# Sudden death, other rabbit not eating



## Michelledickerhoff (Dec 17, 2013)

I've had my male rabbit for 9 months I bought him when he was little, I got him fixed 3 weeks ago, so I decided to get a girl bunny! I had her for three days and she seizures and died yesterday!  all day yesterday she just sat in one spot looking all depressed she wouldn't eat she would only drink water, she was eating fine the day before, she was leaking a slimy clear stuff out of her vaginal area(I don't know if that had anything to do with it or not) I had whent to work at 345 and my boyfriend came home at 430 and she was laying on her side gasping for air then seizures and died! Now my male rabbit has not ate last night or today and is sitting in one spot looking depressed! I don't know what to do I don't know what I'd do if I lost him !! What do yu think ?


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## JBun (Dec 17, 2013)

I'm sorry about the loss of your girl bun, but you need to take your other rabbit to a rabbit vet *immediately! *Rabbits that haven't eaten for more than 12 hours, is an emergency situation. Plus because of your other rabbit dying, it's possible what she had was contagious and now your male rabbit has it.

http://www.bio.miami.edu/hare/ileus.html
http://rabbit.org/vet-listings/
http://www.rabbitsonline.net/f28/finding-vet-13366/


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## Michelledickerhoff (Dec 17, 2013)

We don't have a 24 hour emergency vet. The one that does rabbits doesn't open until 8 am! I'm so worried about him, I'm going to get him there right when they open I just hope he is okayy overnight I'm going to work on getting him to eat!


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## JBun (Dec 17, 2013)

This is a very old thread. I'm going to create a new thread for you with the same title.

Is your rabbit eating or drinking anything at all? Is he pooping at all and what does it look like? Is he showing signs of pain such as sitting hunched up and not moving around, grinding teeth, constantly changing positions and belly pressing, eye squinting, any other behavior that isn't normal for him? Is his belly bloated at all or is there loud gurgling coming from it?


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## Michelledickerhoff (Dec 17, 2013)

I'm new to this it's my first day on here so idk anything about it. I have not seen him eat since I've been home from work. If he did eat while I was gone it wasn't much. He is drinking a lot of water more than normal. All the terds I see look normal. I didn't hear any gurgling. He is sitting in one spot not moving at all unless to take a drink I have his food and water right next to him. Usually when he sits he has his feet tucked under kinda laying down, but he's pretty much just standing there with a faded look in his eyes. Not moving at all


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## Michelledickerhoff (Dec 17, 2013)

Well I was wrong about his terds, I just found one that was soft not in a ball at all!


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## JBun (Dec 17, 2013)

It's not a problem.

He's not moving because he is in pain. It's possible he has some gas pain, which can actually have very serous consequences in rabbits. You could try some infant gas relief drops(simethicone). If you have the adult kind handy, you can use that too, but it may be more difficult to administer. The infant drops you use a needleless syringe and give 1-2cc every hour for 3 hours, then every 3-8 hours as needed. Pain relief is pretty vital, but the best one for rabbits is metacam, and that is rx only. Aspirin can supposedly be used in rabbits if there is no bleeding(it's a blood thinner), but I have never used aspirin myself, so can't say for sure. Here's dosage info for it, but I don't know anything more than that. If nothing else, you can at least try the simethicone.

http://www.medirabbit.com/Safe_medication/Analgesics/safe_analgesics.htm

When a rabbit isn't eating on it's own it usually needs to be force fed. But it shouldn't be done if there is a complete blockage, and only your vet can rule that out. You could try to see if he will eat any leafy greens on his own. Rabbits that aren't feeling well, will sometimes eat these when they aren't eating their normal food. Don't feed cruciferous ones. Stick to dark leafy lettuce, cilantro, parsley, carrot greens, etc.

You can read over the ileus link, as that will give you a general idea of what is happening with your rabbit and what is needed to help your rabbit.


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## Michelledickerhoff (Dec 17, 2013)

I am going to try it and see. I just hope he pulls thru! Thank yu so much for your advice!


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## Michelledickerhoff (Dec 17, 2013)

Yu are amazing! I gave him some leafy greens and he is eating them! Thank yu


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## JBun (Dec 17, 2013)

I'm glad it worked and he's eating something. I hope he is feeling all better soon.


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## Michelledickerhoff (Dec 17, 2013)

Thank yu ..me too!


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## Imbrium (Dec 18, 2013)

I'm so sorry about your new girl dying! ray: (And really glad JBun was around to help you while I was sleeping!). Welcome to RO, by the way - I really wish we weren't meeting you under such tragic circumstances, but hopefully we can help you get through this!

Where did you get her from? Regardless of the source, I really think you should inform them about her death, as it could affect their other rabbits as well if the cause was contagious (which can't be ruled out at this point).

Unless her body has been kept cool (refrigerated but not frozen), it's most likely no longer possible for a vet to get viable tissue samples for a histeopathy but it may still be possible to determine COD from a necropsy (animal autopsy). This would be a good idea in your situation, but a necropsy is a little pricey (my vet's prices are a little on the high side ($75 exam fee) - I think it cost around $80-$100 when I got a sugar glider necropsied; it was $160ish total but a good chunk of that was the fee for the histeopathy).

If I were you, then (assuming you still have her body) I would contact the place you got her from, explain that she fell ill and died so quickly you weren't even able to get her to a vet in time, tell them you have an existing rabbit that you're concerned has been exposed if she died of something contagious and attempt to talk them into footing the bill for a necropsy (don't be afraid to be a smidge pushy while still being tactful). I don't know how good the odds are of them agreeing to pay (and can't wager a guess without knowing where you got her), but it's at least worth a shot.

If they won't cover a necropsy, I'd discuss her symptoms (and his) with your vet (and tell them the conditions her body has been kept in) first thing in the morning... I suggest calling them and specifically asking to speak with the actual vet, that way you know beforehand whether or not you should bring her body to the visit. If your vet feels very strongly that a necropsy would help them correctly diagnose and treat your male rabbit, then you might consider getting one done if you can afford it; if they don't, then I doubt it's worth the expense to you since $80 or whatever is a good bit of money.

