# Bunny lost his balance - HELP



## bunnymama (Nov 11, 2004)

Hi, This is a great website. I just discovered it thanks to someone from another website 

Cadbury is a dutch bunny, who is 3 years old. Yesterday he started to fall over, lose his balance when he walks. So I took him to the vet right away. The vet took swabs of his ear, and said it was normal, and gave him Baytril, but didn't give me an explanation or cause...

Today he isn't doing much better, won't eat, drink, or use the litterbox, he also has a lack of energy... I hate seeing him like this. 

I calledthe vet backand she told me they want to do an X-ray of his brain to determine if he has problems in his inner or middle ear if that's why he is losing his balance, and possible surgery.

Someone from anothersitementioned it could be wry neck. I have looked this up onlineand yes my bunny is showing some symptoms but not all. Like I said it started yesterday, and I hope it won't get worse. 

Has anyone experienced this problem with their bunny? What suggestions do you have for me?

Thanks a lot!


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## Gabby (Nov 11, 2004)

http://hometown.aol.com/savagerabbit/Brice.html

If you have any questions about brice's battle with his inner earinfectionplease feel free to ask, either in the message or byPM.

I posted a link to a page about one my buns who had an inner earinfection. The problem with head tilt is it can be caused bymany things, and they need to be ruled out to help solve what iscausing the reaction. It could be leisions on the brain, adeep inner ear infection, (at first my buns inner ear infection onlyshowed up on radiographs it was a week before you could see i bylooking into his ear) a parasite, or a disease, or even astroke. Fiding out what has caused it, will help decide whatit should be treated with. 

My Bun brice did not respond to baytril we had to use another drug. itis very importain to be sure you bun stays hydrated andeating. Watch the poops to be sure your bun is pooing ok. And make sureyour bun is drinking. Buns who have a head tilt quite often don't eator drink as wel, because they have a hard time holding them selves longenough in the possisition o do so. plus I believe the just don't feellike eating from feeling "dizzy". 

I would try keeping him very comfy, prop him up with blankets and ortowels if need be, and keep that bun hydrated. Wry neck is really onlya symptom of something else wrong in the bunny's system. mybest to you and your bun


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## pamnock (Nov 11, 2004)

Parasites can also be a cause. I've hadsome luck treating rabbits with Ivermectin (horse wormer).Steroids and antibiotics are also sometimes used in treatment.

The following website gives further info on causes:

http://www.rabbit.org/journal/3-8/head-tilt.html

As Gabby said, it's important to find the cause. Please let us know what further examinations reveal.



Pam


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## Carolyn (Nov 11, 2004)

You and Cadbury will certainly be in my thoughts and prayers, bunnymama. 

I feel so badly for you. Gabby is a great connection to make. Take herup on her advice and do check out Brice's page. It's quite an amazingstory.

-Carolyn


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## pamnock (Nov 11, 2004)

Here's another link to check out:

http://www.barbibrownsbunnies.com/ecuniculi.htm



Also, feeding your rabbit Nutri Cal or Critical Care for Herbivores canhelp your rabbit keep up his strenght to fight this illness.

Pam


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## bunnymama (Nov 12, 2004)

Thank you all so much for replying. I havevisited the sites you recommended but the only one I have not been ableto access was barbibrownsbunnies. I have printed information and I amtaking it with me to the vet this morning. I definietly will let youall know the status of the visit. 

I looked at the House Rabbit Society and found a list of recommendedvets in FL, and contacted Dr. Kelleher, who was more than happy todiscuss the conditions over the phone. She suggested that I can ask myvet to call her so they can talk about possible treatment options. Ilive in a small "city" and I am very concerned that the vet doesn'thave enough experience with rabbits. It's an inspiration that Bricemade it, and I only hope that Cadbury can make it through this.


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## pamnock (Nov 12, 2004)

Here's another link http://islandgems.net/wryneck.html

I'm not sure why Barbi Brown's site is down.

