum or dust pan can be helpful for hay, which will inevitably get... everywhere.

I would recommend having a separate trashcan for rabbit trash-- not a small office one, but a large one. It's just easier to have everything in a "station" and you don't need to go back and forth with a kitchen trashcan or something like that.

For the bowls listed, my reaction is that looks very flippable due to the lips on the side. Rabbits flipping and spilling water bowls is quite common. A rabbit may or may not be inclined to do it. One of mine would while the other wouldn't I'd say. Just something to keep in mind.

I personally haven't had good experiences with that amazon toy ball -- there's a lip inside that makes it hard to dispense the last few pellets or whatever you put inside. I think this goes into the larger understanding that toys you buy may not be used by your rabbit and feeling OK with that. It may take a bit to find what toys a rabbit is inclined to use to expend energy.


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## peanutdabunny (Jun 5, 2021)

@John Wick Thanks that will help them. I 100% agree with the trashcan part, and yes, I also get stabbed by hay! Its painful. I love tractor supply litter. With the amazon treat ball, it's my rabbit all-time favorite! I think it is worth the money, also makes it more enriching!


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## BunbunBannana (Jun 5, 2021)

Thanks, I did, look at the list


peanutdabunny said:


> litter box is great from dollar tree,
> the balls not so much.
> you can maybe get the wooden cars, but I’d still not trust it.
> i would just get a water bowl (not from dollar tree, a cermaic bowl is good)
> ...


Thanks, I did, look at the list!


John Wick said:


> There's a lot of cleaning aspects that might not have been addressed.
> 
> White vinegar + water can be put in a spray bottle and used to clean litter boxes and accidents.
> If you don't want to go through paper towels all the time for routine cleaning, you can have specific rabbit-related cleaning towels and can buy a separate laundry bag to keep the soiled ones and wash them separately from the rest of your laundry.
> ...


I have a bin I put up for hay and supplies! And I don't have an allergy bc my friend has guinea pigs and I've helped her feed them hey.


peanutdabunny said:


> @John Wick Thanks that will help them. I 100% agree with the trashcan part, and yes, I also get stabbed by hay! Its painful. I love tractor supply litter. With the amazon treat ball, it's my rabbit all-time favorite! I think it is worth the money, also makes it more enriching!


Yes, I got the ball! Also, a friend already gave me three bags of yesterday's news litter. 

List update:
Cage-$51
Food-$15
Brush-$20
Hay from Pet store
food and water bowl-$9 
Nail clippers from DT
Ball set $14
Foraging mat $20 
Rabbit treat ball for fun food $8
Rabbit treats $10 
Hay hide $14 
Tunnel $20 
Litter box at DT.
Plus a diy bed and diy toys and a diy mat!


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## Diane R (Jun 5, 2021)

Don't get a cage, complete waste of money. Cages and hutches are unsuitable for rabbits, they are always too small. Bunnies need access to at least 60 square ft 24/7. See Indoor Housing


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## BunbunBannana (Jun 5, 2021)

Diane R said:


> Don't get a cage, complete waste of money. Cages and hutches are unsuitable for rabbits, they are always too small. Bunnies need access to at least 60 square ft 24/7. See Indoor Housing


would a 41 by 84 playpen be big enough?


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## peanutdabunny (Jun 5, 2021)

BunbunBannana said:


> would a 41 by 84 playpen be big enough?


Yes that is big enough! Your list is now amazing! If you need anymore help feel free to ask


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## peanutdabunny (Jun 5, 2021)

Here's my setup










During the day he is in a cage connected to an xpen


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## BunbunBannana (Jun 5, 2021)

peanutdabunny said:


> Here's my setup
> View attachment 55657
> View attachment 55658
> View attachment 55659
> ...


Wow that huge! I forgot to say that the dimensions are in inches! So would 41 by 84 INCHES be big enough?


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## BunBun71 (Jun 5, 2021)

peanutdabunny said:


> Can you see this picture?


That is too small.


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## Preitler (Jun 5, 2021)

peanutdabunny said:


> Here's my setup



Your bunny looks almost like my Red (sorry for offtopic  )

Big enough..., that's a difficult question. As I have learned it's what you are comfortable with, and a lot of rabbit owners realize that they are not happy with a cage that seemed sufficient at first. Gosh - I'm at the 4th iteration of building hutches. I mean, countrary to keeping rabbits as lifestock we have pets to enjoy all their potential, and IMHO in that regard a cage just doesn't cut it. I do both, pets and lifestock, and even my smallest hutch is 2,7m x 0,8m (106"x32") with at least some hours garden time each day. My house bunnys don't have any cage or so, they just have to be inside the house during the night.
So, that cage isn't small, or too small for a rabbit per se. But a pen simply offers more options, and I've seen quite some people realizing that there is more and the cage is just a home base and changed to a pen or free roam. It's also about interaction with the rabbit- you can sit in a pen with the rabbit, a cage imo is more likely concieved as their territory, and you are an accepted invader.

It would be good if people would speak up here who actually have indoor rabbits in cages, would be different opinions than from us guys who don't do it that way .


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## peanutdabunny (Jun 5, 2021)

@Preitler He does look like red!
Peanut is never locked up in his cage, ever!
At night I set up an xpen or 2 around the cage so he can binky!
The grey cage is huge, and an amazing cage or homebase.
It keeps everything clean, easy to clean, I love it! It really works for me
@Preitler what breed and coloring is your rabbit?
Peanut was from a rescue, told me he was a mix netherland


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## BunbunBannana (Jun 5, 2021)

Back from a trip to the dollar store!
I got a litter box, poop scoop, nail clippers, measuring cups, pee pads (to align the litter box), and a dish. Here are pics! now all I need to get is...
Cage-$51
Food-$15
Brush-$20
Hay from Pet store
Ball set $14
Foraging mat $20
Rabbit treat toy for fun food $8
Rabbit treats $10
Hay hide $14 
Tunnel $20
I plan on getting the bun around 1-2 months from now.


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## BunBun71 (Jun 5, 2021)

BunbunBannana said:


> Back from a trip to the dollar store!
> I got a litter box, poop scoop, nail clippers, measuring cups, pee pads (to align the litter box), and a dish. Here are pics! now all I need to get is...
> Cage-$51
> Food-$15
> ...


Cool


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## Diane R (Jun 5, 2021)

BunbunBannana said:


> would a 41 by 84 playpen be big enough?


Well, no, that's not nearly 60 square ft! It's 21 sq ft. about a third of the space needed.


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## peanutdabunny (Jun 5, 2021)

I would honestly return the food and water bowl here's why
-It will get spilled everywhere since its light
-it's plastic
-it's very dangerous if ingested
-you don't know if the plastic is BPA free, I love dollar tree, but the food and water bowls just ain't it
Ceramic adorable bowl


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## BunbunBannana (Jun 5, 2021)

peanutdabunny said:


> I would honestly return the food and water bowl here's why
> -It will get spilled everywhere since its light
> -it's plastic
> -it's very dangerous if ingested
> ...


Ill try it, if it flips once, Ill switch


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## peanutdabunny (Jun 5, 2021)

*Bunnies like to chew* ≈ _bunnies end up *chewing plastic*_ 


baby bunny ≈ *sensitive tummy* 


bunnies end up chewing plastic + sensitive tummy ≈ *Very sick bunny with GI stasis*


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## BunbunBannana (Jun 5, 2021)

Diane R said:


> Well, no, that's not nearly 60 square ft! It's 21 sq ft. about a third of the space needed.


I only intend to use it for around half a year, then switch to free roam. Plus It will be 2 stories, so 42 cubic feet, and it will still be a baby.


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## BunbunBannana (Jun 5, 2021)

peanutdabunny said:


> Bunnies like to chew baby bunny
> ≈ ≈
> bunnies end up chewing plastic + sensitive tummy ≈ Very sick bunny with GI stasis


I will be watching it a lot, if I see it even lick it, I will switch


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## peanutdabunny (Jun 5, 2021)

I get where you are coming from, you want to spend less money.
You arent going to be around all day, bunnies love to cause trouble when you are gone, you gotta love them haha
But instead of you spending $7 for the ceramic bowl, you are spending close to 1k to save your bunny from GI stasis.
Preventive measures, not treatment is what you want to aim for


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## BunbunBannana (Jun 5, 2021)

peanutdabunny said:


> I get where you are coming from, you want to spend less money.
> You arent going to be around all day, bunnies love to cause trouble when you are gone, you gotta love them haha
> But instead of you spending $7 for the ceramic bowl, you are spending close to 1k to save your bunny from GI stasis.
> Preventive measures, not treatment is what you want to aim for


Ok


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## Catlyn (Jun 6, 2021)

peanutdabunny said:


> I get where you are coming from, you want to spend less money.
> You arent going to be around all day, bunnies love to cause trouble when you are gone, you gotta love them haha
> But instead of you spending $7 for the ceramic bowl, you are spending close to 1k to save your bunny from GI stasis.
> Preventive measures, not treatment is what you want to aim for


Sorry for the long read, i've thrown in quite a lot of my own personal experiences as reference.

