# Little Miracles Rabbit Rescue (EDIT: STOP THE NEGATIVITY!)



## maxysmummy

*NOTE FROM ADMIN: This forum has investigated these claims against LMRR and concludes their has been no abuse and that the rescue has saved the lives of many rabbits. 
 
Whatever shortcomings the rescue may have had does not by a longshot deserve the level of vitriol leveled at them by the small but obsessive group launching these attacks.** Additionally, the group now appears to be attempting to derail rescue projects even if it means harm to the rabbits. 

Because the group is now linking this thread to promote yet another personal attack, we are asking them publicly to refrain from using our forum. 

*_*Please join us in asking them to stop wasting valuable energy on this negativity and redirect their considerable efforts to HELPING rabbit rescues instead of trying to shut them down!
*_
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I normally don't get involved with naming and shaming but this story touched my heart and i havent been able to get it off my mind.

being on the other side of the world it's hard for me to do anything so i couldn't live with myself if i didn't spread awareness about whats happening.

apparently the person who runs this shelter is a hoarder masquerading as a bona-fide rabbit rescue. i'm not going to go into details as the pictures speak for themselves.






















For more pictures and information go to:

facebook.com/horrors.lmrr

i'm sorry if this is disturbing to you guys, i just couldn't keep this information to myself. who knows, perhaps with the collective shout of all of us, we can speak for the bunnies and hopefully save some lives.


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## Pipp

I'd think (and research) very carefully before supporting and promoting this type of negative vendetta. 

There are two sides to every story. I don't know any of these people, but I'm a journalist. We never believe anything at face-value. This campaign against Little Miracles has been going on for quite some time, and it appears to originate with one person, or a small group, the ever-present disgruntled ex-volunteer segment of the rescue world. 

EVERY rescue has passionate people volunteering who always think things can/should be done better. The most reputable groups will have detractors. If a detractor just happens to have a a lot of time on their hands and a great sense of marketing, the results can be a pretty massive - and very one-sided - hostile campaign. Like this one. 

I'm in the middle of a few huge rescues, including a whole herd of giant meat rabbit babies, and the photos on the Facebook site look a heck of a lot better than my place. I cannot put a huge bowl of water down for the big guys without them drinking it all almost immediately. After two or three (big) bowls in a row, they'll leave some water in it, but within minutes, a bouncy juvenile (or 10) will have landed in it or flipped it over. The food bowl will always be empty. (Even my single guys will eat all their pellets in one sitting).

I'm slowly socializing them, and I'm not going to pick them up to clip anybody's nails until they know they're safe in my care. One of the babies is extremely skinny and after a week of providing supplemental nutrition and other care, he is still ridiculously thin. (He will be going to a vet). There has been a week-long photo opp here in the meantime. 

I have a young feral cat here being fostered. She's started off by stalking the bunnies, and I just watched. They ignored her -- rabbits seem to be able to differentiate predators -- and now they're playing together. (It's really cute!) 

I'm sure pictures of most rescues taken at inopportune moments will look the same as any of these. 

Do I think she runs one of the better rescues? No, I'd probably give them a 5 out of 10 based on a past incident years ago where she did get in over her head, cages that aren't the best housing (although the majority of owners and rescues use 
them). Do I think LM in can do a better job? With help and funds, yes, of course. 

Rescue is a very hard job. Physical labor hard. And time-challenged. 

Kris appears to be good at getting vet care and caring for the rabbits, she gets them spayed/neutered, she's good at fundraising, seems to be good at organizing volunteers, and she seems to be able to largely ignore the ridiculous rescue politics. 

I'd guess the SPCA and/or any other responsible org agrees, because you can bet your booties whoever is behind this ridiculously aggressive campaign has called them on numerous occasions. I have to assume they have checked out her rescue efforts (both in Florida and NJ) and have not taken any action. 

By pursuing this campaign, the instigators are in effect trying to change this by ensuring the funds and support WILL dry up and she will have trouble caring for them. This is a self-perpetuating story. 

What people have to ask themselves is what is best for the rabbits. I'm sure many of her rescues (if not most) were abandoned in the streets or on death row at shelters. If they weren't with Kris, where would they be? 

If this person succeeds in shutting LMRR down, what are the chances the rabbits will be moved to a better place? I don't know any rescues who can take more than a couple more house bunnies. The SPCA has a history of euthanizing rabbits they deem 'sick' (ie: needing vet care). The county animal control can come in and seize them, and chances are good they will be killed or at least locked up in cages smaller and starker than the ones they're in now. 

The best course of action is to campaign vigorously to get support and volunteers for the rabbits, not to stop support. 

If people are concerned about the accusations re: misuse of funding, then donate food and supplies, donate/open an account at her vet clinic or round up volunteers to go help clean, feed and water. They can also monitor the situation. 

Take POSITIVE steps. 


sas


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## maxysmummy

i did attempt to get both sides of the stories but in my opinion there are far too many ex volunteers who had similar stories despite not knowing each-other. 

it's not the empty food bowls that's the main concern, it's the thick dirty urine soaked floor


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## tonyshuman

Your best bet will be contacting the local SPCA or Humane Society to have someone visit. I would find out what the county is that the rescue is in, mention that you've heard a great deal of bad stuff, and ask that they do a check-up. Alternatively, if they're very far from you geographically, try to convince an ex-volunteer to make a report with the local SPCA/Humane Society/county animal control officers.


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## Nela

I'm always very skeptical when I see these types of posts. It's just soooooo easy for a disgruntled volunteer or adopter to use things against the shelter. Do we have any proof that these pictures are pictures of the conditions AT the shelter? Is it possible that these pictures were actually taken when the rabbits were first brought to the shelter? 

In any case, even if one person runs the shelter... If there are volunteers, wouldn't they have been taking care of the animals? How would it have gotten like that?

I'm not saying it did, or it didn't. What I am saying is that I am very careful about taking sides when it comes to these situations. I don't have any experience with that shelter at all. I cannot say I have seen itwith my own eyes. 

I personally do not see why anyone would run a shelter if they were going to mistreat animals. Something just doesn't quite fit...

Thank you Pipp for your post.


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## maxysmummy

there is a mental illness to do with animal hoarding

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Animal_hoarding


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## Nancy McClelland

ray:


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## pla725

I'm attending the open house this weekend to check out the situation myself. The vet that my rescue uses is also involved with this rescue. I doubt she would be involved if the situation is as bad as others have alleged.


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## tamsin

In this situation, I always advise people 

1. Visit the rescues and make your own mind up
2. If after a visit you think there is a problem then 

a. if it's series you should contact the appropriate authorities
b. if you think its a result of lack of funds/volunteers see where you can help out

You'd think photos, as a visual form of evidence, would be useful but they can be very misleading.

Take photo1, for example, that cage is bare of any litter but look top and right, those have fairly clean looking wood shavings down. If the cage wasThat's a lot of poop but buns poop a lot and that's probably a weeks worth at most. It looks like a cage mid clean. An empty food bowl isn't really an issue (mine rabbits don't even have food bowls let alone empty ones) and the water bowl can't have been empty long as there is water pooled on top that looks like its from being tipped over recently. The bun doesn't look particularly underweight in this. There is also a toy and a clean looking blanket.

Pic 2: A skinny rabbit - good rescues have those all the time too as they come in that way, and it's pictured on a lovely fresh looking tray of hay.

Pic 3: Long tails yes, but fluffy white feet - that suggests a cage that has been keep very clean. If it was living in a cage that looked like pic 1 it would have stainned toes. Again rescues have buns with long nails come in all the time. Same with pic 3. A rabbit with an issue like this make take several week to resolve or be that way permenatly depending on the cause.

I can't see photos etc. via facebook but these are certainly not what I would count as conclusive.


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## RosL

*maxysmummy wrote: *


> please someone reply, little miracles rabbit rescue needs to be shut down


You never spoke a truer word.

Having followed accounts of the things that go on in the hands of this woman for years now, she is a hoarder and cares nothing for the rabbits. The photos are just a small example.

Rabbits deserved far better than this and somebody who exploits her role as an *alleged* rescuer when the rabbits are living in filth and squallor, needs to be stopped :X

She has just set up anew (again) in NJ after having lived there with her parents years ago, the rabbits at their home being in such a dreadful condition that she eventually fled to FL...and the rabbits that OTHER RESCUES had to liberate from the parents' home were in dire condition. In Fl....well, she did a lot of fundraising and had a lot of visits to Hawaii!..and the photos shown were taken at the 'rescue' there. BTW she left behind a load of guinea pigs when she left...which she *claims* she's going back for.

The new place she has in NJ now has a lot of volunteers and is clean SO FAR....but give her time and the unfortunate rabbits she has are going to go through the same sorry saga as their predecessors.

It's time people took notice of this. This woman is a hoarder and bad news for the rabbits.


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## bunneezz

Hi everyone,

I am a former volunteer from the FL lmrr in 2009. I left their as a volunteer on MY own...was not fired or told to leave. I'm not a different rabbit rescue w/ a vendetta. I left because the pres. Kristie Corson aka Christie Corson, Bunny Rescue, was not caring for the rescue and abusing the donations. I agree w/ everyone, that these situations need to be researched carefully...and I'm at fault for not researching LMRR more before I started donating time and money. Because I'm so gullible when it comes to rabbits...I fell for lmrr! I found lmrr on the web and began following the rescue. I went to FL grand opening in 2009 and everything looked great!!! I was impressed....not too many rabbits, clean cages, ect. I started volunteering...driving 2 hours to get there. The first time I went to vol....things were different!! Before I even opened the door to the rescue...I could smell the urine. Inside was a mess. The number of rabbits in the rescue building grew! I just thought to myself...ok, she's busy and got behind. Ex-volunteers tried to warn us in the beginning....but we thought they were wrong. Every time I went there conditioned were the same. The rabbits lived in their own waste. The rabbits would be standing on their tippy toes begging for food and water. Many had fleas and ear mites. Many were sick! I would donate money, food, hay & litter. I kept going because there to help the rabbits!! not Kristie!! A group of volunteers would spend over 8 hours there just doing the basics. Kristieâs own pets were in the same conditions in her house! There were dead rabbits in the freezer!! 

PETA, The Humane Society, North Port and Sarasota police and animal control were all contacted. Kristie at that time was a Police Officer...and she used that to her power. 

Why would I want to shut down this rabbit rescue? Because those rabbits are suffering!

To address some of the other comments:
_
"This campaign against Little Miracles has been going on for quite some time, and it appears to originate with one person, or a small group, the ever-present disgruntled ex-volunteer segment of the rescue world." "EVERY rescue has passionate people volunteering who always think things can/should be done better. The most reputable groups will have detractors. If a detractor just happens to have a lot of time on their hands and a great sense of marketing, the results can be a pretty massive - and very one-sided - hostile campaign. Like this one." _This "campaign" originates from Ex- volunteers and concerned citizens. We are not "detractors" with a lot of free time...yes we are passionate...passionate about the rabbits at the rescue just being cared for properly...passionate for the rights of the rabbits! 
_
"I'm sure pictures of most rescues taken at inopportune moments will look the same as any of these." _The pictures being shown were the normal, everyday conditions at the rescue until volunteers cleaned or an event was happening w/ the rescue. I agree that rescues aren't going to be picture perfect all the time. 
_
"Kris appears to be good at getting vet care and caring for the rabbits, she gets them spayed/neutered" _ASK Kris to show ALL the records to the public??? ASK her to show ALL receipts from every spay & Neuter or vet care in the last 2 years??? Count all the rabbits she claimed to have s/n in the past yr...Where is the proof...receipts from the vet?? If your going to run a rescue and depend on public donations....then show the ACTUAL Vet receipts and Vet records. Kristie can't!!! Show all original receipts for food and supplies...not just a few...she had over 70 rabbits in FL!!
_
"What people have to ask themselves is what is best for the rabbits. I'm sure many of her rescues (if not most) were abandoned in the streets or on death row at shelters. If they weren't with Kris, where would they be?" _true...a lot were abandoned, on death row, and surrenders. Some were also purchased from Breeders. People have to ask themselves what is better for the rabbits....dying humanely or dying from neglect at the rescue? We can't save every unwanted animal in todayâs society.
_
"If people are concerned about the accusations re: misuse of funding, then donate food and supplies, donate/open an account at her vet clinic or round up volunteers to go help clean, feed and water. They can also monitor the situation. " _Everyone donates/donated food and supplies. Volunteers did help...there was never enough. lmrr just keeps taking in rabbits, kittens, gp's, everything...more than she could care for. If anyone would ever question Kristie....crap would hit the ceiling!! A volunteer can only do so much! A person can only be treated like crap for a short time. Lmrr could never keep the volunteers for a long time because Kristie treated them like crap.

"Your best bet will be contacting the local SPCA or Humane Society to have someone visit. I would find out what the county is that the rescue is in, mention that you've heard a great deal of bad stuff, and ask that they do a check-up. Alternatively, if they're very far from you geographically, try to convince an ex-volunteer to make a report with the local SPCA/Humane Society/county animal control officers." it's all been done...there is a lot of "red tape" with bigger orgs.

In any case, even if one person runs the shelter... If there are volunteers, wouldn't they have been taking care of the animals? How would it have gotten like that? Kristie couldnât keep her vols...try taking care of 70+ rabbits w/ even 2 or 3 vols...

"I'm attending the open house this weekend to check out the situation myself. The vet that my rescue uses is also involved with this rescue. I doubt she would be involved if the situation is as bad as others have alleged." The shelter will be perfect...go back unexpectedly in a few months. It's all repeated behavior w/ lmrr. It will always look great for events. She will fall back into the bad conditions again and again. Now maybe all of this exposure will change Kristie and she can run a rescue...that would be great!!! I'd be happy for her...I hope that happens.
_
"You'd think photos, as a visual form of evidence, would be useful but they can be very misleading.

Take photo1, for example, that cage is bare of any litter but look top and right, those have fairly clean looking wood shavings down. If the cage was Thatâs a lot of poop but buns poop a lot and that's probably a weeks worth at most. It looks like a cage mid clean. An empty food bowl isn't really an issue (mine rabbits don't even have food bowls let alone empty ones) and the water bowl can't have been empty long as there is water pooled on top that looks like its from being tipped over recently. The bun doesn't look particularly underweight in this. There is also a toy and a clean looking blanket."_ lmrr doesnât use wood shavings...that's dried hay, urine, hair, and feces. Empty food bowls are an issue when they are empty for days. If you look closely the bowls have urine in them..that wet spot could be fresh urine, lmrr uses water BOTTLES. The Fleece blanket repels liquids..(I use those w/ my bunns). yes lmrr does put toys in the cages.

_Pic 2: A skinny rabbit - good rescues have those all the time too as they come in that way, and it's pictured on a lovely fresh looking tray of hay_. That tray is actually the litter box w/ hay on top. 

_Pic 3: Long tails yes, but fluffy white feet - that suggests a cage that has been keep very clean. If it was living in a cage that looked like pic 1 it would have stainned toes. Again rescues have buns with long nails come in all the time. Same with pic 3. A rabbit with an issue like this make take several week to resolve or be that way permenatly depending on the cause." _That could have been a surrender or could have been a rabbit kept in an x-pen on the floor or in her house? 

I understand your points...all rescues are struggling and it's hard. With that said...The rescues need to be responsible. Don't take in more than you can handle and afford. We all want to save all the animals....but that is not realistic in todayâs society.

I understand It is my word against hers....but I'm not the only person making the claims. YES, pictures can be misguided or misleading. I volunteered there and witnessed these conditions...even worse than what is shown.

I just care about the rabbits and they don't deserve to live this way.


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## Happi Bun

:dunno

I'm on the fence regarding the whole matter, I don't know who or what to believe. If the past events are true, well nothing can be done now because she got her act together. Hopefully it will stay that way.


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## Amy27

Wow, I don't know what to say. I never heard of LMRR until recently. A local rescue group was looking at her set up with cages and looking at using it for a rescue that may open in my area for rabbits. When I looked at her FB page at that time, I was amazed and have been following her since. It seems like she is working so hard to get this rescue going and really cares. I am shocked. I am with Erika, I don't know what to believe. I guess all I can do it hope that she keeps her act together.


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## iresqbunnies

You can also not assume that everything is fine, and that it is onlya matter of disgruntled volunteers or other individuals. My experience began in 2003, when our rescue took in 15 of the LMRR NJ foster rabbits to help out the mother of that rescue's president. ALL of the rabbits that we took in were severely underweight, malnurished and had mild to serious health issues. Furthermore, we could sense the intense depression that these rabbits were suffering from. It is a day that I will never forget. 

That was in the past, you say, but I am in touch with as many as seven ex-volunteers from the Florida rescue, who all state the the conditions in the rescue were horrid, and the number of rabbit deaths was high.

This individual has a problem, and it has been the rabbits who have suffered for nearly ten years, now, while the president of the rescue continues to snow everyone.

BTW, things will look great for the open house. Make a surprise visit three months down the road and see if things have changed.


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## Happi Bun

Note: I never said I would forgive such actions.

The problem I have jumping on the 'this lady is an animal abuser' bandwagon is that there are also TONS of people, volunteers, and sponsors/supporters for her. Here is a video I found on YouTube showing the inside of their rescue from back in May of this year. Looks extremely well kept to me. 


[flash=320,256]http://www.youtube.com/v/YQHNGu3grgk[/flash]


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## Harvanator

Yea sure, but than you look at the pictures that the volunteers have of the same shelter and it isn't so well kept, yet it is the same building.. Do you think those volunteers threw piles of poop around before they took the pictures they have? They are obviously the same place and the same home made cages. 

Of course she is only going to publish pictures and videos of when it is just cleaned up. And it was those same volunteers that busted their backs cleaning it up like that after she let it go. 

Those pictures that the ex volunteers have of the same rescue building speak way louder and they speak a better truth than the pre planned video.


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## iresqbunnies

Harvanator is right. Who is going to shoot and post a video with horrid conditions? All part of her snow job to the public, and she is very good at it.


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## maxysmummy

is it worth taking the chance? i find it much more likely that one person is an irresponsible animal hoarder than loads and loads of people from all around the country are just happening to collude and make it all up. if you look at the psychiatric profile of these people they are manipulative and make it look (to others) that they are doing a great job.

I watched an ABC doccumentary type program about animal hoarders and 100% of them relapse if they don't have proper psychiatric help. this woman is in denial and many people saw she was a hoarder (she admitted it herself in a response to the campaign against her.)

This should be about the rabbits. if you add the Bunny Truths LMRR facebook page the pictures and accounts from ex volunteers speak volumes - it's not something that can be ignored.


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## Happi Bun

I guess I find it hard to believe that someone that seems to have it so together and providing good conditions could turn and allow it to get so horrifically bad while still running as a rescue with volunteers see it all.

I cannot tell it's the same building from the photo's posted and the FB profile is private.


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## Amy27

I added the Facebook page and you are right, those pictures can't be ignored. It is sad. I feel sick after seeing them. 

What can others do to help? I would like to help. 

I have to say, I volunteer with rabbits at a nonprofit humane society geared towards cat and dogs. To think of the things I complained about and then to see these pictures, I feel horrible. The buns where I volunteer lives are so much better. I can't believe a rescue could run like this. To think I complained about things like the rabbits not having adoption events like the cats and dogs. And here is a shetler where the rabbits don't even get food and water. I just never imaged. 

There was also a time I reported a feed store who had a rabbit living in inches deep of feces and urine with long nails. The creulty officers gave them so many days to clean the cage and get the nails cut. They then followed up to make sure it was done and since I filed the complaint, they even called me when it was all done to tell me what they had made the owner do and that they followed up to make sure it was done. This rabbits conditions were nothing like the pictures posted. I just don't get how they can ignore it. 

Have you guys looked into getting the House Rabbit Society involoved? I really love the House Rabbit Soceity and know that at least my local chapter is very involved and is willing to do anything to help rabbits. Even contacting the chapter near her new shelter, I bet some of the members would make some visits. Especially since it seems most of the volunteers who made the site are far away.


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## maxysmummy

This woman shouldn't be crucified she needs help. these bunnies can't however, stay in these conditions just because we don't want to exacerbate her mental condition


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## maxysmummy




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## maxysmummy

i don't know man, if these pictures dont show proof i don't know what does.

i used to feel guilty when i forgot to change my boys litter box for a few days...


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## [email protected]

Hi Everyone, 
First of all I just want to say, I didn't even know about these forums! Sorry to find it under such circumstances. Seems like there are probably a lot of great folks here! 

Just want you all to know, I totally understand why you would want to think that none of this with Little Miracles Rabbit Rescue actually happened! I would love to be able to think that too. To just disbelieve all of this and walk away. What I can't seem to wrap my head around is how anyone would suspect that this whole thing was just orchestrated over jealousy or whatever other reason. How can anyone possibly believe that when all of these ex volunteers from Florida, people from New Jersey, Pennsylvania and Virginia, have come forward. Can you really believe we ALL created this imaginary story and imaginary pitures because what? We are ALL jealous? All of these people, who have never met each otherin person? 

Problem is, I was there and I feel obligated to tell the story of the rabbits that I whitnessed suffering at the hands ofor should I say lack of hands of this individual. And I will understand if you choose not to believe me, but it is sadly, very true. 

This individual chooses not to remember all of those rabbits, telling us she never had that many, and changing the number of how many she had every time she defends herself. But I will tell their story, because they deserve to be remembered. I only wish they could be remembered for who they were before going into that hell hole of a rescue. Because at one time, they could have been someone's beloved pet, at one time they binkied and played and had names that mattered to someone. In the care of this person, all they were was a story to tell for attention, and a dollar sign. 

What I whitnessed was much of what her ex volunteers whitnessed, and the other rescue above who took in 15 of these rabbits. What we saw was also different from what others saw. 

We went into thethis personshome in 2003 after this individualwas already gone and living in Florida. To shorten the story, we saw three or four rooms in the home, and a shed in the yard(in the middle of summer) FULL of rabbits. Somewhere around the count of 350 rabbits, either Hal or I lost count, and were too tired to recount them all over again. 

Rabbits in tiny stacked cages. Rabbits who had not gotten out of those tiny cages in over a year according to someone close to this individuals mother. These poor rabbits were so bored, they had chewed their litter boxes until they were nothing but slabs in the bottome of the wire bottomed cage. Any plastic food dishes were the same. They had no interest in us when we came, it was like they had already lost hope in humans. They just sat in the same spot, obviously beyond the point of distress. 

When we had gotten there the first time, the cages hadn't been cleaned in around two months. The one room in the home was called the "sick room" and contained the sickest rabbits. Bunnies with head tilt, bunnies sneazing blood, sneazing and infected goopy eyes. Urine splattered everywhere, scraggly looking pet cats, fleas so bad in the middle of summer we had to wear long clothes and Judy would keep a bottle of flea spray by the steps for everyone to spray themselves with when they walked in the door. 


Hal(another small animal rescue) and our rescue went in and cleaned cages, medicated bunnies and slowly transported as many rabbits as we could out of there.While there, even though we truely did feel sorry for this person close to the head of this rescue, we would have loved to take pictures of the mess, butwas instructed not to let us leave her sight, and told us from the get go she would not allow cameras in the house. She never left us, she stood over us the whole time we were there. 

In the end, all we wanted was to "free" as many rabbits as we could from what we considered prison for innocent rabbits. That was our main conern. In the end we rescued, transported to other rescues, and rehomed all but around 20 of those the rabbits who were stuck there for at least a year, some for two years or who knows? Maybe longer. 

We thought that was going to be the end, because surely anyone who made animals suffer like that would be feeling too guilty to do it again? Wrong! Most people with these kinds of mental instabilities convince themselves that they are doing nothing wrong, and that they are in fact the heros. They can lie and believe their own lies mentally beause they don't have the capacity to face the truth. 

I was very dismayed to find out that she was doing this again in Florida, and even more shocked to find out she was treating them even worse than she did in New Jersey. I saw the pitures the volunteers took and her pitures, it is obvious that it is the same building and some of the same rabbits that Christine wants us all to believe is what happens every day. 

What this person is doing is not "rescue", taking these rabbits out of one bad situation and putting them into another. 

She only now has this "shelter" and all of these new volunteers because she is manipulative,takes convincing pictures, and has convinced others, and maybe some of you here, to fund this new "shelter" and everything she has to make it look shiney and new. The money and the rabbits are like was said by someone else, like a drug to her. And right now she is as high as she can get. Problem with that is that we all know, once you reach the very top, there is only one way to go. 

Once her new volunteers lose interest, or catch on to her, the care of the rabbits will go to the wayside. The cages won't get cleaned as much, and they vet will not be called when needed. Just like what just happened in Florida. Besides that, she will fill out every possible space she has with rabbits to try to get that high back. She will overwhelm herself because in her own mind, she is a hero and no one else can save these rabbits. 

I have said what I needed to say. I am not trying to convince anyone of anything. I know what I saw,just as the others here know what they saw, and only hope that some people can use their better judgement in all of this. 

Our rescue has no interest in opening a shelter, we do not feel that Little Miracles or this person is reputable, so no we do not have any competitive or jealousy issues at all. It's just really hard to feel that the bunnies who have suffered have gotten any closure when everyone, including the one person who was supposed to be there for them, won't even acknowledge them or what she has done to them. 

Great if she really does clean it up and keep it that way. However,the rabbits who myself and all of the others who have their own horror stories to tell, well they deserve to be heard, no matter howthis individualmakes it look. She still abused and neglected hundreds of animals and they need to be heard.


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## tonyshuman

The most important point is that us saying stuff on the internet won't change the situation. What you need to do if you want things to change are call up the local law enforcement, humane society, SPCA, etc, and send them the pictures, ask them to do a visit. The only people who have the power to change it are the law enforcement where the rescue is located, and if they don't know about the problem, nothing can be done. 