For what it's worth, when I paid for a necropsy, it was because of very sudden, severe illness/death en-route to the emergency vet in a "pregnant" glider (they're marsupials; the joey was still in her pouch) - she had a cagemate and I had another pair of gliders living beside them, plus necropsies are considered mandatory in the glider community when a breeding glider dies inexplicably. For the average pet owner, I wouldn't consider a necropsy necessary unless the vet believes the results could help them save another pet's life.

~~~~~

As for your boy, I'm SO glad you got him to eat his veggies! You should definitely still get him checked out today, though, even if he seems to be doing better (especially in light of the sudden death).

What to expect at the vet visit:
The vet will probably prescribe metacam (for pain/discomfort) and a GI motility drug like metoclopramide (Reglan) or cisapride _[Note: drug names will probably differ if you're not in the US]_ as a precaution even if he's still eating a little.

While they won't be able to provide a definite COD unless you end up getting a necropsy done, the vet should be able to discuss the possibilities with you based on her symptoms and the swift progression and tell you whether each potential cause is communicable (as well as their likelihood of being transmitted to your rabbit).

They should also ask questions and possibly run tests to try to determine the underlying cause of the GI stasis (or pre-stasis) symptoms your male is displaying - GI stasis isn't a true diagnosis as it has MANY potential causes and, depending on what caused it, the stasis could easily reoccur if the true issue isn't addressed properly.

Depending on what they think caused your girl's seizures and death and whether they can pinpoint a cause of your boy's symptoms, the vet may recommend some sort of precautionary treatment; failing that, if her COD can't be ruled out as potentially communicable, they may be able to tell you what warning signs to watch out for in your male (while you may not have seen any in the girl prior to her seizures, that could be because there weren't any OR it could be because rabbits hide sickness well and the warning signs were so subtle that it takes a trained eye to be able to spot them).

~~~~~

As a note, it's always a good idea to quarantine (or at least isolate) a new animal that you bring home if you have an existing pet of the same species... recommended time frames vary - for sugar gliders, we always tell people 30 days; when I filled out a foster application with the SPCA, I saw that their recommendation (for all animals) is 14 days (minimum). Quarantine/isolation is always recommended even if you trust the source of the new animal AND even if they got a clean bill of health from a vet immediately before or after you got them, as something that wasn't apparent at the vet check could progress to the point of being symptomatic in the next 2-4 weeks.

_[*PLEASE* don't take that as any sort of criticism or judgment! I am not - in *any* way__ - trying to scold or lecture you for not taking the "proper" precautionary measures to prevent your other rabbit from potentially being at risk, as it's completely understandable that you didn't - in my experience, *most* people never think to quarantine or isolate a seemingly healthy new animal until someone suggests it to them and/or they have a bad experience._ _I just wanted to mention the benefits of quarantine to help you prevent something like this from ever happening again should you decide you still want to find him a companion.]

~~~~~

_Binky free, little girl :rainbow: ... and we'll be keeping your male rabbit in our thoughts, wishing for his swift recovery.


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## Imbrium (Dec 18, 2013)

While your situation truly necessitates a vet visit ASAP and it's nearly morning now anyway, I'm going to go ahead and share my usual (copy/paste) advice regarding at-home treatments for GI stasis in case you ever have to deal with it again in the future.

_*Keep in mind that, as Jenny mentioned, it's a medical emergency if a rabbit goes 8-12+ hours without eating, drinking, and/or pooping - the following options should only be used if symptoms/warning signs are spotted BEFORE the 8-12h mark; once it's been longer than that, a vet trip needs to happen *immediately*.*_



> You can buy a syringe at any grocery store. If you have critical care food (comes from vets), you can syringe feed that. If you don't, you can make a pellet slurry - take some pellets and add water or pedialyte; microwave. Let sit for 5-10 mins so the pellets can "fluff", then mix together (breaking up the pellets as much as possible); add more liquid if needed to get it to a good pudding-like consistency for syringe feeding (using a food processor (before adding liquid to the pellets), a blender or a mortar and pestle (again, before adding liquid) will make it easier to break up the pellets). Critical care will work with a syringe as-is but with the DIY slurry, you may find it necessary to cut the tip of the syringe off to make the opening larger.
> 
> You can also offer a little bit of canned pumpkin (PLAIN stuff, not the pie filling kind) and/or some fruit or squash flavored baby food... not a whole lot, as these foods are sugary - maybe 2 tsp or so. If he won't eat the pumpkin on his own, you'll need to water it down with water or pedialyte in order to easily syringe feed it. These things could also be mixed into the pellet slurry or critical care to make it tastier.
> 
> ...


Here's a great video showing how to syringe feed - [ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8iGZVYVm5Bg[/ame]



> You can also offer pain meds to make your bunny more comfortable - metacam/meloxicam if you have it (bunny painkillers); baby aspirin or low-dose aspirin if you don't. This website has dosing info for pain meds - http://www.medirabbit.com/Safe_medication/Analgesics/safe_analgesics.htm
> 
> Simethicone (any brand of over the counter baby gas medicine) can also be given. it may or may not help depending on the cause of the GI stasis, but it's *incredibly* safe for rabbits so it definitely can't hurt. You can give 1-2 cc every hour for 3h, then 1 cc every 3-8h as needed if it seems to be helping.
> 
> ...


~~~~~



> *After-hours emergencies/finding an e-vet
> *
> There's always an e-vet who treats rabbits/exotics available somewhere not too far away if you live in a major city, so it's just a matter of calling around until you find one. Start by calling your regular exotics vet even though they're closed - it's quite common for them to have an outgoing (ie "answering machine") message that provides instructions for what to do/where to call in the event of an after-hours emergency. If that fails, then the fastest route is to call the nearest clinic even if you know for a fact (from their website or something) that they only take cats and dogs - if they don't take exotics, they'll almost certainly be able to refer you to a clinic that does (unless you live in a very rural area where there simply isn't one, in which case skip to the "Rural areas" section below).
> 
> ...


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## Michelledickerhoff (Dec 18, 2013)

The animal hospital here is keeping him for the day! They think it's some kind of bacterial infection he got from the girl rabbit! His fever is 105.9! They gave him 2 shots I think he is going to pull thru, I should probably disinfect my house everywhere she has been, do yu have any idea what I could use that is safe?


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## Imbrium (Dec 18, 2013)

I'm so glad it sounds like he'll be ok!

I try to avoid "antibacterial" cleaning products, as people in general grossly overuse antibacterial products these days, leading to resistant strains... also, some can leave chemical residue behind which may not be safe for pets. Plain old soap-type products (aided by thorough scrubbing) kill the vast majority of bacteria and viruses (which is why I think antibacterial hand soap is ridiculous - all hand soap will kill bacteria if you use proper hand-washing techniques)... though even soap can leave residue.

My go-to product for cleaning, disinfecting and/or neutralizing odors in pet areas is good ol' tried-and-true white vinegar. Vinegar is effective, dirt cheap, completely non-toxic/pet safe and doesn't leave a residue. For general cleaning and sanitation, most people use a 50/50 mix of white vinegar and water... however, in your case, I'd go for straight vinegar. "Regular" white vinegar is 5% acid; it's perfectly viable to use if it's what you already have or all you can find... but since the acid in it is what kills viruses and bacteria, it wouldn't hurt to use the 9% version if you happen to find it (I haven't seen it at Walmart, but my local grocery store carries it).

By the way, since he's presumably getting antibiotics, I would ask them if they're giving (or can give) probiotics as well - they're always a good idea with broad-spectrum antibiotics, since those can kill "good" bacteria as well and potentially cause some nasty side-effects.


