# Questions about breeding



## greenxfairy (Nov 17, 2013)

I have two holland lops, the doe is 11 months old and the buck is 10 months old. I've been trying to breed them for about three weeks and the doe doesn't accept the buck. At first she would mount him and hump him, then she lunges at him and sometimes tries to bite him. Even when he mounts her, she won't lift for him. I tried to cover her eyes and push her bottom up but it didn't work.

Today, the buck managed to mount but from my angle I couldn't see if she lifted her tail. About five seconds later, he squealed and fell off. I know this would mean that he has ejaculated but I was wondering if its possible that he did it on her fur instead of inside her? Or would he only managed to eject if it was inside? 

I wanted to allow him another mating just in case and he seemed ready to go again a half a minute after but she wouldn't accept him so I separated them as she seemed to be getting more aggressive. 

Sorry for the ton of questions, am new at this.


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## RabbitGirl101 (Nov 17, 2013)

We all start somewhere What type of breeding were you doing?

I personally prefer a table breeding it is easier to control the doe and ensure that she lifts. You can rebred her for about a day after the initial mating. Basically just put the pair on the table and just gentle handle the doe to keep her in place (Put a hand over her eyes) If she is not lifting then you can encourage her to lift by tapping around that "area". Once the breeding has taken place and the buck has fallen off. You can check to see if she is pregnant or if aimed correctly in multiple ways. The first way is to flip the doe over and check around her part. Usuaully it is wet. I usually like to rub the does stomach and just make her more relaxed. Another way is wait two weeks and palpate for babies. Or you can just wait 28-32 days and see if she delivers or makes a nest and if she doesnt then rebreed her. At 28 days you should be able to feel the babies when you palpate and you should notice and increase in weight and the stomach usually seems round.


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## majorv (Nov 17, 2013)

It sounds like he bred her once. You can try to help by lifting her rear end but if her tail isn't up it doesn't do much good. She could be pregnant after one mating, but unless you know what you're doing, I don't recommend trying to palpate her.


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## greenxfairy (Nov 18, 2013)

Thanks for the quick replies! I tried the table breeding thing but he wouldn't approach the doe when my hands were there. I've heard that babies can die if they hit a "wiring" on the cage floor in certain hutches etc. I was wondering, it's not cold where I live about 50 degrees F usually and there is bedding on my doe's cage, if she gives birth without building a nest will the babies still die if there is no box for them?


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## majorv (Nov 18, 2013)

Some bucks won't approach the doe if your trying to help. Newborn kits can die if they're kindled on the wire at any temperature. They can get too cold, too hot or get stepped on. They can die from exposure if she has them in the box and doesn't cover them. Yes, 50 degrees is cold enough for them to die. I suggest you offer her a nestbox at 28 days and put some hay in it. Just watch her close and you may be able to save them if she kindles outside the box or doesn't cover them.


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## Rosies Rabbitry (Nov 22, 2013)

I have been showing, breeding and raising Holland Lops for less than a year now so I am no expert. My first several attempts at breeding ended up with no live ones. Being born "on the wire" just means that the doe had them out of her nest box. I was finally able to have a live kit with my second litter of a young doe. She had it out of the nest box and did not even remove the sac it was born in. I got home just after she had given birth. I removed the sac, held it in my hand, blew in its face and did some very light one finger CPR. Within about a minute I cot a cough so I started to massage the babies belly simulating the moms licking. I got 2 more coughs and she is now doing great. 

I sold her along with 3 others at a show 2 weeks ago and have felt so guilty ever since. She went to a good home and I hope that the young 4H'er enjoys her and she does well as a first Holland Lop for him.





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## Back2Basics (Nov 25, 2013)

We've had such luck with breeding we had 2 accidental litters. We didn't separate the babies in time. We lost a week in our coop development due to severe flu, but I digress.

Our first doe had the babies on the wire. In fact 3 of them fell out of the cage and onto the floor. They were all alive when I found them, and she only lost 1 from the litter. The second doe we gave a nest box and she kindled the next day. She had 5 live, and 1 stillborn. 4 died, I don't think she was feeding them. We learned that their skin shouldn't have wrinkles. We gave her survivor the the first doe, who raised all 8 successfully.