You could also try to contact people in places she's lived before--if she has a trail of neglect in her wake, some humane law officer must have been involved at some point on her case. If you can find a humane law officer who investigated her in the past and saw bad things, but she has now moved out of the jurisdiction of that law officer, the law officer may be willing to put a call in to the current locale's humane law enforcement, which would be an even stronger reason for them to go investigate.

"Bad-mouthing" this person on the web won't get anything done; you need to get the info to the people who can help.


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## [email protected]

The NJ SPCA, their local animal control,police, and PETA, plus just recently HSUS have all been contacted and mailed a large packet of statements. PETA also may have someone on the inside as we speak, because that is how they operate. The problem is, she has to be caught in the act, so we will just have to wait and see. All these past accounts will do is make people aware and help them choose if they really want to support this kind of "rescue". Trust me, law enforcement is listening, and they are not impressed with Little Miracles, but all we can do right now is sit and wait. 

That is why I just said what I needed to say, and I am done saying the same things over and over again. Time will tell the truth.


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## Sweetie

I am really angry that this lady would mistreat the rabbits that she had in her care. I hope that she gets shutdown, put in jail, and has to pay a huge fine for what she did.

I would never treat my rabbits like she treat the rabbits at her "rescue". I treat my rabbits like they are my family/kids. I truly love my rabbits, as I am sure that everyone here loves their rabbits.

I am giving my rabbits big hugs and kisses each night and thanking them for being so wonderful every night/day from now on. Plus I am going to do whatever I can to keep my rabbits. After seeing this, I am not going to rehome my rabbits. I want to help save rabbits! I want to speak out for the rabbits!!!!!!


----------



## Flash Gordon

*[email protected] wrote: *


> The NJ SPCA, their local animal control,police, and PETA, plus just recently HSUS have all been contacted and mailed a large packet of statements. PETA also may have someone on the inside as we speak, because that is how they operate. The problem is, she has to be caught in the act, so we will just have to wait and see. All these past accounts will do is make people aware and help them choose if they really want to support this kind of "rescue". Trust me, law enforcement is listening, and they are not impressed with Little Miracles, but all we can do right now is sit and wait.


Remember anybody can read this forum...u dont wanna give the wrong person the heads up on this...its tough catchin someone in the act if they know ur watching.


----------



## iresqbunnies

Animal Control in the county she lived in, while in Florida, was contacted often. Trouble is, that Kris was a police officer, and she worked with Animal Control, who conveniently, but sadly,looked the other way. Believe me, every avenue was actively explored.

Animal Control, where she currently is in NJ, has been alerted.

Since nobody who has first-hand experience started this thread, responses are not bad-mouthing, IMO. Those who have experience with this rescue, are simply trying to bring out the truth in defense of the person who started the thread. We are fighting for the RABBITS, and that is the simple truth. So many have died in this rescue...


----------



## fsubunnee

Thank you Harvanator!! So many good points!! YES...I was an "enabler" for LMRR!! I was warned by peolpe who knew Kristie and ex-volunteers. I didn't believe them...I thought they had "personal vendettas" against lmrr...I had to learn the hard way. Maybe if I would have listened and did research....this wouldn't have become so big...maybe less rabbits would have died!! But not just 1 person can help this situation!!! it's going to take everyone coming together. 

Look at the patterns....a new group of volunteers start and work so hard to help the rabbits....but they don't last because they realize the truth. It was hard for me and the others vols to leave...because we knew that the rabbits were going to suffer.

All of the posts saying "contact animal control, spca. police, humane society...we all have. Statements, letters, and pictures have been mailed many times....even the Florida State Attorney Gen. There is too much red tape. They all respond saying contact this person or call that agency... nothing happens. The fact that Kristie _*was*_ a police officer in Florida...didn't help us one bit. 

I love all animals and try to help all I can. I'm not going to "shut down" a rescue for personal reasons or out of jealousy...I'll support any rescue that is a "real" rescue. I also understand that rescues are not always going to be perfect...it is a hard job running a rescue. Lmrr may appear to be doing good...but from what I witnessed...it's a really bad rescue. Yes, there have been successful adoptions...I will not deny lmrr that...what a blessing for those rabbits that made it out alive...but what about the rest????


----------



## Sweetie

You say that she WAS a police officer. Couldn't you find out why she isn't a police officer anymore, maybe dig around and see why she got fired or quit as a police officer. Maybe that will have some weight on this situation.


----------



## RosL

*Sweetie wrote: *


> You say that she WAS a police officer. Couldn't you find out why she isn't a police officer anymore, maybe dig around and see why she got fired or quit as a police officer. Maybe that will have some weight on this situation.


It wouldn't make any difference, though, to her neglect of the rabbits.

Those of us who have been following this for some time have some good idea of what happened there, but publishing that isn't at all relevant to how the rabbits in her 'care' have suffered in the past...and sadly are likely to in the future if this can't be stopped now.


----------



## Purple Mountain Rabbitry

actually it can. if she was fired/quit for a bad reason then it can weigh against her with law enforcement, and if it is ever brought to court which I hope it eventually does it can make it where she is even less believable and wiegh in the favor of the rabbits, so she can pay for her crimes and keep it from happening again

Crystal


----------



## RosL

*Oh My Darlin Rabbitry wrote: *


> actually it can. if she was fired/quit for a bad reason then it can weigh against her with law enforcement, and if it is ever brought to court which I hope it eventually does it can make it where she is even less believable and wiegh in the favor of the rabbits, so she can pay for her crimes and keep it from happening again
> 
> Crystal


Well, if that was the case, then the information could be gleaned from her former employer by the court. I'm certainly not going to cloud the issue here of what is happening to the rabbits by bringing up what else has been happening in her life


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## dootsmom

One of the things that is bothering me is that there are no dates on the pictures or proof of where they were taken. They have probably been cropped but, still, dates and location are necessary when making an accusation. I am not defending LLRR, just making a point. I am sure that "she" is aware that "she" is being "watched by a hawk" and, for now, has everything in order. I will be going down there when the excitement of the "Grand Opening" (this weekend) dies down and they have settled into a regular routine and their "guard is down". It doesn't take long for a for a bunny to make a mess of its cage. I know because I have to vacuum most of my cages, daily. Judging from the pictures, the cages hadn't been totally cleaned in over a week.


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## IAmABunnySlave

dootsmom - You are right. Those cages were only cleaned when volunteers came. That means that if a volunteer couldn't make it for a couple weeks (and LMRR was always low on volunteers, as Ms. Corson would continually 'fire' them or they would quit) then the cages would not get cleaned. 

Here are photos that I took in August of 09: http://s1236.photobucket.com/albums/ff445/LMRR_Horrors/

These were taken right before she removed me from her volunteer list. I have heard from other volunteers that things got much, much worse after this and then she decided to move back to NJ.


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## dootsmom

I have 44 rabbits here right now. My Vet, Dr. Hodes in Mine Hill, once said to me: "I don't see why you bother taking such care of them (bringing them to be vetted), they only live 5 to 7 years".....then he stopped and said "except at your house!!". That made me feel good. Officially, my doors are closed. One of the reasons is that I have no volunteers. They did come and only wanted to pet. When I said: "first you clean, then you feed, and then you pet", they never came back. Rabbits are a lot of work. A lot of lifting, lugging, and back breaking work. It takes me 6 hours, a week, just to do litter boxes. Feeding, alone, takes 2 hours a day. Right now, I am procrastinating......I have to go get my monthly supply of pellets....500 pounds. Tomorrow is a "veggie run". Last week was a "shavings and equine pine run" (every two weeks). The work never ends!! Caring for all the rabbits has taken its toll on me. I'm tired. The rabbits that are adoptable are on Petfinder. All my old guys (ages 6 to 11) will stay here. Few people want to adopt an "old" rabbit. The few that are born here, because the doe came in pregnant, do not leave until they are 6 months old and have been spayed/neutered. 

Jeez!!! The smell in that room must have been over-powering!! Obviously, she didn't spend much time in it!!


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## Sweetie

dootsmom: you are doing a wonderful job. I understand that it can/is hard work. I don't think that I would be able to do it. It is hard enough keeping my own two rabbits clean and healthy.

Thank you Oh My Darlin Rabbitry. I knew that there was something that people could use against this lady of LMRR.

RosL: so what I am getting is that you think that this situation is hopeless. That this is a never ending battle because she will always win. I am just trying to understand all of this.


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## dootsmom

I don't think that the situation is "hopeless". It's obvious that she has to be monitored, constantly, and when she slips up the right authorities have to be called. Not the local ACO's but, PETA, NJSPCA, the Mayor, Town Councils, etc.. and be kept on top of until they have to do something.


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## Sweetie

I see. Thank you dootsmom.


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## RosL

*Sweetie wrote: *


> RosL: so what I am getting is that you think that this situation is hopeless. That this is a never ending battle because she will always win. I am just trying to understand all of this.


No, not at all. It isn't easy and many things have been tried, so far without much success, but no, I don't think for a moment that it's hopeless, and I don't think I said or even hinted that.

I just want the discussion to stay focused on what is happening to the rabbits, rather than sidestepping to Kris' private life, which really I don't believe is relevant to this at all.

Several people who have contributed to this thread have personal experience of what has happened to the rabbits and other animals in LMRR. The word needs to be spread until enough people will take notice, including the proper authorities, so that action is taken, her activities are stopped, the animals in her 'care' are actually rescued from her and she gets the help she very clearly needs.


----------



## RosL

*dootsmom wrote: *


> I have 44 rabbits here right now.


Dootsmom, you have the heart of a lion. You're doing wonderful things The world needs more like you...and it would be wonderful if you could have some volunteers who would actually help.


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## bunneezz

Yes at times it does seem hopeless...because she always manages to get away w/ everything...I just think of the rabbits and I will never give up!


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## Sweetie

*RosL wrote: *


> *Sweetie wrote: *
> 
> 
> 
> RosL: so what I am getting is that you think that this situation is hopeless. That this is a never ending battle because she will always win. I am just trying to understand all of this.
> 
> 
> 
> No, not at all. It isn't easy and many things have been tried, so far without much success, but no, I don't think for a moment that it's hopeless, and I don't think I said or even hinted that.
> 
> I just want the discussion to stay focused on what is happening to the rabbits, rather than sidestepping to Kris' private life, which really I don't believe is relevant to this at all.
> 
> Several people who have contributed to this thread have personal experience of what has happened to the rabbits and other animals in LMRR. The word needs to be spread until enough people will take notice, including the proper authorities, so that action is taken, her activities are stopped, the animals in her 'care' are actually rescued from her and she gets the help she very clearly needs.
Click to expand...

Thank you for explaining this. I think that digging into her private and work life will have a great effect. It will hold up in court and she will not win in court.

I hope that she does get the help she needs and those rabbits will get deserving homes that will take very good care of them.


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## lagomorphlvr

Oh goodness. I recently found this forum, and I feel that I need to add my story to those already posted. Where to start? I am an ex-volunteer of LMRR Florida (2008-2009). While I was there, we had a wonderful group of volunteers who tried very very hard to make life better for the rabbits and other creatures under Ms. Corsonâs care, and we finally all left when we could not take the awful conditions, illness, and death any longer.

Let me address some points and concerns from Pippâs post. They are certainly valid points.



> There are two sides to every story. I don't know any of these people, but I'm a journalist. We never believe anything at face-value. This campaign against Little Miracles has been going on for quite some time, and it appears to originate with one person, or a small group, the ever-present disgruntled ex-volunteer segment of the rescue world.



The complaints do not come from one person or group. LMRR originated in New Jersey, and yes, that is where the original group that spoke out against her came from. However, there have been several other groups of people who have spoken out again LMRR since then. I can only truly speak for the group that I was a part of, however, I have since listened to their stories, and based on the similarities of our experiences, I fully believe them. As for the group I was part of - several other volunteers, including myself, visited LMRR and naively thought we could fix it. I thought that Ms. Corson was simply overwhelmed and needed some help. We recruited lots of volunteers, worked for more donations, and worked extremely hard to make things better (Brings up another of Pippâs points -


> Do I think LM in can do a better job? With help and funds, yes, of course


-I do not share the same opinion, and this is why). After a while, it became clear that things were getting worse, not better, and not for a lack of effort on our part. Ms. Corson kept bringing in more rabbits after we repeatedly begged her not to â there were too many. When I left, she had run out of cages and actually had a bun living in the hay bin. Our âgroupâ left in August of 2009. This does not include the odd volunteer here and there over this period of time who also gave up and left. This was a mass exodus of 7 or 8 volunteers. There was another mass exodus in summer 2010. I want to stress the point that NONE of these groups knew one another until AFTER leaving/dealing with LMRR. People look for others who have had similar experiences, and well, we found each other.

I am not merely a disgruntled volunteer. I was truly concerned by the things I was seeing. The decision to leave was agonizing, because I was horribly worried about the conditions the bunnies would be in after we all left. We were the only ones doing anything. I just couldnât support her any more. I realized we were all enabling her. I would like to share some actual correspondence between myself and another volunteer before we left LMRR:
_
Yeah, I totally respect your decision to quit. I've been thinking about it for quite some time. I'm just tired of continually making excuses for Kristieâ¦ I'm just torn. I love those bunniesâ¦I feel like I can't leave them...but at the same time, you're right...she's being enabledâ¦Hmm...I just keep getting more and more disturbed about thingsâ¦ I wish we could start our own rescue! I want to be part of a rescue I'm proud of...not one where I'm constantly worrying about the welfare of the buns and fighting bad press (which is around for a reason)._ (Quote from my actual email)

This is why we left. I donât do this because I have tons of time on my hands (I donât â I work a very strenuous job 45-55 hours a week, volunteer at another rescue, and have my own 2 buns, 2 guinea pigs, hamster, and fish tanks, plus a social life), nor do I do it because I have some sort of personal vendetta against Ms. Corson. I have my own opinions of her personally, but thatâs neither here nor there with this issue. This issue is about the safety of the rabbits and other animals in her care.


> Kris appears to be good at getting vet care and caring for the rabbits, she gets them spayed/neutered, she's good at fundraising, seems to be good at organizing volunteers, and she seems to be able to largely ignore the ridiculous rescue politics.



Yes, she APPEARS to be good at these things. The one thing Iâll agree on â she is good at fundraising. As for the rest â I personally witnessed many rabbits who needed vet care who did not get it. I can give you names of rabbits, particular instances, and approximate dates if you wish. She promised us she would bring the bun to the vet on her next day off. This almost never happened. These were rabbits who needed more than things like sub-q fluids or ear mite treatment. These were serious issues, like EC. I will not say she NEVER took any to the vet â she did occasionally, but this was not the norm. She is good at begging for volunteers, but she hated dealing with the day-to-day organization of it (and didnât really take part), and therefore the job got delegated to me. I had to constantly fight to KEEP volunteers, as she tended to chase them away. She does get rabbits spayed/neutered, but there were a few we came across that were supposedly fixed, and were not. There were rabbits that sat there for a year or more before getting fixed. She may act like she is âaboveâ rescue politics, but she most certainly is not. She has given her share of unprofessional rants.

To those who plan to visit and make a decision at her Open House â I can PROMISE you it will look sparkling clean that day. First of all, things are brand new. Sheâs had a rash of volunteers and donations. It will certainly not look dirty, and I can promise you that if there are any sick rabbits, they will be hidden elsewhere. Iâve participated in cleanups. Iâve seen her hide away sick rabbits. Of course itâs going to look nice at the open house. As others have suggested, go visit unexpectedly a few months down the line. Maybe even volunteer. Honestly, if she can keep things up and genuinely take proper care of the rabbits, I would be happy. Itâs just that Iâve seen history repeat itself with her over and over â and now sheâs got more room than ever. Look at it logically. This building sheâs renting has a $1200/mo mortgage, not including utilities and other operating expenses. Her only income is donations and what her parents give her. Will she be able to keep that up, especially with a child on the way?

To finishâ¦those pictures were not taken on âbad daysâ. That is how LMRR looked nearly every time we walked in. I only wish I could share the smell in the building with you. I can vouch for the first picture on the thread (the bunny in the dirty, small dog crate) â I took that photo on August 8[sup]th[/sup], 2009 in the LMRR Florida building. The rabbit in the photo was named Hollin. The other volunteers and I would spend about 12 hours every weekend cleaning all the cages. Ms. Corson RARELY assisted. I work full time. I did what I could, but I knew it wasnât enough. I was typically over there at least twice a week (with one day being the all day clean-a-thon on the weekend). I simply didnât have the time or the funds to do anything more. There were TOO MANY BUNNIES. We couldn't keep up. When the volunteers were unable to come, cleaning didn't happen. When we dumped litter pans, the bottoms were moving with maggots. The flies were awful. Fleas were a nightmare. Black widows made nests in the corners. There was filth everywhere. It was dreadfully hot. I saw more dead bunnies than I ever cared to see. Her personal bunny, Sophie, died in my arms, and Sophieâs son Foo died the next morning. Another rabbit, Faever, had already died that afternoon. I walked into the rescue and found him dead (covered in fleas). I was worried about some kind of epidemic. Ms. Corson said she was distraught and would take them in for necropsy right away. Those two bunnies were in the fridge for well over a week before a volunteer finally buried them in the backyard. I witnessed emaciated bunnies â and they were not emaciated upon arrival. In that first picture, Iâm not sure where the âwood shavingsâ are? Thatâs the floor in back of the cage, covered in hay and poop. LMRR only uses water bottles. There was not water in that dish. When the volunteers did not feed and water, there were times when it was certainly not done on a daily basis. Ms. Corson regularly traveled to St. Petersburg on weekends (well, her weekend â she worked irregular hours), and she called me on several occasions (after she had arrived up there) to ask if I could go feed and water the bunnies. I was the only volunteer who lived close by with reliable transportation, so I was pretty much it. There were a couple times when she asked me this, and I was unable to go to the rescue due to other obligations. The bunnies did not get fed and watered on those occasions. I could go on with accounts of my experience, but I hope this is enough to get my point across.

The idea of jumping in and helping to make LMRR better is a noble one, but I fear a foolhardy one. You see, Iâve been there done that. It didnât work. I am frankly ashamed that I ever supported her, but all of us were just trying to help the bunnies. As for what would happen to the buns if she did get shut down â well, Iâm pretty sure there are a lot of folks who would be willing to help out.

I hope that in writing this, I have not come off as sounding merely like a âdisgruntled volunteerâ. These are my personal experiences, and I felt that I had to present them. You are free to make your own decision.


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## Amy27

I asked this in a previous post of mine, but no one answered, has anyone contacted the House Rabbit Society? I really think they may be able to help you. I know each local chapter is different and I am lucky that I live in an area with a great local chapter. But I really think contacting the local chapter near where she has moved to, may help you guys keep watch, which would be really beneficial. I can tell you if you contacted my local chapter with this information. We would make frequent visits. That documentation would help. 

I really do support you guys in what you are doing. I want to help. I saw those pictures and that was enough proof for me. If I walked into a place that looked like that, I would report them and do everything I could to help the poor rabbits who don't have a voice.


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## Sweetie

lagomorphlvr: Thank you for doing your best to help the rabbits when you could.

This lady, Kristi Corson, sounds to me like she is a hoarder and takes in rabbits without thinking about the cost to feed them and make sure that they are healthy.

It is terrible what she has done. She also sounds like she doesn't really care about the rabbits. If she did, she would take them to the vet all the time and not just on ocassion(sp).


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## Flash Gordon

the only time anybody does something about these kind of things is if there is a big stink about it...if alot of people are talkin about it then they listen.....theres a writer for Examiner.com that is at this moment looking for stories to write about bad Animal Rescues in preferrably the New Jersey area..
the link
Examiner writer
..and another website asking for info on bad rescues..
painfultruths


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## fuzz16

a good idea is try to contact a person who deals with animal hoarding, the mental aspect of it, and get their opinion on what a animal hoarder exactly is. then from there go to the state with evidence. hoarders are mentally ill and if convicted of animal hoarding and abuse can go to jail if they ever own another pet.


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## fsubunnee

To everyone concerning, Pet-Rabbit-Toys.com , I've bought toys from this company for yrs. I recently sent them an email explaining why I would not purchase their toys due to the fact they were supporting lmrr. After emailing back and forth...with their permission, I'm re-posting their email to me. I don't want someone else or a business to suffer because of lmrr.

Pet-Rabbit-Toys.com


_*"As for LMRR, this entire issue has been very frustrating for us.

As a manufacturer of toys for rabbits we get donation requests ALL
the time. We do not have time to check into each and every rescue.
I never heard of LMRR until they posted on our wall asking people
to order toys and send them to them. I thought it was a grand idea so
we offered to match each order (we offer wholesale to rescues so by 
matching it we where basically sending them toys at the wholesale
price).

Then all the crap hit the fan. Now we are accused of supporting them
AND accused of hating them at the same time. I decided that I was
going to end the conversation on our page. What are we supposed to do?
If it looks like we support LMRR we lose customers, if we look like we 
do not support them we lose customers. Now we take a neutral stance
and we lose customers on both sides! 

*_

[font="Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif"]_*That means we lose customers for something that has absolutely nothing
to do with us and nothing we where trying to get involved with in the first 
place.
*_[/font]
[font="Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif"]
_*I am sure you have more info about LMRR than I do since you knew them.
We do not know them. We do not dispute anyones stories or facts but
I did not have any of this information when we decided to send them a donation.

If I would have know there was controversy I would not have made the offer
in the first place.

Here is how we will deal with this from now on: If they want to order our toys
wholesale, we will let them. However they will not be featured as a rescue
in any of our newsletters and they will not be chosen for donations in the future.
Such an action would spur too much controversy and we are not willing to go
down that road again.
I feel this is fair and hope others feel so as well.

Feel free to share this email with others, even LMRR supporters if you like.
We do not hate them or support them. We are a small, independent company.
We support our family by making toys for rabbits and selling them to rabbit lovers
all over the world. This is our main source of income. All I ask is that the LMRR
conversation takes place elsewhere, not on our page where we need to concentrate
on making and selling our products.

If you have any further questions or comments please send them to me. I am
happy to lay this issue to rest the best we can. Obviously at this point I can
not make everyone happy. We've been cornered and pulled into an issue that
has nothing to do with us simply because we did not know the history of a 
rescue that requested a donation.

Thank you again and I look forward to hearing back from you!

Ali Thompson
http://www.pet-rabbit-toys.com"
*_[/font]


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## Dragonrain

> the only time anybody does something about these kind of things is if there is a big stink about it...if alot of people are talkin about it then they listen.....theres a writer for Examiner.com that is at this moment looking for stories to write about bad Animal Rescues in preferrably the New Jersey area.. the link Examiner writer ..and another website asking for info on bad rescues.. painfultruths



I live in Northern NJ and also write for Examiner.com...
My Examiner page

I'd be willing to write something up as well, preferably after the holiday season as I've already been working on articles for the holiday season and will also be taking some time off around Christmas. 

But I'd like to maybe get some statements from ex-volunteers or even set up an email interview with someone if at all possible. 

I've been following the issues with LMRR through a few different sources and although I've remainded relatively neutral so far, I'm finding the testimonials from ex-volunteers and other rabbit rescues harder and harder to ignore. I think I'll also try to get out to LMRR sometime in the next couple of months, after the open house to see how things are going.


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## RosL

*fsubunnee wrote: *


> To everyone concerning, Pet-Rabbit-Toys.com , I've bought toys from this company for yrs. I recently sent them an email explaining why I would not purchase their toys due to the fact they were supporting lmrr. After emailing back and forth...with their permission, I'm re-posting their email to me. I don't want someone else or a business to suffer because of lmrr.
> 
> Pet-Rabbit-Toys.com
> [font="Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif"]_*
> *_[/font]


Thanks for posting their message, fsubunnee I think it would be unfair for the company to lose business simply because they tried to support a rescue, which was a generous act on their part. I hope anybody here who wants to buy rabbit toys will not let this company's former support for LMRR's rabbits put them off. After all, we all want to help the rabbits.


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## fsubunnee

thanks Rosl, they do make the best and safest rabbit toys. My rabbits love them.


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## slavetoabunny

*RosL wrote: *


> *fsubunnee wrote: *
> 
> 
> 
> To everyone concerning, Pet-Rabbit-Toys.com , I've bought toys from this company for yrs. I recently sent them an email explaining why I would not purchase their toys due to the fact they were supporting lmrr. After emailing back and forth...with their permission, I'm re-posting their email to me. I don't want someone else or a business to suffer because of lmrr.
> 
> Pet-Rabbit-Toys.com
> [font="Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif"]_*
> *_[/font]
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks for posting their message, fsubunnee I think it would be unfair for the company to lose business simply because they tried to support a rescue, which was a generous act on their part. I hope anybody here who wants to buy rabbit toys will not let this company's former support for LMRR's rabbits put them off. After all, we all want to help the rabbits.
Click to expand...

Pet-Rabbit-Toys.com makes awesome toys at great prices. I don't think that their former support of this rescue should reflect on whether any bunny lover's buy their toys. I have bought their toys in the past and will continue to support them.


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## Happi Bun

*Amy27 wrote: *


> I asked this in a previous post of mine, but no one answered, has anyone contacted the House Rabbit Society?


Waiting for an answer to this as well. 

I joined the Bunny Justice Facebook page and looked at all the pictures. Clearly they were taken at LMRR. 
The conditions were deplorable and inexcusable in my opinion, especially for a rescue.


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## RosL

*Happi Bun wrote: *


> *Amy27 wrote: *
> 
> 
> 
> I asked this in a previous post of mine, but no one answered, has anyone contacted the House Rabbit Society?
> 
> 
> 
> Waiting for an answer to this as well.
> 
> I joined the Bunny Justice Facebook page and looked at all the pictures. Clearly they were taken at LMRR.
> The conditions were deplorable and inexcusable in my opinion, especially for a rescue.
Click to expand...