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## Michelledickerhoff (Dec 18, 2013)

Thank yu for the tips! The only problem is I don't keep him in a cage he runs free around the living room. I have a litter box in every corner. Which I know I should get new ones since the girl bunny has used them. She's been on the carpet too and they both liked to hang out behind the couch I'm just not sure what I could do to disinfect the carpet/couch. If any of the infection would have got exposed to it.


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## JBun (Dec 18, 2013)

Wow, that is a really high temperature! I'm glad you got him in ok. Hopefully they will be able to figure out what is going on.

For disinfecting, it is going to depend on what he is infected with. You'll want to call the vet and ask if they have discovered the cause of his illness yet. Ask if they tested a fecal sample. If they haven't, I would suggest asking them to. You want them to determine whether he has a protozoal parasite called coccidiosis, or if he has a bacterial infection. The vet also needs to know this as the medicine used to treat each is different. If your bun has coccidiosis, you will need to disinfect(and rinse) everything with a 10% ammonia solution. Quaternary ammonia would be the best kind to use if you can find some. If he just has a bacterial infection, a 10% bleach solution will work fine. Just make sure to rinse everything off too, as you don't want your bun exposed to the chemicals.

These links have good explanations about bacterial enteritis and coccidiosis, but be *WARNED-there are medical pictures which could be a bit disturbing.*
http://www.medirabbit.com/EN/GI_diseases/Generalities/Enteritis_en.htm
http://www.medirabbit.com/EN/GI_diseases/Protozoal_diseases/Cocc_en.htm

ETA: I'm not sure about disinfecting soft products. You could ask the vet office about how to disinfect. You may just have to disinfect the hard surfaces and litter box as much as possible and hope that will be good enough.


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## Imbrium (Dec 18, 2013)

At the very least, vacuuming the carpets never hurts... I don't actually know if it would disinfect effectively, but vinegar *might* still work if applied lightly to carpeting/upholstery with a spray bottle that has a "mist" setting. I agree with Jenny that asking the vet how to go about disinfecting would be best.


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## Michelledickerhoff (Dec 18, 2013)

Okayy I'm going to try everything I couldn't find the 9% vinegar but I got the 5


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## majorv (Dec 18, 2013)

It sounds like the girl that passed away may have had mucoid enteritis...which is usually fatal because it happens so fast that it's hard to treat in time. Good thing you got your other one to the vet because it can be passed around. That's why it's so important to quarantine new rabbits. I agree that you need to let whoever you got the girl from know what happened.


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## Michelledickerhoff (Dec 19, 2013)

My boy is doing better after the vet and the syringe feeding. He ate a few pellets on his own this morning. Who new he loved baby food that much lol he went crazy for it! Too bad it's so sugary tho, the only thing different I've noticed is that he has a little bit of the sneezes, maybe because I had to get him out in the cold to go to the animal hospital. I've let the pet store know yesterday after I dropped him off at the vet, she had another owner before me, 2 little kids and their grandpa, I guess they brought her back to the pet store because they couldn't take care of her. So who knows what she was exposed to. Poor Layla  rip


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## JBun (Dec 19, 2013)

I'm so glad he's doing better! Maybe ask your vet about the sneezing. Sometimes dust or sensitivities to things in the house can cause it, but also bacterial infections can be a cause.

Also I thought that I should mention that you may want to be careful about feeding your bun sugary foods, especially with a suspected digestive problem due to harmful bacteria. The bacteria feeds off the sugars, so can make the problem worse.

I'm just so glad to hear he's improving


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## Michelledickerhoff (Dec 19, 2013)

Okay thank yu I'll probably quit the baby food and only the pellets soaked in water until he's eating on his own. I snuck some cut up pieces of Timothy hay in there too, even tho he usually doesn't eat the Timothy hay but I don't think he noticed. He isn't all the way back to his ornery normal self but it is deff an improvement from the nite before I took him to the vet!


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## JBun (Dec 19, 2013)

Did your vet not give you Oxbow Critical Care feeding mix? It's a powdered mix especially made for sick herbivores. You could ask your vet about it. Or the soaked pellets should be ok if he's eating that alright, unless there is mushy poop that isn't clearing up, then the critical care might be a better choice.

Did the vet give you any medications for him, to give at home?


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## Imbrium (Dec 20, 2013)

Michelledickerhoff said:


> I snuck some cut up pieces of Timothy hay in there too, even tho he usually doesn't eat the Timothy hay but I don't think he noticed.



Lol... reminds me of my mom grinding up veggies in the food processor and sneaking them into meatloaf and such when I was a kid.


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## Michelledickerhoff (Dec 20, 2013)

Lol imbrium! Jbun yes they gave me a pill form of antibiotics to give him a half one twice a day. Which is hard to suck up in the syringe with the mushed pellets, so I mix it with a tiny bit of baby food like up to the number 2 mark on the syringe. I'm about to call and ask about his sneezing. And about the medical food yu just told me about. I wonder why he didn't offer that. Do yu think they sell it anywhere?


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## Michelledickerhoff (Dec 20, 2013)

His poop isn't really mushy anymore like it was but it's very tiny tiny balls now, normally they were way bigger than that


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## Imbrium (Dec 20, 2013)

Some feed stores sell critical care for herbivores, but not many from what I've seen. If your vet doesn't have it, another alternative is to try other vets in your area. It can also be found online... apparently it's easier to find than it was when I first ordered some over a year ago - I just found it on Amazon for $8.05 for a 141g bag (which is a reasonable price) and it's Prime/super-saver eligible.

If you can't find it locally and don't have Prime, I could use my Prime membership to get it to you faster (since free super-saver shipping requires a $25+ purchase and takes ages to arrive). Basically, I would buy it off of Amazon myself and put in your address as the delivery address and then you can pay me back through PayPal. If you've got a PayPal account, I can give you my email address and you can just send me the money for the food... if not, I can use my PayPal business account to send you an invoice, since that can be paid using a credit card, debit card or your checking account *without* having a PayPal account (since PayPal processes the payment, your payment information would still be protected through them).

By the way, did your vet give you probiotics to give with the antibiotics? If not, I could slip some BeneBac Plus in with the hay samples I'm going to be sending.

Come to think of it, I should have an unopened bag of critical care somewhere. I'll see if I can find it... if I do and it's not expired yet, I can just send that with the hay via priority mail and it should get to you on Monday. I wouldn't charge you for it, since (assuming it's still good) I really doubt I'd need/use it before the end of its shelf-life - I'd rather give it away than have to throw it out later .


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## Michelledickerhoff (Dec 20, 2013)

Imbrium yu have saved me twice! No he did not give me any probiotics, if yu end up not having any, yes I do have pay pal!