I totally agree.
If you don't want to go for a ceramic dish, or want one that will never be tipped over, and won't be really interesting to the rabbit, look around for a lock-and-crock dish. I have one for Storm since he's a tosser-digger rabbit, he's never managed to flip it once. Although the one i have for him is plastic, it is big and "fat", hence not chewable and holding plenty of water. It has lasted me for more than a year and it only cost about 5€

If you do plan on getting a rabbit after all the educational text thrown at you, *do get an adult bonded pair from a shelter instead of a single baby from a breeder.*
*a pair of rabbits is always better(save for maybe 1% of rabbits that just won't take any rabbit pal) -people can never fully fulfill a bun's need for a same-species buddy. A bonded pair will also have an easier time for vet trips, moving or furniture swap. I had a solo rabbit(Musti), then had a duo of them(Storm&Lümi), now back to a solo bun(Storm). Even though the pair was largely unbonded, Storm has kinda flipped since Lümi's passing and he took moving quite hard(did great when he moved together w Lümi) I can see the changes in him and i am just not the right type of company he truly needs. He'll be fine with us, but i guarantee, he would much rather have another rabbit groom him instead of me. Bonded rabbits are also known to live happier, and sometimes even longer. So whatever you do, better get a pair.
*shelter rabbits are already fixed and vaccinated, have had their health checked and some degree of personality assessmsnt, also socializing training. This means no nasty behavious like humping, grunting, spraying, excessive destruction&aggression, running away from your hands, and also a huuuge decrease in the risk of reproductive cancers. Fixed rabbits are better in litter training and are generally calmer. Health-checked and vaccinated rabbits are a rarer sight in breeders' rabbits.
Adult rabbits have developed their personality, so it is easier to get what you see, and thus, better plan what toys to get and make for your new fellows.
*there is such an overpopulation of rabbits who are in need of good homes, until that situation goes away, there is no need to go to a breeder and fuel the flames. (Not saying that all breeders are bad, some do breed rabbits specifically to have great pet-traits, but most that i've heard of are not so great.)
It is generally a much better idea to get a duo from a shelter, if it is possible. Pretty sure it's the case for all the folks in Australia, USA and UK, not at all here in Estonia and any other place not so great in rabbit care (Pakistan is another example and the Philippines have also popped up in those discussions)


Also, one thing to consider if you're a minor-does everyone in your household want a pair of rabbits? Are they on the same page with you in terms of how to care for them? Who will be funding any costs, especially the vet bills? Annual vaccines and general health checks, and quite big vet bills depending on the ailment your rabbits may be stuck with. Musti had a knee abcess and in attempt to find the cause and cure it, in 6 months i had coughed up nearly 500€ for all the xrays, antibiotics, painkillers, driving costs and any other miscellaneous payments(including neuter; 45€ is cheap here, you probably won't find any experienced clinic doing it for that cheap. Spays go even further, our minimum is 75€). All in vain as he had to cross the bridge since the abcess had taken his quality of life. Lümi had pastuerella, fought three months with antibiotics, treated many bouts of gas and chaffed skin, also around 200€, he still ended up dying suddenly. Both were young and had been healthy. Long story short, do be aware that vet bills for annuals aren't too expensive, about 50€, but the running costs are whopping. 
You might have to consider insurance.
When i started my rabbit journey, we were on the same page on how to care for my boy, but as time moved and i gained more knowledge, my parents didn't, so we've had a fair share of struggles with that. I vented about it in December, i believe, i'll find it and add the link to it, might be an interesting heads-up read on what may lie ahead if your parents don't agree with you. Just on a side-note, things have gotten much better on my end, i believe that was the worst i'd had in caring for my rabbits.





I needed to vent about rabbit-related issues.


I don't know if it's a smart idea to vent here, but at least i know that people will somewhat get where i'm coming from. You don't have to read it, i just feel like i really need to vent on all the rabbit-related issues i'm having. I'm starting to think that it would be better if i didn't...




www.rabbitsonline.net


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## Ashrocks92 (Jun 6, 2021)

What litter do u guys use we use paper stuff for the bedding and stuff also tractor supply here is cheaper than PetSmart for rabbit stuff gonna shop there for now on


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## BunBun71 (Jun 6, 2021)

I don't use litter. Sorry I can't help.


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## bunny34422 (Jun 6, 2021)

(Didn't read the whole thread, sorry if I missed something but just wanted to add) babies need a lot of room too, I'd say that my boy was very active as a baby and loved having a big room to himself. Always binkying and zooming around. If you're talking about whether or not the c&c grid cage you have is big enough, I've heard that they prefer more floor space rather than stories/levels. The good thing about c&c grids is that you can change the height and shape whenever you want so you can adjust it if needed. Though if you get a jumper you may need more to make it higher, my boy is such an escape artist and has climbed over 2 and 3 ft pens, lol


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## MiloTheBunny101 (Jun 7, 2021)

Looks good to me! But remember your going to have to slowly bond with your rabbit! Maybe leaving it in the cage for a couple of days. If you want i could link some bonding video?


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## peanutdabunny (Jun 7, 2021)

MiloTheBunny101 said:


> Looks good to me! But remember your going to have to slowly bond with your rabbit! Maybe leaving it in the cage for a couple of days. If you want i could link some bonding video?


I wouldnt leave the bunny in the cage for a few days, I would sit next to the cage and have treats in your hand, and let the bunny come out themself


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## peanutdabunny (Jun 7, 2021)

Also, I have done more reasearch on sherwood and there is baby food. Soy And Wheat cause slow of the GI track, this can lead to GI stasis. More info here! Info


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## BunbunBannana (Jun 7, 2021)

I plan on getting the bunny in the cage and leaving it alone for the rest of the day, and then coming in to climb to bed and leave it alone for the night. In the morning, I will start letting it out.


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## BunbunBannana (Jun 7, 2021)

Catlyn said:


> Sorry for the long read, i've thrown in quite a lot of my own personal experiences as reference.
> 
> I totally agree.
> If you don't want to go for a ceramic dish, or want one that will never be tipped over, and won't be really interesting to the rabbit, look around for a lock-and-crock dish. I have one for Storm since he's a tosser-digger rabbit, he's never managed to flip it once. Although the one i have for him is plastic, it is big and "fat", hence not chewable and holding plenty of water. It has lasted me for more than a year and it only cost about 5€
> ...


I I would have gotten 2 but my cage isn't big enough. When I switch to free roam, I will probably get another bun.


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## peanutdabunny (Jun 7, 2021)

BunbunBannana said:


> I I would have gotten 2 but my cage isn't big enough. When I switch to free roam, I will probably get another bun.


Read This


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## Madelyn L. (Jun 7, 2021)

BunbunBannana said:


> I will be watching it a lot, if I see it even lick it, I will switch


You can also just use a heavy glass bowl from your kitchen. They worked very well for me! Plus, no extra money!


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## Madelyn L. (Jun 7, 2021)

Ashrocks92 said:


> What litter do u guys use we use paper stuff for the bedding and stuff also tractor supply here is cheaper than PetSmart for rabbit stuff gonna shop there for now on


I use care fresh rabbit litter. It works well for me


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## peanutdabunny (Jun 7, 2021)

Read this too, this person is not in the US though Here
Pet *rabbits can eat grass* from the yard provided that it's fresh and not treated with chemicals. Don't allow a rabbit to *eat* excessive *grass* immediately as her stomach needs to adjust to it. If you're going to clip some *grass* to *feed* your rabbit, you *should* use scissors


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## peanutdabunny (Jun 7, 2021)

Also this "
The answer is both potentially yes and no.

Firstly, a rabbit that is not used to eating grass all day may have stomach upsets as a result which could lead to gut stasis. If however you were feeding grass before letting her out all day and she was used to it, it should be fine. However slow introductions starting from 5-10 minutes at a time, once a day leading up to several hours over a couple of weeks would be the way to go.

Secondly, it's important to know what your grass is. Most backyard grasses are perfectly safe, however there can be certain weeds in lawns/gardens (plus common garden plants) that are fatal if ingested by a rabbit. Before I first let Bandit out in my yard, I did a lot of research on the plants in the garden and the weeds in my lawn before just letting him go at it. It took a lot of online research, double-checking of resources for rabbit-safe plants before I was confident to let him out there. In addition to this, if any pesticides or herbicides are used on the lawn, this could also have a bad effect on your rabbit.

The third factor which should also seriously be considered, is if you're letting your rabbit out for the whole day largely unsupervised, you need to be aware that there's a risk of predators taking your rabbit, whether it be a bird, cat, fox or other depending on your location.

While I certainly encourage people to have their rabbits exercise outside and feed on lawn in such a way, just take care in the way that it's done. If you've only just started letting your rabbit out on the lawn, it's likely why she is gorging herself because it's a new amazing food that she wants to eat as much of as possible before she gets shut away again. If you make the trips outdoors regular, it's possible that she won't immediately resort to eating as much as she can as quickly as she can"


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## BunbunBannana (Jun 7, 2021)

peanutdabunny said:


> Also this "
> The answer is both potentially yes and no.
> 
> Firstly, a rabbit that is not used to eating grass all day may have stomach upsets as a result which could lead to gut stasis. If however you were feeding grass before letting her out all day and she was used to it, it should be fine. However slow introductions starting from 5-10 minutes at a time, once a day leading up to several hours over a couple of weeks would be the way to go.
> ...


Thanks! And I will be watching the rabbit the WHOLE time.


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## BunbunBannana (Jun 7, 2021)

Do I have to neuter/spay and vaccinate the bunny. And is hot glue safe?


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## Mac189 (Jun 7, 2021)

BunbunBannana said:


> Do I have to neuter/spay and vaccinate the bunny. And is hot glue safe?


I would HIGHLY recommend spaying and neutering, it tends to greatly improve rabbits' general behavior, prevents conditions that could crop up later in life, and is necessary if you were ever to consider getting a second rabbit as a bond. I tend to feel that the earlier you can get it done, the better. While you don't HAVE to spay or neuter, it will make you and your rabbit's life much easier in the long and short term, with few reasons not to.

In the US there aren't very many vaccines available for rabbits yet, but when the RHV2 vaccine does become available you should get it, always better to be safe than sorry.