Pam


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## bunnymama (Nov 12, 2004)

Hi everyone,

I took Cadbury to the vet this morning, and I had to leave him there.The vet sedated him so they can take some x-rays and said everythinglooks normal. The vet doesn't think it's wry neck because Cadbury isn'ttilting his head as much, he's just losing his balance from time totime.

You won't believe this, at the vet's office he acts normal, likenothing is wrong and even started to eat, yet at home I can't get himto do these things... but it is evident that he lost a lot of weightbetween Wed and Fri and that's not good for a rabbit. 

Well the vet just called me back, and they want to neuter him, theythink this will help, I hope so. All of this is costing a lot of money,($220 for sedation, visit, and x-ray, plus $242 for neutering him, andon Wed I spent $90 for the visit and Baytril)especially for someone wholost her jobbecause of Hurricane Charley and hasn't receivedany money from the insurance company yet. I just want him toget better, and I only pray that the vet knows what they are doing. 

Has anyone gotten their male rabbit fixed? If so, how was the rabbit after the procedure, and how long is recovery?


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## pamnock (Nov 12, 2004)

With an undiagnosed health problem, the neuteringsurgery will only stress his system more. Now is not the timeto consider neutering. Get him on some Nutri Cal,antibiotics, medicated ear drops and Ivomec injections. Thiswill be the least expensive route for you pocket book at this time andthis general treatment will help if parasites or a bacterial infectionare involved.



Pam


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## Gabby (Nov 12, 2004)

I do not see how they think being afull male is causing this problem? And i agree with pam that with anunknown problem not is not the time to be neutering him. I am not surei would trust a vet who says, i don't know whats wrong with your rabbitbut i wanna neuter him anyways. THat is causing undue stress on a bunalready sick. he can be neutered anytime down the road, butfirst I think his illness should be treated. Goodgracious, what do they want? to get extra money out of you beforesomething horrible happens? I am not saying anything horrible willhappen, just I find the whole thing very fishy. Wishing youthe best


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## bunnymama (Nov 23, 2004)

Hi everyone,
Unfortunately I did getCadbury fixed, I had no idea what to do, the vet said this might makehim better, and I live in an area where the vets are not thatexperienced with rabbits. He recovered from the surgery, he went to thevet today to get his staples removed...

Well you all were right, along with what I suspected, the vet finallysaid oh it looks like cadbury has head tilt. I couldn'tbelieve it. I told her, yes that's what I said to you on his firstvisit in...

Now she doesn't want to treat him anymore, and is sending us to Tampa,which is like 2 hours away &amp; cad doesn't travel well, he getsstressed out just driving 20 minutes to the vet.

I read about wry neck on barbi brown's website, and it's sad, but Ineed to find a qualified vet ASAP so we can start the treatment. I amso frustrated, I just want my baby to get better.

Any ideas or hints on treatment or recovery of head tilt??? any words of advice would be a greathelp.


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## bunsforlife (Nov 23, 2004)

Sounds like one irresponsible vet... stressing the poor sick Cadbury out to make a few bucks for the neuter. 

I do wish I could offer more then my sympathy and support, but I have never had any experience with head tilt 

You and Cad are in my prayers! Keep us posted


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## Stephanie (Nov 24, 2004)

I'm so sorry you're going through this, and all I have to say is, thank god Cadbury has an owner like you who cares this much. 

I have no experience with head tilt, but if I were you I'd PM Gabby, asshe has first hand experience. Maybe you could even exchange phonenumber or something.


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## Loppy Earred Mom (Nov 24, 2004)

I think Im kind of confused.. 

The second vet that you took Cadbury too was the one that the RabbitSociety had posted? Or the 2nd vet is the first original vet you sawand could give the Rabbit Society vet suggestion a call with questionsfor inexperienced bunny vets? 

It honestly angers me that some Vets feel they can take advantage ofpeople like that but its not just vets mechanics and other places aswell. But to cause undo stress for now to a rabbit thats already sickis just so WRONG! Vets are suppose to care for the well being of youranimal not the well being of their pockets and that just sickensme. If this is the vet you got from the rabbit society page Iwould most certainly let them know about that vet via a post orsomething if its not that vet you saw on their page then Im so sorrythat Vet was so icky!