I've seen you ask this a couple of times. Sorry nobody has replied. I believe contact has been made, but will check with some of the contacts I have and let you know.


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## fsubunnee

*lmrr's current adoptable rabbit....
*
_"Yoshi Harlequin Mix: An adoptable rabbit in Atco, NJ "_http://www.petfinder.com/petdetail/17712408?photo_view=1






*Yoshi 2009 at FL lmrr*Â 







*This is the same rabbit...look at the markings.*


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## Happi Bun

The president (Kristie) states in a message of defense that the bad conditions happened when she was in and out of the hospital after being diagnosed with Crohn's Disease.


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## fsubunnee

*"Little Miracles Rabbit Rescue Inc>Photos 
Bianca's Recovery"*

*http://www.myspace.com/littlemiraclesrr/photos/albums/album/1608159#mssrc=SitesPhotos_SP_AlbumCover_ViewAlbum*











*Bianca & Cosmo...both died.Â  *


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## fsubunnee

*Happi Bun wrote: *


> The president (Kristie) states in a message of defense that the bad conditions happened when she was in and out of the hospital after being diagnosed with Crohn's Disease.


She will have an excuse for everything....she had volunteers when she was in the hospital...there is NO excuse for these conditions!!! If your going to own/run a rabbit rescue....you need to be responsible...have back up plans, limit the # of animals you take in...


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## lagomorphlvr

> The president (Kristie) states in a message of defense that the bad conditions happened when she was in and out of the hospital after being diagnosed with Crohn's Disease.


I'll be honest here, she had several hospital stays. However, the neglect started years before she was supposedly diagnosed with Crohn's disease. The neglect in Florida was apparent even during periods of time when she was not in the hospital. Crohn's disease is not the only medical excuse she gave to me to get out of caring for the rabbits. When I volunteered, she called me over to feed the buns when she was "incapacitated" for everything from tooth pain to a supposedly broken foot. I did have some reason to be skeptical. Trust me, she will have an excuse for everything. 

And I would like to pose a question: If she knows that she is unable to care for the rabbits properly due to a medical condition, why does she keep taking more in?


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## Happi Bun

I agree with you both, there is no excuse for that kind of neglect from a rescue. It's sad these bunnies are supposed to go from bad situations to good ones, not from bad to bad, or even worse!


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## [email protected]

You are right, it is just inexcusable. 

I run a rescue,I have been sick, I have had tragedies, I have been in the hospital and I have had to be out of the state for periods of time.Not during any of these times didany animals in my care NOT have someone to care for them. 

Ihave crawled across the floor to care for myanimals and children before, I have hired pet sitters that Ican't afford and bribed, begged andsold just about anything of value that I own to care for myfamily properly, furry, human or fosters.. doesn't matter! 

Shecould have utilized all of her resources she brags about, she comes off as being pretty smart. Why did she notcall her buddies at the police department, how about the shelters that are all allegedly falling over themselves to help her? Someone could have coordinated something in her absence to help care for them properly.

There is no excuse forit getting that bad before anything is done about it. 

She makes a LOT of excuses for a LOT of accusations. Sometimes the story is different every time, or she adds to it.


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## [email protected]

I don't know, maybe I would be a little more sympathetic to her if she would admit to what she has done wrong and show even the slightest bit of remourse! Can't even fathom how a person treats any living creature this way and is able to live with it!:X:X


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## Flash Gordon

so whos gonna step up and do some articles with the link that i posted or with Dragonrain RO member offered....just discussing this in a forum is not gonna help the bunnies.i know its a big step to put urself out there but any and all noise about this rescue will help shut it down... waiting for people to get back with you and hoping they will take over the fight is a waste of time..more people who voice their concerns to the media will get somebodies attention...


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## Happi Bun

I believe a lot _is_ being done behind the scenes. 

However, that information is kept under wraps to not tip off the wrong people.


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## [email protected]

Yes from what we hear there are things underway. Thank you Flash for all your help as well!


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## Flash Gordon

i hope ur right guys about things being underway cuz ive heard about this rescues probs a long time ago, but shes still open.


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## Sweetie

Seeing those pics of the bunnies in the condition that they are in, just really pisses me off. I wish I was in NJ so that I can personally send her a *beep*. You guys can fill in the beep.

To those living in NJ and Florida, can those of us who are not living in those states email you and you send the info to her? Also statements about the reason why we would like to get LMRR shut down?


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## maxysmummy

*Flash Gordon wrote: *


> so whos gonna step up and do some articles with the link that i posted or with Dragonrain RO member offered....just discussing this in a forum is not gonna help the bunnies.i know its a big step to put urself out there but any and all noise about this rescue will help shut it down... waiting for people to get back with you and hoping they will take over the fight is a waste of time..more people who voice their concerns to the media will get somebodies attention...


i posted one of the links to the LMRR bunny truths website and told them to write in to these people - the admin of the page said she would try to do that.

i wish i could do more, i hate living so far away


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## fsubunnee

BIANCA SHOWN IN THE ABOVE PICS......is still alive...I made a typing error.


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## Sweetie

That is good that Bianca is still alive. But it is so sad that the other rabbits are not alive.

I wish that I was closer so that I can do something.


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## Sweetie

*Flash Gordon wrote: *


> i hope ur right guys about things being underway cuz ive heard about this rescues probs a long time ago, but shes still open.


If things are underway, it takes time to get a place shut down. After all the evidence and such then it will take about a month or so to shut her down. Learning Tree Child and Family Center was shut down after years of things going wrong. So it can take a while for a place to get shut down.


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## [email protected]

An investigation like this might take several months unfortunately. The evidence that has already been gathered over the years will simply get them the aid they need to open a new investigation. It is still good for us to spread the word and keep others from being victimized by this kind of carelessness in the process.


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## Violet23

PETA is involved?! oh boy, thats another can of worms I dont even wanna go near, I think there's another post about them somwhere else


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## fuzz16

thats no good about peta getting involved imho....


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## maxysmummy

*Violet23 wrote: *


> PETA is involved?! oh boy, thats another can of worms I dont even wanna go near, I think there's another post about them somwhere else


I can't STAND peta (for feminist reasons)

but why is it bad that they are getting involved in this?


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## Violet23

It was just the other post that i read that had the articles about them euthanizing 97% of the animals they rescue, that's why I worry about them getting involved in anything like this. I mean if they get involved and it actually does some good, then ok. Im just hoping for the best for the bunnies's sakes.


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## maxysmummy

can you link me to that article? wtf that is fucked


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## kk

I wonder... if someone local could contact the medium like TV or newspaper with the behind the screen photos or even some video clips, this should be able to draw the public awareness of what's truly going on with the LMRR.


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## iresqbunnies

The media did nothing in FL, but who knows in NJ. We will need to wait until conditions get bad again, and they will, to contact the media. It does seem to me, that the media does nothing unless Animal Control gets involved, and animals are being removed from the home/shelter/rescue.


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## Violet23

http://www.rabbitsonline.net/view_topic.php?id=61595&forum_id=1

there's the forum thing with the article in the first post, like they said its a bit of a lengthy read


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## HoppyFamily

Hi everyone. This is my first post here and I just have to say Wow! I knew things were bad but didn't know it was this bad. I have known Kris, personally, for over a decade. We have been internet "friends" but have also met in person. She started her rescue when we were just in High School and I remember then thinking her house was a disaster and the pets were not cared for. I have seen the "sick room" too. 

These accusations are not new. They date back to at least the year 2000. If you do a google search of her or her many aliases (she likes to change her name- Kris, Kristie, Christine) you will find old message board threads JUST like this one. I was never a volunteer for her but as a "friend" I watched her drive them away one by one. Of course her side of the story was always different but after awhile I came to realize that not everyone ELSE can be crazy, it was obviously her. The same thing happened with her real friends, she can't keep anyone close to her. She is REALLLLLY good at putting on an act though, which is how she gets so many new volunteers and donations. She is very smart.

I just wanted to add in some info, probably irrelevant, but thought you might want to know. I do know why Kris is no longer a police officer. She is pregnant and due very soon (end of Jan). She had a huge falling out with the daddy (they only knew eachother a few weeks) and I can only assume she has become overwhelmed with her problems/life and decided to run away again- just like she did when she became overwhelmed with her first NJ rescue and fled to FL, leaving her poor mother with all those animals in her house. I think she has probably decided that she will attempt to run a rescue full time as her new career. She was not a good police officer, she was always getting into trouble with her bosses and they were attempting to drive her out, maybe they were successful, I don't know. 

I have NO idea how she is going to be able to support herself, so she must be living back with her mother even though she will be turning 30 in Jan. Furthermore, I have NO idea how she will support the rescue! Rent alone is $1100/month! 

Kris is notorious for begging for money and not handling it properly. First of all, she used to lie about having a legit non-profit. She did not have the proper status as such but claimed she did when she decided it would look better if she did. That is just one of MANY lies. Although I do think she probably does have the correct status now, I hope at least! Secondly, she is constantly asking for large amounts of money and then spends her own (I hope) money on expensive things for herself like handbags, clothes, tattoos, vacations, etc etc etc. 

I am surprised that she is even "allowed" to open a rescue again in NJ considering what happened with her first NJ "rescue." But I am happy to see the authorities are involved and watching.


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## HoppyFamily

Also, wanted to add that I don't think Kris is evil- she is just SICK! She is most definitely a hoarder, and not just of rabbits. She doesn't see what is wrong here and believes she is the hero.


Looks like she has gotten lots of donations and help starting her new rescue:

http://littlemiraclesrr.wordpress.com/

This page doesn't work for me but maybe I am blocked: 

http://www.facebook.com/littlemiracless


I know she took down her personal page for the most part because she had a lot of horrified "friends" when she mentioned getting a late-term abortion.


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## Happi Bun

Their facebook isn't working for me either... strange. :?

I know that LMRR does not have proper 5013 non-profit status.


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## RosL

*Happi Bun wrote: *


> Their facebook isn't working for me either... strange. :?
> 
> I know that LMRR does not have proper 5013 non-profit status.


Remove one 's' from the end of the Facebook link and it works.


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## Happi Bun

Ooooh, thank you! :biggrin:


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## Flash Gordon

um when i remove the extra "s" the link takes me to Little Miracles ..somebody in New Zealand..i dont think thats her ..


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## RosL

Nope, turns out that's a site of the same name in New Zealand but about babies by the look of it. My mistake, sorry. But the link with the double 's' won't open at all


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## HoppyFamily

*RosL wrote: *


> *Happi Bun wrote: *
> 
> 
> 
> Their facebook isn't working for me either... strange. :?
> 
> I know that LMRR does not have proper 5013 non-profit status.
> 
> 
> 
> Remove one 's' from the end of the Facebook link and it works.
Click to expand...

Then it went to a store in New Zealand called Little Miracles.... I think that is why she had the extra s since her name was taken...?


And that is a shame she still does not have proper 501(c)3 status because she claims to and people donate thinking it will be a proper write off! Kris is a habitual liar, so much so that she believes her own lies as truth.


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## pla725

http://www.facebook.com/littlemiraclesrr

I did see the 501 3(c) status and all other paperwork posted on facebook.


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## HoppyFamily

Oh, ok, I see now- she has me blocked because I just clicked the link from my husband's computer and saw it but then I signed it and it went away.


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## Purple Mountain Rabbitry

You can report her. If enough people do they will remove her from facebook.
if you hit the report button it will give you options. I hit fake profile then the last option it gave me
Report/Block this Person
=1039851273][/i]Share




 

Bunny Rescue
[/i]Awaiting friend confirmationCancel Friend Request[/i]Add as Friend

Crystal


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## HoppyFamily

Yea but report her for doing what?

Did anyone from here go to her grand opening at her new rescue, if so how was it?


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## Purple Mountain Rabbitry

You can select fake profile and then does not represent real persn cause she isnot representing herself right.

Crystal


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## iresqbunnies

Having the paperwork does not mean the IRS has approved them. I want to see the letter of determination from the IRS.


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## Happi Bun

They also don't mention having it anywhere on their website, which is strange if they actually did.


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## HoppyFamily

Oh really? Well she certainly will tell you to your face that she has it.


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## slavetoabunny

She was registered with the state of Florida as a non-profit corporation, which means she had to provide proof of her status with the IRS.

She would have needed to register her status with the state of NJ, but she is a tax-exempt organization.


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## slavetoabunny

Just searched NJ and she is registered as a non-profit https://accessnet.state.nj.us/BusinessEntityResults.asp.


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## HoppyFamily

That's good to hear.


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## iresqbunnies

You can be incorporated in a state, but that doesn't mean you are a 501(c)3,
federally recognized non-profit. When I called the IRS, they told me that she
was a not-for-profit in Florida, which means she could only take in $5,000/year in
donations to have them be tax exempt. She is not a 501(c)3, federally recognized non-profit organization, though she is always claiming to be in the process of completing the paperwork.


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## HoppyFamily

Interesting.

Oh you know I think she has two FB pages for her rescue. My theory is she has one for people she likes and one for people she doesn't like...? Because I cannot see the link above (unless I logout) but she has sent me messages (i.e. donation requests!) from a different FB page just called, "Bunny Rescue." Which seems to be a group of confused people wondering what is actually going on with the real rescue! I just went back to my old FB messages though and it seems she has taken that page down, unless I am blocked by it, too.

And also just wanted to add that yes, she has "defriended" me, both figuratively and literally, but I am not a disgruntled ex-friend. I have had the same opinion of her for the last 10 years, I only followed along because her life is such a train wreck that I could not believe my eyes. I held my tongue through all her BS until she mentioned getting an abortion at 24 weeks pregnant and I couldn't not say anything about that!


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## Amy27

I am a friend of hers on FB under Bunny Rescue. I know she still using that page as she has made a few posts today. The Bunny Rescue page seems to be about the rescue. All the posts are about rabbits being adopted, what they are doing at the new rescue, what supplies they need, when they are having the open house, ect. She never posts anything personal that I have seen on that page. Here is the link to that page http://www.facebook.com/?ref=home#!/littlemiraclesrr


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## HoppyFamily

Oh ok. Well she must have blocked me, which is fine I have just been worried about both the baby and the bunnies so I did a little google searching and found this page.


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## Flash Gordon

she has a Myspace page too..and i found numerous posts on there that go wayy back about how bad it is at that rescue...this has been going on for a couple of years...thats alot of bunnies who have been mistreated and uncared for...that makes me more then mad.


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## HoppyFamily

Oh yea, this all started as far back as 2000 at least. I met her in 99 or maybe even 98 and she had her first NJ rescue in her mom's basement/backyard and it just grew from there. She then fled to FL a few years later when she became overwhelmed with the rabbits. She slowlllly started collecting more animals until a few years ago when she bought her house and started that FL rescue full fledged.


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## Flash Gordon

she also has a Bunspace page too


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## christinelea1

KC changed the name of her FB page after many many outraged ppl saw her still hoarding animals! BUNNY RESCUE is what it is under now! Take a peek( There is also a FB page to help with getting LMRR shut down ASAP as bunnies are suffering so badly at KC hands-deaths are still occuring w/ buns in horrific pain thru neglect like infection after surgery from fuilthy potty boxesand awful tragic things like her rant that she hasnt the money to buy food to feed the over 100 at her facility tho she took in over 5K at fundraisers for bunnies thyat were sick-and they still passed away in her hands... See here:

http://www.facebook.com/home.php?sk=group_107799202629567&id=108505962558891

It is a closed group but if you want to join say you know me.... here is the FB website addy-This FB page has tons of pics and facts from ppl that have wk'd as volunteers and ppl that have adopted and more. [email protected]

We just cont to talk to HSUS, NJ SPCA< the Police Dept and the press to try and get this LMRR shut down-KC HAS to stop this hoarding of petsReally.

Peta-whilst THEY SUCK and have collared ONE PET ABUSER IN 2 YRS though their website has more than 15 ads asking for money per page IS supposedly looking into this and may have undercovers invloved as well. At the FB pages above there are several numbers you can call to help us finally get someone to finally pay attention and help these bunnies who have suffered so much neglect and through 2 states of this woman fraudulently taking ppls money.. We are looking now for places that can responsibly help take a bunny(or 5 or 10) when the day comes that KC is closed down for good so more tragedy does not follow.

Thanks for hearing me.

I had posted here a year ago about not allowing KC to take anymore bunnies. The mods at that time said it was "touchy ground and that KC was a RO member and so they had to get bk w/ me about opening this can of worms and posting my thread.

Is she still a member here or has she "fired" RO as a place to post as she fires anyone who challenges her about these poor defenseless animals in her care? Just curious about posts she has made b/c I have a reporter that will help us to raise a stink to try and light a fire under the proper authorities bottoms to help these animals ASAP! That is what Peta does-they are not law enforcement and SPCA isnt neither-Neither can make arrests but after such a fuss is raised by them-the public demands that action be taken. Any AC or HumaneSociety cant offer much hope either as they are not the law and when a CRIME is commited like animal neglect or abuse there has to be alaw enforcement agency-ie the local police or PAto get and gaurentee acollar on any perp!

Any info you have and dont want to share here-go ahead and PM me.

Again thanks for caring enough to do the right thing and help these babies-There is so so many ppl that know about LMRR that at this point NOT A ONE PERSON can deny it.

2 sides to every story-agreed, disgruntled volunteers LIE as do internet friends that you dont see eye-to-eye with, agreed, emotions run very high when it invloves rescue, agreed but too, sick or not sick I CRAWL to get food, hay and greens to each and every cage everyday! Sick or not sick if you are running a rescue-YOU dont get any days off! Period!

Again I am interested if KC is still with us at RO.

Thank you, God bless and LOVE YOU BUNNIES!XXXOOO


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## Pipp

LMRR has been investigated time and time again by 'the proper authorities', reporters and others and to my knowledge, nobody has found any evidence of SERIOUS wrong-doing. 

With all this very aggressive years-long campaigning, she is being closely monitored by the RESPONSIBLE bodies. I would have to guess she's providing proper nourishment and vet care and she's better than the alternatives. 

Nobody has accused the 'disgruntled volunteers' of 'lying', but they are certainly embellishing.

And for the record, Kris Corson has never been an active member of this forum. She has no friends here. 

Please stop posting this propaganda in this forum. Post your own direct experiences, but please don't pass on the information that's being circulated by the aggressive small group of campaigners. 

You are leaving yourself and this forum open to lawsuits! 


sas :grumpy:


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## Pipp

PS: I would have been more receptive had the above-mentioned group not immediately removed me for questioning some of the 'facts' presented. If they were confident in their accusations, they'd be willing to answer questions from unbiased (and unrelated) parties instead of only allowing input from those willing to take the word of the group members as gospel with no additional research and participate in a witch-hunt.


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## christinelea1

OK so are you KC?

And can I go ahead and publish her direct emails saying the bunnies there have no food and her Mother's aying that she left 90 bunnies and moved to Florida and too when she moved bk to NJ can I post of the guineas left behind not fed and not waterd? These thing for which there are proof of. I am sorry.

I dont know whether pipp is a mod or KC???

I certainly do not mean to flare up trouble but I can tell you when I see the photos that have been posted-THAT to me is enough...It is evidence of neglect anyway you look at the photos there is just no other way they can be anything else. We have 17 that is SEVENTEEN vet that work for CritterCafe and all of them also are sure of misconduct and neglect by these pictures. Not a day in the life of any bunny should they live with the bottom fungi in the one photo and the long nails in the other which we all know long nails cannot be too much of a problem till their hocks are RAW and they can no longer hop and are bleeding(which to me indicates a HUGE prob). Gosh I dont know...this thread has been aloud to be posted thus far-WHY all of a sudden attack my post? Just curious.


----------



## slavetoabunny

Pipp is most certainly NOT Kristi! There is no reason why you should even question this. Whether the concerns are valid or not, this is not the proper venue to vent. All of the members of RO care about the well being of rabbits. I am a rescuer myself. I think that any discussion of this matter should stay on FB.


----------



## Yield

slavetoabunny wrote:


> Pipp is most certainly NOT Kristi! There is no reason why you should even question this. Whether the concerns are valid or not, this is not the proper venue to vent. All of the members of RO care about the well being of rabbits. I am a rescuer myself. I think that any discussion of this matter should stay on FB.



[align=center]I think the reason christinelea1 asked that is because of this statement: "And for the record, I Kris Corson has never been an active member of this forum." Pipp must have accidentally worded it wrong because when I read it I was like ":?"


----------



## slavetoabunny

[align=left]*Yield wrote: *[/align]


> slavetoabunny wrote:





> Pipp is most certainly NOT Kristi! There is no reason why you should even question this. Whether the concerns are valid or not, this is not the proper venue to vent. All of the members of RO care about the well being of rabbits. I am a rescuer myself. I think that any discussion of this matter should stay on FB.





> [align=center]I think the reason christinelea1 asked that is because of this statement: "And for the record, I Kris Corson has never been an active member of this forum." Pipp must have accidentally worded it wrong because when I read it I was like ":?"[/align]



[align=left]
I'm sure that you are correct. It looks like Pipp left out the word "know" or something like that. Regardless, this battle shouldn't be waged on this forum.[/align]


----------



## christinelea1

OMGosh Pipp plz, with all the info and pics are you freakin BLIND? and a lawsuit-?Where has there ever been a lawsuit that won-that paid off on anything even remotely like this-Site it if you've proof because our attnys think NOT-Law enforcemet for one hasnt caught up with technology...This neglect is through 2 states-NOT ONE PIPP

(

And too, my gosh everyone, I mean everyone that means everything and anything from SPCA, lawEnforcement, the press and the Prosecuting Attorney and HSUS(and i agree some of those sucK)are working in this and all have been sent pics and too an entire packet of proof from many many people's persons collaberations. If it were one or too disgruntled ppl from both states-I mean I'd get it BUT all these almost 400 ppl from 2 states that SAW this neglect with the rescue and fraudulent donation and fraudulent claims to be 501?.

Her own mother was left with 90 bunnies when KC left to Florida 10 years ago and had to reach out for help to other rescues-mqny many of the bunnies were sick and died-There are pictures...My gosh-This is NO witchhunt as you see so many know here as well as so many other places. Why are you so adventageous to protect someone that is sick and hoarder.DIAGNOSED!

I am sorry and hate to see he bad press here at RO but I refuse to turn a blind eye as well. Thats all...


----------



## Yield

slavetoabunny wrote:


> [align=left]*Yield wrote: *[/align]
> 
> 
> 
> slavetoabunny wrote:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Pipp is most certainly NOT Kristi! There is no reason why you should even question this. Whether the concerns are valid or not, this is not the proper venue to vent. All of the members of RO care about the well being of rabbits. I am a rescuer myself. I think that any discussion of this matter should stay on FB.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> [align=center]I think the reason christinelea1 asked that is because of this statement: "And for the record, I Kris Corson has never been an active member of this forum." Pipp must have accidentally worded it wrong because when I read it I was like ":?"[/align]
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> [align=left]
> I'm sure that you are correct.Â  It looks like Pipp left out the word "know" or something like that.Â  Regardless, this battle shouldn't be waged on this forum.[/align]
Click to expand...



[align=center]Yes, I agree.


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## christinelea1

Yet another bit:

Here in Fl many called and reported her. She was given a "warning" BEFORE investigation by the only AC officer in her area who she had a questionable relationship with. This warning was at least 24 hours. In which time she had teenagers come pull "all nighters" as she called them, moved and hid animals. Then when the officer got there she cried and played the poor victim as always. My call got the goat taken away that she BOUGHT and left in the dark dangerous rescue garage where it cried pitifully. WHen the hammer came down she fled the state for her mom to take care of her and start the scam again.


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## christinelea1

Thank you as that BLERW my mind( I posted here many times...and is the post now deleted?

Look I am not trying to start trouble but I need to ask questions to be sure and I am not the internet slave as many are. I ask for honest answers to questions that pertain to the subject manner.

I am sorry to offend anyone but recognise this-550 bunnies in 2 years have been rescued here ALL FROM HORRIBLE CIRCUMSTANCES! I am not standing bk and throwing the covers over any complaint until it is followed throough-anbd we have channeled all authorities toi get that done but the fact is that this gal being a police officer in FL has dampered many opportunitie for info and help. IO am sorry but seeing the pictures I am sure-after 550 bunnies here in 2 years and 1080 adoptions, I am-well-my feeling is right, I am sorry to offend anyone. If KC is a hoarder and needs help-my gosh lets save the bunnies and help her get it. Have you seen the neglect-the pictures of the hurting so badly neglected bunnies at the FB page-Do you not think there is merit to my taking time to look and research her and SPCA to when we are so very busy you all.

I MEAN NO HARM to an innocent bunny loving rescue and have had disgruntled volunters but this goes WAY beyond that-MY GOSH WAY beyond that. I posted over a year ago here about trying to stop LMRR from taking any more bunnies in and was -My thread was deleated. We could have helped bk then if you all would have done a small ampount of research to help. Have a Website still does not allow you to not look into and try to help abused animals but, gee( YOU seem to not care about the many many bunnies so so badly hurt and dead....What is up here?


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## slavetoabunny

*christinelea1 wrote: *


> and a lawsuit-?Where has there ever been a lawsuit that won-that paid off on anything even remotely like this-Site it if you've proof because our attnys think NOT-Law enforcemet for one hasnt caught up with technology...This neglect is through 2 states-NOT ONE PIPP


I personally know of a consumer advocacy site that was sued by a scammer. The scammer did not receive any monetary settlement, but the site was required to remove all posts relating to this person's business and also cost the admins many dollars to defend.

Whether or not this this is a valid issue or not (and I will not post my personal opinion here) - all we are saying is that Rabbits Online is not the venue in which to argue about it.


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## christinelea1

Then why have the valid entrys and pictures-Ya know ya cant go both ways as my attnys told me about my continuence.

