# help!!!!! baby bunnies



## Rosy (Feb 7, 2020)

hi, i have rescued 5 baby bunnies and their mom from someone who was incapable of caring for them. apparently, the bunnies were born about a month ago. they were left in a garbage bag since they were assumed to be dead. When i arrived, i found them in the bag and the mom and dad walking on top! i separated the mom and dad and now i have the 5 babies and their mom in my possession. attached are pictures of them now. they do not look a month old. will their mom feed them? do i have to feed them? please help!!!!! i put them in a cage together with their mother. was this the right thing to do?? also, they are all moving, and wriggling...


----------



## Preitler (Feb 7, 2020)

They are not one month old, more like a week. 12 days if the eyes are open.
I would give them something to crawl under since there is no fur nest, like cotton wool, dryer lint, etc. to keep them warm, depending on what the bedding is and room temperature. But better too much insulation than not enough, they need body temperature for digestion and wiggle to their comfort zone anyway if it gets too warm.

If the doe wouldn't feed them they would be dead by now, and they look well fed and cared for. I think the doe does a good job there.

Keep the doe in a rather small cage with the nest for now, enough place to stretch out, eat and poop, but not a pen or something. Give her rest, lots of food and privacy. I would screen her cage off if she hasn't a room for herself. If you are not sure if she realizes that this is her nest you can dunk her nose into it, but I wouldn't stress her if she's not cool with being handled.

There'll quite likely be another litter in 2-3 weeks if dad was around, you'll have to seperate this kits then.


----------



## Rosy (Feb 7, 2020)

thank you! the women was quite insistent that they were born a couple of weeks ago... it is a huge relief to hear that they look ok.


----------



## Preitler (Feb 7, 2020)

If there was a litter more than a month ago it died off unnoticed and this is already the second. More likely, dates got mixed up.

Feed the doe really a lot of what she's used to, when nursing they need about twice or more of what they normally eat, unlimited hay anyway.

Being moved is a big stress for a doe, so really give her quiet and privacy, some of my does do not nurse if someone is around.


----------



## Rosy (Feb 7, 2020)

thank you @Preitler! i will do that. how do i ensure the babies are warm enough? They are currently in my basement which tends to be a bit chilly. i set up a radiator near their cage to try and warm up the area. the bedding they are on is paper bedding. are they supposed to be covered with it? as of now, they are uncovered for safety reasons as i don't want them to suffocate. also, they don't stop moving and wriggling. is this normal?


----------



## zuppa (Feb 7, 2020)

Hi, you'd need to make a nest to keep them warm. Here's a short video, surely you don't have a proper nest box but you can use just washing up basin put some absorbing stuff then lots of hay, make a little hole and cover with something soft and fluffy, ideally if mother will let you do that you can pull some fur off her belly around the nipples or else her furr should come off easily now, and line the hole with fur (use cotton wool or what you have at hand there), then put babies in there, they will burrow inside and will staywarm because they will warm each other moving, but of course you can warm this nest a bit with hair dryer or placing a hot bottle for a few minutes to help them. Then all as Preitler said already make a small space for mother and babies for one-two weeks and provide with lots of hay, lots of water, unlimited pellets (she'd eat up to 4 daily portions to produce milk), if you feel she's hungry or worry if she has enough milk give her about a tablespoon of rolled oats daily.
If father was around you will possibly have another litter in 3-4 weeks but for now just separate father from them all and just make nest they will stay warm in it, make sure that whatever box you will use the sides are high enough so babies can't escape as they won't be able to get back into it and mother won't be able to bring them in so they can die of cold.

Good luck and keep us updated any question just ask and take pics of your nest and all setup we'll tell you more.

Babies look less than one week imo.



Here's another 2 mins video


----------



## Preitler (Feb 8, 2020)

Rosy said:


> thank you @Preitler! i will do that. how do i ensure the babies are warm enough? They are currently in my basement which tends to be a bit chilly. i set up a radiator near their cage to try and warm up the area. the bedding they are on is paper bedding. are they supposed to be covered with it? as of now, they are uncovered for safety reasons as i don't want them to suffocate. also, they don't stop moving and wriggling. is this normal?



They cannot suffocate, no way, on the other hand low temperature can be a life threatening problem. They can't keep their body temperuture up when out in the open, with low temperature digestion doesn't work. They wriggle when they try to find a comfortable warm spot, not too cold or hot, and when they get disturbed. Normally you don't see anything of the kits until they leave the nest.

In nature, the nest is in an hole in the earth, consists of lots of hay with a ball of fur where the kits are in, and that hole gets sealed off with hay, grass and dirt except for a few minutes twice a day when the doe comes feeding. Most nestbox designs more or less simulate such a short tunnel (which keeps the kits from crawling out too), but most domestic rabbits lost the instinct to seal the nest of (only one of mine does it vigorously)

Since quite probably you don't have a stash of fur the cotton wool, dryer lint, or fur you can comb off other rabbits (if you can't pluck some from the doe, or if that would stress her) would come in handy. Anyway, as been said above, make a nest of soft hay, lots of it, it is a good insulator too. Also, the first thing kits start to nibble on is the hay in the nest, but that's not the concern for now.
You don't really need a nest real nestbox, an open cardboard box with about 4" walls will do. Check regularily after feeding (normally around dusk and dawn) that no kits are outside of the nest, they can be dragged out while latched on a teat.


----------



## Augustus&HazelGrace (Feb 8, 2020)

I have used a cardboard box for a nestbox. If it was chillier then I would use a $2 blanket from Walmart cut in half folded in there. You can use the whole thing if you think that its too cold down there.


----------



## Rosy (Feb 8, 2020)

thanx everybody for responding! ur posts r really helpful. i made them a nestbox made out of a litter box. the bottom later is an old sweatshirt and t shirt. then is hay with cotton balls. ill post a pic of it as soon as i can.
im worried about one the kits. it is laying on its side weakly waving all four paws. he opens and closes his mouth from time to time. what can i do to help it? the others are way more active, burrowing through the nest box.


----------



## Rosy (Feb 8, 2020)

a small issue has developed regarding the nest box. the doe seems to think that it is her litter box and is relieving herself in it... is this harmful? the cage they are in now is kinda small as receiving these rabbits were so last second. it is the cage i used when my other rabbit was much younger. there isn't enough room for a nest box and litter box in it. what size cage should i purchase for them? @Preitler, u mentioned that i should not put them in a pen. what is the reason for that?


----------



## Rosy (Feb 8, 2020)

here is a photo of the doe in the nest box with her kits


----------



## majorv (Feb 8, 2020)

For the kit in distress, does it look like it was being fed? You said you found the parents walking on the bag the kits were in? It may have internal injuries from being stepped on. It doesn’t sound good though.

You don’t want the doe peeing/pooping in the box the kits are in. You may need to provide another box for the kits or move the box out of the corner she’s peeing in.


