# breeding buck issues



## Out of this world bunnies (Mar 6, 2019)

my buck Comet (see my profile picture) is the one having issues, i put him in a cage with one of my does Venus and she wasn't cooporating at all (but thats normal for my does) so i was trying to get her to keep her tail up. And Comet was breathing really heavily and started having a runny nose (not nasty white or green stuff just clear) and i have issues with him and his nose in the past why i am so confused is its was not hot outside so why was he breathing so heavily, he also got no fall offs and he was mounting the wrong way towards the end, and i am worried if i should ever even breed him cause i don't want to hurt him cause he is my baby, please help me!


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## majorv (Mar 7, 2019)

If he was running around chasing after her that can wear them out. Before you use him for breeding you need to have him checked to make sure he doesn’t have snuffles.


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## Imbrium (Mar 8, 2019)

I don't have much help to offer but it's worth mentioning that you should always bring the doe to the buck (not put the buck in the doe's cage), as intact females are more territorial than males.


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## Out of this world bunnies (Mar 8, 2019)

Imbrium said:


> I don't have much help to offer but it's worth mentioning that you should always bring the doe to the buck (not put the buck in the doe's cage), as intact females are more territorial than males.


yeah, i have heard that but 1. my doe is a HUGE french lop and really heavy, 2. she hates being picked up and it really stresses her out, and i feel like if i pick her up and carry her she is less likely to breed ( i think her last home did not treat her well) like she is breathing rapidly, and hiding in the corner of her cage and sometimes squeal if i try and pick her up. So i resorted to moving him as a lightweight young New Zealand cause he is not even half as heavy as her, also he likes being carried.


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## Imbrium (Mar 8, 2019)

That makes sense... though if she's not cooperative when you bring him over, it could potentially be a territorial thing. Is it possible to open her cage/pen and encourage her to hop out of it and let them try mating immediately outside her cage? That's very sad that her previous home traumatized her like that - I bet she really appreciates having someone who is so considerate of her now!


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## Velveteen Lop (Mar 8, 2019)

Agree with both comments, check to make sure no snuffles, and you should ALWAYS bring the doe to the buck, especially with your buck being significantly smaller than the doe. If for any reason you can not move the doe, I wouldn't recommend breeding them. 
Sounds like she doesn't have a good temperament, and you'd need to be able to pick her up to trim her nails (she could really harm the babies with her nails) and check for any diseases that could be transmitted to the buck during the breeding, and just check her overall health. 
May I ask why you are breeding the two? Mixed rabbits are very hard to sell.


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## Out of this world bunnies (Mar 10, 2019)

Velveteen Lop said:


> Agree with both comments, check to make sure no snuffles, and you should ALWAYS bring the doe to the buck, especially with your buck being significantly smaller than the doe. If for any reason you can not move the doe, I wouldn't recommend breeding them.
> Sounds like she doesn't have a good temperament, and you'd need to be able to pick her up to trim her nails (she could really harm the babies with her nails) and check for any diseases that could be transmitted to the buck during the breeding, and just check her overall health.
> May I ask why you are breeding the two? Mixed rabbits are very hard to sell.


Okay, when i first got my buck and i didn't care what breed i got and didn't think of him being advertised as a "meat rabbit/freezer food" so i got him cause i thought he was cute and his babies would sell well, but then i realized it would be super hard to find good homes for the babies. At this point, most people would sell the rabbit and go on their merry way, but i am fully committed to my rabbits and as soon as that rabbit is placed in my hands i have committed to its full lifespan and i don't want to ever sell a rabbit that i have committed to. So i decided i would a get a doe that is "cuter" and more sellable and i will advertise the babies as "Lop mixes" no need to get into the father's side you know? maybe if the person is fully committed and a good home i will get into the fathers history. (also if this pair fails a have a mini rex pairing as well)


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## Popsicles (Mar 11, 2019)

If you’re unsure whether the babies will sell, why are you breeding them?


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## SableSteel (Mar 11, 2019)

Why not get a purebred lop buck and breed it to her instead? Just because you have the buck doesn't mean you need to breed him, and purebred rabbits tend to sell better than mixed breed rabbits. Or you could not breed her at all; there isn't a very large market for even purebred pet rabbits in most places (just the mini rex pairing should be able to produce enough rabbits to fill demand).
If your rabbit is too hard to handle and prone to stress to bring her to the bucks cage,_ I really don't think that's a trait you should be continuing_. Rabbits get more personality from their mother than their father imo, and you'll likely end up with babies that are prone to have a poor temperament when they reach adulthood (much of that is learned, but if they see their mother actively being scared of humans, that doesn't set a good example). French lops are usually a pretty calm breed, so there is no reason, in my opinion, to breed French lops with poor temperament (especially into pet lines, where temperament should be a huge factor in breeding choices)
About the original question, it sounds like your buck just got tired from all the excitement and effort, that can make them have clear discharge from their noise. Never bring the buck to the doe's cage, especially if the doe is big enough that you wouldn't be able to too easily separate them if a fight broke out.