Sorry i got emotional and upset about the way you were treated by the vet its so expensive as it is. 

I sure hope Cadbury gets thru this Gabby is a good source ofinformation on head tilt I read her story and she's a very loving bunnymommy and Brice is so lucky to have such a good bunny mommy to takecare of him. 

Marie


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## Gabby (Nov 24, 2004)

*Loppy Earred Mom wrote: *


> I sure hope Cadbury gets thru this Gabby is a good source ofinformation on head tilt I read her story and she's a very loving bunnymommy and Brice is so lucky to have such a good bunny mommy to takecare of him.
> 
> Marie


you have no idea how good it is to hear something nicetoday.. i needed that..I don't like holidays things are too stressfuland hetic. At any rate

I was of the understanding the vets listed on the HRS are not"recomended vets" but just vets who have attended their conferences,and shown interest in learning about rabbits. 

Bunny Mama, like i said before feel free to ask me anything, It's adifficult thing to have to watch your bun struggle with, and i thinkanyone dealing with it needs as much support as possible, so i'm herejust remember that.


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## Loppy Earred Mom (Nov 25, 2004)

Its true Gabby When I read Brice's page I was intears! Both in sorrow for what the little guy was/is going thru andbecause of such a wonderful person as yourself that cares and loves himso much he is doing better and learning to live with his wry neck! 

It was very touching to me and even tho I haven't said much on the pageabout what went on with Brice I was still very touched by the love youshowed for him.

Your a wonderful Bunny Mommy 

Marie


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## Gabby (Nov 25, 2004)

*Loppy Earred Mom wrote:*


> Its true Gabby When I read Brice's page I was in tears! Bothin sorrow for what the little guy was/is going thru and because of sucha wonderful person as yourself that cares and loves him so much he isdoing better and learning to live with his wry neck!
> 
> It was very touching to me and even tho I haven't said much on the pageabout what went on with Brice I was still very touched by the love youshowed for him.
> 
> ...


THere are those days that it is so nice to have a lovely pickme up such as that, thank you. Brice is my wittle man, Ireally couldn't see life w/o him around, and sice he was willing tofight I was too. He is quite the trooper.


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## Delphinum (Nov 25, 2004)

I too was crying reading Brice's story.That poor little man! You're definately a person I'd like onmy side Gabby! A genuinely nice person with a heart of gold!

I hope Cadbury gets the care he needs bunnymama. It reallymakes me sick when these vets don't administer the propertreatment. You should definately complain to the practicemanager about the stress to Cadbury and also to yourself that this vethas caused.

Ang xx


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## Loppy Earred Mom (Nov 25, 2004)

With Cadbury going thru the surgery and gettingthru it while having head tilt is definitly saying how strong yourrabbit is and what a fighting spirit he has! 

Good Luck with it and please keep us posted on his condition!


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## Buck Jones (Nov 25, 2004)

*bunnymama wrote:*


> ...Any ideas or hints on treatment or recovery of headtilt??? any words of advice would be a greathelp.



We lost one bun to head tilt, so I understand your concern anddilemma. Most breeders would not spend the time/money on sucha rabbit and euthanize. The only pet owner I know who seemsto have treated their bun successfully is Gabby, as was mentionedpreviously.

Massive and continuing doses of Baytril sometimes seems toaffect an improvement in some buns, but once the medication isdiscontinued the bun often relapses into a worse than ever condition,which is what happened in our case. If that treatment is atall effective, one must consider continuing it for the rest of thebun's life. At that, our bun only came back to about 90% ofnormal while medicated.

People like the breeders Barbi Brown and one, Mr. Rick Stahl fromWashington State claim to have produced total and enduring cures, buttheir regimens are often difficult for the average pet owner toreproduce.