----------



## Rosy (Feb 8, 2020)

@majorv how do i know if its being fed?
yes thats where i found them. yikes. i hope it will be ok. i will keep you guys updated.
the cage they are currently in is not that large. i dont think the doe was ever litter trained. i dont know if i will have room for two boxes.


----------



## majorv (Feb 8, 2020)

If it hasn’t been fed it will be thin and wrinkly. You can try to hold mom and see if the kit will suck but it sounds like it may be too weak.

Do you have an exercise pen you can place around the cage they’re in? This would allow the doe to get out of the cage, and you can place a litter box out there.


----------



## Rosy (Feb 8, 2020)

yes it is a bit wrinkly. it is not doing well. it is moving less and less. it is separate from the others for some reason. the other kits are moving a lot and clumsily climbing over each other
i have an exercise pen but my other rabbit ( a buck) currently occupies it. i will try to get another one. what size do you recommend i get?


----------



## zuppa (Feb 9, 2020)

You can try hand feeding as majorv suggested just be careful hold her tight


----------



## majorv (Feb 9, 2020)

I suspect there may be something wrong with this little one, especially if it’s apart from the others.

The pen doesnt need to be real big...maybe an area about 3-4’ by 4-5’ would give her extra space to run around and put a litter box in. Below is one we temporarily used when we had to house a rabbit inside.


----------



## Preitler (Feb 9, 2020)

The reason for a rather small cage was that the doe learns her surroundings and the position of the nest quickly - that point is moot now, she has figured it out already. Good girl. 

About using the nestbox as litterbox - you can try to put a sheet of cardboard or whatever over it to create a cieling, at a height that is appr. at her neck when she sits up. If she peed in there replace the hay and any wet stuff, and wash the box. Some poos don't hurt.

About the weak kit, there could really be something wrong with it, that happens. If it were mine I would keep putting it back to the others. You can try to give it a feeding by holding the doe if she's not stressed out by that. (what I did was: towel on my lap, kit between my legs, doe on top - careful about her hind claws, if she struggles she can hurt the kit), there are other ways like putting the doe on her back.


----------



## Rosy (Feb 9, 2020)

sadly, the little one passed away last night. 
when i came down this morning, i found a different kit separated from the others in a similar position! im really worried about it. it has been pretty active until now.
i brought the whole cage upstairs where it is warmer. i also got a different cage which is bigger. unfortunately, i had to go to college this morning and i wont be back until much later.


----------



## Rosy (Feb 9, 2020)

i would like to try hand feeding. i cant seem to find a local place that sells milk replacer for bunnies. would kitten (for cats) milk replacer work?


----------



## majorv (Feb 9, 2020)

Goats milk would be better than kitten replacer


----------



## Preitler (Feb 9, 2020)

Check the does nipples if any are red, inflamed, or look different than the others. Kits getting sick and dying off could be the result of Mastitis.

Handfeeding is a really last resort for me, didn't have too much success, and I avoid getting too attached. I importet some cans of condensed goat milk (Walmart) for that purpose, can't get that over here.
Rabbit milk is something special, much richer than others.

About handfeeding, read up here, start with the stickies:
http://rabbittalk.com/kindling-and-care-of-does-and-kits-f47.html

Good luck


----------



## Rosy (Feb 9, 2020)

majorv said:


> Goats milk would be better than kitten replacer


if the goat milk says it is for cats or dogs is that ok?


----------



## Rosy (Feb 9, 2020)

Preitler said:


> heck the does nipples if any are red, inflamed, or look different than the others. Kits getting sick and dying off could be the result of Mastitis.


thanks for the advice. i will check as soon as i get home


----------



## Eve84 (Feb 9, 2020)

Rosy said:


> thanks for the advice. i will check as soon as i get home







Have a look if u can get this milk and feed with a syringe. Always just a little drop of milk. 

Good luck
Eve


----------



## Preitler (Feb 9, 2020)

A suitable milk powder sure is much easier to use than mixing a formula from goat milk, egg yolk, and syrup. 

@Eve84 Did you successfully use this, and do you know what the shelf life is approximatly?


----------



## Rosy (Feb 9, 2020)

@Eve84 do u know the name in english?


----------



## Eve84 (Feb 9, 2020)

Rosy said:


> @Eve84 do u know the name in english?








You can get it on Amazone uk 
I Heard- of Someone who has successfully raised rabbits with it


----------



## zuppa (Feb 9, 2020)

Rosy said:


> i would like to try hand feeding. i cant seem to find a local place that sells milk replacer for bunnies. would kitten (for cats) milk replacer work?


You have mother and she feeds other ones so there is no point in using replacements if she's healthy and have enough milk, just try to feed the wrinkled one keeping it close to her nipples. If you worry if she has enough milk make sure she drinks lots of water and has unlimited pellets, also give her some rolled oats. Those replacements are for if you don't have mother or any other chance to get natural milk so I wouldn't start with them unless there is absolutely no other option.


----------



## Rosy (Feb 9, 2020)

thank you @Eve84 ! i appreciate it. i actually live in the US. i tried looking it up on amazon but i cant seem to find it...


----------



## Rosy (Feb 9, 2020)

sadly, were down to three kits! i dont know what the issue is. ! @Preitler, i want to check for mastitis but i need another person to help me with it. she doesnt really enjoy being held, and if im gonna turn her over, im definitely gonna need another person... im going to have to wait until someone is available to help me. ill keep you updated after i check.


----------



## Rosy (Feb 9, 2020)

@zupper i dont know if shes feeding the kits enough. i picked them up before, and their stomachs were not round; maybe even a bit wrinkled. im worried since two out of five have already passed on. they are quite active tho, and were wiggling out of my hands.


----------



## Rosy (Feb 9, 2020)

as i picked one of the kits up, it made a squeaking sound. why would it do that?


----------



## Julie&Bunnies (Feb 9, 2020)

Rosy said:


> as i picked one of the kits up, it made a squeaking sound. why would it do that?


 Usually, it means they are too cold or too hot. They should be warm to the touch.


----------



## Rosy (Feb 9, 2020)

i picked up the doe to check her nipples for mastitis. they were really hard to find. i think they look ok, but im not sure with all the fur on her stomach. while holding her, i noticed there was something on her rear end, possibly dried blood. what could that be from?


----------



## Julie&Bunnies (Feb 9, 2020)

That squeaking sound usually means they are too hot or too cold.
If they are the correct temperature, it could mean starvation.


----------



## Rosy (Feb 9, 2020)

attached is a photo of the cage that they are all currently in. also attached is a pic of the kits in the nest box.


----------



## Rosy (Feb 9, 2020)

Julie&Bunnies said:


> That squeaking sound usually means they are too hot or too cold.
> If they are the correct temperature, it could mean starvation.


oh no! what is the most likely cause? i dont think they are too hot. the basement that they are in is on the chilly side even with the radiator i have going on full blast for them. so maybe they're too cold? how can i get them warmer? but it just may be that they are hungry. they do look a little thin to me. but it was only one kit making that sound...