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## Imbrium (Dec 20, 2013)

Ok, let me go scrounge around for critical care and start getting stuff together for you


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## Michelledickerhoff (Dec 20, 2013)

Okayy


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## Imbrium (Dec 20, 2013)

Geez, people are being ridiculous about the Critical Care. Amazon insists that it's going to be delivered on Tuesday with Prime shipping even though orders placed on Friday normally arrive on Monday.

I thought maybe I could find it locally, since priority mail will arrive on Monday... called feed stores; no one had it. Started calling vets near me... one had it, but the chick insisted they needed to see the bunny. I said the bunny had already been seen by the vet, I just needed the critical care... she kept insisting that they'd HAVE to see that bunny. I hung up on her for being unreasonable. If I can buy it off Amazon no questions asked, you do NOT need to "see the bunny". It's not prescription-only and it's not even medication.

The next vet referred me to a pet store that was really close to me... I called and they DID have it. I took the bunnies and gliders for a car ride to check out the pet store (we'd never been to this one before). In retrospect, I should've asked how much it was before we went, heh - they wanted $16.99 for the 141g bag, which is utterly absurd. The bunnies got doted on by pretty much everyone in the store, though, and I got a couple things for the kitties so at least it wasn't a wasted trip . After that, I called my vet, who wanted $13 for the critical care. Again, pass.

Now I'm arguing with an Amazon customer service rep who thinks if she says "the shipping is 2 days and you'll receive it on the 3rd day" enough times, that makes it a valid argument. No, that's not how Prime works. That's never been how it works. I'm no longer arguing with her, as I "hung up" by closing the chat window - we were obviously at an impasse. Usually Amazon customer service is *great* and they really take care of you... but not this time. I blame the stupid holiday >.>

Anyway, it would've been $3.99 extra to get it delivered Monday ($8.99 extra to get it delivered tomorrow, sheesh)... I didn't think they should get paid more for something that's supposed to happen for free and I figured you'd probably rather wait until Tuesday than pay another $4, so I just placed the order normally (if you DO want to pay to get it on Monday, though, let me know and I can change it).


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## Michelledickerhoff (Dec 20, 2013)

Tuesday will be fine, how much was it and how do I go about getting it to yu thru pay pal the only thing I've ever done with pay pal is buy and sell on eBay


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## JBun (Dec 20, 2013)

So did your vet not prescribe any metacam for pain? Pain control is essential to get a rabbit eating on it's own again. I would ask about it, and you may also want to ask about a motility med now that your bun is having small poop. Small poop indicates a gut slowdown which can sometimes develop into GI stasis. And that is something you DO NOT want happening if it can be avoided.


Jennifer, I know! It's so ridiculous how they treat Critical Care like some sort of medication, when all it basically is is food. Then there's the places that say it is for vets only. WHAT! I think Oxbow must have some sort of special deal with vets.


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## Michelledickerhoff (Dec 20, 2013)

The doc gave him a shot to get his gi track moving, to help his poop because he was having very mushy poop. He didn't prescribe anything for pain..he gave him 3 different shots right when we came in my receipt says it was baytril, dexamethasone, and metoclopramide, and then he gave him another shot of baytril before I picked him back up


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## Imbrium (Dec 20, 2013)

Metoclopramide (aka Reglan) is a GI motility drug to get/keep his GI tract moving. Dexamethasone is a steroid; metacam (the usual bunny/small animal pain killer) is an NSAID... from what I gathered from some brief research, steroids and NSAIDs shouldn't really be taken together (which explains why you weren't given metacam). Not sure why the steroid was given, though.


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## Michelledickerhoff (Dec 20, 2013)

My boyfriend said he was once given steroids by his doctor when he was sick and it was to make his body stronger so it heals faster, so I'm assuming maybe it's meant for the same thing


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## JBun (Dec 21, 2013)

Steroid use in rabbits is very risky, as it lowers their immune system, and makes them prone to any underlying health problem surfacing. So generally steroids are for VERY ill rabbits, almost as a last resort. Usually in most cases where a pain med/anti inflammatory is needed, then metacam is given, as it is considered a much safer option for rabbits.

http://www.medirabbit.com/Safe_medication/Corticost/Cortico.htm

But yes, if a steroid has been given, you can't also give metacam, and have to wait, I think, two days before you can give it.

The metaclop injection would help, but only the first day it was given. If your bun needs the help of a gut stimulant, it needs to be given every day. It can also be given orally.

http://www.medirabbit.com/Safe_medication/GI_stimulation/metoclopramide.htm


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## Imbrium (Dec 21, 2013)

Oh, was it only an injection? I got mixed up; thought it was also sent home with him.

I wondered about the steroid... I saw mention of a lot more risks than benefits when I looked it up and was perplexed that it was given instead of metacam. If it only needs to be two days before metacam is ok to give, then I'd definitely ask the vet about getting metacam (and oral metaclopramide).

I really, really hope he likes the orchard hay I sent... I also sent some 80/20 orchard/alfalfa, though not very much - even if he likes that, I recommend being extremely stingy with it. From the sounds of it (based on getting him as a baby/having him for 9 mos), I'm guessing he's only about a year or so? Not really a big deal age-wise to give some alfalfa as long as he gets primarily grass hay... but because of his GI issues, it's probably not a good idea to let him have more than a little nibble.

The 2nd cut orchard is insanely soft... it looks and smells so tasty, I almost want to eat it (I've actually tried it before, it's a little sweeter than timothy and has kind of a "woody" flavor to it) . I think the box + BeneBac + 80/20 blend was about 6 oz total... then I stuffed as much orchard in there as I could without going over 16 oz (since the shipping cost would've jumped up about $2) - that way if he likes it, he'll have a decent bit of hay to munch away on. Speaking of hay, I wish my bluegrass would get here already - that's one of the few kinds we've never tried before! I ordered 45 lbs, so they'd better freaking like it.

Hopefully between meds, new kinds of hay, BeneBac Plus and critical care, you'll have a healthier bunn in no time... which is the best Christmas present anyone could ask for!


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## Imbrium (Dec 21, 2013)

Oh, and btw, recommended dosing on the BeneBac is 1g (assuming he's under 10 lbs) - give him one dose, then a second dose three days later, then after that you can give them a week apart if he still seems to need it (I sent a 4-pack of 1g tubes, ie four bunny doses).


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## Michelledickerhoff (Dec 21, 2013)

I called the vet today to update him on how he's doing and to tell him about his poop changing from mushy to now tiny balls, and to see if I can get something more to help it. I guess they closed earlier than what I thought,and I got hung up on by the after hours emergency answering person, he didn't see it as an emergency I guess, he didn't let me finish what I was saying, before he said we would appreciate if non emergency calls were during regular hours we open at 8 am thank yu have a great day "click"! Well geeez...thank yu so much. For everything! I can't wait for him to get better. I feel so bad for him. I feel as if he's my own child. He's been very sweet since he doesn't feel good. Hopefully that part doesn't go away


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## Imbrium (Dec 21, 2013)

Sheesh. Like there's so **** many emergencies going on that he can't take ten seconds to be vaguely polite?