From what you describe it sounds like the breeding was successful. They do suggest you turn the doe over and check her afterward to see if his aim was right, but it's too late for that. Put a box in 28 days from when you did it, and you'll be doing all you can.

Keep us updated! Kits are so much fun, and they grow so fast!


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## greenxfairy (Dec 19, 2013)

Thanks everyone for the replies  she didn't get pregnant from the first breeding and I read online that apple cider vinegar helps get them in the mood? So I tried putting a drop into her water and it worked!! She stopped acting aggressive towards the male and let him breed her  I let him breed her twice and she definitely lifted! After that I separated them and tried a rebreeding within 6 hours. It's the 14th day of her supposed pregnancy now and I've tried palpating (based on youtube videos and ARBA instructions) but I can't feel pellets or faeces or anything except fats on her belly and her nipples. I guess it may be cause I'm inexperienced so I'll just put in a nest box on the 28th day and see how things go from there. Was wondering if it's okay to use a nest box made out of a shoe box? I'm really excited and hope that she is pregnant.. fingers crossed!


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## majorv (Dec 19, 2013)

The shoe box needs to be big enough for her to turn around in and allow the kits to gather toward the back without mom stepping on them. It can be used but don't be surprised if the doe starts chewing on it. Plastic would be better...metal or wood are optimal.


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## greenxfairy (Jan 5, 2014)

Hi all  Happy new year and a belated Merry X'mas! She gave birth to 4 live kits this morning! They all seem healthy, though one is a little smaller than the others and I worry it may be a runt... it's not MUCH smaller though so maybe its just me being paranoid. I tried to look at their bellies, they're a little wrinkled but I read somewhere that sometimes the doe might not feed the kits for the first 2 days? Was wondering if that's true or not. And if there are any other important things that I should be doing or things to look out for... 

I'm currently feeding the doe showmaster rabbit feed, timothy hay and alfalfa hay as well as making sure she has plenty of water. The kits are in a metal nest box (I read online that it can cause spay legged-ness but the place I bought the nest box from only carried metal nest boxes.) The doe pulled a great amount of fur so I'm sure they're nice and warm... it's about 25 degrees C or 78 degrees F here usually. I placed the kits at the back of the nest box and covered them with a bit of fur, but I was worried about covering them too much cos was scared the doe wouldn't be able to see them or that they might get tangled in the fur and miss a feed or etc. Then again, am also afraid that if I don't cover them enough they'll get too cold. Hahaha. Anxiety level's a little crazy.


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## majorv (Jan 5, 2014)

Your doe should feed them within about 24 hours kindling. They won't last much past 48 hrs without being fed. A metal nestbox is okay. Does it have a wood floor? If not, I would put a piece of cardboard on the bottom and then put shavings and/or hay over that.make sure the kits are in a little hole towards the back of the nest. Don't be afraid to cover them. Mom will know they're there. You just don't want to overheat them since its a little bit warm there.


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## greenxfairy (Jan 6, 2014)

Okay thank you... I've got 2 runts, or one may or may not be a peanut. His ears and legs look fine, but his skin is all wrinkly even after I let him do a supplemental feeding for like 3 mins. His stomach got a bit bigger and he looks fine from above but it was still really wrinkly below. Sorry for all the blurry pictures. The pink colored one is the one who could be either a runt or a peanut.

The little black one is a runt but when I do supplemental feeding for him, I can feel his tummy getting bigger around my fingers, whereas not so much for the other one. The mom's been getting testier and testier with me lately, guess she hates doing the extra feedings and the first few days she didn't mind me checking the nest box but today she did. I definitely want to save the runts if I can but she seems to be only feeding their 3 bigger siblings.


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## majorv (Jan 8, 2014)

If mom is getting testy with this then try supplementing with some goat's milk. However, a peanut rarely lives very long. The runt might have a better chance. Sometimes you just have newborns that fail to thrive and there isn't anything you can do about it.


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