----------



## Julie&Bunnies (Feb 9, 2020)

I always give infants a baby blanket. They sell nice small fleece ones at Dollar Tree, or if those are not in stock, I buy the car cleaning cloth from the automotive aisle. It's basically just a small fleece blanket.
In a pinch, you can use a t-shirt or warm scarf.


----------



## Julie&Bunnies (Feb 9, 2020)

I have raised a lot of orphans/rejected babies. It's hard work and a lot of times heartbreaking. Body temperature is vital. They should be a nice warm temperature to the touch, not too hot but not cool or just lukewarm.


----------



## Rosy (Feb 9, 2020)

Julie&Bunnies said:


> I always give infants a baby blanket.


they are on top of a tshirt and sweater. what do u do with the baby blanket?


----------



## Rosy (Feb 9, 2020)

i tried to get pics of their stomachs so you guys can tell me if they r underfed... thank you!


----------



## Julie&Bunnies (Feb 9, 2020)

I lay them on part of the blanket and cover them lightly with the other half. They love to snuggle underneath the blanket.


----------



## Julie&Bunnies (Feb 9, 2020)

They look seriously emaciated t/dehydrated to me. We have to figure out a way to get nourishment and hydration into them, or sadly, they won't survive much longer. The one in the center picture concerns me most.


----------



## Rosy (Feb 9, 2020)

i have goat milk available that is meant for puppies. is that ok for them?


----------



## majorv (Feb 9, 2020)

Rosy said:


> i picked up the doe to check her nipples for mastitis. they were really hard to find. i think they look ok, but im not sure with all the fur on her stomach. while holding her, i noticed there was something on her rear end, possibly dried blood. what could that be from?



They shouldn’t be hard to find. If she’s actively nursing there is usually no hair right around the nipples.


----------



## zuppa (Feb 9, 2020)

Rosy said:


> as i picked one of the kits up, it made a squeaking sound. why would it do that?


Squeaking is nothing wrong some kits make sounds even when they are fine.
It is hard to say from your photo I hardly see bellies on them.
If you can't find nipples on their mother maybe she doesn't have much milk, otherwise would be no problem finding them. Does she have enough water? What food is available for her? Vegetables, rolled oats, herbs? 
It is really hard to tell what is on her back maybe some old wounds she is good looking and not underweight. 
Honestly I never tried any replacement but I've heard that goat milk is good, make it warm, not hot and try, just be careful not too much at once so they can breath.


----------



## majorv (Feb 9, 2020)

Rosy said:


> i have goat milk available that is meant for puppies. is that ok for them?



What else is in it besides goats milk? Is it fresh whole goat milk? If so, you can add a bit of heavy cream, warm it, and use an eye dropper. Go slow and keep them upright as you feed them. There are formulas on the internet...some add egg yolk to the formula. Ideally, colostrum should be added but it isn’t as easy to get.


----------



## Rosy (Feb 10, 2020)

it is powdered goat milk. what would b the ratio of goat milk to heavy cream?


----------



## JBun (Feb 10, 2020)

I like the ratio recommended on this site. It's 3 parts powdered milk (they use kmr), 3 parts water, and 1 part heavy cream (not sweetened).
https://www.2ndchance.info/bunnies.htm


----------



## zuppa (Feb 10, 2020)

How's it going?


----------



## Rosy (Feb 10, 2020)

i am hand-feeding the 2 remaining kits with the goat milk. so far so good . it does take a while tho...


----------



## Rosy (Feb 10, 2020)

how much do you recommend I feed per feeding? and how many times per day?


----------



## majorv (Feb 10, 2020)

A doe would normally nurse 1-2 times per day. Because they will most likely take less, being hand fed, you may have to do it more often.


----------



## Julie&Bunnies (Feb 11, 2020)

It's slow work at that age. As they get older, it will go faster.

Does nurse twice daily, about every twelve hours. However, their milk is far more nutritious than the canned milk and they are much better than we are at getting their tummies full. Does milk is designed to be metabolized slowly by the kits and to "stay with" them. 
For their survival, it is vital that they be fed often, especially at this age. Every 2 hours would be ideal. Every 4 hours is the minimum, at least during waking hours. But they really should get a feeding at least once during the night as well. 
This is because of the way their body works. If their stomach and subsequently their GI tract becomes empty and stops moving food/milk through their system, bad bacteria grows in their guts. This is especially true with hand fed babies that don't have their immune system their mother. They are far more fragile than kits fed by a mother, and the only way I have found to keep them alive is to keep them eating.


----------



## Rosy (Feb 11, 2020)

ok thanks. do you think that the doe has nursed them at all? after all, they have survived this long until i started hand feeding them...


----------



## Mariam+Theo (Feb 11, 2020)

I hope they continue to do well. I suggest getting this milk replacer ASAP. If you read the review with the video the person says that their baby bunnies died 1 by 1 on goat milk. They later had more babies and they gave them this and all lived. https://www.amazon.com/Wombaroo-Rab...pY2tSZWRpcmVjdCZkb05vdExvZ0NsaWNrPXRydWU&th=1


----------



## Julie&Bunnies (Feb 11, 2020)

Just remember, when you switch the babies to the new milk, do it gradually, not all at once. Give them 1/4 new milk, 3/4 old formula for 1 day or two, the next day 50/50, keep it 50/50 for a few days, then 3/4 new to 1/4 old, and finally, 100 new.

I cannot tell if the mother was feeding them or not but I would heartily suggest that you leave them in with the mother in case she does. The mother's milk cannot be replicated. A foster Doe would be best.


----------



## zuppa (Feb 11, 2020)

Rosy said:


> ok thanks. do you think that the doe has nursed them at all? after all, they have survived this long until i started hand feeding them...


Of course she feeds them, you started this thread Friday and they would have no chance to survive that long without her feeding them. I personally don't see need to use replacements at all, what I meant by hand feeding was that you could try bringing them to their mothers belly a couple times a day to be sure and give them an extra chance, as in video I posted.
I had some weaker wrinkled kits and because others were stronger they had no chance to get their portion so I used this hand feeding and also removed fattest kits from nest for one-two feedings but that was just first few days after that they were strong enough, also if there's more than 6 kits or if mother looks exhausted sometimes I split kits and make sure weakest ones are warm and fed and get more milk than the fat ones. But I always take a very good care of mother she needs to be well fed, happy and relaxed and she will take care of her babies.
In your case you have mother and she feeds them generally, you just need to make sure she has everything to produce enough milk, maybe stimulate her by bringing kits to her belly, give additionally rolled oats, herbs etc, and she'll do the rest.
Your mother looks strong girl not skinny and all, she can do it herself.
In your photo actually was very hard to see bellies but honestly they didn't look that much wrinkled. Maybe you could post some new photo so we can see their bellies?
Good luck anyways please don't separate them from their mother.