Sick animals seem to somehow understand when you're really trying to help them feel better... and they often remember to appreciate you for it even after they've recovered .


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## Imbrium (Dec 24, 2013)

I've got some choice words for USPS right now, none of which are appropriate for the forums >.>

There's no guarantee for Priority mail, only for Express... so I can't bitch them out about not delivering my package today even though, based on the origin and delivery zipcodes and a drop-off time between 5 and 6 pm on Friday, they claimed it would arrive on Monday. Tracking shows it didn't get to a post office in Michelle's state until 1:25 pm, meaning it gets delivered today (Tuesday)... hopefully. I drove to a more distant post office (that's open until 6 pm) in rush-hour traffic on Friday because I didn't make it to a closer one before they closed at 5 pm... and I waited in line instead of just dropping it in the package chute inside, because I arrived at 5:40 and the last time the packages are collected from the drop box for the day is 5:30... all to make sure a sick little bunny got his probiotics on Monday. **** post office - they think it's fine as long as stuff arrives by Christmas; never mind that some of us are mailing things *other* than Christmas presents. I've come to expect this stuff from Amazon Prime shipping (and from freaking UPS, who I've had countless problems with), but USPS is normally reliable. Since starting my online business, this is the first time I've had a package not arrive when I was told it would (if not early).

I've got half a mind to ask for a picture of your adorable bunny giving his best disapproving and sad face(s) and then forward it to USPS to show them who they let down, lol. Actually, I've got one bunny that looks perpetually disapproving (Nala's got a "grump" face) and another that looks perpetually sad (Gazzles has an "Eeyore" face)... narrowing it down to the best couple pics will be hard, though!

Disapproving (Nala):

























Disapproving (both):


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## Imbrium (Dec 24, 2013)

Then we've got Gazzle's sad faces:


















Gazzle looking both sad AND disapproving:






And a combo shot where Nala looks disapproving and Gaz looks sad... I'm leaning towards this one ...


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## Imbrium (Dec 24, 2013)

Wow... you must pretty much be first on the route, lol! Crossing my fingers he loves the hay 

Arrival at Post Office - December 24, 2013 6:50 am
Sorting Complete - December 24, 2013 7:38 am
Delivered - December 24, 2013 8:22 am


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## Michelledickerhoff (Dec 24, 2013)

Yay! I got it this morning! My mail man usually doesn't deliver at my house til 1030. But he's a bit he gives off a bit of a perv vibe the way he looks at me, he never says anything inappropriate but his eyes says it all, so he looks every day to see if I have a package bc I order online quite a bit so he brings it at 830 if I do so he can catch me before work! And yess he is eating the crap out of the orchard kind! I can't believe my eyes I've never seen him eat hay like that! I havnt tried the other 2 yet. For some reason those pictures are not loading on my phone


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## Imbrium (Dec 24, 2013)

Heh... little creepy, but works out well if you're eager to get the package 

Actually, two of the three bags are plain orchard - I filled up a big one and still had room (weight-wise) for a little more without the postage going up. The 80/20 blend is labeled; anything not labeled is plain orchard.

I'm SO glad he likes the orchard! I'll still send you some of the KMS Hayloft stuff when it arrives, though (well, I'll mail it on the 26th, since I think the post office closes in 27 minutes and the hay isn't here yet).

45 lbs of hay (two 20 lb boxes + 5 free lbs) from Sierra Valley is $66.98 for me, but $85.90 for you (because TX qualifies as a "west coast" state and your state doesn't)... KMS Hayloft has the same delivery charge for your zipcode as for mine (though delivery apparently takes three days longer for yours) - 45 lbs of bluegrass would be $59.79 after shipping and 45 lbs of 3rd cut timothy would be $61.79. Sierra Valley estimates that a 20 lb box will last two rabbits around 2 mos, which is 5 lbs per rabbit per month - at that rate, 45 lbs = about 9 mos of hay for one bunny, so you'd be really only paying $1.44-$1.67 more per month if you bought from Sierra Valley... but if he'd be just as happy with one of the KMS Hayloft hays then you may as well save $14-16 each time you order a 45 lb box.


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## Michelledickerhoff (Dec 24, 2013)

Ya I'm deff gonna have to order some more, bc I don't think I've ever seen any at the pet store


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## Tauntz (Dec 24, 2013)

Hooray! Hope your bunny keeps improving! I've been following your thread here but knew you were in excellent hands with Imbrium! Please keep updating us!

Thanks (Jennifer) Imbrium! You are one of THE RO heroes in my book! RO members are fabulous! They always come forward & help a bunny & their human in need (especially those of us who are still new & learning bunny parents)! :goodjob


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## Michelledickerhoff (Dec 24, 2013)

Thanks  this morning was actually the first day I didn't have to syringe feed him! I'm still finishing the rest of his antibiotics tho he has 3 more to go, he doesn't like getting syringe fed at all, he knows when I'm getting his medacine ready bc he sits there with his ears all the way back watching me, lol so cute!


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## Imbrium (Dec 24, 2013)

Orchard grass is sometimes marketed as "meadow grass," I believe... and I know oxbow sells it. My girls wouldn't eat Oxbow's orchard grass, though, and the Oxbow hay (or any other "pet store" hay) is a LOT pricier than Sierra Valley or KMS Hayloft anyway... even though it's not even as fresh and pretty.

*blushes* Always happy to help! How can I look at adorable bunny faces and not? (Unless said bunnies are mine and the help they "need" involves getting more craisins and/or pellets in a day than they're allowed!)

Bunnies are too often misunderstood as pets, and the way to change that is through educating pet owners - which is what RO is all about, bunny-slaves sharing information! I learned most of what I know about rabbits from other RO members and from websites I discovered because someone on RO linked them, so I enjoy being able to pass that info around to others. I especially love it when I help some people fairly regularly and then turn around and see them giving out great advice to others based on things they learned from us "veteran" folks (which has been happening a good bit lately) .


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## Michelledickerhoff (Dec 24, 2013)

I'm glad I found this app! It was completely accidental, I was googling and found it! I'm deff going to pass it on to any other rabbit owners I know


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## Imbrium (Dec 24, 2013)

I forgot we have an app now, lol... I always hang out on RO from my home computer. I suppose I could download the app, but I'm always home anyway and rarely use my phone. (Btw, if you log in from a computer, you should be able to see the pics I posted earlier - the phone probably doesn't like the size or something. Same user name and password should get you onto the non-app version of the site.)