Please let us know if you want to scrap ALL the posts and pics or you are just helping to and harrassing the few?


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## christinelea1

Yes MAAM! I AM so sorry and I agree .Still would like to know if KC is entertaining this site is all.


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## slavetoabunny

*christinelea1 wrote: *


> Yes MAAM! I AM so sorry and I agree .Still would like to know if KC is entertaining this site is all.


No she is not. I believe she registered as a member a long time ago, but is not active and hasn't been for a number of years.


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## Pipp

THE FOLLOWING IS MY PENDING REBUTTAL TO THE ACCUSATIONS AGAINST KRISTIE CORSON AND HER LITTLE MIRACLES RABBIT RESCUE.
MY COMMENTS ARE IN RED ITALICS.



---------------------------------

http://www.ripoffreport.com/directory/Christine-Corson.aspx

Christine Corson of Little Miracles Rabbit Rescue LMRR, Bunny Rescue, Little Miracles, Little Miracles RR, Kristie Corson, Kris Corson donation fraud, animal abuse, tax fraud, lies, scam, exploitive animal hoarder. Atco, New Jersey *Consumer Comment...

Verified *Author: * North Port Florida I want to make the public aware of the animal abuse, neglect, and donation fraud perpetrated by the president of Little Miracles Rabbit Rescue, Christine "Kristie, Kris" Corson. I was a former volunteer in one of the higher positions at LMRR when it was located in Northport Fl. I saw first hand many things the public needs to know. 

_Rebuttal Disclaimer: I am a rabbit care professional (as the owner of a large rabbit care and behavior forum). I also rescue rabbits. I have never spoken with Kristie Corson nor have I had direct communication with her over this matter although I have seen almost all her posts on the Internet and I have seen the posts from her detractors and researched the accusations. Iâm posting a rebuttal as an expert in the field. _

*The Animal Abuse:*

-The "rescue" building was a detached 2 car garage in poor condition. 
 
It was indeed a ârescueâ, no need for quotations. Most rescues run on limited funds, are housed in older buildings, garages, basements, sheds and warehouses and are rarely pristine. 
 
-The ONLY running water was a hose outdoors. There was no hot water and all bottle were filled there.

This may have been abusive to the volunteers who needed to use the hose, but I assure you, the rabbits really didnât feel abused by this. 

-The air conditioner was often broken or not properly working. In the SW Florida summer heat, with no AC the temp would rise to around 100 degrees F. A cheap fan shifted air but that was it. 

Rabbits are âair cooledâ, like an old Volkswagen. They release body head mainly through their breath. A fan to dissipate the hot air so they donât re-inhale it is just as efficient (and many will argue preferable) to air-conditioning. 

-It was ALWAYS dark unless a volunteer was there. Corson did not allow lights on, even during the day and had the small windows covered so that the public could not look in and see the horrible conditions on the inside.

The domestics found in US rescues are European rabbits, which live in underground burrows. They will come out for an hour or two usually twice a day to eat and frolic. Assuming the volunteers come in once or twice a day and turn the lights on, this was not a hardship for the rabbits. (For the record, no rabbits in shelters and few in rescues have regular access to sun and grass, neither does the average very spoiled house bunny). 

-Dead animals were thrown into the freezer and later buried in the back yard. 

Not sure what the alternative is here? Stuff them? Leave them in their cages? Even if a rabbit is being sent to a veterinarian for a necropsy, they need to be refrigerated or frozen. Cremation is expensive, burying them in the yard is a viable option. Necropsies are not needed if the cause of death is already known, and often inconclusive. 

-Food was often not available, and Corson would become cross and berate all volunteers who repeatedly questioned her until the volunteers bought food themselves.

This sounds like a personal disagreement, but not abuse. If the rabbits were truly starving, this would have been at the top of this list. Reading between the lines, I suspect Ms. Corson was hoping for or expecting support in this area from the volunteers, who in turn thought Ms. Corson should be responsible for this on her own. (For the record, the volunteers traditionally supply at least some of the food with my rescue).

 -The animals were NEVER given fresh produce at the Fl location unless a volunteer brought it, or there were cameras and Corson getting attention.

Produce is often donated by produce retailers and distributors and having volunteers picking it up is a duty often listed on rescue âto doâ lists. And bunnies munching on greens is a great photo opp. Pellets can be quickly consumed before the shots are done, and getting them to eat hay on cue isnât as easy. 

-Rescued animals frequently escaped and bred one another, some who were there for months. Nearly all babies DIED who were born at LMRR. 

This may be irresponsible (which begs the question, did the volunteers not keep them secure, either?), but hardly abuse. (The word âfrequently Iâm sure would be argued, I seem to recall the rescueâs blog alluding to two or three litters over many years). The mortality rate can be high for babies, especially if theyâre not intentionally bred and the pregnancy is unexpected.

-Corson BOUGHT her Flemish giant "mascot" rabbits from a breeder but lied and said she rescued them and took public donations for them. One of whom, Maya, was impregnated by a rescue rabbit months later and gave birth, yes your donations paid for the needs of all of those baby rabbits. 

A long-standing argument in rescue is whether rabbits being kept in poor conditions should be purchased in order to ârescueâ them. This is one of those agree to disagree differences that can never be called right or wrong. It is certainly not abuse. Neither is choosing to pay for a rabbit you're fallen in love with. Rabbits pregnancies in rescue are not uncommon because they are really only old enough to be spayed and neutered when theyâre old enough to breed. Sometimes the realization theyâre old enough comes just a little too late! They are also often mis-sexed, even by vets. (For the record, my rescue mascot is a mis-sexed Flemish bought from somebody who was selling him for meat. Sue me). 

-Corson PURCHASED many pure bred animals who the volunteers were charged with caring for. Some actually lived in the rescue garage. They included a goat, chinchillas, lops, 3 small rabbits, 2 rats, 2 Akitas, a cat, and a Flemish Giant, Hailey, who lived in a dark filthy back room alone. 

Ms. Corson likely thought these animals all needed help. If they didnât need help but the volunteers resented caring for them, this is grounds for being âdisgruntledâ, but again, nothing even remotely related to abuse.

-No matter how many animals were in the rescue garage, sometimes in cages stacked 3 high, Corson kept bringing animals in. Among ourselves we often said these animals needed rescuing from the rescue. 

Shelters and rescues routinely stack cages, Iâm sure the rabbits really donât care if theyâre stacked. Yes, Iâm sure the disgruntled volunteers talked among themselves. A lot. 

-At one time all of the rabbits had horrible flea issues, bald spots and all from the irritation. There were also many animals with worms. When asked to treat them she yelled about money and belittled us for not buying the medication.

Key words, âat one time.â It only takes one animal coming in with fleas to infest the herd, and they will show signs of the infestation before theyâre gone. (Even the Four Seasons can get bed bugs). Worms are found in almost all rabbits rescued outdoors. Most are not an immediate threat and can wait until meds are donated or funds are on hand for purchases. Rescuers and volunteers donât always agree on treatments, common argument in rescue. 

-The total number of rabbits in the garage was between 80-100.

Most main rescues here have this same number. 

-Later Corson took in a bunch of guinea pig, hamsters and need supplies to sell. She refereed to them as "pure profit" 

Not sure what this means, maybe they were cheap to feed and/or easy to adopt out for a decent adoption fee? Canât think of a scenario where this would be abusive or criminal.

-When I first started many animals, including Corson's own pets had severe urine scalding, nails so long the animals couldn't walk, mats, fleas, wounds, eye and ear infections, and were scared and unsociable.

Rescued rabbits very often come in with such ailments. The photo posted falls under the milder end of the scale, a rabbit can look like that two or three days into a urinary tract infection. Rescuers can fall ill or have family or personal emergencies. Rescuers depend on volunteers to help with their care and suffer through periods when nobodyâs available or theyâve walked out in a huff. Sometimes disgruntled volunteers show up when asked but instead of helping, they take pictures. 

-Corson would purposefully deny special care or help or good ideas for the rescue if it was the good idea of another. 

This sounds personal, differing opinions. Bruised egos, not bruised rabbits. Not abuse.

-Corson threatened to kill all of the rabbits when she was upset with personal issues.

The rabbits were probably up for euthanization before Ms. Corson rescued them. Being overwhelming/sick and threatening/whining about not continuing with the rescue would mean taking them to a shelter where theyâd likely be put down. Itâs a short surrendering = killing them leap. But weâve all threatened to kill someone or something in our lives. (My rabbit just are my phone charger, sheâs been subjected to all manner of death threats). 
 
-There is FAR more, but these are important notes. 

If these are the important ones, itâs Corson by a landslide. There is NOTHING about rabbits starving, injured or dying, no emaciated rabbits. The photos posted shows full litterboxes, mild urine scald and a urine-soaked floor outside the cages â the latter a sign that the rabbits are getting run time and not always cooped up. (They will always urinate in front of the other cages to establish territory, Twenty cages on the ground = 20 puddles x 10 rabbits loose between clean-ups = 200 puddles = a urine-soaked floor. The pictures show that the white rabbits paws are white and not urine stained, a sign that the cages are kept clean. Continuing exposure to urine will quickly stain their feet. The photos also ook like the majority of rabbit rescues in terms of rabbits, cages and space in spite of captions about hoarding. 

*Donation Abuse:*

-Many times I witnessed Corson use funds from the "rescue card" to pay for her own things. Food, party supplies, supplies for her own pets, and personal bills. She was shameless and always had a crafty way of explaining it. 

Iâd hazard a guess youâre not mentioning instances of Ms. Corson using her own funds to pay rescue-related costs. Party supplies can mean event supplies, a common fundraising expenditure. (Isnât a âcraftyâ way of explaining is a good thing?) 

-Corson would raise tons of money for a project that never came to be. She just kept the money, never refunding or giving the people what they wanted. People calling about their memorial brick, tee shirt, sponsored bunny or other undone contribution would be berated and blocked from calling her or emailing.

Rescues will attempt to raise funds for an idea or project all the time and if not enough funds are raised, the idea isnât implemented and the funds are redirected to another project. If the donors have a problem with this, itâs up to them to complain, and not a group disgruntled ex-volunteers. After reading the voluminous material presented by this group for years, I donât recall seeing a complaint from a third-party donor. 

-When given cash, Corson put it in her pocket or purse, did not record it and never put it to the rescue. Often in the same day, you would see her purchase something totally unnecessary with the same cash. 

When somebody hands me cash, I put it in my purse or pocket, I think this is pretty common! In a statement below, you say Ms. Corson was the only one with access to the books, so how do you know it wasnât recorded? âNecessaryâ is subjective.

-Corson often told people and advertised being a 501c3 non profit, she NEVER has been, but collected funds as such. 

Again, people expecting a tax-deductible receipt should be the ones to complain and there is no evidence of any such complaints. The IRS doesnât take these things lightly thus I doubt your version of these events. 

-Corson took donations at least 2 times that I know of for the 501c3 filing cost but they were never filed. 

There is a note on Ms. Corsonâs site or blog that references the rescue having to reapply for a different level of tax exemption that has a higher filing fee. I suspect this is another normal procedure youâre trying to twist into a âcrimeâ.

-Corson instructed us to "lie" and "make up" info asked for in the 501c3 application.

Iâm sure had the details been anything more than âfudgingâ, this person would have noted this âcrimeâ as well.
 
-Corson had many people donate items for yard sale benefit sales and kept what she wanted for herself. 

How do you know she didnât pay for them? I have yet to see a rabbit rescue or shelter at this level capable of having more income than output.

-Corson raised money to pay her mortgage saying the rabbits needed it because she had spent too much money on a large tattoo. 

This is the mortgage on the rescue building I assume? If all you can muster in a âspending rescue funds on herselfâ accusation is paying for a tattoo, however large, it sounds like youâre REALLY scraping the bottom of the barrel. 

-Corson has many different fundraisers going at once, in an effort to defraud the public

Just maybe the different fundraisers are to fund the rabbit rescue? This is the usual MO for a well-run non-profit. 

-NO ONE has access to the books and money in the account except for Corson and every now and then a few close friends are given the card to buy stuff.

Then, as above and again below, how can you accuse her of not logging all the funds and cheating on her taxes? You canât have it both ways. 

-Corson has a small store at the rescue where she sells items, she claims none of them and gives out no receipts. 

See above. 

-Corson lies on her taxes, and NOTHING you give can be written off. 

See above.

IN SHORT, I want to ask that you PLEASE donate to a reputable rescue and report to the IRS any suspicious dealings that you have had with Christine "Kristie" Corson, her parents, or the boyfriend that helps enable all of this, Justin Evans.

It sounds like Ms. Corson and the rabbits have a good support network with her parents and boyfriend giving her a hand. There is absolutely nothing here to indicate abuse by Ms. Corson.


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## christinelea1

I am writing this to whomever was indeed able to post at the closed LMRR(Rescue ME) Topic



I dont know how anyone can say they have seen all her posts online-she has so many aliases noone has been able to keep count and also has conversations with herself for ppl to read(See Case Study on FB), also not mentioned here is this reckless rescuers leaving not one but TWO states where up to 300 animals were the first time-these animals were sick and unvetted-dieing and left w/ her unknowledgeable Mother(her words not mine) and then moving to Florida started the same thing and did the same thing leaving many of these animals in that "heat-filled"garage in filthy conditions....again after "rescueing" up 300 bunnies even BUYING Hampton "Spokesbunny" from a breeder claiming he was a very sick boy RESCUED by her(to help bring in donations) His pedigree is also posted online as is the statement from the breeder he was purchased from.
I know the volunteers have been very negative-but the case study FB page shows facts and one really must try and understand that when you treat ppl badly and they see death and sickness not being taken care of time and time again and are forced to bring in food so the animals they are VOLUNTEERING to care for can eat-sorry-I would be mad too and say some bad things.
It cant be all wrong when ppl from 2 different states-23 of I have talked to SO FAR have all the same stories on Coron and LMRR.
If it was one of two disgruntles volunteers I'd say well better ck further into things but these are ppl that befriended Corson thru volunteering and over 10 years time!
They pictures indeed tell a story of reckless endangerment of animals living miserably....some prob would have been better off PTS than suffering the pain they did before dieing!
Oh and that does not even begin to touch the fraud with donations that hardworking ppl sent FOR BUNNIES that she herself is on a YouTube video saying "her three facial peircings" are thanks to those donations!
Not to mention the lies-Oh my gosh too many to document-not one thiing that comes from her mouth can be l;ooked at as totally true.
And if she has used her own moneys for the care of the many many that have been in her care-wouldn't that require some kind of job.
Your rebuttal comes from a place that lacks knowledge and facts. I am sorry.
There is so so much documentation out there I cant imagine writing what you did if you looked around at the facts.
Oh and you do not mention b/c of lack of research LMRR as of Monday has been issued a Cease and Desist and are closed by the Health Dept in that town. She, Kristy Corson, cannot take in any more animals and she cannot adopt ANY out without a certified health document from a licensed vet!
Also not mentioned here is the recent adoption of several rabbits with syphyllis which ran around LMRR untreated though Koprson was well aware of the rabbits having it(this is comfirmed BY HER VET).
Thats all I have to say.
I am not wasting my time going to copy and Paste the order from the Health department b/c I figure if you start looking around and researching LMRR(and for that issuance) you might learn facts about the place you quite frankly as of right now are blind to.
Respectfully, ChristineLea
CritterCafeRescue


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## slavetoabunny

Can you post a link to this FB Case Study page. In doing a search, there are way too many results to narrow it down. I would be interested in reading it.

BTW.....LMRR is not closed down. Kristie met with the health department this morning, delivered the "plan review" that was missing from her documenation and is still very much in business.


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## christinelea1

Effective May 12, 2011, the Camden County Health Department issued a *CEASE AND DESIST* order to Christine "Kristie" Lynanne Corson, for the business Little Miracles Rabbit Rescue. The legal paperwork regarding this issue has been sent to Corson's residence. Until and IF Corson complies to the demands the health department and their multiple subsequent inspections, she is to follow the following directives:



-CHRISTINE LYNANNE CORSON & LITTLE MIRACLES RABBIT RESCUE IS NOT TO TAKE IN ANY MORE ANIMALS OF ANY KIND FOR ANY REASON



-ANY ANIMAL LEAVING THE PREMISE MUST HAVE A COMPLETE AND LEGAL CERTIFICATE OF HEALTH FOLLOWING EXAMINATION BY A LICENSED AND UP TO DATE VETERINARIAN SAYING THE ANIMAL IS HEALTHY AND FREE OF DISEASE.



To confirm this report call the Camden County Health Department at *(856) 374 - 6026*


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## slavetoabunny

Do you have a copy of the actual document? You are just repeating hearsay from FB. I spent a good 20 minutes searching for in online (including the county's FB page and official health department page) and can't find it. To the best of my knowledge, no one has been able to document this claim.


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## christinelea1

https://www.facebook.com/home.php?sk=group_204611632886256&id=226788337335252#!/home.php?sk=group_204611632886256

I am only the messenger here.
I KNOW these peopple are very upset and negative BUT as I said after being put thru what they were, seeing what they saw, being treated how they were treated-I WOULD be mad too.
They are under all the anger just out to get help for the many animals again in harm's way.
Look meaness is a part of human nature and we all have it...
If you read just a small amount of the way these ppl were treated you'd act out twards your abuser too...its like PostTramaticStressDisorder.
They arent going to give up and they are not going away until their message is heard and these animals get protection from LMRR founder.
I DO think alot of the anger "SCREAMING" could stop but I just want to say I understand it!
hey you think I was an ANGEL when the Muskegon Police brought the seven bunnies with their ears cut off?
WOAH!!
You should have heard MY BIG MOUTH!!(And for over a YEAR later even.....
I was only trying to get justice for the bunnies but my emotions seeing these babies just inferiorated me to where I could not hardly hold a conversation with the Prosecutor handling the case.


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## christinelea1

Was that helpful-Prob not.
Did we get justice-YUP.
Could i stop screaming my fool head off then-YUP.


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## christinelea1

I posted a direct number for them as the Doc was served only yesterday.Please call it.(Thats why I posted it...) Here it is again just in case you missed it maybe..(856) 374 - 6026


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## slavetoabunny

Thanks for the link Christine. I thought I would see something new, but it's the same small group regurgitating the same old stuff.

Since I can't post on any of the many pages that BJ has, perhaps you can address an issue with them. If their continual attacks and harrassment do manage to shut them down (which is unlikely) - what's going to happen to the rabbits? Are you or any of the small group of people involved going to take them in? Or is this group going to facilitate the euthanization of all the rabbits. Just wondering.


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## christinelea1

I continue PRAYING and trying to tell everyone trying to shut the place down that THOSE BUNNIES AND ANIMALS THERE ARE THEMOST IMPORTAND AND FIRST AND FOREMOST.Please make sure all the ducks are in a row to care for these innocent pets so everybun and the others pets do not go from bad to worse.This is my main concern and thank you for being THE ONLY OTHER PERSON TO ADDRESS THIS ASIDE FROM ME!YOU ROCK and again my heartfelt thanks!
I have put together several places that continue to wait for word,we all want to help though the more she takes in the more impossible that may be.
Too a huge concern is this, the syphillis...We keep TRYING to find out if the bunnies were ALL treated including those adopted that came bk(after diagnoses)...We have confirmation o0f the outbreak and diagnoses and the then adoptions that should not have taken place but the only one that can confirm treatment is that vet-she confirms syphillis through an adopter but she will nmot, prob can not let anyone know about treatment.
I have asked several ppl with documentation to please show up hear with proof MINUS attitude.
I know if you post at PAU and ask with honest concern as I did, oh, you will get documentation of all FACTUAL INFO.
They are a nice group of folks but so sick and tired of being sick and tired over not being heard about many many faults at this LMRR.
As I posted earlier...there are too many ppl from too many differing states that have the same story-ALL of them cannot be called liars ortelling BS accounts.
They came together from luck and care-ON FB- (HA! Wow the power of the net is something isnt it?)...Well and ALl of them said we will NOT let these naimals down once again...plz reach out and talk to them if you care to....Lookif they did not care they would not have maintained this thing for so long and see now-they are getting down to business as the Health Dept is the first step in all this after the confiramtion of the syphillis outbreak.


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## Pipp

Sorry, didn't realize this thread was still locked. Although it will be locked again if christinelea continues to spam the thread.  

Christine, I love you, you've got an awesome heart, but either these people are playing you or you're just too emotional to do your research and take a good look at the actual facts. 

Syphilis in rabbits is very common and only a minor concern. It's only spread through the birth canal and sexual contact, it usually only manifests as painless, mildly crusty skin around the eyes, nose and vent areas, and it is EASILY cleared up with a single shot of penicillin. 

There is NO emergency health issue here, sheesh!! 

*I'm deleting a lot of this post because I've repeated myself. Stick to this. *

Is the world really better off without this rescue? 

Even if there was some discomfort from less than great conditions, were/are those rabbits better off dead? 

How many have been saved? Hundreds. At least. 

The attackers have called every authority possible. She's been investigated ad nauseum. There is no veterinary or protection agency documentation or proof rabbits died or suffered from neglect. 

There is ample proof the rabbits are getting good care right now. 

Stop this campaign. 

The page that's linked lambasts Kristie for singing karaoke and sitting in a hot tub. WTF does that have to do with the health and welfare of rabbits? 

Ditto with posts that you have regurgitating mentioning the father of her child and her employment status as a police officer. This is all info that Kristie has posted herself, they've just reposted with nasty captions. 

What makes this worth repeating?

No rescue on the planet can come out of this kind of scrutiny unscathed. When the Camdem Dept. of Health are notified by FIVE different people complaining about the conditions, of COURSE they're going to react and investigate. But the all these people are saying right now is that the county IS investigating! Its not the county health complaining, they're responding to complaints. 

They have asked the rescue to PROVE their in compliance and asked that no more animals be taken in until they do so. This is a far cry from the bull these people are spewing saying that the county health has shut them down "for filthy conditions." 

The wording at worst should read 'intake and outtake of animals suspended while the county investigates the complaints'.

Christine, they could have just as easily filed complaints against you with the same result if the five decide en masse they don't like you, and that's what makes them beyond annoying, they're dangerous. 

And after their ridiculously aggressive attempts to shut down the recent rescue of 80 Florida rabbits, they're a danger to the lives of the rabbits. Had they succeeded in even delaying Kristie by one day, those rabbits may well have died.

Aside from dredging up the pages and pages of personal information (which again when you strip it down and look at it, it's not bad, they just labelled it that way), they have really stepped over the line by involving the rabbits. 

:X


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## Pipp

Note that the group of detractors have created dozens of websites, pages, Facebook groups and other venues to distribute their vitriol, and they are not allowing supporters to post but they do have a wide range of aliases furthering their own cause. 

Thus the pages SEEM to be 100% anti-Kristie Corson. 

That said, Kristie herself rarely, if ever, even tries to post. She has consistently taken the high road and kept her nose to the grindstone, rescuing rabbits. 

Here's one of my posts deleted from their sites:


Rabbits Online I forget, is Kristie Munchausen Julie or Ronnie? Or maybe Dixie or Amber, no matter. Its just that I loose track of all the aliases. Not to mention the cousins, bf's and husbands. The best comment made IMO is still the one where Patti very correctly said in response to someone referencing the 'bickering' or âfightâ is that âKristie isn't fighting, she just wants them to leave her alone.â 
Although understandably frustrated and subject to the odd rant, throughout the years of abusive posts from these people, Kristie has never wavered from the business at hand, rescuing the rabbits. Iâve seen a few of her posts giving her explanation of one of their insane missives, but otherwise Iâd never know. She doesnât take the (considerable) time to post rebuttals. She has stuck to the high road, preferring to just get the job done, and I respect the h*ll out of that.
Kristie has never tried to hide anything, either. She wears her life on her sleeve. The âammunitionâ being used by this group of thugs is most often Kristieâs own words from public forums â her doubts about her pending motherhood, a post about taking Percodan for a toothache, everyday stuff. They turn them into Kristie being an unfit mother and a drug addict, just by posting them with horrible captions. Nobody is stopping and saying, âheyâ¦this isnât rabbit abuseâ. 
And Kristie isnât fighting. She just wants them to leave her alone.


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## Pipp

This is another deleted note first posted on the RO Facebook page and deleted by Facebook. 


Facebook apparently pays attention to volume, not content. Launching five complaints will get a page taken down for doing nothing more than asking these people to stop their attacks. But they in turn have dozens of pages and posts with cute titles like "Kristie Corson is a filthy pig" and they're all still up.
(I'll probably repost this to the top of the page). 

-----------------------------------------------------

To the "Bunny Justice" crew (Julie Christa Stephens, Ronnie Cyr, Dixie Stone Resnick, Amber Seely Spoerl and a very few others parading under dozens of aliases), please stop posting your vitriol all over the Internet, including here.

For those of you who are friends or unsuspecting followers of these people, PLEASE research and WEIGH the information you're regurgitating. A few dirty cages and poop on the floor of a rabbit rescue is NOT abuse!! When volunteers come to feed/water rabbits, the dishes are going to be empty! An accidental litter can happen to any rescue or foster home!! A picture of a rabbit with a wet butt isn't grounds to shut down a rescue! Photos of a lot of properly housed rabbits don't show the rescuer is a hoarder no matter what the caption says! A ten-year-old incident where rabbits were re-homed is no longer relevant!! These are not 'crimes'!

And especially, letters and posts about personal issues like pregnancy and employment are totally irrelevant to rabbit rescue and you have no business plastering them all over the Internet!


The amount of effort and ugliness put into this campaign is astounding and the tactics are despicable. Its natural to 'cluck cluck' with your friends, but seriously, do you really see anything here that warrants shutting down this rescue? Please think before blindly supporting a group comprised of people with personal grudges launching ridiculously aggressive personal attacks.
This group has reported this girl to the Humane Society, the SPCA, Facebook, income tax, child services, all the media outlets, animal control, the health board, posting personal info, you name it. Very few, if any, rescues can withstand this kind of scrutiny. To Kristie's credit she has been passing a wide array of inspections brought on by this group for months (and in many cases, years) and she has survived all the attempts to derail her. What does that tell you?