----------



## Rosy (Feb 11, 2020)

thank you everybody who has responded so far! its been really helpful. i really appreciate it!


----------



## Rosy (Feb 11, 2020)

todays stomaches  i syringe fed the first baby about 1 ml. it was really hard to feed. the second baby i fed about 2 ml. please tell me what you think!


----------



## majorv (Feb 11, 2020)

Rosy said:


> ok thanks. do you think that the doe has nursed them at all? after all, they have survived this long until i started hand feeding them...



Does can sometimes abandon a litter in stressful situations. I don’t know if that’s the case here. Have you left them with the mom even though you’re trying to hand feed? Ideally, you would be able to catch the doe nursing, or possibly place a camera on the cage so you can review the recording later if she is. 

And young kits can squeal for no reason...doesn’t necessarily mean anything.


----------



## zuppa (Feb 11, 2020)

Hi, they look well fed I would just leave them with their mother just make sure they are warm and she eats/drinks well herself. They are max one week old now they look pretty good.


----------



## Rosy (Feb 11, 2020)

@majorv yes, i take them out to feed and then return them to the mom. i have not caught her nursing. how would i do a camera?


----------



## Rosy (Feb 11, 2020)

zupper said:


> Hi, they look well fed I would just leave them with their mother just make sure they are warm and she eats/drinks well herself. They are max one week old now they look pretty good.


thank you! the photos are after they have been handfed so they may be a bit misleading... how do i ensure that the doe eats and drinks properly? they are on top of a sweater with it folded over them. do you think that this will keep them warm enough?


----------



## zuppa (Feb 11, 2020)

I thought you had cotton wool there? They should be fully covered with fluffy stuff, here's my nest for example


----------



## Rosy (Feb 11, 2020)

@zupper, i did have that but it got dirty and the doe spread it all around. but i will try that again and cover them with the cotton


----------



## zuppa (Feb 11, 2020)

Here's how nest looks from inside, there's like a hole in hay and it lined with fur, then babies and you cover them with more fur, or they will burrow into it themselves. This is nest after about 10 days I cleaned it removed all wet stuff from underneath put some fresh pellets with shavings then shredded paper and hay and on top all that fur from the old nest removed some dirty. Nest is on the right and they are in a small box just for cleaning time. So just make a hole in hay and line it with cotton wool or dryer lint or get some fur from their moms belly




This is how it looks around 3 weeks. They just constantly moving and fluffing it mixing with hay so it creates really warm cloud around them


----------



## Julie&Bunnies (Feb 12, 2020)

How I would do it is I would start them on the milk replacer while they had still some of the mother's milk in their tummy, or find a foster Doe. That's how I would do it. I certainly would not allow them to starve to death and do nothing. That's plain cruelty. three of them already starved to death so I don't see what point you're making by saying that they couldn't still be alive if the mother wasn't feeding them.
I would, however, never hand feed an Internet troll... That's for their mother to do.


----------



## Rosy (Feb 12, 2020)

@zupper, when i added hay, the mom seemed to think that it was her litter box? how can i prevent this? also, thanx for the pictures! its helpful to see them.


----------



## Rosy (Feb 12, 2020)

belllies this morning. imo, they look fed. am i right?


----------



## Julie&Bunnies (Feb 12, 2020)

Yes! They are fed. Great! So the mom can probably take it from here. Ditto pottying. Just watch them daily that they look fed.


----------



## majorv (Feb 12, 2020)

Julie&Bunnies said:


> How I would do it is I would start them on the milk replacer while they had still some of the mother's milk in their tummy, or find a foster Doe. That's how I would do it. I certainly would not allow them to starve to death and do nothing. That's plain cruelty. three of them already starved to death so I don't see what point you're making by saying that they couldn't still be alive if the mother wasn't feeding them.
> I would, however, never hand feed an Internet troll... That's for their mother to do.



We don’t know if the other ones starved to death. Without pictures of the deceased kits, and based on how they acted just before death they could’ve passed from other causes.


----------



## Julie&Bunnies (Feb 13, 2020)

majorv said:


> We don’t know if the other ones starved to death. Without pictures of the deceased kits, and based on how they acted just before death they could’ve passed from other causes.



Pictures were posted further back. The last one that died was really emaciated.


----------



## Rosy (Feb 13, 2020)

i came down this morning and i think the mom was nursing them. bus as soon as she saw me, she moved away... will she continue to feed them?


----------



## Mariam+Theo (Feb 13, 2020)

Rosy said:


> i came down this morning and i think the mom was nursing them. bus as soon as she saw me, she moved away... will she continue to feed them?


She should continue to feed them later. Some rabbits prefer to not feed in front of people.


----------



## Rosy (Feb 13, 2020)

the mom is acting a bit aggressive. i wanted to pet her as i heard that its good to pet the mom before handling the babies so her smell is on your hands. i was gently petting her back when she turned around and bit me! i know that in her previous environment, she did not have much human interaction. can this be the cause? or is it because she is a new mom? how can i build her trust?


----------



## zuppa (Feb 13, 2020)

Maybe she is just protective needs some privacy rabbits are prey animals and generally don't like when anyone see them nursing or touching their kits, I don't know if you take them out of nest once a day for 5 mins that's fine but some mothers don't like it, one of my girls Bernie is happy to share and I can take them when she is there and she is happy, but Smokey wouldn't let me go near her nest I remove her and then check the kits quickly, if they look good and fed I check max once a day for first week and then just leave it to her, also I place something like a blanket over it to make her feel safe. You did great job you gave her nest and babies are fed and she will take care of them, rabbits are good mothers.
If you want to bond with her and build trust you better don't approach her in her cage and don't pick her up, sit next to her reading and give her time to come out and approach you if she wants, but honestly nursing mother maybe just doesn't want much contact, it is normal.
Lovely kits, now look a bit overfed sure they have much milk for only two of them. I had one overfed kit once I named him Spud he was real big fat lazy boy. Soon when they are 2-3 weeks they will start exploring territory and exercise they still have to stay in their cage but you can attach a playpen to it and let their mother out for day so she can be active and get some rest from them. Then you can sit next to playpen and read or play with your phone not paying attention, get to her level sit or lay on the floor, do it regularly for a week or two and you will see changes


----------



## Rosy (Feb 13, 2020)

thank you @zupper for the advice and information! i will try that


----------



## zuppa (Feb 13, 2020)

By the way, you said that father was separated from them after they were born so it is very possible that you will have another litter in about 3 weeks from now. If you see her collecting hay in her mouth and digging building nest maybe in a couple weeks you'd need to prepare nest box for her and when she gives birth you will need to remove older babies from cage, they will be about 4 weeks old by then so they will start eating her food and hay already and they will survive, but it will be more important that she feeds new babies first because they won't survive without her milk, and older babies can get what's left, and they will start eating more hay/food then.