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## Michelledickerhoff (Dec 24, 2013)

Okayy I will have to try that! And do yu know how I edit my profile ? It lets me change my picture just nothing else


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## Michelledickerhoff (Dec 24, 2013)

How much of the pro biotics should I give him? And how


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## Imbrium (Dec 24, 2013)

On the actual website (not sure if the app differs), you go to "My Account" and then under "Control Panel" near the bottom of the drop down menu you can choose to edit other stuff... I'm not sure which options require a paid subscription and which don't, though (aside from the fact that I know signatures DO).

Unless your bunny is over 10 lbs, give him 1 gram (one tube) of the BeneBac Plus. Some bunnies will eat it straight (either from the tube or put on a plate or something)... if that doesn't work, you can mix it in with a small amount of fruit or veggie flavored, preservative free baby food (given his tummy troubles, I would opt for something involving a low-sugar veggie) or mix it into the critical care if you give him that tonight. You'll want to give him a second dose in three days (Friday).


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## Michelledickerhoff (Dec 25, 2013)

Merry Christmas! I woke up about 6 am and most his pellets and pretty much all his hay was gone! It's like he thinks he has some catching up to do! Lol. He's back to playing and doing his little kick thing he does with his back legs, "thump" does anyone else's rabbit do that he does it when he plays or if I'm trying to pick him up when he doesn't want picked up. Do yu think it's fine to give it to him even while he still has 2 doses of his antibiotics to go. Or is it fine to mix?


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## Imbrium (Dec 25, 2013)

Give or mix what? I'm a little lost, hehe. If you mean the Benebac, definitely give it to him.

Ideally, you want to give the first dose the day you start giving the antibiotics (a day or two before is just as good if it happens to work out that way), then a second dose after three days and a third dose one week after that (so 10 days after the first dose). Late is better than never, though! Probiotics will NOT interfere with any antibiotics (the reverse can happen with broad-spectrum antibiotics, though) except to cancel out some of the side-effects.

Which reminds me, I forgot to mention that you do NOT want to give the probiotic and antibiotic at the same time... I wanna say it's 2-3h you're supposed to wait between giving one and giving the other. If you screw up and give them too close together, it's the probiotic that you risk ruining. Since you can't really OD a bunny on probioitics, you can give an extra dose a few hours later if you think you canceled a dose out by giving it too close to the antibiotics.


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## Michelledickerhoff (Dec 25, 2013)

Yes that's what I was talking about was mixing the 2 I just now gave him his antibiotic so I'll do the benebac around 2 or 3


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## Imbrium (Dec 25, 2013)

Ah, ok. Sounds good . Hopefully the probiotics and, more importantly, the fact that he's *finally* eating hay will have a positive effect on how his poops look!

I think Sierra Valley must infuse their orchard grass with bunny crack somehow, lol. It seems to have a way of turning "My bunny absolutely refuses to eat ANY grass hay!" into "Holy crap, where did all the hay go??" It got my girls eating grass hay and I've sent it to two people in the last couple weeks who both had the same success - pretty **** impressive to win over four picky bunnies in a row!


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## Michelledickerhoff (Dec 25, 2013)

Ya when I give it to him it will be gone in minutes! I just don't know if I should limit him or just let him eat what he wants.


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## Michelledickerhoff (Dec 31, 2013)

can yu see the bump or bubble under his chin? It just feels like fur to me but he jumps every time I try to feel it but it just doesn't look right to me!


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## Michelledickerhoff (Dec 31, 2013)




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## Michelledickerhoff (Dec 31, 2013)




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## Michelledickerhoff (Dec 31, 2013)




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## Michelledickerhoff (Dec 31, 2013)

He doesn't act like he's in pain at all he acts normal as ever


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## JBun (Dec 31, 2013)

Has your vet looked at it? Is this something that has suddenly appeared?


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## Imbrium (Dec 31, 2013)

In some pics, it looks like a dewlap (which is mostly a female thing, but some males get them too), but in others it looks a bit odd... I can't say with certainty whether or not it's something to be concerned about. Does it feel like "extra"/loose skin or something more substantial?


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## lovelops (Dec 31, 2013)

Michelledickerhoff said:


> Ya I'm deff gonna have to order some more, bc I don't think I've ever seen any at the pet store



I've gotten orchard grass at my local petco. My problem is Chico and Chica like to use it for toilet paper and not eat it!!!


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## lovelops (Dec 31, 2013)

Imbrium said:


> In some pics, it looks like a dewlap (which is mostly a female thing, but some males get them too), but in others it looks a bit odd... I can't say with certainty whether or not it's something to be concerned about. Does it feel like "extra"/loose skin or something more substantial?



Yeah it does look like a dewlap both Brooke and Lady have one... I think it's from them being pigs. I'm going to have to make them work out more instead of eating and sleeping like little pigs. Chico and chica doesn't but they are more athletic at times than those two..

Vanessa


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## Imbrium (Dec 31, 2013)

Actually, dewlaps don't necessarily correlate with weight issues - it's just a genetic thing  (though they tend to stand out more on rabbits who have a larger frame and/or who are overweight, and not all females have them in the same way that some males do)


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## Michelledickerhoff (Dec 31, 2013)

It just feels like fur really it started with just a little bit of fur sticking out. I thought it was sticking out because when I was syringe feeding him it would drop on his chin and I couldn't get it all cleaned off. I thought maybe it was from him cleaning it off but then it got bigger. He seems fine to me. I'm going to look up some pictures of dewlops and compare


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## Michelledickerhoff (Dec 31, 2013)

JBun said:


> Has your vet looked at it? Is this something that has suddenly appeared?




Yes it has appeared within id say a week, but I didn't really notice how big it has got until today, I'll probably stop by the vet and ask what they think just in case. What is a dewlop? Is it like fat? Extra or loose skin? Or just fur?


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## JBun (Dec 31, 2013)

That's NOT a dewlap. A dewlap is like a double chin, and most often it's the females that get them, but it isn't going to develop over only a week. I would be very concerned over a lump that large, developing so quickly.


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## Imbrium (Dec 31, 2013)

It's theoretically possible for a dewlap to "appear" to develop very suddenly - for the longest time I thought neither of my girls had one and then one day I suddenly realized that Gaz did, lol. That said, her dewlap is quite tiny and I can't see failing to notice something as big as what's on your rabbit.

A dewlap is extra skin whose purpose is to provide extra fur - the reason they're primarily a female thing is that the dewlap provides them with extra fur that they can pull out to add to their nest when they kindle. Why males occasionally get one is a bit of a mystery as far as I know.

I'm inclined to agree with JBun that the size and sudden appearance of what we're seeing on your rabbit isn't really in line with it being a dewlap. If it feels like loose, furred skin and not something more tangible then chances are it's not a tumor or growth of some sort... however, it's definitely still suspicious enough to warrant discussing with your vet in the near future.


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## JBun (Dec 31, 2013)

I guess in that sense it could be a dewlap, if it developed slowly but it just wasn't noticed.


