# Buying whole bales of hay?



## mark (Jul 25, 2017)

Hello RO community!

There is a good thread going on the topic of hay storage, that I didn't want to hijack for my purposes. So, here we are with a new thread ... apologies if this topic was covered previously here. 

I should first say, that I am a HUGE FAN of SmallPetSelect.com. They are focused on providing high quality hay in manageable portions, via mail order, and have a great website and ordering process (in my experience). I just love them, their customer support team, and their product. So I recommend them wholeheartedly and will continue to purchase hay from them at least periodically. Their emails are sweet and fun, too!

I recently switched Kimchi from the alfalfa hay, which he LOVES and DEVOURS, to real grass hays. The vet said that it's time for him to switch, so he isn't getting an over-abundance of calcium. Specifically, I ordered the "sampler pack" from SPS, which included a second and third cutting of Timothy hay, oat hay, and orchard hay (grass). We are trying to find out what he likes among those types, at least.

I do have a few questions though. We are fortunate to live very close to a tack and feed store that sells, of course, full bales of hay. 

Caveat: please forgive me, I am a "city boy" as my dad would say (who is himself, a "city boy"  ), so while some of this may cause a "no duh - that should be obvious" kind of response to some, I really do not know!

So my questions are:

1. Can you typically find these different varieties of hay in full bales at feed stores? My only experience with hay bales is at old racetracks (I'm a motorcycle rider), and at pumpkin patches and county fairs. I now know that those are generally "oat hay" which is the large diameter, very coarse hay.

2. How much does a full bale of hay typically run? Or are the different varieties sold at drastically different prices?

3. For those who have purchased full bales, do you find that your rabbit(s) will continue to eat it, or do they get tired of eating "the same thing" for so long? Imagine us with one rabbit, with a half a bale of hay ... it would likely last most of his life (or a significant chunk, assuming we can keep the hay mold-free).

4. Does hay "spoil" or go stale over time, assuming you can keep it mold-free? (I think it gets stale right?)

5. How many times would you have to split up a single bale of hay, to make it into manageable chunks, for those of us who live in smaller places like apartments and condos? We are lucky to have a garage, but not a lot of extra space (for instance, we don't have a hay bale-size bit of extra storage space!). 

We have one friend locally who has expressed interest in splitting a full bale with us. But even half a bale would be too much I think (depending on the answers to my questions above). I may try to reach out to others nearby, or explore donating some to a rabbit shelter nearby.

Thanks in advance for your thoughts here!

Attached, a photo of Kimchi exploring his latest shipment of the sampler pack. :bunnydance:


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## Blue eyes (Jul 25, 2017)

mark said:


> So my questions are:
> 
> 1. Can you typically find these different varieties of hay in full bales at feed stores? My only experience with hay bales is at old racetracks (I'm a motorcycle rider), and at pumpkin patches and county fairs. I now know that those are generally "oat hay" which is the large diameter, very coarse hay.
> 
> ...



Here's that website about hay -- a good, thorough read. For example: green and leafy is not always the best choice for hay.
http://rabbit.org/hay-in-your-bunnys-diet/


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## RavenousDragon (Jul 25, 2017)

In terms of the getting sick of one type of hay (since blue eyes already said everything else) I've never had a rabbit get sick of a kind of hay either. You CAN (if you so choose) get a bale of say timothy hay, and then use that as the primary source of hay- but add in small 'treats' of other kinds from small pet select (e.g. orchard grass)- just to add variety (this is not necessary or anything, but it can be fun for the rabbits). We do this (we get bales from Oxbow though, which are not nearly as cheap- it's just the most convenient for us where we are) and it works very well!


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## mark (Jul 26, 2017)

Thank you both, Blue eyes and Ravenous Dragon, for your thoughtful replies! I am truly astounded at the cost of a full bale of hay! 

I love the suggestion of purchasing the big bale, splitting it with friends and rescues hopefully, and also continuing to support SPS (and Kimchi's very discerning palette) by continuing to buy "treats" and other types of hay to mix it up.


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## mark (Jul 26, 2017)

P.S.- that is a fantastic article on hay growing, harvesting, storage etc. from HRS - thank you Blue eyes! I love learning about things like that ...


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## LoveCrumb (Jul 26, 2017)

Hi Mark, that is one adorable bunny you have there.

First, I'd like to say how envious I am that you have access to Small Pet Select hay where you live. Up here in Canada, our hay options are very limited, and if you have a picky bunny like I do, it can be a nightmare. I'm currently looking into bales of hay as well myself, not for cost-saving (I'll pay almost anything for a hay that my rabbit will love) but maybe it'll be fresher and entice him more. I've tried stopping by one farm and one tack store with little success. I plan on taking a day trip down to the States and ordering some small pet select hay to my friend's place there if I continue to not have any success. 