Well maybe you are lucky and she's not pregnant but be prepared. This also can be why she doesn't want to communicate if she's pregnant. But maybe not, maybe she just doesn't want you to touch her belly because of she's nursing.

Let us know when babies open their eyes it will help with estimating their birth date. She could get pregnant even same day after giving birth


----------



## Rosy (Feb 13, 2020)

wow thats quick! ill keep an eye and watch her behavior. thanks for the heads up! ill keep you updated!


----------



## Julie&Bunnies (Feb 13, 2020)

Yes, most likely she will continue feeding and caring for them from now on. I think you are in good shape now. They are a few days older and stronger now. In a few more days their eyes will open and they will be chasing her down. LOL

I'm guessing something, stress, being moved, etc...caused a pause in nursing. It happens sometimes. I would only check on them once a day to make sure they are fed at this point.


----------



## Julie&Bunnies (Feb 13, 2020)

Sorry to hear she is biting. It's par for the course with rabbits. my rabbits are really nice and will generally tolerate a lot (grooming then, giving medicine, etc) before they bite. But nursing mothers you can count on to be cranky. Their hormones are all mixed up and they are probably fearful something will hurt their babies. At this point, I would chalk it up to the fact that she just doesn't know you very well. If she was not socialized and handled a lot in her previous home, that is a part of it, too. Bunnies dislike change and she has gone through a lot now. 

However, there is always the chance that she could be pregnant, so if in a few weeks she starts to get more aggressive, especially towards the kits, you should remove them and just let them nurse twice a day. If she does have a second litter, then you will have to let the older ones wean. I say this because occasionally pregnant mothers, especially when they are very near giving birth, hurt other rabbits, even their own babies. 
Right now I think she just doesn't know what to make of what is happening. She hasn't had enough time to really trust you yet. Be cautious when putting your hand in the cage. some of my bunnies are very territorial about their cage and get very annoyed when I put my hand in to clean, even though they are fine with me handling them outside the cage.


----------



## Rosy (Feb 13, 2020)

its great to hear that! they are growing some fur and are super cute. 
that definitely makes sense. She wasnt in the best environment to begin with and with the big move... totally understandable.


----------



## Rosy (Feb 13, 2020)

i guess im just really surprised. i know that rabbits can bite, but it has never happened to me before. my other rabbits, were and are very tame and gentle.


----------



## Rosy (Feb 13, 2020)

Julie&Bunnies said:


> However, there is always the chance that she could be pregnant, so if in a few weeks she starts to get more aggressive, especially towards the kits, you should remove them and just let them nurse twice a day.


how would i ensure that she is nursing them? she doesnt nurse when i am around...


----------



## Pumpkin (Feb 14, 2020)

I agree with zupper, but don't separate the first babies unless your 100% sure that the mom is going to have another litter. They should be kept with their mom until at least 6 weeks, but it is preferable that they stay with her until 8 weeks. Separating them at 4 weeks could cause intestinal issues resulting in some deaths. You're in a sticky situation if the mom is pregnant, because the first litter might die from separation if they won't eat food, but if you don't separate them, then the next litter might die from not getting enough milk. Good luck!


----------



## Pumpkin (Feb 14, 2020)

I'm not sure how you can ensure that she is nursing them, but I do know that the mother only nurses them once or twice a day and in private. She doesn't lay down like a cat does, so it can be hard to tell. In the wild, the mom will spend most of her time away from the babies so she doesn't lead predators to them. You might just need to set up a camera to see if she's going in there and nursing.


----------



## Mariam+Theo (Feb 14, 2020)

Can you send some pictures of the babies? They sound adorable!


----------



## Rosy (Feb 14, 2020)

my babies


----------



## Mariam+Theo (Feb 14, 2020)

Oh! They are so cute!










Btw- I don't know why the heart eyes are showing up on different lines?


----------



## Rosy (Feb 14, 2020)

Thank you!!!


----------



## Rosy (Feb 15, 2020)

the babies have opened their eyes! the completely white one has red eyes ( is it a REW?) while the other kits eyes are dark. how old do you think they are? about 12 days?


----------



## Rosy (Feb 15, 2020)

they are getting so fat!
not an awesome pic but just had to show you guys.


----------



## Mariam+Theo (Feb 15, 2020)

Ok, I know I already said this but they are so cute! I can't get over it! It makes me want babies, but I know I shouldn't breed rabbits.


----------



## Cluckin'Bunny (Feb 15, 2020)

I'm new to the forum so I am just joining this discussion.  They look really cute! I'm glad they are doing well! I'm sorry you lost two.  That's sad. 

I hope they continue to grow and thrive!


----------



## Rosy (Feb 15, 2020)

Thank you @Theo and @Cluckin'Bunny! i think they're adorable too  .


----------



## majorv (Feb 15, 2020)

Kits typically open their eyes between 10-14 days old, so 12 is a good average. Yes, the one with red eyes would be a REW (red or ruby eyed white).

Once eyes are open they’ll start exploring more so it’s important to baby proof the area. Kits can be little escape artists!


----------



## Pumpkin (Feb 16, 2020)

I LOVE THEM! They're soo cute! Continue sending pictures please! (and maybe even videos) I'm obsessed with baby bunnies!


----------



## eacartmell1000 (Feb 16, 2020)

Here's our babies, there's seven of them! They all seem to be doing well. One or two seem a little thin but they also look longer than the others.


----------



## Cluckin'Bunny (Feb 16, 2020)

Rosy said:


> Thank you @Theo and @Cluckin'Bunny! i think they're adorable too  .



Your welcome.  Probably everyone thinks they are adorable!


----------



## Julie&Bunnies (Feb 16, 2020)

Precious babies...such a good thing that you saved them. They will be growing fast now! In a week or less, they will be trying out hay and pellets!


----------



## Rosy (Feb 16, 2020)

ill send some more pics as soon as i can


----------



## Rosy (Feb 16, 2020)

@eacartmell1000 adorable! how old are they?


----------



## Julie&Bunnies (Feb 16, 2020)

Theo said:


> Ok, I know I already said this but they are so cute! I can't get over it! It makes me want babies, but I know I shouldn't breed rabbits.



Theo.... love the way you think! I don't know where you are located, but there is likely a way you can enjoy babies without contributing to the rabbit overpopulation crisis...but by helping instead. You could serve as a foster parent for a mother and babies. Contact your local shelter and rescue. I am sure they have bunnies they need help with. That way you have all the enjoyment without a permanent commitment, and you would be making things better instead of worse.


----------



## Cluckin'Bunny (Feb 16, 2020)

@Rosy - more pictures please? ****heart****


----------



## Pumpkin (Feb 16, 2020)

@eacartmell1000, That's so cute! How old are they? And are they lionheads?