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## peanutdabunny (Jun 7, 2021)

In CA I would get vaccinated, especially if your rabbit is going to eat grass from outside. There are cases in CA and it is spread through insects and wild rabbits


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## peanutdabunny (Jun 7, 2021)

Read this..
https://www.rabbitsonline.net/threads/different-types-of-hay-what-and-why.101991/post-1177180
However, there are specific things you need to watch out for. These are the things you need to consider to prevent it from becoming a negative activity which poses risks:


Has the grass been treated with any products or chemicals? Weed Killer and other Pesticide and Herbicides products can be fatal to a Rabbit if consumed.
Have other animals, pets been grazing or using the area in which the grass grows? Could they have urinated/excreted on it?
Have any wild animals been on/or use the grass?
Have you recently mowed the grass, or cut it down using a lawnmower?
Has your Rabbit consumed grass before? Has it been a significant part of their diet?
Source Can Rabbits Eat Grass? [This Is What You Must Be Careful Of]


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## BunbunBannana (Jun 7, 2021)

peanutdabunny said:


> In CA I would get vaccinated, especially if your rabbit is going to eat grass from outside. There are cases in CA and it is spread through insects and wild rabbits


What should I take the vaccinations for


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## Mac189 (Jun 7, 2021)

BunbunBannana said:


> What should I take the vaccinations for


In the US the only vaccine that I currently know of that is even slightly approved is the RHDV2 vaccine, which is only available in some regions right now, although will likely become more widespread soon.

Globally there are vaccines for RHDV 1 & 2, as well as myxomatosis, however, none of these are available in most of the US at this time. The bay area may have a little more availability simply due to having more highly specialized clinics than many other areas, so you may want to call a few clinics and see if they carry any vaccines.


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## Mac189 (Jun 7, 2021)

https://www.aphis.usda.gov/animal_health/downloads/faq-rhd-vaccine.pdf


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## Catlyn (Jun 7, 2021)

BunbunBannana said:


> I I would have gotten 2 but my cage isn't big enough. When I switch to free roam, I will probably get another bun.


This is not an excuse, really. Take the reccommendations, get an xpen with whatever base cage you end up getting. If coupled with ample time to excersise out the pen as well, a pair of rabbits won't mind at all. I persoanlly believe that "double the rabbits, double the space" is a myth as my boys used to look extremely happy in their ~2 sq m pen with at least 6hrs extra roaming space.

A large-ish base cage, an xpen(or two) attached to it and at least 4hrs of roaming time in an even bigger, rabbit-proofed place. Only a few initial steps that can help you take a bonded pair from the shelter and forego all problems of rabbit puberty, fixing, doubling that and then bonding(if it works oht between any two rabbits). Just try to keep it simpler for yourself-find a way to create some extra space and get a bonded pair into a few xpens' worth of area and it should be all good in terms of space.


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## BunbunBannana (Jun 7, 2021)

Catlyn said:


> This is not an excuse, really. Take the reccommendations, get an xpen with whatever base cage you end up getting. If coupled with ample time to excersise out the pen as well, a pair of rabbits won't mind at all. I persoanlly believe that "double the rabbits, double the space" is a myth as my boys used to look extremely happy in their ~2 sq m pen with at least 6hrs extra roaming space.
> 
> A large-ish base cage, an xpen(or two) attached to it and at least 4hrs of roaming time in an even bigger, rabbit-proofed place. Only a few initial steps that can help you take a bonded pair from the shelter and forego all problems of rabbit puberty, fixing, doubling that and then bonding(if it works oht between any two rabbits). Just try to keep it simpler for yourself-find a way to create some extra space and get a bonded pair into a few xpens' worth of area and it should be all good in terms of space.


I guess I can free roam them in my room... It's 60 square inches. would that work for 2?


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## Catlyn (Jun 8, 2021)

What's 60 square inches? The cage? Your room?
Did you mean square feet? 60squareinches is really, really small for whatever it is. No being can be housed in 60sqin spaces.
If you meant 60 square feet, then it is a very decent size and should be totally okay. (I use the metric system so i don't know what exactly it makes, the reccommended minimum was 60sqft i believe). Although we can all agree that bigger is better, if you really meant feet instead of inches, that size would be good.


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## BunbunBannana (Jun 8, 2021)

Catlyn said:


> What's 60 square inches? The cage? Your room?
> Did you mean square feet? 60squareinches is really, really small for whatever it is. No being can be housed in 60sqin spaces.
> If you meant 60 square feet, then it is a very decent size and should be totally okay. (I use the metric system so i don't know what exactly it makes, the reccommended minimum was 60sqft i believe). Although we can all agree that bigger is better, if you really meant feet instead of inches, that size would be good.


Yes I meant sqare feet in my room.


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## peanutdabunny (Jun 8, 2021)

RHDV2 is a deadly diease no cure. I saw lennon the bunny get the vaccine in LA. If you are going to give your bunny grass I reccommend getting the vacciene. It is spread through insects and wild rabbits.


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## BunbunBannana (Jun 8, 2021)

Catlyn said:


> What's 60 square inches? The cage? Your room?
> Did you mean square feet? 60squareinches is really, really small for whatever it is. No being can be housed in 60sqin spaces.
> If you meant 60 square feet, then it is a very decent size and should be totally okay. (I use the metric system so i don't know what exactly it makes, the reccommended minimum was 60sqft i believe). Although we can all agree that bigger is better, if you really meant feet instead of inches, that size would be good.


I don't think I can. My room is carpeted, so unless 2buns are ok with 30 sqr feet... the rabbits will get to see other buns tho, as we have friends with bunnies.


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## peanutdabunny (Jun 8, 2021)

Do you have a basment?


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## BunbunBannana (Jun 8, 2021)

peanutdabunny said:


> Do you have a basment?


A large thick cloth, yes


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## peanutdabunny (Jun 8, 2021)

Rabbits do better in coolar temps, so if you can make it nice down there then the rabbits would love it


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## John Wick (Jun 8, 2021)

BunbunBannana said:


> I don't think I can. My room is carpeted, so unless 2buns are ok with 30 sqr feet... the rabbits will get to see other buns tho, as we have friends with bunnies.


Keep in mind that rabbits aren't necessarily pets that can have playdates with each other, especially if a rabbit is being brought into another's territory. There is likely to be aggression and fighting, rather than positive interaction. This is also why you cannot just get two rabbits and keep them together right away-- bonding steps are required to ensure safety and the highest likelihood of success.


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## Preitler (Jun 8, 2021)

BunbunBannana said:


> the rabbits will get to see other buns tho, as we have friends with bunnies.



Uhm, not really, going to visit other rabbits usually doesn't work that way. Rabbits are more like cats in that regard, not like dogs. Actually they live in small groups with a strict hierachy, establishing that peacefully is what a big part of bonding is all about.

I don't think putting a rabbit in the basement, out of sight, out of mind, is what having an indoor pet about. Rooms that are comfortable for humans are ok for rabbits.


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## peanutdabunny (Jun 8, 2021)

Oh, people dont go in their basment offten? I do all the time, its sooooo much coolar and nicer down there


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## peanutdabunny (Jun 8, 2021)

Honestly, I would wait longer before you get a rabbit, so you can have everything ready, not just getting a bun because you want to, because it will also be the best for the bunny. As it seems right now, you seem like you can't commit to a 10 year commitment. I would save up more money before you get a rabbit too


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## BunbunBannana (Jun 8, 2021)

peanutdabunny said:


> Honestly, I would wait longer before you get a rabbit, so you can have everything ready, not just getting a bun because you want to, because it will also be the best for the bunny. As it seems right now, you seem like you can't commit to a 10 year commitment. I would save up more money before you get a rabbit too


I'm waiting a few months, to research and order everything


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## BunbunBannana (Jun 8, 2021)

Catlyn said:


> This is not an excuse, really. Take the reccommendations, get an xpen with whatever base cage you end up getting. If coupled with ample time to excersise out the pen as well, a pair of rabbits won't mind at all. I persoanlly believe that "double the rabbits, double the space" is a myth as my boys used to look extremely happy in their ~2 sq m pen with at least 6hrs extra roaming space.
> 
> A large-ish base cage, an xpen(or two) attached to it and at least 4hrs of roaming time in an even bigger, rabbit-proofed place. Only a few initial steps that can help you take a bonded pair from the shelter and forego all problems of rabbit puberty, fixing, doubling that and then bonding(if it works oht between any two rabbits). Just try to keep it simpler for yourself-find a way to create some extra space and get a bonded pair into a few xpens' worth of area and it should be all good in terms of space.


Would my 30 square feet pen work for 2 with 1-4 h of free roam daily for the first 6 months


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## peanutdabunny (Jun 8, 2021)

BunbunBannana said:


> Would my 30 square feet pen work for 2 with 1-4 h of free roam daily for the first 6 months


eehhh not IMO, a little small for exerice area + home base


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## Catlyn (Jun 8, 2021)

30 square feet might work if your rabbits will get AT LEAST 6 hours of playtime outside their pen.
It WILL NOT be okay if it is any less time than that. If you have a smaller space than reccommended then you need to compensate by giving extra playtime.
What is up with the whole carpet thing though? I have carpet in Storm's enclosure, and around the rooms, he's doing marvellous with it. No pees, no chew holes, nothing. Despite the fact that he is a digger more than not. Could you just not remove the carpet all together, or cover it up with okay to chew placemats/rugs?
Again, why it is a good idea to get a fixed bonded shelter pair. People there generally know the rabbits and can help you pick a pair that isn't interested in carpets. Them being fixed also means a decrease in wanting to wreck something.


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## Catlyn (Jun 8, 2021)

Why can you not freeroam your rabbits in your room in the first place?
Storm's setup is about 4*1m pen made from two fence panels and some flat latchers, and a spare piece of grid for a 80*90cm door. It is technically STILL a bit under the reccommended 3*2m. He has carpet there, and a no-carpet area. His door is ALWAYS left open, even at night. He sleeps under my bunks, the desk, in between the wall and the cabinet. He moves onto my bunk's lower floor. He can also go anywhere else in the house's main floor. At night my door is closed, so he has about 4*3m space. The worst he does is zooming at 3am, totally natural.
I have taken away all loose wires onto my desk, gridded up loose wallpaper. All his stuff is on a wall shelf and i keep my floor clean for him. I have no indoor plants. Absolutely no problem.
Why can't you do that?