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## Velveteen Lop (Mar 11, 2019)

SableSteel said:


> If your rabbit is too hard to handle and prone to stress to bring her to the bucks cage,_ I really don't think that's a trait you should be continuing_. Rabbits get more personality from their mother than their father imo, and you'll likely end up with babies that are prone to have a poor temperament when they reach adulthood (much of that is learned, but if they see their mother actively being scared of humans, that doesn't set a good example). French lops are usually a pretty calm breed, so there is no reason, in my opinion, to breed French lops with poor temperament (especially into pet lines, where temperament should be a huge factor in breeding choices)


Very true. I don't think that the babies will stay with their original owner for long, because of the poor temperament. They will likely get the bunny while it is cute and small for a child, then when the rabbit starts scratching or biting the child, they'll end up getting rid of it. 

As for the 'cute' factor, you mentioned your doe is HUGE and people buying for pets aren't very likely to buy a big rabbit. While I don't believe in people buying for looks, or on impulse (rather by temperament and what size is best for they lifestyle), I do think that your big, mixed, and poor temperament rabbits will have a hard time selling as anything. 

I would suggest getting a good, well-bred, known for good temperament, purebred pair of rabbits, with pedigrees if you're serious about this breeding thing. And from a reputable breeder too, not one of those mass backyard breeders.


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## cherylapbf (Mar 11, 2019)

I tend to agree, why breed them, there so many bunns in the humane society that are not treated like cats and dogs, once their few weeks(if they are lucky) are up they are put to sleep, unless someone like ORA or other rabbit organization steps up and rescue's them . Or eats them. maybe i'm just too soft but loving bonded pairs, a litter once in a great while or meat rabbits but the Easter bunny will sell and then be forgotten when they are big and half end up in the Humane society. Wow am I doom and gloom sorry.


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## Velveteen Lop (Mar 12, 2019)

cherylapbf said:


> Wow am I doom and gloom sorry.


Lol, not really. It's just the truth. Especially with kids wanting bunnies, they end up loose or in a shelter sooner or later.


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## Out of this world bunnies (Mar 12, 2019)

Popsicles said:


> If you’re unsure whether the babies will sell, why are you breeding them?


i was unsure BEFORE i got the doe, and for everyone else i already have a few people interested in their future babies. Plus Venus is not bad tempered or mean at all! she is just scared of being picked up from what her past owner(s) (i am her third home) did to her! i love her very much and she enjoys being pet and has never tried to scratch or bite me. (she has love nibbled but those don't hurt) she is very precious gentle giant C:


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## Imbrium (Mar 24, 2019)

It is worth considering that for every baby you sell that's one less bunny that could be getting adopted from a shelter... and the people who end up with the babies may not spay/neuter (which usually runs a couple hundred dollars at the vet but comes free with the adoption price on a shelter bunny). They might even dump their baby at the shelter when it hits those nasty hormonal teenage years and they find out just how expensive it is to get a rabbit fixed. At the very least, that cost is something I would recommend discussing with potential owners of the babies you hope to produce.

I guess what we're all trying to get at is that rabbits are the #3 most common pet in the US and, much like cats and dogs, there is a serious epidemic of rabbits in shelters. I myself just brought two home earlier in March, one of which had been there for five months (after being found abandoned in a park at 6 mos old) and there were numerous other rabbits waiting to be adopted as well.

ANY deliberate breeding of rabbits to be sold as pets inherently has a negative impact on the shelter rabbit problem *even* if none of those particular rabbits end up in shelters, simply because there are more homeless rabbits than homes seeking them. *Please bear in mind that in no way am I trying to say that "breeding is bad" or trying to shame anyone who breeds. I am not. *BUT... I think the vast majority of us here at RO (including both pet owners AND breeders) agree that breeding should be done with the best interests of both the rabbits and their respective breeds in mind (heck, even meat rabbit breeding is done carefully to select for certain traits).
*
In order to breed responsibly, there has to be some sort of gain or benefit to the rabbits/their breeds to offset the impact of adding to the pet rabbit population. *This is why people in this thread, many of whom I recognize as being responsible breeders and/or involved in the world of rabbit shows are putting so much emphasis on their advice to find purebred rabbits of known/proven lineage and excellent temperament if you want to breed. By doing so, you can help advance the breed(s) you choose to work with, contributing towards the goal of healthier, cuter, sweeter, happier rabbits, free of genetic defects and other unwanted traits.