----------



## Rosy (Feb 16, 2020)

some more pics of my fur babies


----------



## Rosy (Feb 16, 2020)

at what age can I take them out and really play with them?


----------



## Cluckin'Bunny (Feb 16, 2020)

@Rosy those are such cute babies! I'm not a rabbit expert at all so I have no idea.


----------



## BunBun71 (Feb 16, 2020)

@Rosy - That is so cute. 
Have a great night! 
- TheBunny7


----------



## Mamees (Feb 16, 2020)

Rosy said:


> they are getting so fat!
> not an awesome pic but just had to show you guys.View attachment 45166


They look to be about 2 1/2 weeks


----------



## majorv (Feb 16, 2020)

Rosy said:


> at what age can I take them out and really play with them?



I wouldn’t take them out and start playing with them until they’re close to weaning. You can check them each day and hold them some but it’s best if they stay with mom. The health of young kits can be fragile.


----------



## Mariam+Theo (Feb 17, 2020)

Julie&Bunnies said:


> Theo.... love the way you think! I don't know where you are located, but there is likely a way you can enjoy babies without contributing to the rabbit overpopulation crisis...but by helping instead. You could serve as a foster parent for a mother and babies. Contact your local shelter and rescue. I am sure they have bunnies they need help with. That way you have all the enjoyment without a permanent commitment, and you would be making things better instead of worse.


I didn't think of that! I will totally look into it! Now how to convince my parents...


----------



## Rosy (Feb 17, 2020)

@Mamees I think that they are a bit younger than that since their eyes have only opened this past Saturday


----------



## Spectacles (Feb 18, 2020)

We just had a litter of 8 kits born last Thursday, we don’t own a male so it was a massive shock, she must have gotten pregnant when she escaped last month, she was meant to be getting desexed next week, looks like that isn’t happening


----------



## Rosy (Feb 18, 2020)

omg @Spectacles ! how are they doing?


----------



## Rosy (Feb 18, 2020)

my little darlings!
they grow so fast! here are pics that were taken today.


----------



## Mariam+Theo (Feb 18, 2020)

Oh my gosh! This is just making me want a little rabbit! They are so cute!


----------



## helena (Feb 18, 2020)

Awwww they are sooo cute! Same @Theo


----------



## Rosy (Feb 18, 2020)

thank you guys!


----------



## JBun (Feb 18, 2020)

I actually took my kits out all of the time since the day they were born. It didn't bother my momma bun at all. I would just take the whole nestbox out. I was careful though, about handling them because they're so squirmy at that age, and I always washed my hands thoroughly first, before handling.

It was so much fun to bring them in and watch them play. I would set up a play area on the floor and they would popcorn and zip around having all sorts of fun. Of course its not really until about 3-4 weeks old where they start to do this.


----------



## Rosy (Feb 19, 2020)

@JBun, so its ok to take them out if taking the necessary precautions?


----------



## Pumpkin (Feb 19, 2020)

I would think so. Once they start hopping around and getting curious, I think you should start socializing with them and getting them used to humans if the mom permits. Just be careful with handling them and make sure they can't hurt themselves. I'm subscribed to a YouTube channel called Hook's Hollands and it seems like the owner plays with her baby bunnies a lot.


----------



## Rosy (Feb 19, 2020)

the babies have climbed out of their nest. should i put them back in? remove the nest?


----------



## JBun (Feb 19, 2020)

When my babies started climbing out, I cleaned the nest box out, then turned it on its side and put some hay down to create a little cubby hole for them to snuggle in. I also made sure the mom had something she could hop up onto to get away from babies wanting to constantly nurse from her, as she became totally frantic when all these baby bunnies started wandering around her pen.

I can't say what you should do, just what I did. I didn't have any problems taking them out and playing with them, and the babies are now grown up 7 year old bunnies. The important thing is just making sure the environment they'll be in is safe for them.


----------



## Rosy (Feb 20, 2020)

it isnt a real nest box. its a large litter pan repurposed for this... i dont think itll work for it. any other options? she does have a hidey hole connected to the side of the cage which doubles as a ledge so she can get away from her little ones if need be.


----------



## Rosy (Feb 20, 2020)

hey guys! i took them out for a little bit.


----------



## Rosy (Feb 20, 2020)

some more pics


----------



## Rosy (Feb 20, 2020)

and some more!


----------



## Rosy (Feb 20, 2020)

@Theo i wanted to post a video but it was too large


----------



## eacartmell1000 (Feb 21, 2020)

My seven babies are growing fast! I can't believe they've done so good. I bought a nesting box from tractor supply for $14 if anyone is needing one. Seems to serve the purpose. Here's the babies now. About 23 days old.


----------



## Mariam+Theo (Feb 21, 2020)

All the babies are so cute! And thanks for trying @Rosy!


----------



## Rosy (Feb 26, 2020)

the babies are doing well. They are nibbling at mom's hay pellets and greens (and the occasional bit of carrot or apple). Should i allow them to do this?


----------



## Rosy (Feb 26, 2020)

these guys are so active! they move so fast! it is really hard to take decent pictures of them!


----------



## Julie&Bunnies (Feb 26, 2020)

Rosy said:


> the babies are doing well. They are nibbling at mom's hay pellets and greens (and the occasional bit of carrot or apple). Should i allow them to do this?



Yes, the sooner the better for hay and pellets. It's far better to let them nibble and acclimate slowly while they are still primarily sustained by the mother's milk. Small bits of carrot and apple are okay, just not much at a time. Sugary produce is dangerous if they eat too much.

Congratulations, they are adorable!


----------



## Rosy (Feb 26, 2020)

ok. Thank you for the info @Julie&Bunnies! i appreciate it! 
Thanks!


----------



## eacartmell1000 (Feb 27, 2020)

Pumpkin said:


> @eacartmell1000, That's so cute! How old are they? And are they lionheads?



They're about a month old now. Yes, the doe is a lionhead and the sire is also a lionhead but his ears are lopped. Tried to load some photos but files were too big.


----------



## eacartmell1000 (Feb 27, 2020)

Doe(gray)
Sire


----------



## Mariam+Theo (Feb 29, 2020)

Please send more pictures @Rosy!


----------



## Rosy (Feb 29, 2020)

@Theo this is what happens when i try to take pics of them lol. here one second, gone the next. they move so fast!!!


----------



## Rosy (Feb 29, 2020)

here are some pictures that i managed to capture lol


----------



## Rosy (Feb 29, 2020)

trying to upload a short video. an error message pops up saying "the following error occurred: the uploaded file does not have an allowed extension." anyone have any idea why this is happening and how i can fix it?


----------



## JBun (Mar 1, 2020)

Very cute!

For videos you have to upload to a video hosting site like youtube, then post the link for it here.