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## peanutdabunny (Jun 8, 2021)

Okay @BunbunBannana
Tell us the *reason you are getting a bunny*
Restate what you are *getting for your bunny*
A *picture *of where your *bun would stay*
The *temperature* of your room(where the bun is staying)?
The *hay *you will be *using?*
The *Pellets *you will be using (and the ones you will be using as an adult bun)
What is your plan for the next 10 years? Are you going to move? Are you going to go to college? Are you going to have kids?
Will you be able to *provide toys every month*?
Will you be able to afford *expensive emergency vet visits*?
Do you have a *rabbit-savvy* vet near you?
Will you be able to* love the bunny* even if it might not love you?
Will you be able to deal with a hormonal bunny? (they nip, they will be aggressive to some extent, they will spray pee everywhere, they will have stinky poops everywhere, and they won't be the nice baby bunny you once had)
Are you going to be able to provide unlimited hay every day? My bunny eats 2 1/2 his body size every day!
Will you be giving free-roaming time at the right times of the day? (dawn and dusk)
You need to consider all of this, when getting from a breeder, you never know if your bunny will end up nice, even if the bunny is nice as a baby, it won't be the same bunny as an adult. Your bunny can be a destructive bunny, an anti-social bunny, a bunny who won't sit on your lap, a bunny who HATES to be held, a bunny who gets scared when you walk by them, a bunny who has a ton of health conditions. Not every bunny is the bunny you see in pictures or youtube videos, that is just the bunny at its best moment. I am guilty of this too, only posting the good on my Peanuts account, and not the bad. It makes bunnies look more like dogs than bunnies. And be prepared for having the feeling of wanting to give away your bunny right after you get them, as you realize it's more work than you expected, or they aren't acting the same as you thought they would. You need to push through that, and you will be good. It is a common feeling, and I know and have heard of people who have the same feeling.
I am playing devil's advocate, as it seems you think bunnies are super cuddly and truly they aren't. Only really on their own terms will they sit on your lap, and most of the time it's for a treat


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## BunbunBannana (Jun 8, 2021)

Catlyn said:


> 30 square feet might work if your rabbits will get AT LEAST 6 hours of playtime outside their pen.
> It WILL NOT be okay if it is any less time than that. If you have a smaller space than reccommended then you need to compensate by giving extra playtime.
> What is up with the whole carpet thing though? I have carpet in Storm's enclosure, and around the rooms, he's doing marvellous with it. No pees, no chew holes, nothing. Despite the fact that he is a digger more than not. Could you just not remove the carpet all together, or cover it up with okay to chew placemats/rugs?
> Again, why it is a good idea to get a fixed bonded shelter pair. People there generally know the rabbits and can help you pick a pair that isn't interested in carpets. Them being fixed also means a decrease in wanting to wreck something.





Catlyn said:


> Why can you not freeroam your rabbits in your room in the first place?
> Storm's setup is about 4*1m pen made from two fence panels and some flat latchers, and a spare piece of grid for a 80*90cm door. It is technically STILL a bit under the reccommended 3*2m. He has carpet there, and a no-carpet area. His door is ALWAYS left open, even at night. He sleeps under my bunks, the desk, in between the wall and the cabinet. He moves onto my bunk's lower floor. He can also go anywhere else in the house's main floor. At night my door is closed, so he has about 4*3m space. The worst he does is zooming at 3am, totally natural.
> I have taken away all loose wires onto my desk, gridded up loose wallpaper. All his stuff is on a wall shelf and i keep my floor clean for him. I have no indoor plants. Absolutely no problem.
> Why can't you do that?


Ok, I can let the rabbits (two) free roam in my 120 square feet room during the day, and in the cage at night.


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## BunbunBannana (Jun 8, 2021)

peanutdabunny said:


> Okay @BunbunBannana
> Tell us the *reason you are getting a bunny*
> Restate what you are *getting for your bunny*
> A *picture *of where your *bun would stay*
> ...


I am getting a bunny bc after owning rats for 4 years, and my rats passed away, I wanted to try a new animal (I'm training for a vet)
I am getting
Cage-$51
Food-$15
Brush-$20
Hay from Pet store
Ball set $14
Foraging mat $20
Rabbit treat toy for fun food $8
Rabbit treats $10
Hay hide $14 
Tunnel $20
Climbing tree $35
and food and water bowl
I have already got
plus I have already got a litter box, poop scoop, nail clippers, measuring cups, pee pads (to align the litter box)
the temp will be MIN 60 MAX 77 (and I have a fan I can put in)
Freshest hay the pet shop has (if it looks bad, ill get it from elsewhere), plus some backyard hay as a treat.
here is a pic of the room, I plan on creating a loft bed, so the cage will be where the bed used to be (that whole space) and I will bunny proof the wires.
The pellets are science selective, and when the rabbit gets bigger small pet select
I don't plan on moving in the next 10 years, no, and no plans like that
I will def be able to provide toys, firstly I love D.I.Ying them, second I have a habit of buying way too many toys for my pets.
I can afford vet visits, I have 500 served up from my rat's vet fund
I have 5 different vet clinics that specialize in buns.
I will be able to love the bunny no matter what, my first pair of rats were rescued from abuse and they hated me. I let them play and loved them SO much anyway. Didn't force them to be with me
Yes, I can deal with a hormonal bunny, as my abused rats bit, peed, and one of my sweet rats had a hormonal problem.
I don't have a problem providing hay, I have a pet shop I can bike to in 2 mins!
Will you be giving free-roaming time at the right times of the day. They will free roam all day, and stay in the cage at night.
Hope that covered it!


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## BinkyLouie (Jun 9, 2021)

BunbunBannana said:


> Thanks. I plan on going to the pet store for the hay (to get the freshest they have). I plan on making a foraging mat, aswell as a cardboard castle. And I am fine with paying, amazon just works best for me. Here is the new list...
> Food-$10
> Brush-$20
> Timothy hay from pet shop $20
> ...


Hi, kaytee hay ISNT all that bad. Actually if you get the wafer cut Timothy hay from kaytee it comes with layers of strands. I’ve had a good experience so far buying that specific hay from and I apologize if it’s different for you. Let me snap a pic for you! Also I bought my bun two bags of this and I still haven’t finished one. I’ve had one bag for about 1-3 weeks. It’s a good money saver. About small pet select.. the hay is good it’s excellent but it’s kind of pricy. Mostly everything is there so I decided to just buy that hay I just showed you.


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## BinkyLouie (Jun 9, 2021)

BunbunBannana said:


> I am getting a bunny bc after owning rats for 4 years, and my rats passed away, I wanted to try a new animal (I'm training for a vet)
> I am getting
> Cage-$51
> Food-$15
> ...


I’m just gonna give you a brief explanation and I know you’re new to having a bunny and you know what I am too but I’m learning still. Basically, if you want your bunny to be happy you need to let it free roam. My bunny has free roamed since he was small. He did spend a few hours in his cage but not too long. I wanted him to have a better life than my other bun did and he does. I just give him all the space he wants he has a big living room and although he wants to explore other rooms and does manage to escape to them I always bring him back because there are dangerous things he could encounter. He’s litter trained, he has a feeding schedule, he’s loved and he gets treats. It’s super simple for a bun bun to be happy you just need to give him what he wants. A happy bunny will need a good diet, affection and their space. I know because this is what my bun bun has. I’m not sure about the cage situation because mine only has a cage for the night. From 8:30 to 10PM hes inside all day. I can’t give you information on anything else but I’ve heard that from 2 months to 7 months rabbits should be fed alfalfa pellets and then after those 7 months they should be fed Timothy pellets. Another thing is that rabbits don’t need alfalfa hay when they’re small but you can provide it. I only fed unlimited alfalfa pellets and unlimited Timothy hay since he was small and he’s great. He doesn’t get that anymore obviously. He gets 1/4 cup of pellets now and I’ll be switching soon and still unlimited hay.
PS. MAKE SURE YOU BUNNY PROOF TO AVOID HAZARDS!


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## Preitler (Jun 9, 2021)

A lot of that discussion about how much space or whatnot a rabbit needs is not so much about rabbits, but about what people would like to see if they had a say. That's fine as long as this is the bases for what they themself do (which isn't always the case, but what they would like to do), or suggestions about what other people with the same attitude towards pets are happy with, but get's problematic when it's all about telling other people what to do based on opinion and preferences, not so much facts.

There are quite some different ways to keep and feed rabbits that are imo ok, it's not rocket science, everyone needs to find his own working compromise - I sometimes get the feeling that there is quite an inflation of demands getting flaunted around.

Anyway, since you said that you've friends with rabbits I would think it would be a good idea to spend some thime there, just to help getting an idea about what you want, and how rabbits work as pets. Only knew one rat briefly, and that was a little different, liked being toted around in my friends hoody and so.


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## peanutdabunny (Jun 9, 2021)

Here what I recommend doing
1. Dont get Kaytee hay
2. don't get small pet select food, they have soy and grains which slow down the urinary and GI tract, which can cause problems later in life. Like stasis and sluge
3. if you get a loft bed. watch stormy rabbits on youtube and build a cage-like theirs.


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## BunbunBannana (Jun 9, 2021)

BinkyLouie said:


> I’m just gonna give you a brief explanation and I know you’re new to having a bunny and you know what I am too but I’m learning still. Basically, if you want your bunny to be happy you need to let it free roam. My bunny has free roamed since he was small. He did spend a few hours in his cage but not too long. I wanted him to have a better life than my other bun did and he does. I just give him all the space he wants he has a big living room and although he wants to explore other rooms and does manage to escape to them I always bring him back because there are dangerous things he could encounter. He’s litter trained, he has a feeding schedule, he’s loved and he gets treats. It’s super simple for a bun bun to be happy you just need to give him what he wants. A happy bunny will need a good diet, affection and their space. I know because this is what my bun bun has. I’m not sure about the cage situation because mine only has a cage for the night. From 8:30 to 10PM hes inside all day. I can’t give you information on anything else but I’ve heard that from 2 months to 7 months rabbits should be fed alfalfa pellets and then after those 7 months they should be fed Timothy pellets. Another thing is that rabbits don’t need alfalfa hay when they’re small but you can provide it. I only fed unlimited alfalfa pellets and unlimited Timothy hay since he was small and he’s great. He doesn’t get that anymore obviously. He gets 1/4 cup of pellets now and I’ll be switching soon and still unlimited hay.
> PS. MAKE SURE YOU BUNNY PROOF TO AVOID HAZARDS!