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## Out of this world bunnies (Mar 26, 2019)

ll


Imbrium said:


> It is worth considering that for every baby you sell that's one less bunny that could be getting adopted from a shelter... and the people who end up with the babies may not spay/neuter (which usually runs a couple hundred dollars at the vet but comes free with the adoption price on a shelter bunny). They might even dump their baby at the shelter when it hits those nasty hormonal teenage years and they find out just how expensive it is to get a rabbit fixed. At the very least, that cost is something I would recommend discussing with potential owners of the babies you hope to produce.
> 
> I guess what we're all trying to get at is that rabbits are the #3 most common pet in the US and, much like cats and dogs, there is a serious epidemic of rabbits in shelters. I myself just brought two home earlier in March, one of which had been there for five months (after being found abandoned in a park at 6 mos old) and there were numerous other rabbits waiting to be adopted as well.
> 
> ...


okay, i understand where you are coming from but i try and keep in touch with everyone i sell a bunny to, I also heal it the fact rabbits (if not being bred) they NEED to be neutered/spayed and i am a huge supporter of that, but in my state there is not a huge amount of "rehoming rabbits" as if you browse craigslist it is all breeders selling their babies and i have only found 1 rabbits shelter in my entire state and i am not even sure if it is open still. I don't want to breed rabbits all my life (actually i am homeschooled and still in school and its kind of for school so as soon i move out i am gonna neuter/spay all my rabbits and keep them for the rest of their lives in their own room C


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## zuppa (Mar 26, 2019)

Out of this world bunnies said:


> ll
> okay, i understand where you are coming from but i try and keep in touch with everyone i sell a bunny to, I also heal it the fact rabbits (if not being bred) they NEED to be neutered/spayed and i am a huge supporter of that, but in my state there is not a huge amount of "rehoming rabbits" as if you browse craigslist it is all breeders selling their babies and i have only found 1 rabbits shelter in my entire state and i am not even sure if it is open still. I don't want to breed rabbits all my life (actually i am homeschooled and still in school and its kind of for school so as soon i move out i am gonna neuter/spay all my rabbits and keep them for the rest of their lives in their own room C


Hi, not judging or anything here just wondering can you make a living on selling bunnies? I've got an impression that you actually need to spend a lot of money during those two months before you can actually start selling them, also I think when people buy rabbits from a breeder they want them to be at least vaccinated so that would add cost if you got six kits and would need to feed them, train them and pay for vets would the price paid by buyer really cover that and also it is very time consuming I believe.


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## Popsicles (Mar 26, 2019)

Agree with poopy poo, please bear in mind you are likely to be out of pocket - you will end up spending far more on food, vet bills, and enclosures for all your bunnies than you will make from selling mixed breed pet bunnies.


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## woahlookitsme (Mar 26, 2019)

I do have a question though. Are you in middle or high school by chance? 

If so I highly recommend getting into rabbit showing or at least look into showing. I started late I’ll admit with my senior year of high school but from showing bunnies that year I was able to pay for one semester of my full time schedule at college. It really is a great experience and you make so many friends who all have the same love for rabbits that you do!

Just a suggestion


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## Out of this world bunnies (Mar 27, 2019)

Poopy Poo said:


> Hi, not judging or anything here just wondering can you make a living on selling bunnies? I've got an impression that you actually need to spend a lot of money during those two months before you can actually start selling them, also I think when people buy rabbits from a breeder they want them to be at least vaccinated so that would add cost if you got six kits and would need to feed them, train them and pay for vets would the price paid by buyer really cover that and also it is very time consuming I believe.


my rabbit breeding is more of a "school project" and kind of a buisness my parents pay for most of the fees, i breed and sell mini rex's and i sell them from 25-30 dollars and if i have a litter of two thats 60 dollars (i have only had 2 litters one solo baby and 2 in the same litter) but really the only money we spend on them is for food, litter, alfalfa so not alot of fee's (food is 9 dollars, litter is 7, alfalfa is 7) so 23 dollars every month and a half.


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## Popsicles (Mar 27, 2019)

Yes you’re right, it stays fairly cheap when you only have two babies, and when everything goes smoothly. But in the event that things go wrong and you need a vet, or you have a litter of 9 babies, thins start to get pricier. Just warning you, because it’s not uncommon that we have people on this forum who make the choice to breed but then don’t put any money aside for vet fees etc, leading to rabbits suffering.


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## Augustus&HazelGrace (Mar 27, 2019)

I also breed and sell mini rex and you should be having at least 6 in each litter. Is your buck or doe super small? I also breed and sell for my FFA SAE (Supervised Agricultural Experience).


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## Out of this world bunnies (Mar 28, 2019)

Popsicles said:


> Yes you’re right, it stays fairly cheap when you only have two babies, and when everything goes smoothly. But in the event that things go wrong and you need a vet, or you have a litter of 9 babies, thins start to get pricier. Just warning you, because it’s not uncommon that we have people on this forum who make the choice to breed but then don’t put any money aside for vet fees etc, leading to rabbits suffering.


thank you for the warning!