From my experience (and from also keeping bunnies for many years) I have a few tips for you. First, make sure you know which type of hay the bales are. A lot of farmers sell bales that contain some alfalfa, and at this point, you don't want to continue feeding alfalfa to your bunny. Second, you want to know the date they were baled. I had a farmer try to sell me 2 year old hay that had lost a lot of its colour and nutrition and sunbleached hay, which has the same problem (You can tell by looking at/smelling the hay if it's fairly fresh- green and fragrant hay is fresher). The way they have stored the hay is also important. It should be stored indoors on a palette, off the ground, and away from the rain- this is a no-brainer for most farmers, but you never know. It should be sun-cured, which means that it has been adequately dried for safe mold-free storage. It is an absolute must that you buy hay that is at least horse-quality hay. Horse quality hay can safely be fed to rabbits because it has met the standard for being mold-free and is lower on dust (both things that are very dangerous to rabbits and horses). I've had little luck with horse-quality hay here because I've only found very rough forage, but I have a friend with a horse who says the hay is much more tender later in the season in 2nd and 3rd cut hay, so I'll be trying that around September/October when it's ready. 

So you probably already know this, but rabbits eat A LOT of hay. My guy is just over 5 pounds, and he goes through 9 pounds of hay in about 8-9 weeks, and yet the vet says he should be eating 9 pounds of hay in 4-5 weeks.

In addition, the older the hay gets, the less nutrition it has. I know people with rabbits who are okay feeding their bunnies hay that is up to two years old, at which point it will have lost a lot of its nutritional value. My guy is on a low-pellet diet so it's essential that his hay is fresh for maximum vitamin and nutrient retention. On top of that, a lot of bunnies just won't eat old hay. I have a hay connoisseur on my hands and hopefully you wont, but it's very common for bunnies to turn up their noses at old hay. Old hay just doesn't smell and taste as good as the fresh stuff, and since it doesn't contain much nutrition, why bother feeding it to them? 

I'm trying to buy as small a bale as I can find (smallest I've seen was about 15 lbs), but since it's incredibly cheep to buy baled hay, I intend on donating some of the bale to a rabbit rescue or animal shelter that houses bunnies if I find a good hay in a too-large bale.

Currently I buy 9lb bags of Oxbow Timothy and Orchard grass- two varieties and switching it up seems to improve his appetite for the hay. It's not necessary, but it's a good trick and nice for the bunny.


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## Blue eyes (Jul 26, 2017)

LoveCrumb, you may want to take a read of that hay article from the House Rabbit Society. It has lots of great info and may help you in your search for the right hay.

For example, it discusses why it just isn't true that 2nd or 3rd cutting is better. There are other factors that determine hay's quality and digestibility for rabbits. It also discusses why the greener, softer, more leafy hay is not necessarily what we should feed to our rabbits since that hay can be far too rich for the average bunny and lack sufficient fiber. I used to assume the softer and greener, the better. But this article has been most informative in correcting that myth. 

Worth the read. 

http://rabbit.org/hay-in-your-bunnys-diet/

Good luck with your hay search!


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## samoth (Jul 26, 2017)

I looked into this, as I work out in the country, and have asked some people who've been on/around farms. I turned out that it wasn't practical for my situation.

The biggest issue for me was transportation, as I only have a sedan, and not a pickup truck or SUV. Bales comes in different sizes, so I'm not sure which size bale I'd need to get. Regardless, I don't think I have the means to transport an entire bale myself.

The next issue was storage. I could store it in the garage, but it gets hot and humid in there during Michigan summers, and I wasn't sure how it would stand up long-term.

After having a collective nine pounds of house rabbit for almost a year now, I've found that they don't eat as much hay as I thought they would... though I go through 5x what they actually eat due to waste. I probably have 40 lbs (of a 60 lb box) worth of SPS timothy left from last September, as they didn't care too much for it. Presently I'm going through around one box of SPS clover/orchard hay each month (of course they want the most expensive stuff the company sells), with timothy and oat thrown in for variety here and there.

What you're suggesting is a great way to go if you can work out logistics and storage, and if your rabbit(s) like the hay. It's definitely worth a try if you can make it work.


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## LoveCrumb (Aug 5, 2017)

Blue eyes said:


> LoveCrumb, you may want to take a read of that hay article from the House Rabbit Society. It has lots of great info and may help you in your search for the right hay.
> 
> For example, it discusses why it just isn't true that 2nd or 3rd cutting is better. There are other factors that determine hay's quality and digestibility for rabbits. It also discusses why the greener, softer, more leafy hay is not necessarily what we should feed to our rabbits since that hay can be far too rich for the average bunny and lack sufficient fiber. I used to assume the softer and greener, the better. But this article has been most informative in correcting that myth.
> 
> ...