It's incredibly distracting to people trying to rescue rabbits (us and Kristie included). It's alienating the entire community and putting all of us in a horribly unprofessional light with the government, media and the public.

And it's a COLOSSAL waste of energy and resources. These huge efforts should be directed to saving lives, not jeopardizing the rabbits in rescue or in need of rescue. Please rethink your involvement!

To others reading this, please ask these people to stop poisoning the rescue pool! STOP THE NEGATIVITY!!


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## slavetoabunny

I will be traveling to NJ on company business in mid-July and have been invited to visit the shelter along with one of their adopters. I realize this is almost two months off, but will be sure and take pics and post a review.

I'm amazed at the posts that have been deleted on the many Bunny Justice pages, while the vitriole has remained. This whole situation has gone way too far, and I am appalled that I am actually having to defend myself.

Anyone that has been my friend on this forum and other forums know who I am and what I stand for. No further explanation is necessary. BTW, PIP, did you know that you are really Kristie and she owns RabbitsOnline? LOL!


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## Pipp

post from a group: 

_christinelea - OH I am so so upset after I read on LMRR about baby wilders needing help-so I temp "Liked" the LMRR page to try and help this person w/ 3 baby wilders(buns)...
I -in detail- wrote many many options he could use and the very important info you ie cannot feed KMR or baby infant form. to wilder bunnies as it will dehydrate and ultimatly kill them(GOATS milk and probios only)....she (KC)??deleted all my info left for these bunnies...NOW why...I ask thru tears-it is not about me or her but caring for these bunnies...WHY would she dlete my posts?
I am soooo mad and I am beyond sad... Now of course I am blocked(??) from posting but I did message the bunny(wilders) person personally and I have no msg bk yet so alls I can do is worry and be so mad at this freak of a human who knows NOT me but deleted the info I wrote to care for an innocent baby WILDER-why would any reasonable person do this(even tho we all KNOW she is not reasonable). I am about wanting to call her and ask her thru my tears, HOW could she be so nasty and give such awful and outright WRONG advice for caring for a baby wilder bunny?She totally did the wrong thing in order to care for or save these buns. Iwant to SOCK her in the eye at this point for deleteing the helpful info I posted to a person at her LMRR site-I did not intend it for her but I did intend it to help these wild baby buns!-I cant help it and I care NOT what any of her defamned supporters think after she would allow these baby wilders not to get care/offer the wrong care and then delete the proper care to save their very lives!-and its gotta be b/c of her own poor self asteem.._


Christine, you've been slandering this woman and this rescue all over the internet and you're surprised your not allowed on her site? 

This is another example about how this is hurting the rabbits. It takes cooperative care. But again, Kristie Corson is reactive, not proactive. She's not the one fighting here.

And no offense, but baby wild rabbit care is controversial and subjective. There is nothing to say that your treatment suggestions are any better than somebody else's. I can't say one is better than the other and I've researched it pretty extensively. There is no right or wrong, we all have our opinions.

Please be more tolerant (a LOT more tolerant) of what YOU see as crimes against rabbits as well as tolerant of other people's views.


sas _
_


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## Happi Bun

I have nothing to add really other than thank goodness for level headed people like Patti and Pipp! I'm so thankful this forum didn't just jump on the "Kristin is the spawn of Satan" band wagon. I used to believe the accusations against her rescue until I took a step back and really thought about it without all the hype/drama to throw me off. I also came to see the true colors of the people against her and how crazy they are.


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## RosL

Before you edited one of your posts, it said 


> The '23' people you refer to as witnesses are just the same five people (max) with aliases, boyfriends and cousins parroting their information.


Sorry, that is wrong. Maybe that's why you edited it out?

Apart from the five you refer to, I know a dozen or more others from various Yahoo groups who don't spend their time doing nothing but spamming as those handful do who you refer to, but have personally witnessed the horrors over the years and have done what they could to clean up the situation, to get bunnies out, in the distant past in NJ and then later in FL.

These are not aliases. They are real, identifyable people. They concentrate mostly on other things when they post on the groups, but mention LMRR to them, mention Kristie Corsan and they are transformed, not by vitriol but by what they have witnessed and experienced.

They don't go around making the hate mails, though the crazies do try to drag them in, do make up quotes from them. These are intelligent, reasoned people. I trust that they are being truthful. I can think of no reason why they would lie about any of this. And they are not alone, though sadly due to the lunacy of that tiny vitriolic minority, their voices are being ignored. And who is suffering because of that? The rabbits are suffering, that's who.


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## iresqbunnies

I do not condone the methods of those associated with Bunny Justice, but please do not blindly dismiss their experiences with Little Miracles. I have made a statement regarding my personal experiences, earlier in this thread. Other reputable rescue people, former volunteers and adopters have also shared experiences on this thread and on other lists organized to try and make changes within Little Miracles.

There are at least 50 people that I personally know, who have witnessed the poor conditions and ill rabbits within this troubled rescue. There are many others who have not come forward. 

Please know that when company is expected, ie. for events, scheduled visits, and unwise tip-offs of visits by officials by the Bunny Justice group, the shelter is cleaned up, and in the past the ill bunnies have been hidden away.

Agreed, Kristie Corson is a well-spoken, intelligent and convincing individual. What she is not, is truthful. Please consider the experiences of dozens of reputable people whose only concerns are the welfare of the Little Miracles foster animals, as genuine.


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## christinelea1

Become a fan of award winning Wildlife and Nature Photographer Michael Poliza and see his latest images.
.Like Â· Maria Montgomery likes this.VOORHEES LMRR (Borrowed from a Scam Warning)
.by Tina Zimmerman on Tuesday, May 17, 2011 at 10:51pm.On the surface, Little Miracles Rabbit Rescue (LMRR) looks like a paradise for our fluffy, furry friends. Their website is impressive and professional. If you perform a google search on LMRR and you will find no less than 50 polished donation sites to raise funds and increase donations. These donation/charity event site span approximately 11 years. The earliest I was able to locate online was right around 2002.



Although the founding date of LMRR is subject to debate, Corson states more often than not that LMRR was established in January, 2000 when she was 18/19 years of age.



How did LMRR begin? That's up for debate also. In Corson's version it started when she bought a bunny from a pet store, only to bring it home and watch it die the next day. A witness and close friends tell a completely version. This version is very different from her account. Kris Corson started out as a rabbit breeder. Back in April, 2000, she was adamant about being able to breed, even mixed breeds. She then started to work at a pet store. A few rabbits came in ill with coccidi. She took them on, with a plan to breed them, and in truth some of them did die, as was expected.



On Dec 22, 2000 in the time line, Corson stopped breeding and began "rescueing". The problem was, she was taking in rabbits at an alarming rate. (On 7/9, 2000, she had 26 rabbits, on 12/22, she had 65, it went up from there.)



Let's stop here and you decide how LMRR came to be. This may help you...The Better Business Bureau lists LMRR as 'Animal Insemination - Artificial'. Yes, a rabbit breeder. Which version do you find more plausable now? I could have told you, I was there. Corson has a funny way of twisting the facts and shifting blame. You needed to decide for yourself.



Let's continue. Time marched on and at some point volunteers, among others, couldn't help but notice that Kris may have a serious problem. Kris had collected 350+ bunnies by 2003. You read that correctly, the bunnies were counted and by more than one person. At the time when Corson was confronted with this concern, Corson's response was that "a very one-sided - hostile campaign" was being launched against her.



Another, more disturbing concern was that Corson claimed to be "moving" the rescue. She made floor plans, and begged for money to help pay for moving. Her floor plans didn't include enough places for the rabbits to exercise. The rabbits were to be caged most of the time. She never addressed peoples concerns at that time either. She has always asked for money, and always defended her right to take on as many rabbits as she pleased, claiming they were all "okay". She has claimed to have 20-25 adoptions happening per week, yet the numbers of rabbits there didn't drop. The rabbits were never moved. The shelter was never built. Where did all that money go that she collected I wonder?



The situation reached a breaking point, July 24th. The NJ SPCA arrived at the Corson residence for further investigation. After the investigation, Corson's mother, called for help last minute and asked everyone/anyone to take as many buns as possible. They were warned that pasturella and EC present. People helped, good people stepped in and cleaned up that horror-show they walked in and saw. One rescue stated the bunnies they took in from LMRR in Voorhees were severely underweight, malnurished and had mild to serious health issues.



After it was all was said and done, her mother was left with approx. 90 rabbits to care for. Did I not mention that Corson had left the state? Yup, she had left NJ and her collection of rabbits that lived in the outdoor shed and in the basement of her mothers home in Voorhees, NJ. (I know the story of her abrupt move, but we would be opening more issues than just the rabbits. Let's leave that for you locate on the internet if you so choose and stick with the LMRR issue.)



In later years, Corson has been confronted about what happened. Corson's response was that "a very one-sided - hostile campaign" was launched against her. She denied it all. She denied the number of rabbts. She denied the "sick room". She denied all the donation money she collected. She denied bunnies were ill and flea infested. In the tales she tells, Corson changes the history of what happened in Voorhees, NJ.



I and others were there, the truth haunts us still. Looking back, I am saddened that I helped. I thought it would be the end of Corson's behavior, I was wrong. By helping in Voorhees, it only helped to enable her to continue and make bigger, more dangerous decisions in the future.



You readup on Little Miracles Rabbit Rescue and see what you locate. Sadly there is much more to tell, but that will be for another day and another topic. I'll tell you this, LMRR resurfaced in Florida, this time in her garage.



To get you started, here are a few links: http://www.examiner.com/tampa-pet-services-in-tampa-bay/for-one-florida-rescue-organization-easter-is-a-bad-hare-day 



http://www.petkb.com/Uwe/Forum.aspx/rabbit/260/The-end-of-LMRR 



http://www.rabbitsonline.net/view_topic.php?id=62580&forum_id=7&page=1 



http://groups.google.com/group/alt.pets.rabbits/browse_thread/thread/962b973b0506a00e/d2cae2d8115e1b98 



http://www.care2.com/news/member/442150667/857314 



http://www.rabbitsonline.net/view_topic.php?id=62580&forum_id=7&jump_to=834822 



http://www.facebook.com/horrors.lmrr



http://www.petkb.com/Uwe/Forum.aspx/rabbit/260/The-end-of-LMRR 



http://www.rabbithabit.org/adoptables/memoriam.asp 



http://www.rabbited.0catch.com/over.html 



http://www.facebook.com/home.php?sk=group_107799202629567



http://bunnyjustice.com/ 



http://www.petkb.com/Uwe/Forum.aspx/rabbit/260/The-end-of-LMRR 



http://www.rabbitsonline.net/view_topic.php?id=62580&forum_id=7&jump_to=833979 



http://www.facebook.com/pages/Little-Miracles-Rabbit-Rescue/150460001646201



http://www.facebook.com/home.php?sk=group_191071520923696



http://www.facebook.com/pages/LMRR-Hoarding-Animal-Abuse/182803015088084


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## [email protected]

Sorry I have been quiet in posting because I am slowly becoming disgusted, not to mention I am busy. So I hope you guys don't mind a long message here, and than I need to go back to my own life. 

In all of this, do you know what is the saddest thing? This has become a JOKE. Not just from the people of Bunny Jutice either, from the Kristie supporters, some of the people here, the fake profiles, and people who are simply watching it as if it were a soap opera. MOST of the people who have made themselves involved, have lost sight(or never saw) what is important here. While some people have personal issues with Corson, and have used the rescue as a way to get to her, that is ONLY because they see that there is a real issue. And I will admit, I have gotten pulled in more than once over the internet drama. It's hard to stay quiet when you know differenty than what people are saying. 

However, most of the general statements about people who do not agree with what is going on at that rescue do not apply to me. Like "Well why don't you actually get involved instead of sitting on the internet..." I have gotten involved! I have been to that "shelter" three times so far, donated items and gotten my hands dirty. I have seen what it looks like, clean and when no volunteers show up for a few days. " Why don't you focus on your own animals instead of another rescue." I NEVER STOPPED! Do you not also understand, that their actions directly effect our rescue? Why you ask? Because it involves the possible neglect of rabbits(which I also rescue!) in the same state, only 35 minutes form where I live. Isn't that what I signed up for? To protect the welfare of animals, especially rabbits and small animals? Besides what rescues do you think they will contact when this finally does go south? And because we are so close to this rescue, we hear a LOT from the inside. Some of the things I saw with my own eyes, were NOT pretty. It doesn't matter how many AFTER pictures are posted.. it doesn't take way from the negligence I saw with my own eyes. 

So you may wonder why these volunteers don't want to talk? And you may think my answer fictional, but I am going to tell you anyway. These volunteers WILL talk, to someone who is actually going to listen. Some of these volunteers went in there with their hearts full of love for animals, wanting to do a good thing. These types of people will NOT neglect them on their watch. So when these types of volunteers go in there, they get the job done, it is them who the credit for anything going right should go to! And their biggest fear is that they will walk away, the animals will be neglected and NO ONE will help the animals, because so far, Corson has had enough of a heads up(thanks to both sides of this on facebook) to clean up! So the volunteers who do want to help the animals feel defeated, and feel like the only thing they can do, is keep trying AS BEST AS THEY CAN around their own lives and their own animals.. to help the rabbits at LMRR. 

I am really ashamed to even be a part of this, because of what it has turned into, because it REALLY isn't about the animals anymore. Yes it is one person who created this mess,and so far, she refuses to take responsibility for ANY of it. Right now, I think we all just need to stop, take a deep breath and just wait and see what happens. Despite the fact that she has gotten away with so much, and some of us having to be mentally tortured not knowing if the animals in her care are REALLY going to get what they need and deserve. There are pictures,there are whitnesses there right now that will talk to the RIGHT people, there are statements from people all over the place, that didn't even know about each other before it got all over the internet. There are even recent pictures,and I have seen them. 

All of this will eventually unfold, and people will see the truth. Even if it doesn't happen, tomorrow, next week or even a few months from now. And one day when the truth comes out, a lot of people are going to bad about a lot of things they said.. but I know for sure, I won't.


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## slavetoabunny

No one has named you in this Stephanie. I agree that this whole mess casts a bad light on rabbit rescue in general. I also agree that it isn't about the animals anymore. It has turned into a personal vendetta that I'm not sure will ever stop. I'll say it again....Kristie doesn't want to fight, she just wants to be left alone. She knows that she is in the spotlight and I sincerely hope that she continues to maintain the standards she is currently operating under.

If you are at all interested, I'm going to be in Mount Laurel, NJ July 12-15 on business (tentative date). I am planning on visiting LMRR on the 12th along with a person that has adopted 3 rabbits from them. If you can make it out there that afternoon, I would be delighted to meet you. Dinner is on me that evening!


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## Happi Bun

Why is it people with so few posts come to defend Bunny Justice? :confused2:

I think it speaks volumes that after all the accusations, phone calls, and bad mouthing that no media or large reputable rescues in our country have gotten involved and no action from animal welfare groups has been taken.


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## [email protected]

Yes that is true, no one seems to want to do anything about it, but it's tough all around. I used to work for a shelter that was a NJ state licensed to do cruelty investigations. I would still be working there if I hadn't moved too far away. I have seen the animals come in abused, and the people who did it, give little to no consequence for their actions. The big organizations and shelteres only want to get involved if there is media involved(more donations and faster adoptions) and the media only wants to get involved if the big organizations and shelters are involved. Not to mention animal laws in NJ SUCK big time. Even when you think you have enough documentation, they want more. It is VERY hard to get a warrant to seize animals, let alone the right to access a place whenever they want. That is why they have to schedule visits with most of these people.. Unfortunately in the media everywhere, the only time you see it get out there is when it's too late for so many of the animals and people involved...


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## Happi Bun

Yeah, I find that hard to believe that after all these years of horrific abuse and dieing rabbits that no complaints were acted on, nor did they stick. Also, like I mentioned, none of the large reputable rabbit rescues in our country have gotten involved, even though I'm SURE they've had it brought to there attention. How can this be?


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## christinelea1

That above is copied and pasted from FB...
I read and read and was emailed numerous X's about LMRR.
I DO GET ***SO*** EMOTIONAL ***so*** much to facts and then the images of some of the bunnies from LMRR and any other place that animals are/maybe hurting.. The LMRR pictures I have seen-have now ingrained in my memory to the point that I still cry like a baby just thinking of them at times...SOMETHING IS INDEED WRONG THERE.
I do not purposely slander this woman/rescue; I have copied what I have read and in few places posted that. 
A person cant help but form an opinion after just observing the pictures really.
I have repeatedly said what I am saying now...Something has to be wrong for so so many ppl to be so angry!
I have had the experience with the disgruntled volunteer that started many and much problems for CCR UNWARRENTED. I wasn't even the meanie I read that LMRR's founder is and all of the former volunteer's complainers/ well their posts match 99.99% .
In CCR's case The AC, Dept of Ag.,Our many veterinarians, HumaneSociety and several other rescues I work with from far and wide in Michigan and my church's elders **and CCR's supporters** could see through material sent all over western Michigan(sent also to many vets-some not even used by CCR- and my church)....it was slanderous and all so very made-up and untrue-it was one person and one of her little croanies.
This person has started so much trouble all over w/West MI rescues noone was at all surprised about her starting it w/CCR-her material was laughable at best-and come to find out after SPCA and 2 other rescues-I was 4th to be hit by this now very well known person who ended up being sued by one the second rescue she set out to exploit-that rescue prevailed in a court of law.

One thing I do need to make clear.
Rehabbing Michigan Eastern Cottontails and baby wilder bunnies is NOT controversial and subjective as above stated. 

This is very important for me to say.
The info I share with anyone trying to rehab wilders WORKS 100% of the time if it is followed correctly with a healthy little wilder/domestic bun.
I try and find a NO KILL reputable rehabber to take baby wilders from whereever they are ( b/c it is a tedious process for someone never having done it before), world-wide, for any person that finds them(after of course making sure that the wilders cannot be put bk for Momma to care for).
If no NON KILL rehabber is possible(few and far between), the regimin used by CCR and othes very special Michigan rehabbers I work with is precise, EVERY SINGLE TIME and far from controversial.
I have not lost a baby(including some that were quite injured) yet in my many rehabbing years even the ones w/ broken femurs and pelvic regions have been saved and went on to live long healthy lives in non-preditor/protective area.
The ones with "deadly" injuries-most HBC,and terribly suffering obviously must be helped to pass.
I have 8 right now at this early time in spring-all are bright eyed and full-bellied but do know it is a time consuming and labor of love that takes much, much patience. A person can expect it to take up to a half hour to get 1 ML of goat's milk mixed w/ probios into baby bun and that will not at all be enough... it takes baby to have a full rounded and hardened tummy twice a day to "make it"..
The info I posted at LMRR FB page was ONLY about baby wilders and ***nothing*** else b/c I so much hoped to help the guy that had the three ...
Anyone with a half a heart would have left the good intentioned posts there to save those babies.They were deleted almost immediatly-

Well, those wilders did not get any help and thanks to those detailed posts all being deleted the baby wilders are now DEAD.

No matter who I have a problem with-I would not have ever deleted that helpful info to save those babies.

Too, the post yesterday into a new thread that I wanted to post here but this venue was closed I did not keep a copy of.
I still would like to share that info here if a copy is available.
Thank you, Respectfully, christineLea
CritterCafeRescue


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## christinelea1

Animal Control, ASPCA and so many animal advocates turned their heads-why?
This is a woman working as a police officer for a time and leaving the animals w/ her mother and father.
These are not ppl that would at that time turn in one of their "pwn". If her Mother were not so sick of it I am sure she still would not be speaking out.
Now that she was fired from being a police officer-it certainly has been looked at-in Florida and now back in NJ.


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## Happi Bun

That still doesn't answer my question of why the big rabbit welfare and rescue groups (who would care less if she was a police officer) in our country have not sent out statements against LMRR or shown any support to your cause. Especially when it's being portrayed as a concentration camp for bunnies run by a psychopath.


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## Pipp

*RosL wrote: *


> Before you edited one of your posts, it said
> 
> 
> 
> The '23' people you refer to as witnesses are just the same five people (max) with aliases, boyfriends and cousins parroting their information.
> 
> 
> 
> Sorry, that is wrong. Maybe that's why you edited it out?
> 
> They don't go around making the hate mails, though the crazies do try to drag them in, do make up quotes from them.
Click to expand...

Yes, I edited out because I thought it would be misconstrued without explanation. I'm was referring to the 'Bunny Justice' group and their multiple websites that Christine frequents and regurgitates. 

Nobody has said that LMRR is great at basic rabbit care. The question is 1) is it bad enough to shut down the whole rescue 2) can it be fixed. I have strongly concluded 1) No and 2) Yes. 

What I am saying is that contrary to the tone of these attacks, they have not killed or abused rabbits. 

And Kristie Corson does NOT fit the model of a hoarder. Why? For one reason, she wants VOLUNTEERS to help. This is not a woman who sits in her house and doesn't answer her doors because she's afraid they'll take her rabbits away. She has a building, she asks for help and she applies her OWN SET OF SKILLS TO THE RESCUE. AND SHE GET THEM ADOPTED OUT. 

Her skills do not include diligent cage cleaning and rabbit care (although the latter is often subjective). This isn't hard to shore up. It's WAY harder finding rescuers who are as organized as her, as good at fundraising and adoptions and has the energy and desire to do this. 

And what I've concluded even more so lately is she really has what it takes -- thick skin. Putting up with all the utter crap is what makes pet rescue one of the most difficult things I've ever done. 

I'm may not make any friends in rescue saying this, but by far the hardest part for me has been dealing with my fellow rescuers. In the short year I've been doing this, working along side three separate largely unrelated groups, every aspect has had to deal with people who 'disapproved' of the way our groups were doing things and many who tried to ferret out nasty information to use against us. The three groups persevered and 902 rabbits were safely and happily rehomed instead of euthanized. 

Thank God we had the support of the unsuspecting public. 

This was in ALL areas. I'd say half the volunteers had their own ideas of proper housing, diet and care and were intolerant of different opinions and methods. Some were emotional nutbars (tons of those in rescue, bless 'em), and others were people who truly believed they knew best and/or expected or asked for a level of perfection impossible to achieve when dealing with the number of rabbits and resources at hand. 

Because the rescue heads are ultimately responsible for everything, we're always to blame when people's standards aren't met and ultimately we will be trash-talked every time we disappoint a volunteer. 

Even worse, though, are the 'fellow' rescues. I don't want to say they're bad people, they truly do have the animal's best interests at heart, but so many are ridiculously judgmental, intolerant, competitive or bitter. 

A huge number of rescues boycott this board because I promote 'rabbitats', an outdoor form of housing, and/or we tolerate breeders here. Not only do they not advertise their rabbits which will at least find homes for one or two, thus saving the same number from euthanization, they missed out on the shared experiences of rabbit health and behavior that will benefit the rabbits. 

This may be a 'principles vs. rabbits' thing and the importance between the two a matter of opinion and great debate, but in MY opinion, this kind of intolerance serves to do nothing more than close an avenue of rescue, and I can not take complaints from these organizations seriously. 

Specifically, I cannot take Stephannie seriously either because she has been conducting an 11-year-vendetta that keeps drudging up the past, and doesn't appear to be addressing current conditions. I also never see solutions other than the 10-year call to shut Kristie Corson down. She's also participated in the personal attacks. 

I can't take Christine seriously because she's broadcasting that somebody is killing rabbits because they're using kitten replacement milk instead of goat's milk, which has no basis in science, only personal opinion. 

I did take Iresqbunnies seriously at first until I realized she was one of the rescues involved with taking rabbits out of LMRR 10 years ago, her website (the Rainbow Bridge page is linked by Christine) lists LMRR rabbits that died years after with commentary and catch phrases that boil down to veiled accusations that even two years later LMRR is somehow responsible for their deaths. 

I do take Bunniez seriously because I haven't found any grounds to dismiss her claims, she's not launching personal attacks, she doesn't appear to be prone to hysteria and her claims don't date back 10 years. I do take issue with the irrelevant 'dead rabbits in the freezer' phrase and other emotional hot buttons, but I will otherwise take her at her word. 

There are also other volunteers who I believe when they talk about conditions at the rescue. 

HOWEVER, this takes us back to the discussion of degrees -- are these rabbits truly being abused? No. Are better off dead? Of course not. Can conditions be better? Yes. Are there enough other rescues to take up the slack so more rabbits don't die without her than with her? No. Is it worth throwing away the strong points over over the bad points? ABSOLUTELY NOT. 

The 'bad' photos just aren't that bad, I've shown them to Vets and SPCA-type people for opinions, and they do not see abuse or long-term neglect. I trust Tamsin's assessment far more than anybody else's on this thread for being able to see through the captions and the catch-phrases. 

There is no evidence of long-term or serious abuse, and what constitutes abuse and long term neglect is very hard to hide. That is why nobody has taken action in 10 years. Throwing out excuses like she has law enforcement friends protecting her is lame and not even possible. 

The good photos are awesome and that level is attainable with volunteer help she welcomes to the facility. Maybe Kristie will never keep the cages clean, she'll never be well-liked, her rescue will never be above reproach, but she has proven VERY efficient in very important areas. 

Fix what's broken. Don't throw out the baby with the bath water. Monitor the situation, approach care decisions with tolerance and respect for somebody else's opinion, and be prepared to suck it up and HELP when needed! 