Preitler said:


> A lot of that discussion about how much space or whatnot a rabbit needs is not so much about rabbits, but about what people would like to see if they had a say. That's fine as long as this is the bases for what they themself do (which isn't always the case, but what they would like to do), or suggestions about what other people with the same attitude towards pets are happy with, but get's problematic when it's all about telling other people what to do based on opinion and preferences, not so much facts.
> 
> There are quite some different ways to keep and feed rabbits that are imo ok, it's not rocket science, everyone needs to find his own working compromise - I sometimes get the feeling that there is quite an inflation of demands getting flaunted around.
> 
> Anyway, since you said that you've friends with rabbits I would think it would be a good idea to spend some thime there, just to help getting an idea about what you want, and how rabbits work as pets. Only knew one rat briefly, and that was a little different, liked being toted around in my friends hoody and so.





peanutdabunny said:


> Here what I recommend doing
> 1. Dont get Kaytee hay
> 2. don't get small pet select food, they have soy and grains which slow down the urinary and GI tract, which can cause problems later in life. Like stasis and sluge
> 3. if you get a loft bed. watch stormy rabbits on youtube and build a cage-like theirs.


Thank you! I plan on letting the bunny roam around my room all day, and have them inside their cage at night.


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## BinkyLouie (Jun 9, 2021)

BunbunBannana said:


> Thank you! I plan on letting the bunny roam around my room all day, and have them inside their cage at night.


I hope you figure it out. Since everyone is telling you different things I could understand how it can be hard for you. Get what you can it doesn’t have to be PERFECT. You wouldn’t want to be stressed out about this. If I were you I would watch a rabbit YouTube channel. I watch Lennon the bunny and shes a great YouTube channel. I know someone said something about her earlier but IMO SHES not bad news. You can get a harness if you want to it’s not bad. I have a yard and I bought my rabbit one because he would want to go outside(I don’t use it anymore because it was for when he was small but I’m probably gonna buy him another one when he grows bigger). Having a bunny doesn’t take a lot of time. If you have them in a cage obviously you won’t have to watch them much just make sure your bun knows who you are and you interact with her so she doesn’t feel lonely. I’m with my bun 24/7 so it’s different. Goodluck and I hope your bun bun starts using his potty!


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## Preitler (Jun 9, 2021)

peanutdabunny said:


> Here what I recommend doing
> 1. Dont get Kaytee hay
> 2. don't get small pet select food, they have soy and grains which slow down the urinary and GI tract, which can cause problems later in life. Like stasis and sluge
> 3. if you get a loft bed. watch stormy rabbits on youtube and build a cage-like theirs.


 1. Why?
2. Wrong.


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## BinkyLouie (Jun 9, 2021)

BunbunBannana said:


> Thank you! I plan on letting the bunny roam around my room all day, and have them inside their cage at night.


That sounds like a great plan 
Goodluck!


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## BinkyLouie (Jun 9, 2021)

Preitler said:


> 1. Why?
> 2. Wrong.


I don’t understand what’s wrong with kaytee hay.. I haven’t had a problem with it. I’m not sure about the sps pellets because I haven’t looked at them or bought them. I know about sps because of Lennon the bunny and she wouldn’t recommend it if it was gonna hurt the bunny. SHES such a bunny nerd and you can tell based off her videos but I think everything SPS is great expect for the price. I wouldn’t buy but I do recommend!


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## BinkyLouie (Jun 9, 2021)

Preitler said:


> A lot of that discussion about how much space or whatnot a rabbit needs is not so much about rabbits, but about what people would like to see if they had a say. That's fine as long as this is the bases for what they themself do (which isn't always the case, but what they would like to do), or suggestions about what other people with the same attitude towards pets are happy with, but get's problematic when it's all about telling other people what to do based on opinion and preferences, not so much facts.
> 
> There are quite some different ways to keep and feed rabbits that are imo ok, it's not rocket science, everyone needs to find his own working compromise - I sometimes get the feeling that there is quite an inflation of demands getting flaunted around.
> 
> Anyway, since you said that you've friends with rabbits I would think it would be a good idea to spend some thime there, just to help getting an idea about what you want, and how rabbits work as pets. Only knew one rat briefly, and that was a little different, liked being toted around in my friends hoody and so.


I just read your message did I get something wrong?


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## Preitler (Jun 9, 2021)

BinkyLouie said:


> on’t understand what’s wrong with kaytee hay.. I haven’t had a problem with it. I’m not sure about the sps pellets because I haven’t looked at them or bought them. I know about sps because of Lennon the bunny and she wouldn’t recommend it if it was gonna hurt the bunny. SHES such a bunny nerd and you can tell based off her videos but I think everything SPS is great expect for the price. I wouldn’t buy but I do recommend!




That's the point about my previous post, about personal opinions thrown around as knowledgeable advise...

Lennon is kinda red flag for me. In german, there is a saying, "Das Gegenteil von gut ist gut gemeint", "The opposite of good is well-meant"....


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## BinkyLouie (Jun 9, 2021)

Preitler said:


> That's the point about my previous post, about personal opinions thrown around as knowledgeable advise...
> 
> Lennon is kinda red flag for me. In german, there is a saying, "Das Gegenteil von gut ist gut gemeint", "The opposite of good is well-meant"....


Really! Why is that? I feel like she’s a really good rabbit owner. I mean if her rabbit is alive and well and happy shouldn’t that encourage people to look at her channel. Plus there aren’t a lot of rabbit channels that are any better. I feel like there’s a lot of inexperienced YouTube’s who just buy rabbits and then they die within a month or a few days. Sad to see. Anyways, she just has a strong look on cages. DOESNT like them and I agree. No rabbit should be caged. If it’s an xpen(she even says herself) it’s great just as long as it’s a good area. I think she makes herself very clear.


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## Blue eyes (Jun 9, 2021)

Lennon the Bunny has had some questionable advice. She is sponsored, which means she is getting paid to promote items--- never a good mix. And from what I can tell (last I looked), it appears she is basing all of her "experience" on a single rabbit she's had. Those of us who have had many rabbits over many years have, I think, a better understanding of just how different each rabbit can be. So while she does have quite a bit of good advice, it is not all roses.


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## BunbunBannana (Jun 9, 2021)

Thank you! I personally love lennons care vids, But I will be aware of wha yall said. Also I'm going shopping rn for same supplies. I am leaving for a vacation for a month, but when I come bach, I can get the bunnies!


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## BunbunBannana (Jun 9, 2021)

PET SHOP HAUL!


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## peanutdabunny (Jun 9, 2021)

Most of that stuff looks good. Not the harness though. It can break the rabbit's back/spine. If you want more information on that go watch My Pawfect Family. 
The reason Lennon the bunny is not the best is because...
She only has one rabbit and she doesn't promote getting 2
She takes her bunny into places with a ton of people, which can stress bunnies out
Since she takes her bunny into public places it encourages others to do it, leaving bunnies scared
She promotes taking her bunny to a pet store (don't do this because of all the dogs barking and the different smells, It will freak your rabbit out)
She promotes closed litter boxes which can lead to respiratory issues in your rabbit. (rabbits have very sensitive lungs)
She promotes spring mix, which honesty, isn't the best for your bunny IMO, but that's another topic.
She promotes free-roaming for every bunny. Not every bunny is good with free-roaming, some are more outgoing, some are scared by a lot of things.
She promotes harness
and much more..
Dont get me wrong, she helped the rabbit community get to where it is today, but there are better channels for rabbit care
If you want information on Sherwood pellets @Preitler watch Ohio holland lops on youtube


I do not know about Kaytee hay, I just know Katyee as a company is terrible! They sell bad treats and unhealthy toys.
Kaytee adds fillers to there toys in treats with tons of sweeteners. They also have inhumane breeding farms for birds. They also sell yogert drops, which are extremely unhealthy for rabbits. They include dairy, which any small pet CANNOT eat.

Rabbit Food Comparision - Brand, Type, Nutritional Analysis 
I would read that for the food comparison, it shows why SPS food is not the best. For Sherwood on that list, they changed their formula, so it is better and does not include alfalfa.
"
Kaytee pellets are heavy on corn. Corn is a low quality ingredient that encourages fat storage. That's why it's fed to cattle for the fat marbling effect in the meat. An oil is even used to make the fat potential worse. Given the short ingredients list aside from majority of it being corn there is also a lot of molasses and salt. Ethoxyquin is dangerous to the point it is not allowed in human food and I believe not for feeding to several animals used as human food. That is pretty much all that makes up this food. The rest is a multivitamin/mineral mix you could go buy for any type of animal. As pointed out the mix may not even be suitable for more specific guinea pig needs like calcium if we were to look at the nutritional analysis. Vit c in these cheaper foods also tends to be less stable and less guaranteed to meet guinea pig needs. The supreme diet pellets contain fish meal. Meat most definitely does not belong in guinea pig food. Fish not intended for human use is already treated with ethoxyquin before transport.