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## Michelledickerhoff (Jan 1, 2014)

The pictures I see on google some of them look exactly like his, but I'm still not taking the chance, I'll probably still get him looked at


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## Imbrium (Jan 1, 2014)

Yeah, better safe than sorry! Hopefully it is just a dewlap, but I'm sure you'll feel better after you've had it checked out .


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## Michelledickerhoff (Jan 27, 2014)

I don't know how to make a new thread but the lump on bun buns neck started to pretty much go away. And then came back so I made an appointment for Wednesday because that's the soonest the exotic vet will be in, so a day after I made the appointment (today) his lump popped and there is puss comming out! I got as much of the puss as I could with a wash cloth, but I really wish I could take him in now! I'm afraid if I wait until Wednesday it might get infected more with it being an open wound! I have no idea how to clean it or if I should even mess with it! I knew it was too good to be true when I thought it was going away! I'm so mad at myself for not taking him in anyways! He's still acting normal and eating normal and everything so I don't think he is in pain! I'm just so worried.


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## JBun (Jan 27, 2014)

Squeeze as much of the puss out as you can, a couple times a day. Then if you have betadine, make a watered down solution, like the color of weak tea, and irrigate the wound with it. You may also want to give the vets office a call tomorrow and ask them what you should do with the wound until you see the vet Wed.


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## Michelledickerhoff (Jan 28, 2014)

Okay thank yu


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## Michelledickerhoff (Jan 29, 2014)

It was an absessed tooth. An infected tooth. It's 800 to 1200 dollars to get it x rated and pulled and I guess very life threatening if I don't. My inscurance told me they would cover $97 which is worthless! That kind of money is crazy. I don't even know what to do! What would yu do in my situation? I know I can't let him suffer even tho he isn't in pain now I'm sure it would get to that point.


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## JBun (Jan 29, 2014)

I'm so sorry  You could call around to different vets to see if you can find a better price. Sometimes that can make a big difference, though of course you still want a vet experienced in doing this type of thing.

You could try antibiotics for a while. It may or may not help without the tooth removal, and it may be quite a longterm thing. I know bicillin has been used for jaw abscesses successfully. And you'll have to keep cleaning out the wound each day regardless of tooth removal. Abscesses/infections can be very difficult things to treat, aside from the fact of whether or not the tooth is removed. In some cases the tooth can't be removed if the infection has compromised the jaw bone. You may have a better idea of what to do once xrays are done.

If you want to read up on the medication and this type of problem, here are a few links. I hope you are able to find a good solution and treatment for your bun, and please continue to let us know how he is doing.
http://people.umass.edu/~jwmoore/bicillin/bicillin.htm
http://www.bio.miami.edu/hare/jawabscess.html
http://www.medirabbit.com/EN/Skin_diseases/Bacterial/Absc_treat/abscess_treat.htm (warning: medical photos)


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## aj82 (Jan 30, 2014)

Why will your insurance only pay $97? Is it specific rabbit insurance? If so I would refuse to accept that and I would check the terms of your cover.


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## Imbrium (Jan 30, 2014)

I'm guessing you have VPI, as they're the only ones I know of in the US that insure exotics... VPI is pretty crummy because their coverage is based off a benefits schedule (that hasn't kept pace with rising vet costs) rather than a % of the actual bill like most pet insurance companies do .

One thing you might look into is Pet Assure... not that many vets accept it (I get the feeling there's not much in it for the vets - I don't see anything to indicate that the vets get reimbursed for the discount they give you, heh) so you might have to use a different vet for this, but it's a flat 25% discount on ALL vet services and because it's a discount program (rather than insurance), pre-existing conditions ARE covered.

Another option is to look for veterinary schools in your area to see if you could get the surgery done more cheaply through one of them.


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## Michelledickerhoff (Feb 2, 2014)

I called around and found a vet that has done this before and it's a little cheaper she said the last bunny they did it was around 350 to $400 which is still a lot for me I started a fundraiser at petchance.org idk if any of yu have ever herd of it, I'm just waiting for them to confirm with my vet before they can start it. They said it would only take but 2 days to confirm. I'm keeping my fingers crossed, bc I know it has to be done soon. The wound on his neck is actually looking a little better. But I know it can still come back as long as the tooth is still there.


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## Michelledickerhoff (Feb 2, 2014)

aj82 said:


> Why will your insurance only pay $97? Is it specific rabbit insurance? If so I would refuse to accept that and I would check the terms of your cover.




I know I'm a little confused about it. It says it covers 90% and it has a maximum of $2000 per accident or illness. Im going to call again and talk to someone else. Yes I have the exotics pet plan.


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## Michelledickerhoff (Feb 2, 2014)

Imbrium said:


> I'm guessing you have VPI, as they're the only ones I know of in the US that insure exotics... VPI is pretty crummy because their coverage is based off a benefits schedule (that hasn't kept pace with rising vet costs) rather than a % of the actual bill like most pet insurance companies do .
> 
> One thing you might look into is Pet Assure... not that many vets accept it (I get the feeling there's not much in it for the vets - I don't see anything to indicate that the vets get reimbursed for the discount they give you, heh) so you might have to use a different vet for this, but it's a flat 25% discount on ALL vet services and because it's a discount program (rather than insurance), pre-existing conditions ARE covered.
> 
> Another option is to look for veterinary schools in your area to see if you could get the surgery done more cheaply through one of them.




Yes it is VPI the new vet I found, the lady I talked to said that there is a card I can apply for that's kind of like a credit card but is used for vet bills. But if they do a credit check I probably couldn't get it since I couldn't even get a Khols or ic penny card.


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## lovelops (Feb 3, 2014)

Michelledickerhoff said:


> I called around and found a vet that has done this before and it's a little cheaper she said the last bunny they did it was around 350 to $400 which is still a lot for me I started a fundraiser at petchance.org idk if any of yu have ever herd of it, I'm just waiting for them to confirm with my vet before they can start it. They said it would only take but 2 days to confirm. I'm keeping my fingers crossed, bc I know it has to be done soon. The wound on his neck is actually looking a little better. But I know it can still come back as long as the tooth is still there.




I'll be hitting your fundraiser as soon as I can. Is it active now? Let me know..
Vanessa


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## Michelledickerhoff (Feb 3, 2014)

lovelops said:


> I'll be hitting your fundraiser as soon as I can. Is it active now? Let me know..
> Vanessa




I actually have 2 of them I signed up for the petchance.org isn't active yet because they call my vet to make sure my info is legit it said 2 days but the weekend probably didn't count so I'm hoping it will start today bc I feel more confident about that one since they call my vet and everything. but I have one on give forward that is active now here Is the link http://gfwd.at/1aTPymE.


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## lovelops (Feb 4, 2014)

How much time do you have? How quickly do you need to get your bun in for this? Have you asked the vet that is going to do it for $450?