Withholding help and asking others to withhold help more abusive to the rabbits than anything Kristie will do to them. 


sas


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## slavetoabunny

I would like to broach a subject which has not been adequately addressed. In the unlikely event that LMRR is shut down, who is willing to take all of the rabbits? Is the Bunny Justice folk or a rescue going to take them all, or is this group condemning them to euthanization? I guaranty that unless they are taken in by a willing no-kill shelter that this would be a death sentence for most of them. I would like to know what the long range plan is for the bunnies. The bunnies is what this about, right?


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## Pipp

Please note that 'Harvantor' posts were removed because they appear to be an alias of Steph.


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## gentle giants

*Happi Bun wrote: *


> I have nothing to add really other than thank goodness for level headed people like Patti and Pipp! I'm so thankful this forum didn't just jump on the "Kristin is the spawn of Satan" band wagon. I used to believe the accusations against her rescue until I took a step back and really thought about it without all the hype/drama to throw me off. I also came to see the true colors of the people against her and how crazy they are.


Thank you so much, that is exactly what I what I was thinking! I looked at the very few pictures that were posted of rabbits supposedly being abused by LMRR, and other than one rabbit being too thin I saw nothing that looked like abuse to me. I mean really, if the level of "filth" in the couple of shots I saw is abuse, then my fat spayed house rabbit is being tortured too. Plus the fact that any pictures that have been posted could have been taken ANYWHERE and none of us would be the wiser.

*Christine-* I don't know you. As far as I know, you adore rabbits and want nothing more than to help them. But I have to tell you, the viciousness of your attack against Corson, and the (dare I say it?) absolute fanaticism of the attacks made by youself and others have completely turned me off. I mean come on, one post made by someone named Ronnie Cyr on the FB page you posted called her an "attention seeking whore". How on earth does that help the rabbits? If this is really truly ONLY about helping the rabbits, then you are going to have to act with maturity and tact to get people's attention. I understand anger if you are seeing abuse, but trust me! NO ONE is going to listen to you when you are acting/talking this way, especially when the person you are (let's face it) slandering has been smart enough not to reply in kind.

*Pipp-* THANK YOU! For your level headedness (is that a word?) and common sense in dealing with this thread.


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## christinelea1

Know this for certain, NEVER EVER EVER PIPP DID I CALL ANYONE AN ATTENTION SEEKING WHORE! NEVER>>>>PLZ enlighten me where you ever and why you ever would say this....
I DO NOT use the word WHORE in my vocabulary even.
YOU are out of line and without proof for certain!
Please bring forth the place where you think you saw this b/c I can gaurentee it was not me talking like that EVER!


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## christinelea1

Something like that does not help the rabits or anyone. You are very much mistaken about what you thin I have spoken/written/posted.

For one I said earlier and gave the benefit to the ppl I quoted...

Again..NEVER did I call this girl Kristie and attn seeking whore!

WOW! I retracted at FB page when I thoughtmy new thread post was deleated-I did not have knowledge it was meshed until Patti showed me. I RETRACTED and I FULLY hope that once you see that I did not ever say such a thing as you suggest YOU also will retract!

Fair is Fair-why I posted my thread was indeed NOT deleted but "MESHED"

I can be a big girl and admit to my misgivings and non-understandings whomever you are person(AGAIN SORRY NOT!!!Pipp )CAN YOU?

Either that or proove to all of RO that I indeed said something so cruel as that!


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## christinelea1

Again I have not slandered this person at all. I still do not see the posts I made to try and save those wilders but she seems to think they are indeed there.
Please too enlighten me where I slandered this person-I DID not and have LOTS more cooth than that!
Without proof dear Person(NOTPipp, SORRY PIPP((...)-

You are no better than you make me out to be now are you-B/C at this point YOU are slandering ME and stating wrong facts-AT LEAST I provided facts and places anyone was welcomed to go to ck out LMRR and the history!


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## Happi Bun

CALM DOWN no one claimed that YOU said that...

Read gentle giants post carefully and it was Ronnie Cyr who called Pipp that.


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## slavetoabunny

Christine...I think thatMyrna (Gentle Giants) was saying the Ronnie Cyr called her the derogatory name. That's the way I read it.


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## christinelea1

Christine- I don't know you. As far as I know, you adore rabbits and want nothing more than to help them. But I have to tell you, the viciousness of your attack against Corson, and the (dare I say it?) absolute fanaticism of the attacks made by youself and others have completely turned me off. I mean come on, one post made by someone named Ronnie Cyr on the FB page you posted called her an "attention seeking whore". How on earth does that help the rabbits? If this is really truly ONLY about helping the rabbits, then you are going to have to act with maturity and tact to get people's attention. I understand anger if you are seeing abuse, but trust me! NO ONE is going to listen to you when you are acting/talking this way, especially when the person you are (let's face it) slandering has been smart enough not to reply in kind.

I am sorry but does anyone not see this statement???"the viciousness of your attack against Corson" and 
"you posted called her an "attention seeking whore"


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## Happi Bun

You left out key details...

Quote: "one post *made by someone named Ronnie Cyr* _on the FB page you posted_ called her an "attention seeking whore" "


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## slavetoabunny

I do see Gentle Giants commenting on "the viciousness of your attack", but the derogatory name calling is blamed on Ronnie. All Gentle Giants is saying is that you reposted Ronnie's post somewhere.


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## Pipp

Christine, this is why you're such a good tool for these people. They get you all wound up and turn you loose and you don't even stop to see what it is you're actually posting! 

ETA: If you don't agree with the sentiments like that being posted, you have to not respond to them IN THE THREADS or you have to say you don't agree. 

That's all Gentle Giants (Myrna) is saying is that by repeating their posts (without even stopping to make it clear who is saying what), you're tarred with the same brush. 

ALL those links and paragraphs contain horrible personal attacks. The first link I commented on was the reference to the picture of Kristie in a hottub, and it was another 'whore' caption, along with incredibly irrelevant references to her karaoke photo. 

They post perfectly normal photos that look like half the rescues in the country, but they caption them with key words like 'horror' and 'hoarder' and off you go. 

They count on you and people like you to not even read it closely, you just spew it out. 

You have to stop this! :shame It stresses YOU out and it stresses everybody here out. You honestly don't need it. Please just take a few deep breaths and have a nice cup of tea. You're among friends here. 


sas :expressionless


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## christinelea1

I am now washing my paws of it all including the FB page-and all involved in it.
YUP I get too emotional and charged b/c IT HURTS ME BEYOND what words can express and the pictures tear me up(and never leave my memory)..
TOO SEE and think that ANYONE could disregaurd ANY LITTLE FUR OR FEATHER LIFE-a bunnies, a guineas, a degus, a parakeet-ALL OF THEM mean so much to me and are my world!!! No doubt.
I need that energy for what I do best here.
I am Unwatching this topic as well as the (anti)LMRR..NOW...and what better time to do it! My babies Wilders are ready to eat!
Best of luck either way.
Alls I can do is pray for all bunnies and animals in hardship but being involved in a mess like this is JUST not me...
Take good care nose bumps to the bunnies everywhere)
ChristineLea

I wish you all the very best) ChristineLea
CritterCafeRescue
~Where the wilders live with the domestics in a sortof perfect Harmony~


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## Kipcha

Wow, reading through this entire thread, all I can say is people seem to be getting extremely wound up over things that, in all seriousness, do not look that bad (However, I haven't ever been there or anything, I am only juding from photos, stories, links online, etc.). Sure, they can be improved and all, but I don't think this is a bunny holocaust.

It's nice to see so many people on here who are level headed and actually look at the facts before jumping on the bandwagon. Kudos to you guys!

Pipp is also correct in that Kristie does not sound like she fits the typical animal hoarder. I did a 10 minute presentation this year on the psychological aspects of an animal hoarder and the fact that she adopts any of them out is a huge blaring sign that she is NOT a hoarder.

Really looking forward to that review from slavetoabunny, it'll be nice to see some photos and thoughts from someone who isn't quite as... Exciteable as most.


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## lagomorphlvr

A rebuttal to the rebuttal:
*Deep breath* Okay, here we go again. First off I will say that I do NOT support the methods that the so-called âBunny Justiceâ group has used. I never agreed with the personal attacks, spam on everyoneâs Facebook pages, and the general unprofessionalism. Believe me, my posts on their page were deleted as well when I questioned the methods. Quotes are in red.

This may have been abusive to the volunteers who needed to use the hose, but I assure you, the rabbits really didnât feel abused by this.

Oh yes, I used this hose. Iâm not afraid to use a hose. It was a bit problematic that the hose never worked well, as it had multiple leaks. I finally purchased a new hose. By the way, I used that hose many a time in the middle of some violent FL thunderstorms. A bit scary, but the rabbits all had empty water bottles.

Rabbits are âair cooledâ, like an old Volkswagen. They release body head mainly through their breath. A fan to dissipate the hot air so they donât re-inhale it is just as efficient (and many will argue preferable) to air-conditioning.

Frankly, I am appalled by this dangerous misinformation. Rabbits do not release body heat mainly through their breath. They are cooled mainly by their very vascular ears, and can quickly become overheated in temperatures over 80 degrees F. I am a biologist. This information can be found in any biology 101 course, as well as many rabbit-savvy information sources.

The domestics found in US rescues are European rabbits, which live in underground burrows. They will come out for an hour or two usually twice a day to eat and frolic. Assuming the volunteers come in once or twice a day and turn the lights on, this was not a hardship for the rabbits. (For the record, no rabbits in shelters and few in rescues have regular access to sun and grass, neither does the average very spoiled house bunny). 

That may be, but the overall mood in the building was very depressing â and not just for the humans.

Not sure what the alternative is here? Stuff them? Leave them in their cages? Even if a rabbit is being sent to a veterinarian for a necropsy, they need to be refrigerated or frozen. Cremation is expensive, burying them in the yard is a viable option. Necropsies are not needed if the cause of death is already known, and often inconclusive.

Itâs a problem when the dead keep piling up. I have a list of about 30 known bunny deaths from 2008-2009. Itâs a problem when volunteers are instructed to place 3 bunnies who died on the same day in the fridge (Faever, Sophie, and Foo) for a necropsy that never happened. They were in there for about 2 weeks before the volunteers finally buried them. This was the same fridge in which volunteers were instructed to keep veggie donations.

This sounds like a personal disagreement, but not abuse. If the rabbits were truly starving, this would have been at the top of this list. Reading between the lines, I suspect Ms. Corson was hoping for or expecting support in this area from the volunteers, who in turn thought Ms. Corson should be responsible for this on her own. (For the record, the volunteers traditionally supply at least some of the food with my rescue).

Once again, itâs a problem when volunteers go over to feed, and thereâs no food. I do not think itâs appropriate to EXPECT volunteers to supply the food. Sure, itâs good when they do. The problem is that we were forced to. At the time, I was making $12 an hour with no benefits. Sorry, I canât support the entire rescue, as much as I would have liked to. When Ms. Corson left for vacation in both June and July of 2009, I was forced to buy kitten food and toys, hedgehog food, hamster food, litter, and vegetables. I brought my own guinea pig pellets over because Ms. Corson was feeding them rabbit pellets. If youâre a guinea pig person, you know this can be a fatal mistake. I had to buy all of these items because they were not supplied and I had NO OTHER CHOICE.

Produce is often donated by produce retailers and distributors and having volunteers picking it up is a duty often listed on rescue âto doâ lists. And bunnies munching on greens is a great photo opp. Pellets can be quickly consumed before the shots are done, and getting them to eat hay on cue isnât as easy.

Once again, volunteers were generally forced to buy veggies for the buns. They certainly did not receive them on a regular basis. I DID research places to donate veggies. I found a local veggie market that was glad to donate veggies. I picked them up. Ms. Corson informed me that it was too hard to pick through the veggies, and to stop picking them up. We also had an adopter who owns a hydroponic farm donate veggies. Ms. Corson got into a personal argument with him and cut him off.

This may be irresponsible (which begs the question, did the volunteers not keep them secure, either?), but hardly abuse. (The word âfrequently Iâm sure would be argued, I seem to recall the rescueâs blog alluding to two or three litters over many years). The mortality rate can be high for babies, especially if theyâre not intentionally bred and the pregnancy is unexpected.

The cages were rickety and not secure â no amount of volunteers securing them would make them escape-proof. The awful wood kennels had holes cut to allow for ârecessed litter boxesâ that never worked. Ms. Corsonâs solution was to place NIC panels over them. We wanted to staple them down, but Ms. Corson would not replace the broken staple gun. It was simple for buns to move the panels and hop down to their downstairs neighbors. This was a regular occurrence. There were more litters than the rescueâs blog referred to. Most of the babies died. 

A long-standing argument in rescue is whether rabbits being kept in poor conditions should be purchased in order to ârescueâ them. This is one of those agree to disagree differences that can never be called right or wrong. It is certainly not abuse. Neither is choosing to pay for a rabbit you're fallen in love with. Rabbits pregnancies in rescue are not uncommon because they are really only old enough to be spayed and neutered when theyâre old enough to breed. Sometimes the realization theyâre old enough comes just a little too late! They are also often mis-sexed, even by vets. (For the record, my rescue mascot is a mis-sexed Flemish bought from somebody who was selling him for meat. Sue me). 

Yes, I know this is a hot topic. I purchased my first bun at a pet store, and will never do so again. I most certainly will never buy from a breeder. I work in rescue, and I am personally acquainted with the unwanted castoffs. However, I know that other people have their opinions, and they are entitled to them. What bothers me about Ms. Corsonâs role in this is that she lied about purchasing from a breeder. She has purchased from breeders on multiple occasions (her Flemmies have come from a breeder in Georgia). She has done this herself, and yet publicly berates anyone who has done the same. She is a hypocrite.

Ms. Corson likely thought these animals all needed help. If they didnât need help but the volunteers resented caring for them, this is grounds for being âdisgruntledâ, but again, nothing even remotely related to abuse.

Maybe she did. I donât know. I will tell you that she bragged about her purebred Akita and Flemish giants. I will also tell you this: I will NEVER regret caring for any animal. You have no idea the hours I put in caring for her personal animals because she didnât. I saw them suffering, so I emptied their litter boxes. I filled their food dishes. I filled their water. Her French lop Sophie died in my arms, and I broke down crying.

Shelters and rescues routinely stack cages, Iâm sure the rabbits really donât care if theyâre stacked. Yes, Iâm sure the disgruntled volunteers talked among themselves. A lot.

Iâm fine with stacked cages. At this moment, I have two temporary fosters currently stacked in dog crates in my bedroom. The problem with the stacked cages at LMRR was that they were not sturdy. They collapsed. They were absolutely unsafe. Volunteers would place pens on the floor and attempt to get the buns out of the dangerous cages, but Ms. Corson moved them back, saying it looked âmessyâ.

Key words, âat one time.â It only takes one animal coming in with fleas to infest the herd, and they will show signs of the infestation before theyâre gone. (Even the Four Seasons can get bed bugs). Worms are found in almost all rabbits rescued outdoors. Most are not an immediate threat and can wait until meds are donated or funds are on hand for purchases. Rescuers and volunteers donât always agree on treatments, common argument in rescue.

Well, I donât know about the person that wrote âat one timeâ. When I was there, there was a constant severe flea problem. The building remained untreated. She DID give ivermectin shots on occasion. Do you deny that untreated coccidia is a problem? That was rampant there as well. A rabbit that we had begged Ms. Corson to get to the vet was adopted out. Heroic measures were taken to save the rabbit (Mooshu). The rabbit was dead a few days later. Pam Brooks, Ms. Corsonâs adoption counselor, told me that the vet had concluded that the rabbit died of hepatic coccidiosis.

Most main rescues here have this same number.

That may be, but LMRR did not have the space, funds, or sufficient volunteers to take care of that number. Every situation is different. You canât apply a number across the board and say itâs okay.

Not sure what this means, maybe they were cheap to feed and/or easy to adopt out for a decent adoption fee? Canât think of a scenario where this would be abusive or criminal.

Perhaps itâs not criminal, but as a guinea pig lover, I found her references to them as âeasy moneyâ appalling. As I stated above, I brought my own guinea pig pellets to the rescue pigs because she refused to feed them anything but rabbit pellets.

Rescued rabbits very often come in with such ailments. The photo posted falls under the milder end of the scale, a rabbit can look like that two or three days into a urinary tract infection. Rescuers can fall ill or have family or personal emergencies. Rescuers depend on volunteers to help with their care and suffer through periods when nobodyâs available or theyâve walked out in a huff. Sometimes disgruntled volunteers show up when asked but instead of helping, they take pictures.

I am personally offended by this statement. You have no idea of the blood, sweat, and tears that myself and the other volunteers put into caring for those rabbits. We literally begged her to take them to the vet. I COULD NOT afford it, otherwise I would have. I didnât walk out âin a huffâ. It KILLED me to leave those rabbits. I still have NIGHTMARES about leaving those rabbits. Okay, maybe the illnesses started out as mild, but they were often left untreated. She also gave home remedies. One day, we noticed Flower (who had lived at the rescue for around a year â she had not come in like this) was having neurological symptoms. We were promised she would see a vet. She never did. Ms. Corson self-diagnosed Flower with diabetes and was âtreatingâ her with Karo syrup. She was finally taken into foster by a volunteer, taken to a rabbit-savvy vet, and diagnosed with EC. The vet said her prognosis would have been much better if she had been treated earlier. Flower is dead now.

This sounds personal, differing opinions. Bruised egos, not bruised rabbits. Not abuse.

Really? What about when the volunteers come together as a group and say, âWe CANNOT take in any more animals. We canât care for the ones we haveâ and are dismissed. What about when the volunteers beg for vet care for a bunny that needs it? This has nothing to do with ego, I assure you.

The rabbits were probably up for euthanization before Ms. Corson rescued them. Being overwhelming/sick and threatening/whining about not continuing with the rescue would mean taking them to a shelter where theyâd likely be put down. Itâs a short surrendering = killing them leap. But weâve all threatened to kill someone or something in our lives. (My rabbit just are my phone charger, sheâs been subjected to all manner of death threats). 

This is why we were afraid to leave or speak out. She threatened this on a regular basis. Youâre really defending that? And no, these were not joking death threats.

If these are the important ones, itâs Corson by a landslide. There is NOTHING about rabbits starving, injured or dying, no emaciated rabbits. The photos posted shows full litterboxes, mild urine scald and a urine-soaked floor outside the cages â the latter a sign that the rabbits are getting run time and not always cooped up. (They will always urinate in front of the other cages to establish territory, Twenty cages on the ground = 20 puddles x 10 rabbits loose between clean-ups = 200 puddles = a urine-soaked floor. The pictures show that the white rabbits paws are white and not urine stained, a sign that the cages are kept clean. Continuing exposure to urine will quickly stain their feet. The photos also ook like the majority of rabbit rescues in terms of rabbits, cages and space in spite of captions about hoarding. 

Really? The litter boxes with more poop than litter are okay? I might go an extra day before cleaning my bunniesâ boxes if Iâve had a long day at work, but I can assure you that they have NEVER looked like that. I pray that you never have to experience dumping litter boxes full of writhing maggots. As you can imagine, itâs quite horrifying. I hope you never have to try to clean 80 litter boxes in 100 degree heat with fleas mauling your legs. The urine on the floor was urine that had leaked down through the wood kennels. Every time we made a pen and labeled it âEXERCISE PEN â DO NOT KEEP A BUNNY IN HEREâ (oh yes I made that sign), we found another new arrival in it. I KNOW that rabbits are messy. Iâve had rabbits for 10 years. I also know whatâs normal, and what is unacceptable.

Iâd hazard a guess youâre not mentioning instances of Ms. Corson using her own funds to pay rescue-related costs. Party supplies can mean event supplies, a common fundraising expenditure. (Isnât a âcraftyâ way of explaining is a good thing?)

I witnessed her using donations to purchase personal things. I find this inappropriate. And believe me, she paid herself back many times over for anything she used her own funds for.

Rescues will attempt to raise funds for an idea or project all the time and if not enough funds are raised, the idea isnât implemented and the funds are redirected to another project. If the donors have a problem with this, itâs up to them to complain, and not a group disgruntled ex-volunteers. After reading the voluminous material presented by this group for years, I donât recall seeing a complaint from a third-party donor.

I believe that many of these donors are unaware that these projects never came to fruition. Personal opinion.

When somebody hands me cash, I put it in my purse or pocket, I think this is pretty common! In a statement below, you say Ms. Corson was the only one with access to the books, so how do you know it wasnât recorded? âNecessaryâ is subjective.

Yes, I agree, but when I have money thatâs not mine to spend I place it in a pocket separate from my own money. Ms. Corson did not. I saw the extent of her financial records. It was an unorganized drawer full of receipts. And is candy for herself necessary? This is an example of an unnecessary purchase.

Again, people expecting a tax-deductible receipt should be the ones to complain and there is no evidence of any such complaints. The IRS doesnât take these things lightly thus I doubt your version of these events.

Just because people havenât complained doesnât mean that it didnât happen. She did get in trouble with the State of Florida for not collecting sales tax on the items in her âstoreâ.

There is a note on Ms. Corsonâs site or blog that references the rescue having to reapply for a different level of tax exemption that has a higher filing fee. I suspect this is another normal procedure youâre trying to twist into a âcrimeâ.

She has had several different fundraisers over the years that were supposed to pay for the filing fee. It has not yet happened.

How do you know she didnât pay for them? I have yet to see a rabbit rescue or shelter at this level capable of having more income than output.

I personally know several people (my co-workers) who donated items for the yard sale that Ms. Corson kept for herself. She did not pay them for the items.

This is the mortgage on the rescue building I assume? If all you can muster in a âspending rescue funds on herselfâ accusation is paying for a tattoo, however large, it sounds like youâre REALLY scraping the bottom of the barrel.

Do you have any idea how expensive tattoos are? Really? Youâre defending that? Using donation for a personal use such as that is NEVER appropriate.

The rest:
As Iâve said, Iâve seen the extent of her records, at least as it was in Florida. She tried to tell me to fudge info on a form to work with Petsmart. She wanted me to fill out 501c3 paperwork when I was there. I had no idea how, and didnât feel comfortable doing it.

To the person that made the comment that people on this thread who are concerned about Ms. Corsonâs treatment of the rabbits donât have many posts â I had no idea this forum even existed until it was brought to my attention by this thread. I spend most of my rabbit forum time on Bunspace â so I am an active member of a DIFFERENT rabbit forum.

I canât make anyone believe me. All I can do is put my experiences out there. What on earth do I have to gain from this? It is a constant source of stress to me. I hate arguing with people. I have a life. I work 45-55 hours a week. Iâm still rescuing bunnies. I have my own fuzzy kids to take care of. I would love nothing more than to just run away from all of this, but the rabbits keep me going.


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## Happi Bun

All of it is freaking hearsay! My question continues to be ignored (where are the big figures in rabbit welfare? The support from the big reputable rescues in the country?) just like the fact no kind of lawful action has been taken despite photo's and supposed YEARS of horrific abuse by a psychopath.


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## Kipcha

Wow, apparently Pipp's pretty well thought out replies are "stupid". That is a GREAT way to show just how intelligent and mature your arguements are, if this Facebook group is anything to go by...

https://www.facebook.com/home.php?sk=group_191071520923696

Don't people ever think that making a mature rebuttal is the better way to go about it? lagomorphlvr is an excellent example, because it seemed to be fact and not as 'in your face, accept my words as truth dammit' as some other posters.

I just find this sort of childish hate annoying...


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## Happi Bun

Wow... they just rip into anyone that doesn't agree with them. :disgust:


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## RosL




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## RosL

*Good at raising funds? Oh yes.

The thing that really bothered me from your post, Pipp, is the part where you say that you haven't yet found things to rebutt in somebody's messages. Is that what you're searching for everywhere? I would have hoped that people would come to this with an open mind rather than with a determination to prove one side or another.

Please don't consider for a moment that I might be using an alias. My name is Roslyn Lamb. I am a 59 year old retired teacher from north east England. Have a look on Facebook...you'll find a lot of people there among my friends who I used to teach.

I have no problems at all with you promoting an outside living system for rabbit, provided it's safe and protects them from the elements and from predators. Outdoors is the norm in the UK and certainly in our climate and with our very few predators, it's a very healthy way of life for them. Mine live indoors at night and are freerange but they have access to outdoors during the day.

Breeders? Well, not my favourites, but I'd rather build bridges than walls.

I can't remember what else I said in my original posting to this thread, that turned up blank when I hit the send button. What I do remember is about health inspections...

I feel it's a dreadful shame that news of the inspection was leaked in advance. No properly run organisation should be afraid of an unannounced inspection. None should need several days' warning of its happening. Whatever is there should be open to the inspectors at any time. If it had happened without people making claims, giving warnings, etc, then one set or other of voices in this debate could have been stilled for good.
*


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## Pipp

*RosL wrote:

*


> Well now...how surprising. I have just written a lengthy reply...that has turned up entirely blank! Does my voice carry the wrong message?


 
Ros, I thought you of all people would be above the conspiracy theories. Do you also believe I'm Kristie Corson? 



> *Good at raising funds? Oh yes.*


Sarcasm noted, but I don't know why. On one hand you say she doesn't have the funds to support that many rabbits, on the other hand you criticize her for her almost exception skills re: fundraising and events. You can't have it both ways. 

But of course you're zeroing in on what you've been told by the near-professional lambasters that she's abusing rabbits because she paid for a tattoo out of donation money and kept some yard sale junk (which she may or may not have paid for -- and I don't mean paid the people who DONATED it, but called it part of her funds going into the rescue). This is putting her under a microscope with nickel and dime harassment. 

You're in England and hardly in a position to have seen the books. 

More smoke and mirrors similar to the groups immediate claims accusing her of not sharing the funds raised for the Florida rescue within days -- if not hours -- of the rescue happening, prior to any chance anyone had to even list the expenses much less send a check. 