Overall kaytee has just proven over and over again that they value cheap materials for a higher profit over health of peoples' pets. The ingredient quality is always up for question even in the ingredient that seem ok on paper and many of their other products are downright dangerous." - source ( General Why is Kaytee such a bad brand?. )

Gack! I bragged about Kaytee hay the other day, but I'm halfway through my last bag and the hay in the middle is awful. The other bags were fine, and this one looked fine from the outside. You never can tell completely, no matter what the brand, since you can't see what the whole bag looks like. Still, I usually do find with being picky and choosing bags that look green and fresh from the outside. -(source is the same)


manda said:


> make sure you do the change very gradually. i honestly dont think this is the best food for them tho. kaytee is widely known as crap. but i dont know





bunny34422 said:


> I've seen some people from the HRS Facebook group say that they avoid Kaytee because a lot of their products are not the best for rabbits. Does this include their chew-a-bowl? I'm going to assume yes because ingredients include potato starch and honey?





bunbunbaby said:


> I bought a bag of Kaytee Timothy Hay for my bunsand when I opened it I even thought to myself it looked and feltdifferent than usual. I can't explain the difference but my rabbitshave not put a dent in thebag. The same hay I put down in themorning is still there in the night. They are eating pellets and freshveggies but I know how important the hay is. Do you think the petstorewould take it back?





Bo B Bunny said:


> I've heard of people getting MOLDY hay and then old hay and having found things in their hay.
> 
> I buy oxbow and it's always good if I get it from a good petstore or the vet. I can order it as well.
> 
> ...





dajeti2 said:


> I actually quit using the Kaytee. It wasalways dry and always brown...always yucky.I realized I wasthrowing money away. I lucked out and found a farmer. I now pay next tonothing for a square bale of fresh Timothy. I love that it's so freshand Apollo just plain loves it. I don't think I will buy store boughtany more.
> 
> Tina





babybunnywrigley said:


> I didn't even realize how bad the hay I wasgetting for Wrigley was until I ordered Oxbow hay and it was actuallygreen! :shock: lol
> 
> Jenn





alicia ganitano said:


> Hi everyone I too has had a lot of problems with timothy hay KAYTEE brand. I buy them at petsmart store in Tsawwassen BRITISH Columbia Canada and this has been going on for a month I have actually had returned 2 bags the last two weeks because the manufacturer is cheating they put some nice ones only on the top but if you go through the bag its all dust *m not feeding my bunny with dust.
> 
> The store manager and the racist staff is hesitant to do the return. Someone assisted me for the return and gave me my money back. I tried to buy one bag the wayfair cut whip is better than the last two bags that I returned, however, it has this awful odor.
> 
> ...





hasek39 said:


> There's ALL kinds of red flags in there. I wouldn't give that guano to LB. It'd go right in the trash.
> 
> Actually, if it says Kaytee on it, I believe most any knowledged person walks the other way.


"not all are bad but the brand itself doesn't seem to know much about rabbits" -im not aloud to quote anymore haha
I would watch these channels

These people seem like they know what they are doing. So I would watch them.
https://www.youtube.com/c/TheBunnyLady/videos*** Watch like all her videos


https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCX3hqxoTdrC4hkDU-0LMrew




https://www.youtube.com/channel/UChhM7aLCMImtZoF2edIHSFQ










Hook's Hollands


Welcome to Hook's Hollands, your one-hop shop for RABBIT CARE INFORMATION & BUNNERTAINMENT since 2015! This channel will help you decide if a bunny is the ri...




www.youtube.com






https://www.youtube.com/user/101rabbits




https://www.youtube.com/user/abbysrabbitcare101



I would watch these videos




Scatter Feeding 101| The Best Way to Feed Your Rabbit| Preventing Food Aggression| MyPawfectFamily
DO RABBIT HIDES NEED MULTIPLE ENTRANCES| covered litterboxes| rabbit hide dangers| My Pawfect Family
Covered Litter Boxes For Rabbits| Potential Dangers and Why Not to Use Them| My Pawfect Family
Hoppy Hour| What is it and Should I go?| Rabbit Socialization Events| My Pawfect Family
5 RABBITS NOT SUITED TO FREE ROAM| can I freeroam my rabbit| free roam rabbits| My Pawfect Family
WANT A SECOND RABBIT... NOW WHAT?| preparing for a bunny| second rabbit checklist| My Pawfect Family
RABBIT PROOFING DOESN'T WORK| truth about rabbit proofing| freeroaming myths| MyPawfectFamily

For bonding watch these videos
Bonding Rabbits *What no one tells you*
FIGHTING RABBITS *why they fight and what to do about it*
STOP BUYING SINGLE RABBITS| why you shouldn't have 1 bunny| bonding rabbits |MyPawfectFamily
Can Rabbits Live Alone| Bonded Pairs vs Single Rabbits| Should I Get a Second Bunny| MyPawfectFamily
HOW TO BOND RABBITS | Bonding my all male trio


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## BunbunBannana (Jun 9, 2021)

BinkyLouie said:


> I don’t understand what’s wrong with kaytee hay.. I haven’t had a problem with it. I’m not sure about the sps pellets because I haven’t looked at them or bought them. I know about sps because of Lennon the bunny and she wouldn’t recommend it if it was gonna hurt the bunny. SHES such a bunny nerd and you can tell based off her videos but I think everything SPS is great expect for the price. I wouldn’t buy but I do recommend!





BinkyLouie said:


> I just read your message did I get something wrong?





Preitler said:


> That's the point about my previous post, about personal opinions thrown around as knowledgeable advise...
> 
> Lennon is kinda red flag for me. In german, there is a saying, "Das Gegenteil von gut ist gut gemeint", "The opposite of good is well-meant"....





BinkyLouie said:


> Really! Why is that? I feel like she’s a really good rabbit owner. I mean if her rabbit is alive and well and happy shouldn’t that encourage people to look at her channel. Plus there aren’t a lot of rabbit channels that are any better. I feel like there’s a lot of inexperienced YouTube’s who just buy rabbits and then they die within a month or a few days. Sad to see. Anyways, she just has a strong look on cages. DOESNT like them and I agree. No rabbit should be caged. If it’s an xpen(she even says herself) it’s great just as long as it’s a good area. I think she makes herself very clear.





Blue eyes said:


> Lennon the Bunny has had some questionable advice. She is sponsored, which means she is getting paid to promote items--- never a good mix. And from what I can tell (last I looked), it appears she is basing all of her "experience" on a single rabbit she's had. Those of us who have had many rabbits over many years have, I think, a better understanding of just how different each rabbit can be. So while she does have quite a bit of good advice, it is not all roses.





peanutdabunny said:


> Most of that stuff looks good. Not the harness though. It can break the rabbit's back/spine. If you want more information on that go watch My Pawfect Family.
> The reason Lennon the bunny is not the best is because...
> She only has one rabbit and she doesn't promote getting 2
> She takes her bunny into places with a ton of people, which can stress bunnies out
> ...



thanks!


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## BinkyLouie (Jun 9, 2021)

BunbunBannana said:


> thanks!


I think those things are great that you bought her. Have you seen those willow balls? Those my rabbit loves lol I would see if your rabbit likes those as it is basically a twig rabbits like to chew on that stuff. If you want to buy a harness you can I would just be careful when your rabbit runs because it can possibly hurt them so if you can maybe attach a long lace so they can run without being held back in your yard or wherever. I just WOULDNT use the harness to take them out for a walk in the sidewalk or the park. Only do it in your backyard or front yard where there is grass. They will enjoy dandelions and the grass.


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## BunbunBannana (Jun 9, 2021)

BinkyLouie said:


> I think those things are great that you bought her. Have you seen those willow balls? Those my rabbit loves lol I would see if your rabbit likes those as it is basically a twig rabbits like to chew on that stuff. If you want to buy a harness you can I would just be careful when your rabbit runs because it can possibly hurt them so if you can maybe attach a long lace so they can run without being held back in your yard or wherever. I just WOULDNT use the harness to take them out for a walk in the sidewalk or the park. Only do it in your backyard or front yard where there is grass. They will enjoy dandelions and the grass.


I only plan on using in the yard, at rabbitdates,and bunnyfests


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## BinkyLouie (Jun 9, 2021)

BunbunBannana said:


> I only plan on using in the yard, at rabbitdates,and bunnyfests


Yard sounds good and so does the rabbit dates. I would just be careful about how your rabbit acts around other bunnies. Just keep that in mind I would research that or ask someone about that. What do you mean by bunny fests?


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## BunbunBannana (Jun 9, 2021)

BinkyLouie said:


> Yard sounds good and so does the rabbit dates. I would just be careful about how your rabbit acts around other bunnies. Just keep that in mind I would research that or ask someone about that. What do you mean by bunny fests?


Its basicly a huge party where people bring there buns, sell hay, food toys, etc


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## BinkyLouie (Jun 9, 2021)

BunbunBannana said:


> Its basicly a huge party where people bring there buns, sell hay, food toys, etc


Oh wow! That’s interesting. Well, I’m not sure about that situation.. maybe you should ask what the others think


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## peanutdabunny (Jun 9, 2021)

Thats another reason why I dont love Lennon the bunny,
she promotes Bunfest. I WOULD NOT go to Bunfest, your bunny could get sick,(from other bunnies, can get RHDV2 which is fatal in rabbits) stressed, and even pass away of shock. It could hurt another bunny, or another bunny could hurt your bunny. It seems like you want a social animal that you can take to see other social animals, I would get a dog.

edit: Please don't take your bunny on bunny dates, unless you plan to bond them. It can break your bond, cause fights, get your rabbits sick, send your rabbits into GI stais, lose your rabbits trust, among a host of other things. I think a rabbit is not the best pet per say for your living situation


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## BinkyLouie (Jun 9, 2021)

peanutdabunny said:


> Thats another reason why I dont love Lennon the bunny,
> she promotes Bunfest. I WOULD NOT go to Bunfest, your bunny could get sick,(from other bunnies, can get RHDV2 which is fatal in rabbits) stressed, and even pass away of shock. It could hurt another bunny, or another bunny could hurt your bunny. It seems like you want a social animal that you can take to see other social animals, I would get a dog.