This really is an excellent article-I wish there were more like it on rabbit diets. I found it enlightening. At the same time, as the article refers to, first cut hay can be harvested at the wrong time where digestibility and palatability are too low, and this was the hay I was referring to seeing at the farm I went to. This hay was all thick stem, very pale and had little smell, it was difficult to break a piece of hay with my hands- such roughage wouldn't be accepted by most rabbits, let alone my picky one. As for timothy in the normal range of coarse, I wish I could get my rabbit to eat more of it, as I agree it adds the needed fiber. At the same time, my bunny's diet is almost 100% hay, and I have a vet visit on monday that might convince me to go entirely pellet-free, so the added nutrients of the leafy hay seem to help him maintain weight and good poops. For a rabbit with a more diverse diet, I could understand why this might be overdoing it. I'm going to print this article out and take it with me to the next farm I visit and see what they have to say about their hay!


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## BlackRabbits (Aug 9, 2017)

mark said:


> Hello RO community!
> 1. Can you typically find these different varieties of hay in full bales at feed stores? My only experience with hay bales is at old racetracks (I'm a motorcycle rider), and at pumpkin patches and county fairs. I now know that those are generally "oat hay" which is the large diameter, very coarse hay.
> 
> The bales at racetracks, fairs etc are actually straw which has usually been treated with a flame retardant. It should never be used as bedding or feed for animals. The company I get my bales from also sells this straw, as well as untreated straw. They sell a variety of types of hay. Here's their website to give you an idea. NOTE: I am in Canada, so their prices are in Canadian dollars.
> ...


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## mark (Aug 10, 2017)

Thanks for adding your experiences and thoughts, BlackRabbits! I will try to stop by our local feed place this weekend, to see what types of hay they sell, as well as how large the smallest bale is.


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## JBun (Aug 10, 2017)

It is possible to get good quality hay from feed stores of farmers, but you really do have to understand what makes good hay so you don't get stuck with a junk bale, which has still happened to me and I'm fairly experienced on knowing what to look for. The hard part when buying a bale is that you really need to get a look inside the bale to know if it's good and you often can't do that without buying the bale first. Good thing is most feed stores will let you return it if it ends up being bad in any way. If you can get a look at the inside of another bale that is already cut open, that would be good, or I have even bought the bale and opened it up in the trunk of my car while still there at the store, so I can return or exchange it without having to come back later to do it. Before buying the bale I will usually try and pry the flakes apart a bit, in the middle of the bale if it's not baled too tight, and stick my hand into it to see if it feels damp at all, and smell it to see if it smells musty or looks moldy.

Things to look for: lots of weeds, inside of the bale sunbleached where the hay is very yellow/brown and not very green(meaning the hay was over cured before baling, a little yellow is usually ok, a little bit of sunbleaching on only the outside of the bale is usually ok too as long as the hay wasn't also left out to get rained on), blackish or white spots(dry or wet) in the hay or on the outside of the bale(meaning the bale has been wet and gone moldy), the bale is abnormally heavier than the other bales(can mean the bale is wet inside), extremely dusty when dropped on the ground(could be dirt picked up from baling or can be due to mold, especially if the hay has a pale whitish cast to it and smells sour or musty), damp on the inside of the bale, sour or musty smelling. All of these things can be a sign of bad or poor quality hay, particularly signs of mold. You never want to feed moldy hay to a rabbit as it can make them extremely ill and even be fatal.

You want good quality horse hay that has never been wet. I like timothy or orchard grass, though any grass hay is usually fine. I like a medium coarse hay as the softer hay can be too rich, and the stalky bits are good for a rabbits digestion, as well as my rabbits particularly like the stalky bits. If you can take a small sample home first for your rabbits to taste test, I would suggest doing that, as I've found my rabbits can be very picky about their hay and some hay that looks great to me, my rabbits have turned their noses up at.


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## Pinky191 (Aug 10, 2017)

Hi, I cannot answer all your questions but I can share my experience. My bunny who I just got a month ago is 7 months old so this may not apply entirely if your bunny is older. My vet said as long as the hay is timothy or orchard and not alfalfa, it is fine. I got my bale at a local farm for $7.50. It is huge, I am storing it in a spare space in my home. As long as it is not exposed to moisture & has 'breathing' space (it should not be in a closed plastic bag, for example), it can last for a few years. My rabbit is not very enthusiastic about the hay, but I think it is because his previous owners fed his primarily a pellet diet...I might try to mix a different hay type in it to see if that will interest him more. You can do the same if you run into that issue, too. Good luck to you!


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