> *The thing that really bothered me from your post, Pipp, is the part where you say that you haven't yet found things to rebutt in somebody's messages. Is that what you're searching for everywhere?*



It bothers me that you don't take it as research. I found nothing to confirm it either, and if I had, you would have read about it.



> *I feel it's a dreadful shame that news of the inspection was leaked in advance. No properly run organisation should be afraid of an unannounced inspection. None should need several days' warning of its happening. Whatever is there should be open to the inspectors at any time. If it had happened without people making claims, giving warnings, etc, then one set or other of voices in this debate could have been stilled for good.*



Roslyn, don't drink the kool-aid, it's laced with arsenic. This makes me realize how Jim Jones managed to get 1000 people to off themselves. 

The story has gone from 'being shut down for filthy conditions' to 'the news of the inspection was leaked in advance' which I guess means no filthy conditions, huh? They can't get their story straight and you're just falling for the company line. 

You have no way of knowing if Kristie was 'afraid' of the inspection! 

Have you talked to the current volunteers? I'm sure they'll be happy to describe the conditions! 

No organization should be subjected to investigation after investigation with every intention of making them all 'surprises'. 

You're desperate to find what, a dirty litter box? 

Rabbits eat and poop! There will NEVER be clean litter boxes! 100 rabbits eat and poop A LOT!

There is NOTHING to indicate you're going to find abused, sick or dying rabbits! 

You're smarter than this!


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## RosL

The empty message is there to see, Pipp. No I believe you're who you say you are...but I do wonder how the message ended up as it did. I did precisely the same the second time as I did the first. Let's blame the electronic gubbins, eh?

No sarcasm. That was irony.

Where did I say she hadn't enough funds to support the rabbits? I don't recall saying that at all. Did I at some point say that the rabbits weren't getting what they needed - from what I've been told, (which, let's face it, is the same way you're getting your information. Or am I wrong there? Have you actually visited yourself?) which is a different thing altogether.

>>on the other hand you criticize her for her almost exception skills re: fundraising and events<<

Can you direct me please to where I said that. I may be getting old, but I don't think my memory is quite this bad yet.

>>you're zeroing in on what you've been told by the near-professional lambasters <<

Actually, as I said in an earlier mail, I am listening to people who I already know from other sources and whose word I have no reason whatsoever to doubt. I have not known them exaggerate, lie, misrepresent nor anything of the sort. You said, if I remember correctly - and please do correct me if I have this wrong - that I have this from Christine Lea. That is not the case. Furthermore, I have nothing to do with the Bunny Justice group. BJ are ridiculous and all they have achieved with their sniping, their personal nastiness, their childishness is to turn people who might otherwise have wanted to know the truth into supporters of LMRR. This is what I want - to know the entire truth, and that's why I wish nothing at all had been said about the Health Dept's visit in advance, so that the truth would have been available to us all. 

To return to Christine Lea, I hope she won't mind my saying this, yes I am a member of some of the same groups as she is, fewer than in the past, though. When this thread was active a while ago and evidence was being provided in a calm and reasoned way by posters, Christine Lea was somewhat outspoken and the thread was closed. I wrote to her, very angry, feeling and saying that had she been more measured in her comments, that might not have happened. I won't repeat here what was said as it was a private conversation, but believe me, I do not support such outspoken, emotive posting that gets nobody anywhere.

>>You're in England and hardly in a position to have seen the books. <<

I am, and you, I believe, are in Canada.

>>More smoke and mirrors similar to the groups immediate claims accusing her of not sharing the funds raised for the Florida rescue within days -- if not hours -- of the rescue happening, prior to any chance anyone had to even list the expenses much less send a check. <<

Which group do you mean, Pipp? You've lost me, I'm afraid. Is this something from Bunny Justice? I don't follow their FB (though I think I've probably forgotten to 'unfriend' them...FB is not my strength) nor their websites so don't know what has been said. Or is it something I missed from this thread? Since you earlier told Christine Lea that responses to what people post should be made in the appropriate place, I assume that must be the case and I've missed it.

>>Roslyn, don't drink the kool-aid, it's laced with arsenic<<

Earlier you accused me of sarcasm.......

Sorry, no idea at all who Jim Jones is. You've entirely lost me there.

I repeat here

>>>>>>*I feel it's a dreadful shame that news of the inspection was leaked in advance. No properly run organisation should be afraid of an unannounced inspection. None should need several days' warning of its happening. Whatever is there should be open to the inspectors at any time. If it had happened without people making claims, giving warnings, etc, then one set or other of voices in this debate could have been stilled for good.*<<<<<<<<

An organisation with nothing to hide has nothing to fear. 

Oh sorry. Just read what you said...>>The story has gone from 'being shut down for filthy conditions' to 'the news of the inspection was leaked in advance' which I guess means no filthy conditions, huh? <<

My meaning was that because people who had found out in advance couldn't wait to open their mouths, time was available to the rescue to hide what they didn't want to be seen. Did they need to? Well, who's to know? I can't say with 100% certainty that they did. Can you say with 100% certainty that they didn't? I repeat, only an unanounced, unscheduled visit will ever be able to uncover the truth, not one where an entire weekend is available to stage a cover-up...whether that happened or not, which *NONE *of us knows for absolutely certain.

>>You have no way of knowing if Kristie was 'afraid' of the inspection! <<

No, I haven't, any more than anybody knows that she wasn't.

>>Have you talked to the current volunteers? I'm sure they'll be happy to describe the conditions! <<

Has any of us?

>>No organization should be subjected to investigation after investigation with every intention of making them all 'surprises'. <<

I repeat...maybe I haven't made this clear yet...no organisation should have any need to worry about any unannounced inspection. Has LMRR ever had one? From what I understand..please do correct me if I have got this wrong...with details, please, if you don't mind...LMRR has never had such an inspection.

Yes, I did see the photos of a clean rescue and pictures of a lot of labelled files with paper in them. I've got lots of files with paper in them. Sorry, but that proves nothing.

>>You're desperate to find what, a dirty litter box? 

Rabbits eat and poop! There will NEVER be clean litter boxes! 100 rabbits eat and poop A LOT!<<

What I am desperate to find, Pipp, is the truth....and I believe I already know it.

I suppose we have the same aim since we both want the truth and we both believe we know it. The difference appears to be, I wasn't wanting to make this personal between you and me.


----------



## slavetoabunny

For the benefit of those who have said that LMRR only cleans up the shelter in advance of inspections, special events, etc., the shelter is now open to the public 2 hours each day (I believe 6 days per week). Previously, it was by appointment only until they built up their volunteer base enough to staff it everyday. I guess this means that it will have to be kept clean, doesn't it?


----------



## Pipp

Lagomorphlvr (I researched who you were but your name escapes me), thank you for a thoughtful post.

I forgot or missed your previous post(s). 

*lagomorphlvr wrote: *


> Rabbits are âair cooledâ, like an old Volkswagen. They release body head mainly through their breath. A fan to dissipate the hot air so they donât re-inhale it is just as efficient (and many will argue preferable) to air-conditioning.
> 
> Frankly, I am appalled by this dangerous misinformation. Rabbits do not release body heat mainly through their breath. They are cooled mainly by their very vascular ears, and can quickly become overheated in temperatures over 80 degrees F. I am a biologist. This information can be found in any biology 101 course, as well as many rabbit-savvy information sources.


*
*Uh, be appalled at the vet textbooks.  

This was my humorous but not detailed 'quick' explanation of and extremely complicated subject, and while this summary falls short, it is in effect correct. 

Its obvious that temperature control is the key because if the building was cool, there wouldn't be a heat stress problem, but it also boils down to ventilation and humidity. In this situation, a proper fan is as good as the air conditioner, possibly better. 

The oft-used information I have quoted assigns 80% of heat dissipation to respiration, eg: "_[size=Rabbits are cooled primarily by respiration, with the ears playing an important part in thermoregulation. In fact, about 80% of heat dissipation occurs through the evaporation of moisture during breathing, with the ears creating a radiator effect.][/size]_[size=

It's from a veterinary text and is quoted often by vets, like here: 

[url]http://www.lakehowellanimalclinic.com/html/heat_stress_in_rabbits.html[/url]
][/size]
The key sign of overheating is moisture around the mouth and chin. 

However, while I do quote it, I actually question the high percentage myself, but none-the-less, the respiration and nasal mucosa accounts for the larger portion. 

The studies I rely on in this case are production and agriculture sources because I find that shelter situations are closer to these criteria than house rabbits. There is a lot of weight given to ventilation, and being in Florida, the humidity. Those are both major factors in determining the best sources of heat control. 

Here's a specific quote: 

Dept. of Agriculture: 
*
Temperature.*_ Temperature is the most important factor as it directly affects a number of elements. Rabbits have a constant internal (rectal) temperature so heat production and losses must vary to maintain body temperature (Table 49). They do this by modifying their feed intake level (regulating production), as described in the chapter on nutrition. They use three devices to modify heat loss: general body position, breathing rate and peripheral temperature, especially ear temperature (Table 49). __If the ambient temperature is low (below 10Â°C) the animals curl up to minimize the total area losing heat and lower their ear temperature. If the temperature is high (above 25Â° to 30Â°C), the animals stretch out so they can lose as much heat as possible by radiation and convection, and step up their ear temperature. The ears function like a car radiator. The efficiency of the cooling system depends on the air speed around the animal. At the same time the animal pants to increase heat loss through evaporation of water (latent heat). The sweat glands are not functional in rabbits and the only controlled means of latent heat evacuation is by altering the breathing rate. Perspiration (the evacuation of water through skin) is never great because of the fur._
It also has to be noted and considered that there has to be great care taken to prevent the spread of respiratory diseases, and they also need to meed a specific set of criteria based on air flow and humidity. The two have to be regulated together. 

It really gets complicated. But as a biologist, check it out and feel free to share your findings (although maybe best in another thread, LOL!). 




> Not sure what the alternative is here? Stuff them? Leave them in their cages? Even if a rabbit is being sent to a veterinarian for a necropsy, they need to be refrigerated or frozen. Cremation is expensive, burying them in the yard is a viable option. Necropsies are not needed if the cause of death is already known, and often inconclusive.
> 
> Itâs a problem when the dead keep piling up. I have a list of about 30 known bunny deaths from 2008-2009. Itâs a problem when volunteers are instructed to place 3 bunnies who died on the same day in the fridge (Faever, Sophie, and Foo) for a necropsy that never happened. They were in there for about 2 weeks before the volunteers finally buried them. This was the same fridge in which volunteers were instructed to keep veggie donations.
> 
> This sounds like a personal disagreement, but not abuse. If the rabbits were truly starving, this would have been at the top of this list. Reading between the lines, I suspect Ms. Corson was hoping for or expecting support in this area from the volunteers, who in turn thought Ms. Corson should be responsible for this on her own. (For the record, the volunteers traditionally supply at least some of the food with my rescue).



I have a big problem with information like this because while you and the others allude to dead and dying rabbits, nobody has ever stated what these rabbits died from. I think given the viciousness of the attacks and the ongoing battle to report her to the authorities, these rabbits would have been 'evidence' and we'd be seeing specifics on the deaths. 

I see elsewhere you discuss the litters that were born dead or died, do these figures include those? Are you saying that abuse or neglect killed these rabbits or not? Could they not have been taken to the vet or the SPCA for examinations? 

Sorry, but I find these shadowy references odorous. 



> Well, I donât know about the person that wrote âat one timeâ. When I was there, there was a constant severe flea problem. The building remained untreated. She DID give ivermectin shots on occasion. Do you deny that untreated coccidia is a problem? That was rampant there as well. A rabbit that we had begged Ms. Corson to get to the vet was adopted out. Heroic measures were taken to save the rabbit (Mooshu). The rabbit was dead a few days later. Pam Brooks, Ms. Corsonâs adoption counselor, told me that the vet had concluded that the rabbit died of hepatic coccidiosis.



Ivermectin is not my choice for fleas. 

Our forum has had members with extremely well-kept barns wiped out by coccidia, it's not a sign of bad conditions or abuse. 

We do separate fundraising for a medical fund, we'll have a vet do free health checks and/or staff do nail clippings and all those funds go directly to the Vet. When we get to the 'solutions' part of this mess (which I fully intend to do), a medical coordinator or a vet on the board of directors might be a strong suggestion. 

So would calls for donations of meds like Revolution or Advantage, Panacur, etc, again given to the Vet. 

Kristie is or at least should be awesome at promoting the Vets and should be getting free or heavily discounted services for her efforts. They get lots of advertising in exchange for their services. 

But of course vets won't be too keen on aligning themselves with a rescue under attack now, would they? And yes, I'm aware of her current vet, Lori Duggan, but I don't know what deal they have. 

I think continuing to slag Kristie is going to result in even more medical problems for these reasons. However it started out is immaterial. The detractors are contributing to these kinds of difficulties now. 




> I am personally offended by this statement. You have no idea of the blood, sweat, and tears that myself and the other volunteers put into caring for those rabbits. We literally begged her to take them to the vet. I COULD NOT afford it, otherwise I would have. I didnât walk out âin a huffâ. It KILLED me to leave those rabbits. I still have NIGHTMARES about leaving those rabbits. Okay, maybe the illnesses started out as mild, but they were often left untreated. She also gave home remedies. One day, we noticed Flower (who had lived at the rescue for around a year â she had not come in like this) was having neurological symptoms. We were promised she would see a vet. She never did. Ms. Corson self-diagnosed Flower with diabetes and was âtreatingâ her with Karo syrup. She was finally taken into foster by a volunteer, taken to a rabbit-savvy vet, and diagnosed with EC. The vet said her prognosis would have been much better if she had been treated earlier. Flower is dead now.


Okay, I'm jaded here, because I have volunteers who demand I take rabbits to the vet for every sneeze, and they have no faith in my experience. (They don't actually even know me). 

But rabbits are not prone to diabetes and Karo syrup is awful stuff for them. EC should always be suspected and a round of Panacur administered even if its on spec. 

The above suggestions apply here as well.

When facts like these come out it makes me wonder why this considerable effort directed at shutting her down isn't redirected to lobbying for or even fundraising for a Vet fund, appointing a medical coordinator or scheduling regular vet visits (which I do believe is happening now with the mobile vet, Dr. Duggan). I think that would be far more productive and healthier for the rabbits. 




> This sounds personal, differing opinions. Bruised egos, not bruised rabbits. Not abuse.
> 
> Really? What about when the volunteers come together as a group and say, âWe CANNOT take in any more animals. We canât care for the ones we haveâ and are dismissed. What about when the volunteers beg for vet care for a bunny that needs it? This has nothing to do with ego, I assure you.


Why didn't the volunteers try to go public with this type of campaign? Keep the demands reasonable (keeping in mind we ALL have our own opinions on vet care) and only expect concessions, not surrender. Go for moderation or mediation. All we've heard is the 'shut the whore down' rhetoric. 




> The rabbits were probably up for euthanization before Ms. Corson rescued them. Being overwhelming/sick and threatening/whining about not continuing with the rescue would mean taking them to a shelter where theyâd likely be put down. Itâs a short surrendering = killing them leap. But weâve all threatened to kill someone or something in our lives. (My rabbit just are my phone charger, sheâs been subjected to all manner of death threats).
> 
> This is why we were afraid to leave or speak out. She threatened this on a regular basis. Youâre really defending that? And no, these were not joking death threats.


This is not different than what the BJ crew and others are pushing for now -- they want to shut down the rescue. She's not going to murder them, she's going to give them up. That's exactly what BJ and you guys want, isn't it? Why is it different now? There will still be 80 rabbits on the chopping block. 



> Really? The litter boxes with more poop than litter are okay? I might go an extra day before cleaning my bunniesâ boxes if Iâve had a long day at work, but I can assure you that they have NEVER looked like that. I pray that you never have to experience dumping litter boxes full of writhing maggots. As you can imagine, itâs quite horrifying. I hope you never have to try to clean 80 litter boxes in 100 degree heat with fleas mauling your legs. The urine on the floor was urine that had leaked down through the wood kennels. Every time we made a pen and labeled it âEXERCISE PEN â DO NOT KEEP A BUNNY IN HEREâ (oh yes I made that sign), we found another new arrival in it. I KNOW that rabbits are messy. Iâve had rabbits for 10 years. I also know whatâs normal, and what is unacceptable.


Yes that sounds bad, but have you had 80 rabbits for 10 years? I have about sixty and I've gotten the meds donated so the fleas are gone, but sometimes my house looks just like the photos, should I give it up and just have them euthanized after all? Believe me, if all the people who complain about absolutely everything related to our rescue efforts were the ones responsible for the 80 rabbits, I think they'd be a whole lot quieter. 

And try going to some hellhole and seeing a truly abused litter of 10 Flemish Giants all kept in one 2' x 4' cage until their almost three months old and stand there and say 'sorry babies, I don't have enough time, money or volunteers to get you out of here' when there's an empty x-pen in the garage.

And on that note, I have to stop this and take one of those babies -- terribly deformed but alive and happy as all get-out living under my kitchen table -- to the vet for a head abscess that I have no idea how I'm going to pay for. 


sas :confused2:


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## Pipp

*slavetoabunny wrote: *


> For the benefit of those who have said that LMRR only cleans up the shelter in advance of inspections, special events, etc., the shelter is now open to the public 2 hours each day (I believe 6 days per week). Previously, it was by appointment only until they built up their volunteer base enough to staff it everyday. I guess this means that it will have to be kept clean, doesn't it?



Heh! Yeah, I saw a reference to the 'Poo Crew' shirts! Too funny!! 

(And brilliant!!) 


:biggrin:


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## Pipp

*RosL wrote: *


> The empty message is there to see, Pipp.


Ros, I have no power to make your post blank when you hit the send button. 

Its a software glitch! :rollseyes

PS: If I am making this personal, it's only because I have a ton of respect for you with all your other endeavors, you're one of the best communicators and information dissemination of rabbit stuff on the net, but I honestly think you've been sold a bill of goods and you're falling for the 'spin'. 

You're just so above all this. :?


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## RosL

*Pipp wrote: *


> *RosL wrote: *
> 
> 
> 
> The empty message is there to see, Pipp.
> 
> 
> 
> Ros, I have no power to make your post blank when you hit the send button.
> 
> Its a software glitch! :rollseyes
> 
> PS: If I am making this personal, it's only because I have a ton of respect for you with all your other endeavors, you're one of the best communicators and information dissemination of rabbit stuff on the net, but I honestly think you've been sold a bill of goods and you're falling for the 'spin'.
> 
> You're just so above all this. :?
Click to expand...

I feel unable to ignore a situation of this sort, Pipp.

I am certainly not above trying to find out more about what I see as a very worrying situation, and I do trust the people who have given me information, who, let me reiterate, are intelligent, trustworthy people who have seen it with their own eyes, have no reason that I can see to lie and like me, want the truth to be known to the wider public.

I have no truck with anybody who stoops to personal sniping.


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## cindyrads

It seems to me that there is a lot of energy being put into either ripping this woman down or defending her. I would have to ask people on both sides to ask themselves why are they so involved and what is the real motive behind their involvement? (You don't need to tell me why, this is a question you need to give some thought to yourself). Please don't fool yourself into thinking that it's "for the rabbits". At this point it no longer is. I've been involved with different rescues and have done rescue for a long time. Most rescuers, including myself are very codependant. We want to save everyone and take control of the situation because we feel we can do a better job than anyone else. We always want to save someone, human or animal. Helping is fine but when it gets to the point that we are spending more time involved in someone else's life than our own it has become a problem. This is why we become so exhausted and worn out. 

I am not emotionally involved with this on either side. I am curious though to know the truth. The only people who know the truth are those who were actually there. Everyone else has just taken sides and their posts only serve to defend their position. It really is a waste of energy. 

At this point we probably will never know for sure. Things have gotten very convoluted because so many people are involved and there is so much arguing going back and forth. People are more caught up in trying to be right more than anything else. 

The experiences that I have read on this forum from the people that used to volunteer at LMMR are the only thing that i have to go on. What they have shared brings up red flags for me about the rescue if they are true. I don't personally feel from what I have read that they are lying but of course I don't know that for sure. Rebuttals and things of that nature don't help to find the truth because they are only one person's opinion on what they feel about the situation. The volunteers are saying "this is what happened, we saw it". Pipp responded, for example, by basically saying "Ok, but those things aren't that bad and I don't classify that as abuse". That is only her opinion and we can either agree or disagree with her. It doesn't prove whether it happened or not. I'm more interested in knowing what really did happen and then I will make my own decision on how I feel about it. I expect things will sort themselves out one way or another but we may never get all our questions answered.


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## [email protected]

Why exactly was my last posts deleted? By the way, Patti, while she said that the shelter is open to the public. On wednesday someone that I know actually went to her shelter so she could see what was going on herself, during the hours of operation. And guess what? No one was even there!


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## slavetoabunny

I don't know why your posts was deleted. Usually whoever does that will send a PM to the person. Maybe whoever did it will see this and send you a PM.


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## gentle giants

I have to say..... I am honestly wondering why this thread got opened back up. I was glad to see it "die" before, and would love to see it happen again. Let's face it people, no one is going to change anyone else's mind here. Can we please lock this thread back up?

:banghead


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## slavetoabunny

Myra, I would like to see this subject die a humane death too. However, there are some that would just open up a new topic (which is the reason this was reopened...to merge the threads and give everyone the entire story).

Please forgive me, I just HAVE to ask. There was someone on another forum that posted a pedigree from a flemish that LMRR allegedly purchased from a breeder by the name of Gentle Giants. The DOB was 5/23/09 and the name the breeder gave the rabbit was Garfield. The rabbit was renamed Hampton.


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## gentle giants

I don't think I have ever had one named Garfield. If I could find my darn record and pedigree book I could tell you for sure. It would have had to have been from my last litter though, it has been quite a long time since I bred any. Do you happen to know what the rabbit's color was?

ETA: I just re-read and realized you said the pedigree was posted on another forum. Do you have a link to where it was posted?


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## slavetoabunny

Myra:

Here are the documents which are purported to be proof that LMRR bought their spokesbunny Hampton. I find them questionable because (1) there is no sold to info filled in and (2) Garfield is simply crossed out and the name Hampton written in. Anyone could have done that. Your opinion on the documents?


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## slavetoabunny

Just a little update here:

Myra, the Gentle Giants breeder is not you. It is a breeder by the same name in Florida.

An email from the breeder was posted on FB that said that Garfield is indeed Hampton, BUT Hampton was turned over (not sold) to LMRR because of a medical condition. The bunny was one of their stud bucks who developed a hernia. The breeder paid for one surgery, but the hernia came back. At that point, LMRR offered to take the bunny and pay for a follow up surgery, which they did. Hampton (fka Garfield) is alive and doing well today.


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## Happi Bun

Heh... bet the "Bunny Justice" folks who got all worked up about Hampton being from a breeder feel silly now. Just another example of their so called "facts" that are totally wrong.


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## gentle giants

Ok, thanks, I just saw this update. Yeah, definitely not one of my pedigrees. I was pretty sure I would have remembered a Garfield, I didn't breed that many.


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## slavetoabunny

Just curious Myrna.....what to you think of the paperwork in general? Is this the quality of record a breeder would keep even if they gave the rabbit to someone?


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## TinysMom

Patti,

That's the same sort of pedigree I use and I've seen names crossed out before - usually if someone brought the wrong pedigree but it was a littermate or something or if the person was renaming the rabbit sometimes they'd cross out the name without thinking about it.


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## [email protected]

Well this might clear things up a little bit for you! If this post doesn't get deleted to. I did a little digging of my own since I keep hearing about this whole Hampton thing, and here is what I found. Check out their photos on their website. They have photos of a rabbit named Garfeild on there. Not saying it is Hampton but it looks just like him. I also wrote to the breeder to ask them about the sale of a rabbit named Garfeild. If I hear anything back I will let you know. I am assuming it's not the same breeder that is posting here since that breeder is from Ill. this one is in florida and updated their listing on 4/11. 

Donald & Lisa Wilson (Gentle Giant Rabbitry) (4/11)

Green Cove Springs, Florida

Black, Blue, Fawn, Lt. Gray

E-mail: [email protected] 

Website: http://gentlegiantrabbitry.com


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## [email protected]

Here is the picture of Garfield 
http://gentlegiantrabbitry.com/GentleGiantRabbitry.com/Photos.html#18


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## Kipcha

Steph, the Garfield/Hampton thing was already cleared up by slavetoabunny.


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## [email protected]

No a post was deleted and I thought it was here,but it may not have been. I can't remember what posts were deleted here of mine. But someone else said somewhere that they saw a picture of a Garfeild form a Florida Gentle Giants Rabbitry in Florida so I went and found it.


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## gentle giants

*slavetoabunny wrote: *


> Just curious Myrna.....what to you think of the paperwork in general? Is this the quality of record a breeder would keep even if they gave the rabbit to someone?


Well, other than the fact that they didn't fill out the "Sold to" part, the pedigree looks pretty good. I wouldn't have liked the whole crossed out name thing though.


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## TinysMom

The only post that was deleted from here (to my knowledge) was the post under what appeared to be a user's "second name". I'll contact you in a minute about it privately. I didn't pull the post...but I do know about that being pulled as we try to document everything we pull.


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## [email protected]

By the way, I access the internet on my phone, which is crappy, and at work when it's slow because once I am home there is absolutely no time to be on the internet. I can't always see all the posts or where they came from or get them mixed up. Two square inches of screen is just not enough! Anyway, it got cut off, because I said honestly I wouldn't have even cared if he was purchased or came from a breeder as long as stories didn't change all the time. Some people were under the impression he was rescued from Georgia too for some reason but maybe that was some of the other Flemish giants, or that little French or English Lop that was killed by her dog, but that might have been the one that she said a breeder gave her as a gift. I may have gotten them all mixed up. Never saw that many Flemish giants or desireable breeds get rescued by the same person in such a short time before.. amazing...