----------



## Rosy (Mar 2, 2020)

thank you @JBun


----------



## Rosy (Mar 2, 2020)

the babies have started to poop all over the cage. (Now that I've finally litter trained the Mama  Is this normal? Also it seems that they are drinking quite often. I see them a lot at the water bottle. Is this ok?


----------



## Julie&Bunnies (Mar 3, 2020)

Yes, both are fine


----------



## Cloverhouse (Mar 3, 2020)

Baby bunnies eat some of mom's poops to get the bacteria they need in their guts. This allows them to eat the same foods mom eats because they have the same bacteria in them as she does. In other words don't keep the nest/cage ultra clean, they need to eat some of her droppings to adjust easily to a nonmilk diet. 

I've never had problems with even very young baby bunnies eating greens if they were allowed to eat mom's droppings, they were able to eat anything she was eating. That's been my experience. 

Lots of rabbit folks say NO greens ever until at least 6 months old, etc, but in nature, the babies are going to be eating mom's diet from the get go, so...

Don't introduce some brand new food or anything, but if mom's eating it, it should be ok for the babies in about the same ratio as she's eating it.


----------



## Rosy (Mar 4, 2020)

thank you for sharing your experience @Cloverhouse. I appreciate that you included an explanation in your answer. very helpful.


----------



## Rosy (Mar 4, 2020)

What are the chances of my doe being pregnant? If you have not read this thread from the beginning, here is some background. She was separated from the buck only once she had her litter. Its been about 25 days since I rescued her and her kits. She is not pulling any fur. Should I put in a nestbox just in case? If so, should I purchase one or is a litter box ok? Thanks in advance!


----------



## Preitler (Mar 6, 2020)

Hard to tell, having seen how horny and quick bucks can get at that occasion I would guess about 80%, but that's pretty much a random number, it depends on the characters of your rabbits too.

Anyway, better safe than sorry, prepare everything as if she's pregnant. Any box will do, a cardboard box too. I'm not sure if I would use a used litterbox, it's not that easy to remove the toilet smell completly.

Watch her closely, start to feed the older litter some kitchen oatmeal, that will help when you need to wean and remove them when the doe starts giving birth (I would take nestbuilding and fur plucking as a sure sign then).


----------



## Rosy (Mar 7, 2020)

Thank you for ur response @Preitler . Today she has started pulling fur. Should i remove the older babies at this point? In about how long should i expect the next litter? 
For the nestbox, what should i do? Should I put all her fur into it along with hay? It will have to be in a different spot than the the spot she has picked since there isnt enough room in that area. Is this ok? 
For the kitchen oatmeal, is it supposed to be cooked or raw? About how much do i give them?


----------



## Rosy (Mar 7, 2020)

i checked on them and discovered a newborn baby bunny. Is it wise to check on the nest (check how many babies etc) and put the whole nest in a box?


----------



## Rosy (Mar 7, 2020)

ok heres the story. 4 babies born in total. one was stillborn. another one is really cold- im trying to warm it up. the othere 2 look ok.


----------



## Preitler (Mar 8, 2020)

Yes, it's time to seperate, the old ones would raid the milk buffet, and can destroy the nest. Good luck with warming the little one up, a warm towel is one way, I just hold them to my belly under some layers of winter clothes. Even if a cold one looks dead, I still warm it up, you can't tell for sure until it's warm and dead.

Check the nest, remove soiled material, and make sure that the kits are well insulated and covered with lots of fur, and that there'S enough hay around.


----------



## Rosy (Mar 8, 2020)

i removed the babies as soon as i saw that the mom gave birth. 
One little one looks like he has blood on him. Im not sure what it is! S/he is sticking to things cuz of the blood or whatever it is. Is this dangerous? There is fur that got stuck and also the blanket i put in the nest box! How do i remove it from s/he? 
The mom has messed up the next box! she dumped all the contents onto the bottom of the cage! Why is she doing this?? Im going to put everything back in. Please help!


----------



## Julie&Bunnies (Mar 8, 2020)

A little trace amount of blood is okay, but from what you describe, I suspect the baby might have an injury. Please carefully inspect the newborn for cuts and scrapes. Mother rabbits sometimes accidentally injure babies, especially when two litters are present. You can gently dab at the blood with a warm, damp soft cloth, but don't get the baby cold. Warming up the cold baby is priority number one.
Mom is dumping the nest because she is hormonal or something has upset her. Just put it back. I would keep the babies away from her for an hour or two until she settles down and then put them back in the nest box.


----------



## zuppa (Mar 8, 2020)

Rosy said:


> i removed the babies as soon as i saw that the mom gave birth.
> One little one looks like he has blood on him. Im not sure what it is! S/he is sticking to things cuz of the blood or whatever it is. Is this dangerous? There is fur that got stuck and also the blanket i put in the nest box! How do i remove it from s/he?
> The mom has messed up the next box! she dumped all the contents onto the bottom of the cage! Why is she doing this?? Im going to put everything back in. Please help!


I think you don't panic, you make changes all the time and your mother rabbit gets stressed. It is very hard to advise as it is not clear without photos. I understand she lives in a 100 cm cage with her 2 babies from her previous litter 1 month ago and you removed older babies to stay somewhere else?

Please give us clear image of your situation as it is very difficult to suggest anything.

As I said in my previous comment it would be best to leave new nest in cage where it was and let her out to be somewhere in a playpen or somewhere with her older babies or in some other place she can spend her day, and let her into her cage to nurse her new babies in the evening, maybe she can stay in for night.

Make her environment less stressful, give her covers lots of hay and water, no loud people or dogs around etc, plenty of food and if you feel she needs more milk give her rolled oats. Give her some fresh herbs, mint, fennel, basil, coriander, some dried chamomile don't stress her out


----------



## Rosy (Mar 8, 2020)

here is a photo of the setup for now. the gray box is the nest box while the blue box is the litter pan. 
yes, she has been living with her older babies until now. I have put them in a different enclosure for now. 
The nest is in the cage but she keeps messing with it and uncovering the little ones. 
I will purchase another playpen for her. What do you recommend for a decent price?


----------



## Mariam+Theo (Mar 8, 2020)

I got my playpen at a yard sale for $5, but I doubt you will find one that cheap. Craiglist or Facebook Market place are always my go-to for used pet supplies. Just make sure that you clean anything you get with vinegar before you give it to the rabbits. I know you are kinda stressed out right now, but please don't forget to send pictures! You know how obsessed I am with little baby bunnies!


----------



## zuppa (Mar 9, 2020)

Rosy said:


> here is a photo of the setup for now. the gray box is the nest box while the blue box is the litter pan.
> yes, she has been living with her older babies until now. I have put them in a different enclosure for now.
> The nest is in the cage but she keeps messing with it and uncovering the little ones.
> I will purchase another playpen for her. What do you recommend for a decent price?