Yeah I agree with this. You can go the bunfest by yourself but I wouldn’t recommend taking your honey with you. I think it would be difficult for her to deal with everything.


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## BunbunBannana (Jun 9, 2021)

BinkyLouie said:


> Yard sounds good and so does the rabbit dates. I would just be careful about how your rabbit acts around other bunnies. Just keep that in mind I would research that or ask someone about that. What do you mean by bunny fests?





peanutdabunny said:


> Thats another reason why I dont love Lennon the bunny,
> she promotes Bunfest. I WOULD NOT go to Bunfest, your bunny could get sick,(from other bunnies, can get RHDV2 which is fatal in rabbits) stressed, and even pass away of shock. It could hurt another bunny, or another bunny could hurt your bunny. It seems like you want a social animal that you can take to see other social animals, I would get a dog.
> 
> edit: Please don't take your bunny on bunny dates, unless you plan to bond them. It can break your bond, cause fights, get your rabbits sick, send your rabbits into GI stais, lose your rabbits trust, among a host of other things. I think a rabbit is not the best pet per say for your living situation





BinkyLouie said:


> Yeah I agree with this. You can go the bunfest by yourself but I wouldn’t recommend taking your honey with you. I think it would be difficult for her to deal with everything.


Ok no bunny fest or bunnydates


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## Oceanie (Jun 10, 2021)

peanutdabunny said:


> lennon the bunny



I would be cautious with Lennon the Bunny. She does have good advice & tips, but she is also quite biased. Lennon has been raised as a kit and is rigorously trained in a way that many rabbits aren't. Lorelai (the host) hasn't necessarily had the experience of owning multiple rabbits, so the advice she gives is mainly based off of her experience with Lennon, which is much different from that of a typical pet rabbit


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## BunBun71 (Jun 10, 2021)

BinkyLouie said:


> Hi, kaytee hay ISNT all that bad. Actually if you get the wafer cut Timothy hay from kaytee it comes with layers of strands. I’ve had a good experience so far buying that specific hay from and I apologize if it’s different for you. Let me snap a pic for you! Also I bought my bun two bags of this and I still haven’t finished one. I’ve had one bag for about 1-3 weeks. It’s a good money saver. About small pet select.. the hay is good it’s excellent but it’s kind of pricy. Mostly everything is there so I decided to just buy that hay I just showed you.


I still don't think it is good. I could be completely wrong. I think if you get a cheep price then it sometimes is not good. We will see what happens with your bunny the next few weeks. (Not saying something will happen)


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## Preitler (Jun 10, 2021)

BunBun71 said:


> I still don't think it is good. I could be completely wrong. I think if you get a cheep price then it sometimes is not good. We will see what happens with your bunny the next few weeks. (Not saying something will happen)


 You can pay a lot of money for utterly crap in many pet shops, price doesn't say it all. It's just about what people can be convinced to pay with good marketing


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## BunBun71 (Jun 10, 2021)

Preitler said:


> You can pay a lot of money for utterly crap in many pet shops, price doesn't say it all. It's just about what people can be convinced to pay with good marketing


True


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## peanutdabunny (Jun 10, 2021)

I would also like to add that my bun came from a rescue mission from the omish. So he was skitish at first, but now he is kind and sweet, loves to give kisses and sit on my lap. (I didnt rescue him, the rescue I got him from did)


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## peanutdabunny (Jun 10, 2021)

Most of that stuff looks good. Not the harness though. It can break the rabbit's back/spine. If you want more information on that go watch My Pawfect Family.
The reason Lennon the bunny is not the best is because...
She only has one rabbit and she doesn't promote getting 2
She takes her bunny into places with a ton of people, which can stress bunnies out
Since she takes her bunny into public places it encourages others to do it, leaving bunnies scared
She promotes taking her bunny to a pet store (don't do this because of all the dogs barking and the different smells, It will freak your rabbit out)
She promotes closed litter boxes which can lead to respiratory issues in your rabbit. (rabbits have very sensitive lungs)
She promotes spring mix, which honesty, isn't the best for your bunny IMO, but that's another topic.
She promotes free-roaming for every bunny. Not every bunny is good with free-roaming, some are more outgoing, some are scared by a lot of things.
She promotes harness
and much more..
Dont get me wrong, she helped the rabbit community get to where it is today, but there are better channels for rabbit care
If you want information on Sherwood pellets @Preitler watch Ohio holland lops on youtube


I do not know about Kaytee hay, I just know Katyee as a company is terrible! They sell bad treats and unhealthy toys.
Kaytee adds fillers to there toys in treats with tons of sweeteners. They also have inhumane breeding farms for birds. They also sell yogert drops, which are extremely unhealthy for rabbits. They include dairy, which any small pet CANNOT eat.

Rabbit Food Comparision - Brand, Type, Nutritional Analysis 
I would read that for the food comparison, it shows why SPS food is not the best. For Sherwood on that list, they changed their formula, so it is better and does not include alfalfa.
"
Kaytee pellets are heavy on corn. Corn is a low quality ingredient that encourages fat storage. That's why it's fed to cattle for the fat marbling effect in the meat. An oil is even used to make the fat potential worse. Given the short ingredients list aside from majority of it being corn there is also a lot of molasses and salt. Ethoxyquin is dangerous to the point it is not allowed in human food and I believe not for feeding to several animals used as human food. That is pretty much all that makes up this food. The rest is a multivitamin/mineral mix you could go buy for any type of animal. As pointed out the mix may not even be suitable for more specific guinea pig needs like calcium if we were to look at the nutritional analysis. Vit c in these cheaper foods also tends to be less stable and less guaranteed to meet guinea pig needs. The supreme diet pellets contain fish meal. Meat most definitely does not belong in guinea pig food. Fish not intended for human use is already treated with ethoxyquin before transport.

Overall kaytee has just proven over and over again that they value cheap materials for a higher profit over health of peoples' pets. The ingredient quality is always up for question even in the ingredient that seem ok on paper and many of their other products are downright dangerous." - source ( General Why is Kaytee such a bad brand?. )

Gack! I bragged about Kaytee hay the other day, but I'm halfway through my last bag and the hay in the middle is awful. The other bags were fine, and this one looked fine from the outside. You never can tell completely, no matter what the brand, since you can't see what the whole bag looks like. Still, I usually do find with being picky and choosing bags that look green and fresh from the outside. -(source is the same)








"not all are bad but the brand itself doesn't seem to know much about rabbits" -im not aloud to quote anymore haha
I would watch these channels

These people seem like they know what they are doing. So I would watch them.
https://www.youtube.com/c/TheBunnyLady/videos*** Watch like all her videos


https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCX3hqxoTdrC4hkDU-0LMrew




https://www.youtube.com/channel/UChhM7aLCMImtZoF2edIHSFQ










Hook's Hollands


Welcome to Hook's Hollands, your one-hop shop for RABBIT CARE INFORMATION & BUNNERTAINMENT since 2015! This channel will help you decide if a bunny is the ri...




www.youtube.com






https://www.youtube.com/user/101rabbits




https://www.youtube.com/user/abbysrabbitcare101



I would watch these videos





Scatter Feeding 101| The Best Way to Feed Your Rabbit| Preventing Food Aggression| MyPawfectFamily

DO RABBIT HIDES NEED MULTIPLE ENTRANCES| covered litterboxes| rabbit hide dangers| My Pawfect Family

Covered Litter Boxes For Rabbits| Potential Dangers and Why Not to Use Them| My Pawfect Family

Hoppy Hour| What is it and Should I go?| Rabbit Socialization Events| My Pawfect Family

5 RABBITS NOT SUITED TO FREE ROAM| can I freeroam my rabbit| free roam rabbits| My Pawfect Family

WANT A SECOND RABBIT... NOW WHAT?| preparing for a bunny| second rabbit checklist| My Pawfect Family

RABBIT PROOFING DOESN'T WORK| truth about rabbit proofing| freeroaming myths| MyPawfectFamily

For bonding watch these videos
Bonding Rabbits *What no one tells you*

FIGHTING RABBITS *why they fight and what to do about it*

STOP BUYING SINGLE RABBITS| why you shouldn't have 1 bunny| bonding rabbits |MyPawfectFamily

Can Rabbits Live Alone| Bonded Pairs vs Single Rabbits| Should I Get a Second Bunny| MyPawfectFamily

HOW TO BOND RABBITS | Bonding my all male trio

@Preitler Did you see my thing on Soy and Grains? Quote above shows all my info + sources


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## BunBun71 (Jun 10, 2021)

Did you make those videos?


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## BunBun71 (Jun 10, 2021)

I did not read all this so sorry if you said


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## peanutdabunny (Jun 10, 2021)

no I wish I did though! These people have had rabbits for years, and have done tons of research on them. They all have their flaws, but doesnt everyone?


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## BunBun71 (Jun 10, 2021)

peanutdabunny said:


> no I wish I did though! These people have had rabbits for years, and have done tons of research on them. They all have their flaws, but doesnt everyone?


I have a YouTube channel


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## BinkyLouie (Jun 10, 2021)

BunBun71 said:


> I still don't think it is good. I could be completely wrong. I think if you get a cheep price then it sometimes is not good. We will see what happens with your bunny the next few weeks. (Not saying something will happen)


Not necessarily cheap.. it’s 20 bucks. He’s been feeding off of this hay since he was small. I haven’t seen any problems and he loves the hay. I just wanna put it out there that if you want good hay you have to go far for it. I live in a city. I’m a city girl and things are limited here. If I want good hay I have to go get bale from a horse place that sells it for a good price but it’s hella far and it’s 100 pounds. All those places are far. Plus sps is overpriced for the hay. As long as my rabbit is happy and I see there are no problems I’m gonna keep buying it. I see your concern about kaytee and I understand but remember that I only buy their hay and not anything else they sell because I believe they aren’t good sellers of anything else. Plus the hay it’s green and may have some brown strands but it doesn’t mean it’s not gonna provide him what he needs.I appreciate you telling me.