Vanessa


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## lovelops (Feb 4, 2014)

Ok I just donated $50... and posted it to my facebook page and some other rabbit pages I know. I'm hoping others will pitch in and donate as well so you can get going to the doctor... how soon can you go?

Vanessa


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## Michelledickerhoff (Feb 4, 2014)

I


lovelops said:


> Ok I just donated $50... and posted it to my facebook page and some other rabbit pages I know. I'm hoping others will pitch in and donate as well so you can get going to the doctor... how soon can you go?
> 
> Vanessa



i just received it! Thank yu so much. It meens a lot! I want to get him there by next Wednesday bc the lady I talked to at Allen veterinary hospital in ft Wayne Indiana said that even though his wound is looking better and he's not acting painful he still plays and eats, she said even if it does heel up that tooth will cause the lump to come back. She said rabbits can crash fast one day they will be fine and they can be horrible the next day. My vet has him on baytril until the tooth is pulled. She seemed pretty confident that they have done this a lot and that they will get my buns better. So his insurance should be refunding me $75 from his vet visit the other day and I'm putting that towards his procedure. And then your 50$ the bad thing about his insurance is that whatever they cover I have to come up with it first then they refund me


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## lovelops (Feb 4, 2014)

Michelledickerhoff said:


> I
> 
> 
> i just received it! Thank yu so much. It meens a lot! I want to get him there by next Wednesday bc the lady I talked to at Allen veterinary hospital in ft Wayne Indiana said that even though his wound is looking better and he's not acting painful he still plays and eats, she said even if it does heel up that tooth will cause the lump to come back. She said rabbits can crash fast one day they will be fine and they can be horrible the next day. My vet has him on baytril until the tooth is pulled. She seemed pretty confident that they have done this a lot and that they will get my buns better. So his insurance should be refunding me $75 from his vet visit the other day and I'm putting that towards his procedure. And then your 50$ the bad thing about his insurance is that whatever they cover I have to come up with it first then they refund me



I'm going to see what I can do about getting you some more donations..
Hang in there and go ahead and set the apt for next Weds. I got some friends I'm talking to that will give me the money and I can make donations for them via credit card. Don't let your bun suffer any more. We are going to make this happen!

Vanessa


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## Michelledickerhoff (Feb 4, 2014)

lovelops said:


> I'm going to see what I can do about getting you some more donations..
> Hang in there and go ahead and set the apt for next Weds. I got some friends I'm talking to that will give me the money and I can make donations for them via credit card. Don't let your bun suffer any more. We are going to make this happen!
> 
> Vanessa




Thank yu Vanessa! I was so worried after his vet visit when the vet said it was life threatening and then I herd the price! I didn't really think I had any options I didn't know what to do. I knew I wasn't going to let him suffer but I didn't want to put him to sleep either. I held him forever that night


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## Michelledickerhoff (Feb 8, 2014)

Vanessa I just tried to reply to your message it's not showing it on my end did yu get my reply?


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## Michelledickerhoff (Feb 12, 2014)

We are at the vet now  my poor baby is nervous. I hope they keep him away from the dogs. My local vet always keeps him in the room with the kitties so the dogs doesn't scare him


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## lovelops (Feb 12, 2014)

Michelledickerhoff said:


> Vanessa I just tried to reply to your message it's not showing it on my end did yu get my reply?




I think so, if not you can email me [email protected] or call me..
or [email protected]


Vanessa


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## lovelops (Feb 12, 2014)

Michelledickerhoff said:


> We are at the vet now  my poor baby is nervous. I hope they keep him away from the dogs. My local vet always keeps him in the room with the kitties so the dogs doesn't scare him



Awww, poor baby! I hope he is ok and I think the kittens wouldn't scare him too much! Heck my rabbits are not scared of my dogs at all. Only when they growl at each other!! But walking near where the bunnies are, they are actually curious! 

Praying for you guys..

Vanessa


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## lovelops (Feb 13, 2014)

Any updates today?

Vanessa


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## Michelledickerhoff (Feb 21, 2014)

Sorry about the delay everyone, I've been dealing with a lot lately but bun buns is doing great! Vanessa (Lovelops) helped me get fundraiser goal! And I took to him to 2 other vets and they both said that it was not and abscessed tooth! Said it could be a bite from the female rabbit that died. Or even possibly a scratch or cut of some sort?? I'm hoping it wouldn't have been one of my cats bc cats do carry a lot of bacteria in their mouths, but I don't see them doing that, but I can't rule it out, he actually healed very quick! The abscess is completely gone and his hair is now starting to grow back where they had shaved it so he did not have to go through the surgery so I sent Vanessa back the rest of the donations! I'm so glad! That was quite a big scare for me! He is a very happy bunny! I'm a little upset with my vet for scaring the crap out of me but I'm just thankful mostly!


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## Imbrium (Feb 21, 2014)

I'm so glad he's better! I'm sorry I missed your fundraiser; I haven't had much time for the forums lately and have only been reading a fraction of the current posts/threads ><... I'm glad you didn't need to put him through surgery after all!

I doubt it was a cat bite or scratch - they DO carry bacteria that can be spread through bites and scratches that is potentially fatal to bunnies... however, if a bunny gets an infection that way, it tends to progress very swiftly and aggressively. You first posted about this issue at the tail end of December, I believe... There's NO way an infection caused by a cat scratch or bite could go undiagnosed and untreated for nearly two months - it can kill a bunny in two DAYS. Also, even if caught very quickly, I've heard that cat bite/scratch infections generally aren't easy to treat and recovery is far from swift. [More info on the cat/rabbit dangers]


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## Michelledickerhoff (Mar 8, 2014)

Heyy how is everyone doing? Me an bun buns are great he's doing good no signs of it comming back so far. He's still as ornery as ever lol. Sorry for posting on the same post I've tried everything to figure out how to make a new one. My landlord left a note saying they are going to start having the building sprayed for bugs since it's starting to get warm out. They are going to spray along the edges of the rooms. I'm very worried bc that is where bun buns likes to hang out! Do yu think this stuff will make him sick ? I'm going to ask when the bug guy gets here but it has been bothering me all day thinking about it !


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## lovelops (Mar 8, 2014)

Michelledickerhoff said:


> Heyy how is everyone doing? Me an bun buns are great he's doing good no signs of it comming back so far. He's still as ornery as ever lol. Sorry for posting on the same post I've tried everything to figure out how to make a new one. My landlord left a note saying they are going to start having the building sprayed for bugs since it's starting to get warm out. They are going to spray along the edges of the rooms. I'm very worried bc that is where bun buns likes to hang out! Do yu think this stuff will make him sick ? I'm going to ask when the bug guy gets here but it has been bothering me all day thinking about it !



Possibly. I would ask what they are using .. that is going to be key if it's safe for bun bun or not. 

Vanessa


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