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## Out of this world bunnies (Apr 10, 2019)

Augustus&HazelGrace said:


> I also breed and sell mini rex and you should be having at least 6 in each litter. Is your buck or doe super small? I also breed and sell for my FFA SAE (Supervised Agricultural Experience).


usually she has 4 but 2-1 is the survival rate so far, only have had two litters so far.


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## Out of this world bunnies (Apr 10, 2019)

Out of this world bunnies said:


> usually she has 4 but 2-1 is the survival rate so far, only have had two litters so far.


correction my most is 5 born 2 survived, that was her first litter tho, and in my more recent one she had 3 1 peanut 1 "healthy" stillborn and 1 survivor


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## Out of this world bunnies (Apr 10, 2019)

Augustus&HazelGrace said:


> I also breed and sell mini rex and you should be having at least 6 in each litter. Is your buck or doe super small? I also breed and sell for my FFA SAE (Supervised Agricultural Experience).


and also my doe is kind of small? i have no clue where she came from but her head and ears are really tiny for her body this is her:


a blurry photo of the dad:


the dad is a pedigreed chinchilla/mini rex and he is from a really good breeder and out of all the babies (even the stillborns) they had 2 black otters 2 chinchillas 1 ruby eyed white/ albino (it had white whiskers so i am pretty sure it was an albino) and 2 charlies/some sort of broken color? it was white with grey ears paws and little masks on their eyes? no clue what it was so i know they can throw alot of colors i am rambling i love talking about them to people who actually know what they are talking about lol


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## Watermelons (Apr 11, 2019)

Point blank. You should not be breeding rabbits with unknown histories!
If you are not going to breed to "Better the Breed" you should NOT be breeding at all. This is extremely irresponsible.


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## Crazybunnylady27 (Apr 11, 2019)

Hi there I'm going to try and give you advice on your original question rather than get into the debate about breeding rabbits. I bought a lionhead buck from an irresponsible breeder - they had used him to stud and decided to move on to Holland Lops so were selling him cheap online. I could see from the photo he wasn't in great shape so I picked him up combed out his matted fur (quite a few bits needed cutting out) and trimmed his nails. With the hair out of his eyes I could see they were a bit weepy and his nose was damp too. No colour or lumpy discharge but similar to what you may be seeing. I took him to the vet and they confirmed he had pasteurella, he has had an eye flushing and is on eye drops but looking much better for it. 

Infections like these can be quite contagious and I would recommend taking your little fluff for a full vet check before considering any mixing of him with your current rabbits - for breeding or otherwise. You could end up with lots of vets bills if he passes on something nasty to his mate.

If you're then 100% sure you'd like to breed him I would try and get them into a neutral area or in his hutch. Females that don't want to be breed can do a lot of damage to the buck if not supervised properly. 

Sorry to hear that you haven't had many survivors in your litters. Can I ask what your nest set up is?


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## Velveteen Lop (Apr 11, 2019)

Watermelons said:


> Point blank. You should not be breeding rabbits with unknown histories!
> If you are not going to breed to "Better the Breed" you should NOT be breeding at all. This is extremely irresponsible.


Before I start, let me state that I do not want to start an argument, or a heated conversation. I just want to educate and help you understand, as you sound like you really love rabbits and want to do things right. I also admire your maturity in this forum, taking the advice with good comments. 

I just have to say, I do agree with this. Us breeders trying to improve the breed get bashed all the time by 'animal rights activists' or 'rescue groups' because of people who breed irresponsibly, for the money, because baby bunnies(!!!), or by not doing the research and don't get good quality rabbits with a good pure pedigree, and buying rabbits to breed that do not conform with the ARBA standards. 
I understand you want to breed, but in order to do so responsibly, find a local breeder in your area that breeds the breed you are wanting to work with and have them mentor you. Get good quality rabbits, that the breeder can answer all sorts of questions on like their weight, if they're proven, litter history, temperament and so on. Be prepared to spend $80+ for these rabbits. It is worth it to have good rabbits. Do research, lots and lots! There is so many good websites out there on breeding Mini Rex's and great color guides too! 

In regards to @Augustus&HazelGrace comment, Mini Rexs actually can have peanuts, since they are a dwarf breed and carry the dwarf gene. And let me just put it out there, a pedigree isn't really history on the rabbit. Sure, it tells you their lineage, but not if any health problems (or litter survival rates, if he/she is a good brood animal, if the doe is a good mother and so on) arose in the parents, or grandparents, or even the rabbit itself. You can only get that from a breeder who's willing to talk to you and give you information, a 'responsible' breeder. 

Again, I don't want to cause any arguments or turn this into a heated conversation. Just want to help inform people. If you've got any questions, @Out of this world bunnies I'd be more than happy to help you!


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