# Cause of kits born dead?



## Moonika (Apr 25, 2018)

I have a Netherland Dwarf doe that just had her second dead litter.
Her first litter consisted of two very large dead kits; which I expected.

But her most recent litter consisted of four, and they looked normal sized. She delivered two dead and then a few hours later two more were born dead. 
My question is why were they born dead? They looked normal sized and proportioned, and I don’t really know what the problem was.
Could it have to do with her age? She will be turning three in a few months.
Also, anyone know any tricks to dry up a does milk? She produced quite a bit and I don’t want her to develop mastitis.


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## Preitler (Apr 25, 2018)

Well, there's no way to tell for sure.
It could be that she has genetic problems, what do you know about the breeding line she's from? Unfortunatly some rare breeders seem value appearance or other traits more than health and perfekt mothering skills (shortsighted), or breeders that only multiply them for selling and don't care about that. There are things like inbreeding depression. But there are always some random failures, and you can't tell until seeing how they actually perform.

Why did you expect the first litter big and dead? That's a somewhat strange comment.

There are things like pinched hips that can be a problem. Or being too fat (imho high on he list). A high stress level (like another, very dominant doe) can cause problems (had that problem last year).

Well, 3 years is imho a rabbit in his best age, my best does are about 6 now - but, as far as I know, does should be bred in their first year, and at least once a year to avoid problems. That's just a rule of thumb though, no real rule or something.

I would count it as strike two, if something like that happens again I would retire her from breeding - no point in creating rabbits that may carry the same problems. Since she did improve I would try it again if there is a really, really good reason to do so, otherwise I would refrain.


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## Moonika (Apr 25, 2018)

Preitler said:


> Well, there's no way to tell for sure.
> It could be that she has genetic problems, what do you know about the breeding line she's from? Unfortunatly some rare breeders seem value appearance or other traits more than health and perfekt mothering skills (shortsighted), or breeders that only multiply them for selling and don't care about that. There are things like inbreeding depression. But there are always some random failures, and you can't tell until seeing how they actually perform.
> 
> Why did you expect the first litter big and dead? That's a somewhat strange comment.
> ...


I said I expected dead kits the first time around because the first litter commonly doesn’t work out in Dwarf breeds. 
As for genetics, I don’t know anything about her ancestors. She also doesn’t have pinched hips. 
The only thing I would suspect would be internal body fat? She was fed more than desirable early in life, and because of that she developed a dewlap. Other than that she is under 2 and a half pounds and is a fairly petite bun in general.


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## ladysown (Apr 26, 2018)

You can't always know why. I suspect due to the separation in birth times she's too narrow and shouldn't be bred


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## squidpop (Apr 28, 2018)

If she got pregnant with 4 babies I would have also thought they would have lived. 

Do you feed a really good quality pellet? I wonder if she could be deficient in some vitamin she needed? 

With my dwarf rabbits the only time I have had problems is when they only got pregnant with one or two babies. They went over the due date of 31 days— to 33 days and then the babies were too big and got squashed going through the birth canal. 

Every time my rabbits have had 3-4 babies they all lived. Even with the first time moms- I never had a problem.


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## Moonika (Apr 28, 2018)

squidpop said:


> If she got pregnant with 4 babies I would have also thought they would have lived.
> 
> Do you feed a really good quality pellet? I wonder if she could be deficient in some vitamin she needed?
> 
> ...


I don’t remember the brand of pellets specifically, but they work well for my other breeding/nursing does. She had her babies born on day 32. She had two babies right away but then a 2-3 hours later she had the other two. So could it have been the delay in birth?


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## squidpop (Apr 29, 2018)

Sorry its taken a while to respond. I wonder if she they got stuck. My rabbits have usually had all their babies within 1 hour.


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## Moonika (Apr 29, 2018)

By now that’s what I expect happened. I am breeding her one last time and if the litter is born dead that will be her strike three.


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