I also recommend to get secondhand check your local sites where people sell&buy secondhand, playpen or baby fireguards would be great and you can get really cheap sometimes in excellent condition like new. Of course you disinfect before you start using them.

I think this cage is too small and she has no room at all, no wonder she gets stressed. If this cage is high enough you can add a piece of wood to make a shelf for her it would give her some extra room, but in my experience those cages are rarely higher than 50 cm, but still you can add a little shelf.
If you don't have any other place to keep her you can remove the nest and put it into a large cardboard box (think like banana box or bigger) and place next to her cage that would make some kind of extension she will see her nest and you will let her out for nursing. But that will only work for the next couple weeks as after that kits will start exploring territory and will be able to get out from this temporary cardboard box anyway, you will need to build much larger gate so they can be all together. Where are her older kits at the moment, you said you removed them from the cage they are still 4 week old?


----------



## Rosy (Mar 9, 2020)

the cage shes in is 46.9 L x 22.8 W x 24 H in. 

What size pen is suitable?


----------



## Mariam+Theo (Mar 9, 2020)

Rosy said:


> the cage shes in is 46.9 L x 22.8 W x 24 H in.
> 
> What size pen is suitable?


That is too small. A playpen that has 8 walls on it and put it in a rectangle shape. (here is a link to one that would work, but is just expensive: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0758FX7MJ/ref=twister_B076PQMLFK?_encoding=UTF8&psc=1). I would put the food bowl and water bowl/water bottle in one corner, the litter box in another, and the nesting box in another corner. I would ditch the cage completely, or give it to the other babies along with your first playpen.


----------



## Augustus&HazelGrace (Mar 9, 2020)

You could also use the small cage as a litterbox!


----------



## Rosy (Mar 9, 2020)

Yes i understand that the cage is too small. Thats why i would like to purchase a pen for them. Thanks for the link @Theo . @Augustus&HazelGrace thats a good idea but i think its too big for a litter box...its not that small, its just too small for the bunnies to live in.


----------



## JBun (Mar 9, 2020)

If she keeps upsetting the nest, you can remove it from her area and just return the nest early in the morning and late in the evening when she normally would nurse them. Then once she does you can remove the nest box again.

She might be doing this because she is confused about the new babies and old babies. Or she's upset because she's missing the older babies. After she's nursed the new babies, I would consider letting her have some time with the older babies. Though initially I would be careful because if she's been separated from them too long, she could react negatively to being with them again and could even possibly injure them. So any sign of aggressive behavior and I would immediately stop the playtime and not try again.


----------



## Rosy (Mar 9, 2020)

@JBun I came down today and found that she had destroyed the fur on top of the babies and completely uncovered them. They were cold. And quite wrinkly. It doesn't look like she's taking care of them much, if at all.

i tried putting mom with her older babies today. it started off well with everybody minding their own business and a bit of grooming each other. not sure exactly what happened next, possibly the babies were trying to nurse but it it looked like she was on top of one and trying to hump it! i quickly separated them.


----------



## Rosy (Mar 9, 2020)

@zuppa here is a pic of the baby (4 weeks) bunnies enclosure. obviously, this is temporary


----------



## Rosy (Mar 9, 2020)

@zuppa this is what ive done for the mom to give her more space. Ive also left the cage open so she can go in and out as she pleases. is this ok? again, this is temporary until i find something suitable.


----------



## Mariam+Theo (Mar 9, 2020)

For the babies set up put a litter box in a corner and put some of the mom's droppings in the box. Here is a link on litter training: https://rabbitsindoors.weebly.com/litter-training.html. I suggest putting all of their hay in the litter box and replacing it daily. They will not eat hay that has been pottied on.

For the mom, I would remove the babies from the mom's cage and keep them under a heat lamp to keep them warm. Keep them in the nest she built for them but put a heating pad underneath if you have one. I would only put the babies in the cage at 7 A.M. and 7 P.M. so she can feed them, but remove them after they are fed. I would give them goat milk if they start to lose weight, and if the mom rejects them completely I would give them the rabbit formula I suggested for the first litter: https://www.amazon.com/Wombaroo-Rab...05vdExvZ0NsaWNrPXRydWU&th=1&tag=forumyield-20


----------



## JBun (Mar 9, 2020)

I'm guessing you already warmed the babies up. If she isn't nursing them, I would hold her on my lap and carefully bring the babies under her belly to nurse. This works better if you have someone to help, and it needs to be done carefully so no babies get injured.

Once the babies have been fed and the nest reconstructed with fur, there is no need for a heating pad or lamp, and actually shouldn't be used. Using those without the babies being able to move away from the heat if they get too hot, means they could overheat and could die. Something like that should only ever be used with caution, and with a part of the nest left cool so they can move from the heat if needed.


----------



## Mariam+Theo (Mar 9, 2020)

JBun said:


> Once the babies have been fed and the nest reconstructed with fur, there is no need for a heating pad or lamp, and actually shouldn't be used. Using those without the babies being able to move away from the heat if they get too hot, means they could overheat and could die. Something like that should only ever be used with caution, and with a part of the nest left cool so they can move from the heat if needed.


I didn't know this. @Rosy don't listen to what I said and just listen to Jbun.


----------



## Rosy (Mar 10, 2020)

Yesterday, the poor little one that was bleeding passed away. i fed a bit of goat milk to the remaining babies last night. This morning, i came down and another baby was out of the nest! sadly he didnt survive. down to one kit. how do i ensure that he stays warm?


----------



## Rosy (Mar 10, 2020)

@JBun the mom is a bit aggressive. any tips? im going to try what you suggested.


----------



## Julie&Bunnies (Mar 10, 2020)

Put the 


Rosy said:


> Yesterday, the poor little one that was bleeding passed away. i fed a bit of goat milk to the remaining babies last night. This morning, i came down and another baby was out of the nest! sadly he didnt survive. down to one kit. how do i ensure that he stays warm?


Put the baby in a high-sided cardboard box. Since there only one and no one to snuggle with to keep warm, I would use a blanket in the box. I have always used baby blankets with infants and never had it fail me. The mother might be knocking them out of the nest. I would keep the baby separate from the mother and only put them together to nurse twice a day, 12 hours apart. Sounds like Mom is hormonal and they can be unpredictable. Keep baby's box in the warmest room you have. After the new baby nurses, let the other two also nurse but supervise so she doesn't injure them. This will keep her milk supply going and prevent older babies from getting ill.


----------



## majorv (Mar 11, 2020)

Kits who aren’t being fed will leave the nest to go look for food. This leaves them vulnerable to getting cold if they don’t have enough fur yet. I would try doing what Jbun suggested and hold the doe while trying to let the kit nurse. 

The older kits are old enough to move to hay and pellets, especially if they were already eating Mom’s when you had to pull them from her. Given how she reacted to them I wouldn’t put her with them anymore.


----------