I also have read of a breeder who administered massive dosages ofIvermectin 1.87% horse worming paste that many of us use to treatrabbits for fur and ear mites. She had given the bun up forloss, so thought there was little to lose by riskingpoisoningthrough anoverdose ofIvermectin. Much to her surprise, she claimed the bun made acomplete recovery. I cannot account for that, other than thenature of her bun's Wry Neck or Torticollis was parasitic in nature andthe ivermectin "overdoses" effectively eradicated the protozoa

I am sorry I cannot offer more helpful advice, but it is a predicamentfor rabbit owners that doesn't seem to get the veterinarianinvestigation and research that it warrants.

Good luck and prayers for your little bun emanate from here in NJ.

Buck


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## pamnock (Nov 25, 2004)

Buck,

I have also had some surprising success using justIvermectin. I do however recommend the use of steroids andantibiotics depending on the diagnosis.

Pam


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## Bo B Bunny (Nov 25, 2004)

I know someone who's been treating her bunny fortilt. I will check with her and see what has been working....he's doing much better I know!


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## Gabby (Nov 25, 2004)

In the case of Brice, he was not responsive tobaytril, so we used another antibiotic 3 times a day. He has been medfree for 8 months now. One of my friends sent me a web site that had 3personal stories of 3 different rabbits with wry neck, Let me see if Ican find the link. She sent it to me after Brice had finished hiscource of treatment, because she needed more understanding, and thenwas "explaining to me" about Brice'scondidtion.....


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## Gabby (Nov 25, 2004)

http://fig.cox.miami.edu/Faculty/Dana/tilt.html*

*http://fig.cox.miami.edu/Faculty/Dana/Hamish.html

*http://dragonfly.cox.miami.edu/Bunz/bigblu.html*

*I don't know if these links are already on here but here ya go.*


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## bunnymama (Nov 29, 2004)

Hi everyone,

Thanks for your input and links! At this point, my vet wantsme to take Cadbury to a specialist who is board certified. Cadbury isdoing a little better, he now eats on his own, has gained some weightback, and is trying his best.I'll keepyou allposted as I find out more information. 

Thanks a lot, 

Bunnymama


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## pamnock (Nov 29, 2004)

Thank you for posting the update!

Pam


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## Carolyn (Nov 29, 2004)

Glad to hear that there was some good news, bunnymama.

Will continue prayers and thoughts of you both.





-Carolyn


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## Gabby (Nov 29, 2004)

*bunnymama wrote: *


> Hi everyone,
> 
> Thanks for your input and links! At this point, my vet wantsme to take Cadbury to a specialist who is board certified. Cadbury isdoing a little better, he now eats on his own, has gained some weightback, and is trying his best.I'll keepyou allposted as I find out more information.
> 
> ...


eating on his own and gaining weight back is a good thing. we will be thinking of you both


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## bunnymama (Dec 3, 2004)

Cadbury continues to improve, thankfully. He isstill on baytril, I give him about .5 cc every other day. He is still abit dizzy at times, but is going strong, trying very hard to recover!

I am no longer going to take him to the same vet, I honestly believeshe doesn't know anything about rabbits, and it is my belief that shehas been consulting over the phone w/ another vet... Then she tells meshe doesn't want to treat him anymore, and I should take him to the vetthat she has been consulting with.. who is in Tampa, which is 1 hr 3omins away. 

I made an appointment for Cad to see this very nice vet. I spoke withhim on the phone &amp; he explained everything, and is willing tolook at Cad, and help where he can. I will be taking Cad's entire fileand x-rays w/ me, he alos said it is not necessary to take Cad to Tampab/c that vet couldn't possible do anything different.

I will let you know how the appointment goes. It's scheduled for next week. 

Thanks everyone for being so thoughtful, concerned, and helpful  Cad &amp; I really appreciate it!


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## edwinf8936 (Dec 4, 2004)

At least your vet was consulting over the phonewhith another vet and just not wild guessing. A lot of vetswouldn't say you need to go to another vet for care.



Ed


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