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## Happi Bun

It has already been cleared up, the Hampton conspiracy theory. 
He DID come from the breeder, but was surrendered by her due to a medical condition.


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## Myia09

Honestly, I added the anti LMRR group and found them to be nothing but hateful bashing people with no actual evidence. Just a lot of "yelling" and a bunch of people buying into the hype.

When I added LMRR themselves I have found that they do need some better help with their rabbits and shelter; but that could greatly be because of lack of volunteers/funds/ect. However, none of the rabbits are abused or being ill treated. 

I am pretty sure it is some personal vendetta gone out of hand...people who take productive steps to help rabbits in abusive situations don't act as vicious and childish as the ones on those forums do.


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## [email protected]

Well..I don't know what was said about the whole Hampton thing but I was given additional details from the breeder. She did purchase a rabbit from this breeder, it wasn't Hampton, she was advertising Hampton as a PET ONLY rabbit who needed surgery with his neuter and Corson asked to take him.. that's how she got him. This breeder did not sound like she was desperately seeking a rescue to come and save Hampton..she said she had plenty of homes.. Why lie? And since she has lied about this.. and so many other things.. why in the world would anyone believe her? I have tried.. for the sake of the rescue.. but there are too many bad things that outweigh the only recent good...


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## slavetoabunny

*[email protected] wrote: *


> Well..I don't know what was said about the whole Hampton thing but I was given additional details from the breeder. She did purchase a rabbit from this breeder, it wasn't Hampton, she was advertising Hampton as a PET ONLY rabbit who needed surgery with his neuter and Corson asked to take him.. that's how she got him. This breeder did not sound like she was desperately seeking a rescue to come and save Hampton..she said she had plenty of homes.. Why lie? And since she has lied about this.. and so many other things.. why in the world would anyone believe her? I have tried.. for the sake of the rescue.. but there are too many bad things that outweigh the only recent good...


I guess we have all gotten different emails from the breeder, so who knows? Are you saying that the breeder has lied about this and so many other things? By the discrepancy in the emails to various people, I would say that is the case.I'll allow people to form their own opinion. This breeder is close enough to me I can visit them myself. I'm out of town starting tomorrow for the rest of the week. After that a road trip is in order. Just like I will be personally visiting LMRR on or around July 12th.


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## [email protected]

I think so, you should form your own opinions about the emails, and I am sure that some of you will still think she is wonderful.. and that is your opinion. If someone wants to send me their personal email, I will forward you the email she sent. Also the breeder wishes to recieve no more emails on this subject. Honestly I wouldn't have gotten involved because I stepped back from the whole thing, but LMRR is the one that kept tagging me on things on facebook pertaining to this stuff even after we removed them. And her friends kept trying to grab our attention for this whole Hampton fiasco even though we told them we didn't want to have anything to do with it. So they wanted me to look.. and I did. I am not impressed.. sorry- as you are entitled to your own opinions, I am entitled to mine. 

People need to stop entertaining her CONSTANT excuses and making her sound like some kind of saint. The past is the past,absolutely, but the victims of the past were real living creatures that never had a chance and for some reason, it seems perfectly acceptable to just let them disappear as if they never mattered. And it continues.. people like that don't just magically get better.


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## slavetoabunny

*[email protected] wrote: *


> I think so, you should form your own opinions about the emails, and I am sure that some of you will still think she is wonderful.. and that is your opinion. If someone wants to send me their personal email, I will forward you the email she sent. Also the breeder wishes to recieve no more emails on this subject.





> I have my emails and you have yours. Isn't it handy now that you have yours that the breeder doesn't want to get anymore?





> Honestly I wouldn't have gotten involved because I stepped back from the whole thing, but LMRR is the one that kept tagging me on things on facebook pertaining to this stuff even after we removed them.





> If you don't want to see it, then go into your privacy settings and disable tags.





> And her friends kept trying to grab our attention for this whole Hampton fiasco even though we told them we didn't want to have anything to do with it. So they wanted me to look.. and I did. I am not impressed.. sorry- as you are entitled to your own opinions, I am entitled to mine.





> You are absolutely entitled to your opinions. If you don't like hearnher friend's opinions, then block them.





> People need to stop entertaining her CONSTANT excuses and making her sound like some kind of saint. The past is the past,absolutely, but the victims of the past were real living creatures that never had a chance and for some reason, it seems perfectly acceptable to just let them disappear as if they never mattered. And it continues.. people like that don't just magically get better.





> You say that the past is the past absolutelyand then you say it continues.......


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## [email protected]

Did you not read that I offered to forward the email? It says right in the email that she doesn't want to be contacted. By the way, she says she was only emailed three times, me being the third time. Ronnie something or other from bunny justice said she emailed her, that woman named Jess who is Nestle Frey supposedly emailed her, and I emailed her. So when did you email her personally Patti? Where is your email? Here is what I was emailed...

Full view||Back to messagesRe: additional questionâ
5/23/11 
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Hide details Donald Wilson Donald [email protected]

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Find email Add to contactsTo Steph Seyforth, [email protected]
From: Donald Wilson ([email protected]) 
Sent: Mon 5/23/11 7:54 PM 
To: Steph Seyforth ([email protected]) 
Cc: [email protected] 


Okay, this is the third and last email I will send. I don't want to sound mean but you are the third person I have replied to. Garfield had surgery here for a hernia, after 6 weeks his hernia returned. He needed another surgery and neutered. I have a list of people on waiting for pet quality, I called her explained the situation he needed to be neutered and pet only and she was happy with that. He has a lot of personality and a wonderful rabbit. He is still on my web site with my dog they were playmates. Anyway, she picked him up I did give her his papers since he could not be shown or breed it didn't matter if she had them or not. I gave him to her with the understanding that she was responsible for the surgery. She had the surgery done not once but twice according to her since he developed an infection after the first one with her. (I did not confirm any of this) she has sent me pictures of him and he looks healthy and happy. That is what I wanted for him since he is a great rabbit. I have no problems with how she has taken care of him. However, I also sold her a doe, 8 weeks old show quality with papers, she never finished paying for her and according to her, he father left the crate door not latched fully and her dog killed the rabbit. I had no way to confirm or deny this just that it is a shame since that doe is out of championship line and she never finished paying for her. I would be very upset to find out she was not dead but instead being breed or shown or whatever but all I can do is trust what she told me. As far as Garfield she has done a woderful job, he was not sick or anything like that when she got him just needed to be neutered so it would fix the hernia in the same area which she did. 
We are a large breeded and as I said before you are the third inquiry about this I do not know what is going on nor do I want in the middle of it but that is the story on Garfield. Please let others so because I will not be answering more emails about the same subject. Thanks Lisa


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## Yurusumaji

For love of all that is good in this world, please someone kill this thread.

This is starting to get a little too personal and the issue about Garfield/Hampton/rescues vs breeders has been solved.

Make it stop.


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## RosL

*Myia09 wrote: *


> Honestly, I added the anti LMRR group and found them to be nothing but hateful bashing people with no actual evidence. Just a lot of "yelling" and a bunch of people buying into the hype.
> 
> When I added LMRR themselves I have found that they do need some better help with their rabbits and shelter; but that could greatly be because of lack of volunteers/funds/ect. However, none of the rabbits are abused or being ill treated.
> 
> I am pretty sure it is some personal vendetta gone out of hand...people who take productive steps to help rabbits in abusive situations don't act as vicious and childish as the ones on those forums do.


I'm sorry...I find it hard to locate where anybody has been 'vicious'. Most of what has been written here has been done in an adult and sensible, structured way. There are the odd exceptions, but hopefully there won't be more of that.


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## RosL

*Yurusumaji wrote: *


> For love of all that is good in this world, please someone kill this thread.
> 
> This is starting to get a little too personal and the issue about Garfield/Hampton/rescues vs breeders has been solved.
> 
> Make it stop.


Anybody who is sick of the debate could stop watching the thread.

In fact, the breeder says in her letter that another rabbit was SOLD to Kris Corson,



> However, I also sold her a doe, 8 weeks old show quality with papers, she never finished paying for her and according to her, he father left the crate door not latched fully and her dog killed the rabbit. I had no way to confirm or deny this just that it is a shame since that doe is out of championship line and she never finished paying for her. I would be very upset to find out she was not dead but instead being breed or shown or whatever but all I can do is trust what she told me. As far as Garfield she has done a woderful job, he was not sick or anything like that when she got him just needed to be neutered so it would fix the hernia in the same area which she did.


whereas the story she tells is that the rabbit was a gift. Does this not conflict? Is SOMEBODY not lying here? If we trust the breeder on the background of one rabbit, do we disbelieve her on the other?


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## Yurusumaji

> Anybody who is sick of the debate could stop watching the thread.



A very mature thing to say. The debate is dead and a lot of us are sick of seeing this thing pop back up to the top of the Recent page.

It says right in the title "STOP THE NEGATIVITY!", but you're still being negative and now people are starting to get personal with this. It crossed the line long ago and you people just need to let this thread die and rest in peace.

Exchange IM usernames with each other and take it elsewhere. Just get it off the forum.


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## RosL

This was an entirely sensible suggestion...I fail to see why you find it immature. When I am sick of something on TV I switch off or change to another channel. Those who want to read no more on this are free to unwatch the topic. Nothing sarcastic, just common sense.

How is it dead?

I am still searching for truth and therefore not being negative, and feel that there is more to find, so I for one feel that we need to allow the debate to continue. After all, if there is no further 'evidence' to find or discuss, it will die its own death.



> now people are starting to get personal with this.


As I've said before, I hold no truck with people who stoop to personal insults. I don't see where in recent posts on this thread, there have been any such personal insults. Perhaps you can point them out to me..I don't mean anything from months ago, btw, I think we all know about that.



> Exchange IM usernames with each other and take it elsewhere. Just get it off the forum.


Please correct me if I have this wrong, but as legitimate members of the forum, we have a right to debate. As long as people are expressing themselves in an honest and polite way, I feel that your request (?) is, to say the least, unreasonable.


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## Yurusumaji

I think this debate is unreasonable.

You'll see I never said anything about personal insults, but it is getting personal. The most recent example is Steph's implied accusation that Patti never sent or received an e-mail from the breeder you're all talking about.

I don't follow this thread, I never have. However, every single time I sign on it's at the top of the list again. I read the first page and I've read the last page and in my honest opinion, this has just gone too far and you guys have resorted to questioning *everything* LMRR does.

I'm all for the welfare of rabbits and taking down shelters that are unsavory, but whining about it on this forum isn't going to get anyone any closer to a solution to a problem that is only implied but not proven.


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## gentle giants

*RosL wrote: *


> I'm sorry...I find it hard to locate where anybody has been 'vicious'. Most of what has been written here has been done in an adult and sensible, structured way. There are the odd exceptions, but hopefully there won't be more of that.


The really vicious stuff was on the Facebook page that was linked earlier in the thread. The mods here (thanks so much, guys!) remove that crap quickly. One comment from the FB page that really sticks in my head was made by "Ronnie Cyr" and referred to the owner of LMRR as "an attention seeking whore". There was a lot more like it also, which is one big reason why I am now immediately discounting anything the BJ people say as untrue. 
I find it very hard to believe that if this was REALLY "only about the rabbits" as they claim, that there would be this level of fury and personal hatred towards this woman. I hate repeating myself, but here I go again: I can understand COMPLETELY being upset and angry if you are seeing animals being neglected and abused. But personal attacks are *not helping the rabbits!* I would think that it would be obvious to everyone reading this thread that BJ's behavior has not convinced even one person that there is abuse going on, it has been actually the opposite. To tell you the truth, if I were to walk into LMRR today and see signs of abuse with my own eyes, there is still no chance that I would listen to anything that the BJ group has to say purely because of the behavior I have seen from them here and on Facebook. I would gather my own evidence and believe what my own eyes saw, but nothing that they said.

I hope that made sense without turning into a ramble.


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## Happi Bun

Perfect sense! :nod


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## gentle giants

*[email protected] wrote: *


> People need to stop entertaining her CONSTANT excuses and making her sound like some kind of saint. The past is the past,absolutely, but the victims of the past were real living creatures that never had a chance and for some reason, it seems perfectly acceptable to just let them disappear as if they never mattered. And it continues.. people like that don't just magically get better.


I was just re-reading the last page and saw this again. I don't think I have seen anyone on here talking about how good (Corson? can't remember her name) this woman is. I think the main issue being discussed is how very UN-saintlike the BJ group has been. I have to say, this is the craziest thread I have ever seen on this forum.
:rollseyes


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## Yurusumaji

I also can't help but be amused by the constant reminders that no one is getting personal when the whole point of this thread is to bash someone who isn't even around to defend herself. Honestly.

The most recent issue has been settled. The debate is over. This thread needs to be as dead as this so-called 'debate'.


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## [email protected]

No one that is on here posting against LMRR or are concerned about what is going on there is even in that "BJ Group"! So please for the love of whomever you believe in.. don't blame us for what they say and do. I think that is one thing that we can all agree on here is that none of us want to listen to what the the "BJ People" are saying anymore... And us speaking out in no way compares to what they do or should be associated with such. There is no their side and her side. We are all individually expressing what we feel is wrong.


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## gentle giants

I'm confused, I thought christinelea1 was part of Bunny Justice? There were several other posters/new members here that I was under the impression were part of that group also. Was I mistaken?


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## Kipcha

*gentle giants wrote: *


> I'm confused, I thought christinelea1 was part of Bunny Justice? There were several other posters/new members here that I was under the impression were part of that group also. Was I mistaken?


Considering that one of the people posting on the group post about Pipp under pretty much the exact same name, I'm pretty sure that they are one in the same.


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## pla725

I saw a couple of the rabbits that LMRRtook infrom FL. Both were lops. Theylooked in good shape. Dr. Duggan was getting to spay and neuter them.

I believe Facebook removed the BJ stuff at the request of the SPCA. It's over.


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## Happi Bun

At the request of the SPCA? Wowzah.


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## gentle giants

Well, I know that I made a complaint about the page to FB. I know of one other person who did too, mabye FB got tired of being bugged about it.


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## slavetoabunny

Nope. They are still there. They had one page closed down by FB for harrassment and they started 2 more.


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## Happi Bun

Ugh, they remind me of a certain kind of bug. 

I find the below quote HILARIOUS in a very pathetic kind of way. I mean, really? How dare they compare themselves to them or even think this situation is anywhere NEAR the same. GRRRR.

Quote by Bunnies 4 Justice: _*"BUNNY JUSTICE IS THE SEA SHEPHERD AND CREW, KC AND HER MINIONS ARE THE JAPANESE WHALERS! You may not like out tactics but we fight the good fight no one was brave enough for. We will fight until justice is served! Tomorrow a new campaign starts.*__*"*_


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## gentle giants

Some how I am doubting there will be anything new.... 

Just a side note, while I hate whaling myself and am very against it, the Sea Shepard and crew seem a bit nuts to me too!


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## bunnychild

that is awful. how can people do that


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## JessyGirL

Haha...I remember reading all this on FB...I can't believe I found it on this forum too...I adopted my two bunnies from LMRR...Mine seem ok & I have seen the inside of the NJ shelter...She has a big place to house a lot of bunnies, but maybe she does have too many...I have been really confused what to believe about LMRR, but I have my good & bad things to say, so I'm left undecided...I feel bad now for any time I left my bunnies with a dirty cage though! Oh my I don't want anyone coming to my place cause my bunnies always make a mess and I don't always clean it up right away...lol


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## hereinjersey

I too wanted to believe that this woman was a victim of harrassment. But I can tell you now that it is warranted. The rescue now has over 130 animals (buns, guinea pigs, etc.) who are being housed in every square inch and are not cleaned but once a week if that. The volunteers keep coming and going b/c Ms. Corson mistreats them in person and online. That is a fact. She is now becoming a hoarder by refusing to adopt out bunnies in particular that people request, claiming they are her "personal" pets. But they live at the rescue. Is that the true meaning of rescue? She now PERSONALLY owns at her own residence besides several animals 4 Flemish giants (2 of whom were requested to be adopted out but she has now made "spokesbunnies" of the shelter). How many Flemish giants does 1 person need? I have seen recent pix of the shelter in its condition and the buns are FILTHY. The place gets cleaned when important people come to visit (major $ contributors from outside the state) and such occasions, but cleaning litter boxes for bunnies once a week is sickening. Many of us are so disgusted with the behavior of this woman. I now believe all the stuff that happened in Florida was true as we are seeing it here in Jersey.


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## Kipcha

hereinjersey wrote:


> I too wanted to believe that this woman was a victim of harrassment.Â  But I can tell you now that it is warranted.Â  The rescue now has over 130 animals (buns, guinea pigs, etc.) who are being housed in every square inch and are not cleaned but once a week if that.Â  The volunteers keep coming and going b/c Ms. Corson mistreats them in person and online.Â  That is a fact. Â  She is now becoming a hoarder by refusing to adopt out bunnies in particular that people request, claiming they are her "personal" pets.Â  But they live at the rescue.Â  Is that the true meaning of rescue?Â  She now PERSONALLY owns at her own residence besides several animals 4 Flemish giants (2 of whom were requested to be adopted out but she has now made "spokesbunnies" of the shelter).Â  How many Flemish giants does 1 person need? I have seen recent pix of the shelter in its condition and the buns are FILTHY.Â  The place gets cleaned when important people come to visit (major $ contributors from outside the state) and such occasions, but cleaning litter boxes for bunnies once a week is sickening.Â  Many of us are so disgusted with the behavior of this woman.Â  I now believe all the stuff that happened in Florida was true as we are seeing it here in Jersey.Â Â



While I know first hand all about "rescues" working under fraudulant terms, we're dealing with issues right now as a matter of fact, I can't help but feel this is a little bit of an unwarranted response.

First of all, I ALWAYS grow suspicious of motives when people begin criticising the number of animals someone has. We rescue (As the rabbit hopping club, we get a lot of people dumping their rabbits on us) and we have rehomed close to 40 rabbits. However, we also have 12 of our own, most of which came to us through rescuing. We have been criticised for our high number, but all of them are well taken care of. They all get attention, running time in our bunny play room, recieve Oxbow pellets, unlimited hay, larger cages, veggies every single day, mental stimulation and vet care (We have been spending a fortune on vet care the last two months between Flynn's FHO and Babbitty's teeth problems). I feel that we take better care of our rabbits then a lot of single rabbit pet homes and yet we're still branded as people with more then they can handle by people who have never even seen how we care for our buns.

So, when it comes to the 4 Flemish Giants, I really must raise an eyebrow at the accusatory tone of "How many Flemish Giants does one person need?". What's wrong with having 4 flemmies?

And something that really rubs me the wrong way is "it was requested that these rabbits be adopted out". It was requested by whom, exactly? The volunteers, who really have no reason to be requesting such a thing? The people who surrendered the rabbit, who have no right to be 'requesting' anything?

What is wrong with a rescue owner having pets? IF she was breeding them, I would see something deeply unethical but if not, I don't see a problem.

I have seen pictures of the housing on Facebook, and if these are a proper representation of how the cages really are, I see nothing wrong with them. I understand pics can be decieving but I see no sign of foul play in them.

She has a lot of bunnies to take care of, I'd be rather surprised if she could keep up with once a week by herself. Does she have a steady support of a large number of volunteers? Because one person could never be expected to stay vigilantly on top of all that and it seems like a lot of volunteers are more into finding things to pin on the rescue then helping.

I could be completely wrong. I know how frustrating it is when people are completely taking advantage of animals for their own monetary gain.


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## hereinjersey

When people express interest in adopting the rescue animals and the rescue owner says no for no apparant reason other than wanting another personal animal, is that the true meaning of rescue? When that animal will now stay in it's cage with no play time and live in it's own filth for a total of a week? There are a steady stream of volunteers, BUT Ms. Corson goes through them like paper towels because she is a. difficult to work with. 2. insulting to the staff. 3. not there in person herself so heaps tons of work on 2 or 3 unsuspecting volunteers until they get totally burnt out. I know it sounds harsh but this rescue would be a wonderful thing if someone else was running it.


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## hereinjersey

and the reason I ask about the flemmies is because people are extremely interested in adopting them, but when one is found it then becomes the rescue owner's personal pet instead of adopting it out. So I would describe this behavior as hoarding. How many personally owned pets does a hoarder make?


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## ZRabbits

*hereinjersey wrote: *


> and the reason I ask about the flemmies is because people are extremely interested in adopting them, but when one is found it then becomes the rescue owner's personal pet instead of adopting it out. So I would describe this behavior as hoarding. How many personally owned pets does a hoarder make?


Does the Gloucester or Cumberland Counties Health Depts aware of this issue? If not, why hasn't it been reported? They don't announce their arrival. At least they are not supposed to. 

K


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## hereinjersey

Duly noted.


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## Kipcha

hereinjersey wrote:


> and the reason I ask about the flemmies is because people are extremely interested in adopting them, but when one is found it then becomes the rescue owner's personal pet instead of adopting it out.Â  So I would describe this behavior as hoarding. How many personally owned pets does a hoarder make?



Hoarding is a term that is thrown around a lot these days but people use it without truly knowing what it means. It has nothing to do with the actual number of animals you have, but the psychological portion, leading to why the person wound up keeping them. 

A hoarder would not be adopting anything out, period. If a rabbit goes through those doors, they would be staying, that is just an animal hoarders behavior. In their mind, no one will be able to care for that animal the way they do and they would never willingly relinquish the animal to anyone else. These animals would not be receiving proper care or vet care (And from what I have seen from postings online, they do seem to spend a lot of money on vet care).

So no, this would not be a hoarding situation.

I would agree with Karen. Report it and if nothing comes of it, obviously the situation isn't as bad as thought before. Sometimes it takes someone else with no bad feelings towards the person running it to give a clear view on what's happening. 

Like I said, it's entirely possible this could be a terrible situation. I can definitely sympathize with the frustration of feeling helpless in a "rescue" situation.


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## JadeIcing

At the point we have had trusted members become involved with this rescue, go into thier facilities on several occassions, work on large scale rescues and transports. They all say the opposite of what you are reporting. One of the people who has looked into this I trust more than most in my life. So until actual real evidence is presented and actual charges pressed (which I doubt will ever happen) I would like people to refrain from posting negative comments.


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## hereinjersey

Thank you for your response. The vet for this rescue has now quit and reported the rescue to the board of health, so hopefully the proper authorities can get involved now. I appreciate this board and all the work that you do.


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## slavetoabunny

I am located in Florida, but am a personal friend of Kristie and many of the volunteers of the rescue. I have been there numerous times (I travel to Cherryhill, NJ every few months) most recently as the beginning of April. I will be there again May 5th and will be spending 3 days at the rescue before my conference starts. I have never seen anything amiss there.

They are under the jurisdiction of Camden County. They have passed numerous inspections by both animal control and the health department. Yes, I am aware that their vet quit. There are many reasons for this. One reason is that Dr. Lori found out that they engaged a new vet because the rescue wasn't happy with her.

Flemmies happen to be a personal favorite of Kristie's. They are VERY rare to run across in rescue. I've volunteered for Gainesville Rabbit Rescue in FL for 4 years and there has been a total of two come into rescue during that time. Kristie has three personal bunnies right now. Hoarder??? They adopt out several bunnies every week. Hoarder??

Are you bitter because you were turned down for adoption? There are many good reasons why a rescue will turn down a potential adopter. We are all VERY careful about who we adopt out to.

Please feel free to send me a PM if you have any questions I can answer.


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## slavetoabunny

Oh, and hereinjersey.....my rescue has about 150 rabbits right now. How is that bad? In my opinion, it just demonstrates our level of commitment.


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## hereinjersey

I was never ever turned down to adopt a bunny for any reason whatsoever. I did adopt a bunny from there and even found the adoption process to be much less complicated than Luv-N-Buns. I have no personal vendetta against Ms. Corson. I do not like to see animals neglected.


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## ZRabbits

*hereinjersey wrote: *


> I was never ever turned down to adopt a bunny for any reason whatsoever. I did adopt a bunny from there and even found the adoption process to be much less complicated than Luv-N-Buns. I have no personal vendetta against Ms. Corson. I do not like to see animals neglected.



I'm a little leary of what kind of health reports come out of Camden County. I've dealt with them on another issue in the past and boy definitely found out not interested in health issues. 

I hope that all the facts come out about this. And hope the results of this complain is published. It all should be about the Rescued bunnies, but I do know how politics rears its ugly head in all aspects of Camden County and can cloud the real issue. 

There are good and bad in all IMHO. Hope the light is shown on this so that the mission doesn't get lost. And bunnies don't suffer. 

Unfortunately when things of brought to light that one might feel is not right and could be harmful and others don't, the "making it personal" seems to rear up. Shame. 

K


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## slavetoabunny

The animals are NOT being neglected. I am in daily correspondence with a number of the volunteers there. I would also like to add that Dr. Lori and her report to the Board of Health was simply that she was no longer the vet of record for the rescue, as is required.


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## hereinjersey

We have a difference of opinion about your last comment, and we are both in touch with volunteers, so I will have to let it stand at that. My wish is that the bunnies get taken care of and that the volunteers are treated well and that the rescue thrives and that Ms. Corson gets the assistance she needs with that.


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## slavetoabunny

Do I know you hereinjersey? It looks like you joined the forum just to dig up this old thread and comment.


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## hereinjersey

No that's not why I joined. I was doing some research on the Florida case as I am seeing such similarities here in Jersey and google brought me here. I do not wish to fight with you and thought this was done. We have to agree to disagree on this and I am willing to do that.


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## HoppyFamily

Thought I would drop this link here in case anyone was ever curious over the years if KC was back to her old tricks. The good news is, she doesn't exploit animals anymore but the bad news is, she has a new charity (found on FB on Instagram as the Evans Family Lego Project) and is still manipulating people to donate money to her for various things. 

The Voiceless Podcast- LMRR


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