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## Blue eyes (Jun 10, 2021)

BinkyLouie said:


> If you want to buy a harness you can I would just be careful when your rabbit runs because it can possibly hurt them so if you can maybe attach a long lace so they can run without being held back in your yard or wherever. I just WOULDNT use the harness to take them out for a walk in the sidewalk or the park. Only do it in your backyard or front yard where there is grass. They will enjoy dandelions and the grass.





BunbunBannana said:


> I only plan on using in the yard, at rabbitdates,and bunnyfests





BinkyLouie said:


> Yard sounds good and so does the rabbit dates.



The harness in the photo is a vest/velcro harness which is not advised. The only safe harnesses are the H-style harnesses. Only some rabbits will take to a harness anyway. If you want to take a rabbit out in the yard, then it's better to just set up an exercise pen (or build a safe run). Rabbits don't play like dogs so rabbit playdates are not advised either. 

If you are in an area with the RHVD2 outbreak, then a rabbit should not be going outside period. The outbreak is another reason not to allow your rabbit to interact with other rabbits. 

Here are a couple links for threads on this forum discussing harnessing:
http://www.rabbitsonline.net/f14/harnesses-76866/ 

http://www.rabbitsonline.net/f14/questions-about-collars-harnesses-78859/

This page discusses some of the considerations for deciding when and how (or if) to take your rabbit outdoors -- either in the yard, or elsewhere:








Bringing Outside?


[ Tablet users, try the "web" version by clicking on "web" at the bottom of this page for a better, user-friendly format . ]



rabbitsindoors.weebly.com


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## peanutdabunny (Jun 10, 2021)

Should they be eatung things from outside if you have an outbreak near you? @Blue eyes


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## BinkyLouie (Jun 10, 2021)

Blue eyes said:


> The harness in the photo is a vest/velcro harness which is not advised. The only safe harnesses are the H-style harnesses. Only some rabbits will take to a harness anyway. If you want to take a rabbit out in the yard, then it's better to just set up an exercise pen (or build a safe run). Rabbits don't play like dogs so rabbit playdates are not advised either.
> 
> If you are in an area with the RHVD2 outbreak, then a rabbit should not be going outside period. The outbreak is another reason not to allow your rabbit to interact with other rabbits.
> 
> ...


Agreed!


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## Blue eyes (Jun 10, 2021)

peanutdabunny said:


> Should they be eatung things from outside if you have an outbreak near you? @Blue eyes


No. They shouldn't be outside at all if there is an outbreak near you.


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## peanutdabunny (Jun 10, 2021)

They said they were in the bay area. There has been an outbreak in the bay area in 2020. (in wild rabbits it was deteced) So, *DONT TAKE THE BUNNY OUTSIDE. *You shouldnt let your bunny eat the grass either, vacciented or not

*Source*








“New” Rabbit Virus Reaches Southern California - Bay Area Bird & Exotics Hospital







www.birdandexoticsvet.com


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## BunbunBannana (Jun 10, 2021)

ok plan is
Buy all supplies and set up
get 2 bunnies
leave them alone for 12-24h, then start letting them run in my room and bond
after a week, allow them to free roam all day.
feed them to a good alpha alpha based food (instead of the crapthe will probably be fed) (what is better, small pet select or oxbow) also should I feed unlimited food for babies?
Feed them unlimited hay and clean the litter box once a day.
Vaccinate and neuter
add veggies once they turn 3 months


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## BinkyLouie (Jun 10, 2021)

BunbunBannana said:


> ok plan is
> Buy all supplies and set up
> get 2 bunnies
> leave them alone for 12-24h, then start letting them run in my room and bond
> ...


You don’t need to get 2 bunnies if you don’t want to. It’s not really necessary because they have you but IF you want to you can! Don’t feel pressured. Ummm, you can figure out whether you want sps or oxbow.. I’ve heard bad things about both but I think it depends on the batch you get from them. I fed my bun bun unlimited pellets when he was younger but usually he ate 1/4 of a cup of alfalfa pellets twice a day. If I were you I would clean the litter box not super fast because then you’d be wasting a bunch of litter/bedding and the hay because they probably won’t eat a lot. You’ll know when it’s time to clean the litter box when it stinks or it’s heavier so.. yeah. And yes vaccinate and neuter/spay the buns. You can introduce veggies at three months but don’t feed them loads you have to give them a little bit because you won’t know they’ll react to it. Usually people don’t feed veggies to rabbits when they’re younger if anything I’ve seen that they wait till they’re older but what they told me is I could feed 1/2 of a cup to my bun. He gets two cups now since he is older but I think when I asked for advice he was around 4 months. Just watch your bunnies when they eat veggies. That is the advice I would give you. Im not sure what everyone else will say. When you look at the hay brands and look at the reviews and the description so you can see whether that hay is perfect for them.


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## peanutdabunny (Jun 10, 2021)

It seems like you really are a lennon the bunny fan @BinkyLouie. She should get 2 bunnies and 2 adult bunnies at that.
I would get selective science for the food. unlimited till 5 months. Start feeding veggies at 6 months. Dont let the bunnies outside. You need them to get vaccinedted every year.


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## John Wick (Jun 10, 2021)

BunbunBannana said:


> ok plan is
> Buy all supplies and set up
> get 2 bunnies
> leave them alone for 12-24h, then start letting them run in my room and bond
> ...


Be aware that if you get two rabbits, based on the plan you've outlined they need to be already bonded rabbits. This does not mean two young sibling rabbits-- this means two rabbits who are both already spayed/neutered and have been intentionally bonded by someone so it is safe for them to be together unsupervised.


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## BinkyLouie (Jun 10, 2021)

peanutdabunny said:


> It seems like you really are a lennon the bunny fan @BinkyLouie. She should get 2 bunnies and 2 adult bunnies at that.
> I would get selective science for the food. unlimited till 5 months. Start feeding veggies at 6 months. Dont let the bunnies outside. You need them to get vaccinedted every year.


I’m not? I literally only have watched her for the litter box video.. you really shouldn’t be assuming things about people. You seem really bossy about things and I think you should provide advice but let her decide what she wants for her bunny? YOURE honestly making it more complicated than needed. I would understand getting 2 rabbits for an owner who won’t be home 24/7 or won’t be interacting with them 24/7 but if you are going to there’s no need for it. Especially when you’re gonna be spending double n stuff..


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## BinkyLouie (Jun 10, 2021)

John Wick said:


> Be aware that if you get two rabbits, based on the plan you've outlined they need to be already bonded rabbits. This does not mean two young sibling rabbits-- this means two rabbits who are both already spayed/neutered and have been intentionally bonded by someone so it is safe for them to be together unsupervised.


It seems like her plan would work more for a single rabbit huh? I would assume it’s hard for people to bond rabbits especially if you don’t know how they will react to eachother.


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## peanutdabunny (Jun 10, 2021)

Thats why she should be getting a bonded pair. Especially as a first time owner. The bunnies will not act the same as when they were babies.

Edit: She should be getting her first bunnies from a rescue, or at least fostering.


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## BunbunBannana (Jun 10, 2021)

John Wick said:


> Be aware that if you get two rabbits, based on the plan you've outlined they need to be already bonded rabbits. This does not mean two young sibling rabbits-- this means two rabbits who are both already spayed/neutered and have been intentionally bonded by someone so it is safe for them to be together unsupervised.





BinkyLouie said:


> I’m not? I literally only have watched her for the litter box video.. you really shouldn’t be assuming things about people. You seem really bossy about things and I think you should provide advice but let her decide what she wants for her bunny? YOURE honestly making it more complicated than needed. I would understand getting 2 rabbits for an owner who won’t be home 24/7 or won’t be interacting with them 24/7 but if you are going to there’s no need for it. Especially when you’re gonna be spending double n stuff..





BinkyLouie said:


> It seems like her plan would work more for a single rabbit huh? I would assume it’s hard for people to bond rabbits especially if you don’t know how they will react to eachother.


Yeah, I think I will go with one rabbit... I thought they could be together as siblings. I think after I have my rabbit fixed I will bond him...


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## BunbunBannana (Jun 10, 2021)

Also thank you, everyone, for your tips and advice SM!


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## Ashrocks92 (Jun 10, 2021)

Mac189 said:


> I would HIGHLY recommend spaying and neutering, it tends to greatly improve rabbits' general behavior, prevents conditions that could crop up later in life, and is necessary if you were ever to consider getting a second rabbit as a bond. I tend to feel that the earlier you can get it done, the better. While you don't HAVE to spay or neuter, it will make you and your rabbit's life much easier in the long and short term, with few reasons not to.
> 
> In the US there aren't very many vaccines available for rabbits yet, but when the RHV2 vaccine does become available you should get it, always better to be safe than sorry.


True Oreo is fixed now and he acts different in a different way love him


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## Ashrocks92 (Jun 10, 2021)

Madelyn L. said:


> I use care fresh rabbit litter. It works well for me


Thank you very much


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## Cinn-a-bun (Jun 11, 2021)

I would return that water/food bowl too.
You are going to be pulling hay, Pellets, Leafy Greens out of it all day long.
You will be removing food from one side in order to clean the water size. Just tooooo much work!
I have three bowls: one each for, Water, Leafy Green, Pellets (and a very cute little basket for Hay) Have a bigger basket of hay for her to eat out of. Bowls are attached to cardboard with command tabs. See the I re full it many times a day.


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## Cinn-a-bun (Jun 11, 2021)

Cute little basket


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## skipidragon (May 10, 2022)

peanutdabunny said:


> RHDV2 is a deadly diease no cure. I saw lennon the bunny get the vaccine in LA. If you are going to give your bunny grass I reccommend getting the vacciene. It is spread through insects and wild rabbits.


Yep my girl gets her booster in August. I've already started saving up.


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